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distressed
09-17-2010, 08:39 PM
:sl:

I would like to know islamically what can a muslim do on someone's death anniversary ? I live in community where khatham practice is the norm esp for deaths. since joining this board, and reading/learning more on islam ive realised this isnt permissable and is actually biddah.

In October its gona be a year since my father has passed, at home we will be having a khatham. There will also be people reading not on that day, but weeks in advance.

Me being 1 of his daughters too, what can i do ?
also im still expected to attend and help out on the day, but does this make me a hypocrite? if i dont take part in this biddah ? but still contribute my help somewhere at home like the cookin etc ?
also should i read ?

D

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cat eyes
09-18-2010, 12:55 PM
:sl:i wouldn't go because your not meant to help them do this bid'da.. just say that your really sick and you can't help out :) if you don't want to hurt their feelings.

may Allah help you dear sis.

:wa:
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Ramadhan
09-18-2010, 03:19 PM
In indonesia too, death anniversaries are widely practiced, and it is called "tahlilan".
It's basically the relatives and communities gathered at the house of the bereaved from the first night until 7th night of the death, then at the 40th day, 100th day, and 1000 day. Many scholars and historians think this was the practice of hindus centuries ago in Indonesia which continued the tradition when Indonesians became muslims.
The bereaved family has to prepare food for the visitors and everyone then recite Yaa Sin (in a very fast manner, because many have memorised it, due to "yasinan" or tahlilan) and some du'as.

Many have called to stop this practrice because it's bid'ah, but people still continue because they think/feel that the deceased can be forgiven by Allah SWT this way.

Alhamdulillah my own mother has left wasiat that she doesn't want any of us to conduct "tahlilan" when she dies, she just wants us the children to read qur'an on our own and make du'as for her. Although maybe we will get trouble from other relatives if we don't do it.
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aadil77
09-18-2010, 04:46 PM
^MashAllah, wish more parents were like yours
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Hamza Asadullah
09-18-2010, 05:47 PM
Originally Posted by distressed
:sl:

I would like to know islamically what can a muslim do on someone's death anniversary ? I live in community where khatham practice is the norm esp for deaths. since joining this board, and reading/learning more on islam ive realised this isnt permissable and is actually biddah.

In October its gona be a year since my father has passed, at home we will be having a khatham. There will also be people reading not on that day, but weeks in advance.

Me being 1 of his daughters too, what can i do ?
also im still expected to attend and help out on the day, but does this make me a hypocrite? if i dont take part in this biddah ? but still contribute my help somewhere at home like the cookin etc ?
also should i read ?

D
Asalaamu Alaikum Wr Wb, jazakallahu khayran for sharing your issue with us.

According to Sheikh Mufti Ebrahim Desai on the issue of khatams (fateha):

Upon the death of a person, it is a common practice to make Fateha. Contextually, Fateha is the recitation of a few Aayaats of the Qur'aan followed by a Du'aa for the deceased.

There are innumerable number of Ahaadith expounding the virtues of reciting the Qur'aan and making Du'aa. There are also many Ahaadith on Isaal-e-Sawaab (sending reward to the deceased). Surely, the deceased eagerly await for rewards from his beloved wife, parents and friends by them making Du'aa for his forgiveness, giving charity, etc. on his behalf.

However, in order for the deceased to benefit from the gifts of his beloved, they must be channelled to him in the correct way, the way of our beloved Prophet (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam). During the time of the Prophet (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam), many deaths occurred. It was his noble habit to comfort the bereaved families and widows. Many Sahaaba (Radhiallaahu Anhu) enquired from the Prophet (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) about Isaal-e-Sawaab (sending Sawaab to their deceased). It is not proven on any one occasion that the Prophet himself practised or ordered the customary practise of Fateha (7 days, 40 days, and 100 days). Had the customary practise of Fateha (7 days, 40 days, and 100 days) been of any significance, he surely would have at least practised it or ordered its practise at least once in his lifetime.

To emphasise and carry out a particular practise not proven in Shari'ah, for example, Fateha leads to distortion of Deen. Many people may regard the practise as necessary and an integral part of Deen as is the case among many unwary people today. Any practise which leads to a possible distortion of Deen is prohibited and a major sin. Obviously, such a practise leading to sin invokes the anger of Allah. How can such a practise benefit the deceased?

The only way to benefit the deceased is to send Sawaab to him by carrying out acts of virtue, for example, reciting Qur'aan, making Du'aa for him, giving charity, etc. as advised by our beloved Rasul (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam). May Allah Ta'ala bless all our Marhooms and grant them Jannatul Firdaws.

and Allah Ta'ala Knows Best

Therefore you should try to explain to your family in a loving and gentle manner that these practices are not in Islam but do not do in an attacking way as that will never produce any good results and one must never raise ones voice to ones mother but say in a gentle and loving manner using wisdom and tact that these practices are merely traditional and not an Islamic practice.

You can make intention of tidying the house and cook for guests to serve your mother as serving ones parents is the greatest of rewards. But the intention should be for serving your mother and guests but not for the khatam.

For your father you should make regular dua for him and make it a habit of including him and your mother and family in ALL of your dua's. You can also recite the Qur'an and give sadaqa making the intention of sending the reward to your father and what better gift are these for your deceased father?

If we make a habit of sending dua's to the deceased then surely we will also recieve these gifts when we most need it in our graves.

And Allah knows best in all matters
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ardianto
09-18-2010, 06:02 PM
Originally Posted by naidamar
In indonesia too, death anniversaries are widely practiced, and it is called "tahlilan".
Not only in Indonesia. Sultan Hasanal Bolkiah from Brunei Darussalam also performed "tahlilan" for his parents.
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Salahudeen
09-18-2010, 06:12 PM
You're a wahaabi if you don't believe in khatums according to many people ;D
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aadil77
09-18-2010, 11:19 PM
Originally Posted by squiggle
You're a wahaabi if you don't believe in khatums according to many people ;D
only barelvis call you a wahabi if you don't take part in their many bidah
Reply

manaal
09-20-2010, 05:20 AM
Originally Posted by squiggle
You're a wahaabi if you don't believe in khatums according to many people ;D
Do you even know what that means?

To Thread starter:

Sister do you want to fall out with your family just for the sake of this khatham? Family ties are very important in Islam, and so is the spreading of the true message. Boycotting the even will not sere any good purpose. I don't know how a khatham is conducted in your community, but in mine (we call it "kaththam") there are some recitals followed by lunch. I usually skip the recitals and join the family for the meal. It is important for me attend because it is one of those rare occasions where the whole extended family get to meet in one place (our "family kaththam" is meant for my Great-grand parents). If I'm early, I don't join in the recitations. Allah know what my intentions are, and Insha Allah he will not punish me for attending a family gathering.

I suggest you speak to your siblings about this and explain to them why it is wrong. Our beloved Prophet never did it and annual events/celebrations are forbidden in Islam as they are pagan practices. Only the two Eids are allowed.

Alhamdulillah, brother naidamar, my parents too have forbidden us from this. And my mom's family do not do this for their parents either.
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distressed
09-20-2010, 08:14 AM
Salaam

Sis Cats-eyes, making up something just to get out of it, wouldnt that be classed as a lie ? I cant pretend im sick.

naidamar-Ive always been told the same, that its a way maybe getting forgiveness for the deceased on their behalf. Although we only do it for the one day.
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distressed
09-20-2010, 08:15 AM
Originally Posted by Hamza81
Asalaamu Alaikum Wr Wb, jazakallahu khayran for sharing your issue with us.

According to Sheikh Mufti Ebrahim Desai on the issue of khatams (fateha):

Upon the death of a person, it is a common practice to make Fateha. Contextually, Fateha is the recitation of a few Aayaats of the Qur'aan followed by a Du'aa for the deceased.

There are innumerable number of Ahaadith expounding the virtues of reciting the Qur'aan and making Du'aa. There are also many Ahaadith on Isaal-e-Sawaab (sending reward to the deceased). Surely, the deceased eagerly await for rewards from his beloved wife, parents and friends by them making Du'aa for his forgiveness, giving charity, etc. on his behalf.

However, in order for the deceased to benefit from the gifts of his beloved, they must be channelled to him in the correct way, the way of our beloved Prophet (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam). During the time of the Prophet (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam), many deaths occurred. It was his noble habit to comfort the bereaved families and widows. Many Sahaaba (Radhiallaahu Anhu) enquired from the Prophet (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) about Isaal-e-Sawaab (sending Sawaab to their deceased). It is not proven on any one occasion that the Prophet himself practised or ordered the customary practise of Fateha (7 days, 40 days, and 100 days). Had the customary practise of Fateha (7 days, 40 days, and 100 days) been of any significance, he surely would have at least practised it or ordered its practise at least once in his lifetime.

To emphasise and carry out a particular practise not proven in Shari'ah, for example, Fateha leads to distortion of Deen. Many people may regard the practise as necessary and an integral part of Deen as is the case among many unwary people today. Any practise which leads to a possible distortion of Deen is prohibited and a major sin. Obviously, such a practise leading to sin invokes the anger of Allah. How can such a practise benefit the deceased?

The only way to benefit the deceased is to send Sawaab to him by carrying out acts of virtue, for example, reciting Qur'aan, making Du'aa for him, giving charity, etc. as advised by our beloved Rasul (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam). May Allah Ta'ala bless all our Marhooms and grant them Jannatul Firdaws.

and Allah Ta'ala Knows Best

Therefore you should try to explain to your family in a loving and gentle manner that these practices are not in Islam but do not do in an attacking way as that will never produce any good results and one must never raise ones voice to ones mother but say in a gentle and loving manner using wisdom and tact that these practices are merely traditional and not an Islamic practice.

You can make intention of tidying the house and cook for guests to serve your mother as serving ones parents is the greatest of rewards. But the intention should be for serving your mother and guests but not for the khatam.

For your father you should make regular dua for him and make it a habit of including him and your mother and family in ALL of your dua's. You can also recite the Qur'an and give sadaqa making the intention of sending the reward to your father and what better gift are these for your deceased father?

If we make a habit of sending dua's to the deceased then surely we will also recieve these gifts when we most need it in our graves.

And Allah knows best in all matters

Ive been told that only the sons can give charity for the deceased father ? but i guess i can do that 2.

Obviously the community i live in is a bit split, theres the odd few families that dont take part in this sort of practice. Im not gona explain anything to them, cos my sister tried doing the same thing a couple of years ago, and i myself not knowing anything else, told her she was following wahabi practices. I didnt even know what that meant at the time, but cos this is always what ive known, some1 telling me not to do it, seemed silly to me. When a imam comes from the mosque and takes part in this, someone who has studied the quran etc, is older/wiser then obviously there gona take his word over mine. I know nothing in comparison. If someone has followed something, for X amount of years, and has been brought up, knowing nothing different, there hardly gona listen when someone tells them different.
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distressed
09-20-2010, 08:17 AM
Originally Posted by squiggle
You're a wahaabi if you don't believe in khatums according to many people ;D
thats what i used to think too. Im guilty of saying that to my sister when she tried telling me about this biddah stuff. I was uneducated in islam, still am, but we learn from our mistakes.

this is pakistani mentality, and everyone says it to those that dont take part in biddah.
Reply

distressed
09-20-2010, 08:19 AM
Originally Posted by manaal


To Thread starter:

Sister do you want to fall out with your family just for the sake of this khatham? Family ties are very important in Islam, and so is the spreading of the true message. Boycotting the even will not sere any good purpose. I don't know how a khatham is conducted in your community, but in mine (we call it "kaththam") there are some recitals followed by lunch. I usually skip the recitals and join the family for the meal. It is important for me attend because it is one of those rare occasions where the whole extended family get to meet in one place (our "family kaththam" is meant for my Great-grand parents). If I'm early, I don't join in the recitations. Allah know what my intentions are, and Insha Allah he will not punish me for attending a family gathering.

I suggest you speak to your siblings about this and explain to them why it is wrong. Our beloved Prophet never did it and annual events/celebrations are forbidden in Islam as they are pagan practices. Only the two Eids are allowed.

Alhamdulillah, brother naidamar, my parents too have forbidden us from this. And my mom's family do not do this for their parents either.

I dont wana fall out with anyone, esp as everyone is still struggling with whats happened the last few years. We already have divides in the family. This is important to me. Your right i cant really boycott it, i wouldnt feel right, and I wud be seen as the uncaring daughter, whos not bothered. I shouldnt really care what others think, but I do, and the last thing i would want is to cause any more upset esp to my mother, our relationship is hardly a good one.

a khatham in our community consists of people reading the quran/surahs etc, and its all recorded and the imam apparently includes whats been read in his dua, which is then followed by food. some imams usually take money, although i think this is merely for the mosque. Last year, I myself only recited surahs, this year ive not done anything.

On the day were expected to have people round, so I cant sit back and let everyone else work. I feel like i have to contribute in some way if not in the reading, then surely it would be ok, to look after guests who arrive, and general prep of food etc. Like you I hope allah knows my intentions too.
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Insaanah
09-20-2010, 09:50 AM
Originally Posted by distressed
a khatham in our community consists of people reading the quran/surahs etc, and its all recorded and the imam apparently includes whats been read in his dua, which is then followed by food. some imams usually take money, although i think this is merely for the mosque. Last year, I myself only recited surahs, this year ive not done anything.
:sl: sister,

I am sorry to hear about your father. May Allah forgive him, have mercy on him, save him from the punishment of the grave, and admit him into Jannatul Firdous without reckoning. Ameen.

The saddest thing out of all this, is how much benefit is the deceased, in whose name it's all being done, getting out of it?

We should make du'a for the deceased, however... "With regard to reading Qur’aan, there is some difference of opinion among the scholars as to whether the reward from that will reach the deceased. According to the more correct of the two opinions, it does not reach them, because there is no evidence to that effect, and because the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) did not do that for the Muslims who died, such as his daughters who died during his lifetime, neither did the Sahaabah (may Allaah be pleased with them all) did not do that either, as far as we know. So it is better for the believer not to do that and not to read Qur’aan for either the dead or the living...."

"The basic principle regarding acts of worship is to refrain from everything except that which is proven to be enjoined by Allaah or by His Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him)."

Source

May Allah make things easy for you sister and help you remain steadfast. Ameen.

:sl:
Reply

cat eyes
09-21-2010, 02:33 PM
Originally Posted by distressed
Salaam

Sis Cats-eyes, making up something just to get out of it, wouldnt that be classed as a lie ? I cant pretend im sick.

naidamar-Ive always been told the same, that its a way maybe getting forgiveness for the deceased on their behalf. Although we only do it for the one day.
of course you can lie when you don't want to take part in evil or do you want to just come out and say ''HELL NO IM NOT GOING'' and hurt your parents feelings in the process.

ive lied many times when my dad wanted me to go to christcian masses.. i told him i was sick because i didnt want to hurt my dad. i do go to the church but not when their is a mass held i make up for it that way. you really have to be extremely careful how you deal with your family and slowly and gently give them dawah.

i have experience so i know now my dad does not mind me wearing hijab. i never jump down his throat and say i cant go here and i can't go their. this would sound extreme to your family because they don't have knowledge.

also try giving them dawah as best you can.

this is called tact
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Mokhan24
04-19-2017, 11:05 AM
People have there own opinions and spread what satisfies them... biggest indication of this is what these mullahs spread of Islam and Jihad etc... how they poisons minds of the gullible and innocents and the state of Islam in today's world is a mess all thanks to these forums. The Quran is simple to follow, there a do's and dont's and isn't rocket science but people like to poison others minds. My advise is, the Almighty gave everyone a brain to use and to think. Use your brain and follow from there. Be it if you are a Sunni, Shia, Wahabi, Deobandi, Barelvi etc... follow your beliefs and dont meddle with anyone else. End of...
Reply

Aaqib
04-19-2017, 11:32 AM
Originally Posted by Mokhan24
People have there own opinions and spread what satisfies them... biggest indication of this is what these mullahs spread of Islam and Jihad etc... how they poisons minds of the gullible and innocents and the state of Islam in today's world is a mess all thanks to these forums. The Quran is simple to follow, there a do's and dont's and isn't rocket science but people like to poison others minds. My advise is, the Almighty gave everyone a brain to use and to think. Use your brain and follow from there. Be it if you are a Sunni, Shia, Wahabi, Deobandi, Barelvi etc... follow your beliefs and dont meddle with anyone else. End of...
Oh i've seen your name on several exposing ex-muslims videos
Reply

Supernova
04-19-2017, 12:19 PM
Originally Posted by distressed
:sl:

I would like to know islamically what can a muslim do on someone's death anniversary ? I live in community where khatham practice is the norm esp for deaths. since joining this board, and reading/learning more on islam ive realised this isnt permissable and is actually biddah.

In October its gona be a year since my father has passed, at home we will be having a khatham. There will also be people reading not on that day, but weeks in advance.

Me being 1 of his daughters too, what can i do ?
also im still expected to attend and help out on the day, but does this make me a hypocrite? if i dont take part in this biddah ? but still contribute my help somewhere at home like the cookin etc ?
also should i read ?

D
Asalaamualaykum

With all due respect but Berelwis can never make up their mind on issues.

When it comes to Rasool SAW they celebrate his birth in respect.

When a family member passes away they have a katham on the same date every year that the person passed away in respect of that person.

Make up your mind - do you show respect for someone on the day they born or the day they pass away ??????

The fact that you have a special day prophets birth and then contrary have a special day for a family members death just shows the utter confusion of that issue.

So forget the biddah factor for now and just note the inconsistency in the ruling.
Reply

Mokhan24
04-19-2017, 12:33 PM
Originally Posted by Aaqib
Oh i've seen your name on several exposing ex-muslims videos
You got the wrong guy brother... I've just joined this forum and is the only forum I've ever joined... lesson to be learnt... dont jump to assumptions, ask before hand
Reply

Aaqib
04-21-2017, 01:20 AM
Originally Posted by Mokhan24
You got the wrong guy brother... I've just joined this forum and is the only forum I've ever joined... lesson to be learnt... dont jump to assumptions, ask before hand
Though brother, I said your name, not "You".. got ya there bro :p
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