Urgent Advice Please

format_quote Originally Posted by anonymous

Jazakh Allah for everybodys advice
You are right, I need to make a good impression, i think i have for the time ive known him insha Allah
How can i 'open the door'?

I was sitting with my friend in a place, and he told me "My sister often ask about you. She ask me where you study, where you live,....etc". I've guessed it. When I visited my friend house I often noticed that his sister always looked at me, and when I looked at her she always looked shy. She's shy girl, a nice girl. But, I was too young in that time. It's happened in my teen age.

Few years later. I meet a girl in a place,and she told me.
"You must be don't know that there is a girl who likes you"
"Your friend,isn't she?"
"Hey,you know it?" she's surprised
"I know,I can feel it"
"And then?"
I didn't say anything. But I hope she could 'read' it as "tell your friend, I'm sorry"

------

That's two of few examples of 'open the door' through third party. In mostly of my experiences they did not use third party, but since you ask about Islamic way, I suggest you use third party.

There is difference between these two example. In first case her brother took initiative, while in second case, that girl ordered her friend.

But sis, if you use third party, make sure that this third party is someone who close with that guy and know how to tell him in right way. Do not tell in form of proposal like "sister anonymous want to marry you" because it will make you look aggressive. But tell it in 'invitation' form like "sister anonymous always ask about you".

People in my place often say that the life-partner is in the hand of Allah. It's means Allah determine with who we will get married. People in my place also say that if someone has been determined as our life-partner, he/she will not go anywhere.

There was a female highschool student who ever told her grandma about her feeling on a guy who she meet in the classroom. Her grandma understood it, then she performed salah tahajjud wish Allah allow that guy to become her granddaughter life-partner in the future. The grandma passed away not so long after that.

More than two years after she graduated from highschool, she got shocked because the guy she expected chose another girl!. But she still believe that guy would become her life-partner.

And something happened. That guy left by the girl who he wanted to marry. And finally that guy came to her and became her life-partner, until Allah call her return to Him in June 11 2013.

Yes, this girl was my wife, and that guy was me. This is the story between me and her. It sound like a fairy tale, but it's true.

I still remember how jealous my ex-classmate who then became my wife when she knew I chose a girl from a town in south of my city. But I had been fell in love with that girl. I pray day and night wish Allah allow me to marry that girl because I knew she always doubt. That girl often told me that she had a feeling that I'm not the man who would become her husband. Sometime she told me that I should not sad if Allah determine I did not marry her.

And a destiny happened. Yes, like the people say, life-partner is in the hand of Allah.

--------

Sister anonymous,

remember, who will become your husband in the future is in the hand of Allah. If the guy you expect is your husband in the future, whatever happen, he would become your husband. But if he is not your husband in the future, I hope you could accept your destiny. Just like I accept my destiny.

You can make du'a wish Allah make him become your husband in the future. You can also ask your parent or grandparent to make du'a for you. But then leave it to Allah. Allah will determine what the best for you.

format_quote Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim

Talk to your wali and for the love of Allaah do not open your door. The only impression he needs is hearing your interest from your guardian

Any other form of communication is inviting shaytan to play

Men and women are in different position. Men are in position that come to the women propose marriage, while the women are in position that wait for proposal. If a man interested to a woman, he can propose marriage through this woman wali. But if a woman interested to a man, her wali cannot propose marriage to this man. In mostly of societies, if woman propose marriage to man it would be considered as inappropriate. What the women can do is hoping that this man will propose marriage.

In this matter actually men are luckier than women. The women position become a barrier when they are interested to marry a man. They cannot propose marriage but must wait proposal. This is the problem of anonymous sister, although in this case actually she is still too young.

I understand if you suggest anon sister not to show her feeling to the man she expect. If I suggested using third party, it because this way is 'safer' than not using third party. It's from my experiences.

About impression. English is not my first language. So, I maybe made mistake in choosing the right word. What I mean is "building a self-image that will make other people have the impression that she is deserves to be taken as a wife".

Maybe you have heard that a good wife is a wife that will make her husband happy when see her. Also make the husband feel comfortable with her. If a woman have criteria like this, so she would get more attention from men who are looking for a wife.

My suggestion to sister anon is improve her personality to become a woman who considered as "deserves to be taken as a wife". It's include dressed well, have the attitude that make other people feel appreciated, have a good self esteem, etc. It will make her easier to get a husband, although maybe not the man who she expect now.

People often thinking that if a woman is beautiful, she would easy to get a husband. But actually if a woman is beautiful but she is arrogant and look down on other people, the good men would not consider her as deserves as a wife.

format_quote Originally Posted by ~Zaria~

brother,

I think that the 'inappropriateness' of a woman approaching a man for marriage stems more from cultural barriers than islamic ones.
I am reminded of Khadija (ra) who first showed interest towards our prophet (sallalahu alaihi wasalam) - I would imagine, that this may have been more difficult for her considering that she was his (sallahu alaihi wasalam) employer, older than him and widowed.
Yet, alhamdulillah, what a beautiful marriage resulted from this union.

Having said this, I do understand why most women will not approach a man for marriage.
I am also much tooo shy/ introverted (it may not seem as such on the forum, because my posts tend to be lengthier I plan ) in life, to ever do so....
Even if I were to find interest in someone, I would likely wait and make duaa, than to ever make my interest known directly.

However, there are also sisters who more self-confident, extroverted in nature and will not hesitate to make the necessary efforts towards her goal. MashaAllah, for these sisters there is no harm, if they have the correct intentions in this regard.
I know of a few sisters who 'made the first move' in indicating their interests towards a brother, and alhamdulillah, it resulted in marriage : )

I think that the sisters who are too shy probably get left behind in many things in life

As you have mentioned, in these cases, they can possibly find 'indirect' methods of approaching a brother:
e.g. a family member/ friend can casually discuss the topic of marriage with the desired brother - and determine if he is interested in settling down or not.
If he is interested, then the sisters name can be dropped into the conversation, and her positive attributes mentioned.
In this way, the brother has become aware of her, and can approach her wali if he feels in the same way.
If he does not do so, then it would probably indicate that he does not find the same interest in her.

In this manner, in shaa Allah, sisters can also make some (indirect) effort in seeking a potential spouse : )

sister

An important lesson about love and marriage that I've learned since I was kid is, getting a spouse is different than buying a clothes. If I want to buy clothes I could go to the shop, choosing the clothes that I like, pay, and this clothes now belong to me. But if I had interest to marry someone I could not marry her if she didn't have interest to marry me. I could get marry only with someone who is willing to marry me too.

Then I developed my ability to not fall in love with someone who is not mine. And train myself to able to love someone who will become my life-partner.

As a man, of course I attracted to woman too. Sometime happened, I saw a woman who look attractive in me eyes, and I started to attracted. But then I realized that she's not interested to me. So I told myself "She's not for me. It's okay, there are other women" and I burried my feeling to her.

One thing that made me grateful in life is easiness to get life-partner. Not because I was a man who look good in the women eyes. But because I was not type of man who attracted to a woman and the try to get her. So, what I have done just noticed the women who 'open the door' for me, and chose one of them without rejection.

Imagine if I was type of man who attracted to woman and then try get her. Must be I would face a competition with other men, and I would face a risk of rejection. Probably I would rejected, rejected, and rejected.

Sister, we would be easier to get a spouse if we have principle, not try to get someone who we love, but try to love someone who we get.

About shy woman. Actually shy woman is a type of woman that be liked by the men. Usually they are 'hidden', but the men still can find them through some people. There are many shy women who got spouse after some people found them and thinking "She can be a good wife. Why don't I introduce my son/nephew/ brother to her?".

This is why in another thread I've ever written and advice for unmarried sister. They should not lock themselves in the room, but should active in activities with older women. Because if they look good in those older women view, those older women will try to connect them to the men.

But, there are shy women who have low confidence. They are thinking that they are not deserve for the men. And then when a man come, she will doubt "Do I deserve for him?". This doubt will be reflected on her attitude, and unfortunately the man usually read it as sign of rejection. So the man will go to another woman.

Now the important question. If a woman has interest to marry a man, can she propose marriage?

Okay, notice this story.

Kahdijah Bint Khuwailid (ra) had an interest to marry Muhammad SAW (he had not been prophet in that time). But there was a problem. In Arab culture in that time was very inappropriate if a woman propose marriage to a man. However, Khadijah (ra) had an idea. She seeked help to her friend, Nafisah bint Munyah, who also knew Muhammad (saw) personally.

Then Nafisah wait on a way where Muhammad (saw) often walked. When she meet Muhammad (saw) she asked him
"O, Muhammad, don't you have interest to getting married?"
"I have" Muhammad (saw) replied "but I'm poor"
"What you think if there's a woman who beautiful, rich, and has a willing to marry you?"
"Who?"
"Khadijah bint Khuwailid"
"If Khadijah is willing to marry me, I will marry her"

Then Muhammad (saw) told his uncles that he would marry Khadijah (ra)

So, actually Khadijah (ra) did not propose marriage. But she sent invitation through her friend for Muhammad (saw) to propose marriage to her.

format_quote Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim

but I was fearful that this sister may disregard her sense of haya' in some way due to her interest for this man which is very common in western culture.

It can be happen. And it's my fault.

I really understand her situation. I also understand that if she is too easy to be infatuated, it's because she is still very young. Actually what should I do is giving her correct advice to control her feeling and start thinking like mature woman.

But, I don't know why. I gave her wrong advice, I rant about myself. Maybe because too much memories that suddenly appear in my mind.

Okay, I quit from this thread.