Moving out haram or halal?

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Leela

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As you have just read ^ is it haram or halal for an unmarried Muslim girl to move out if she is being abused emotionally, physically and being neglected e.g. Not allowed to eat food everyone else is eating etc. This is causing her to be depressed & have anxiety since childhood and is also malnourished.

if she is allowed to move out is it haram for her to own a dog for protection and emotional support.
 
So this girl wants to move out because she is being abused and neglected....and she feels so insecure that she needs a dog for protection?
Something tells me...this girl has a difficult personality which is the main cause of the conflicts at home...and this desire to have a dog was one of the items she and her parents could not agree about...
Am İ right?
 
If your being abused and neglected then you need to seek help. I dont see why a dog would be any help tho
 
Assalamu Alaikum

It would be impermissible for a girl to live alone without a mahrem. Also it makes no sense that food is one of the issues. If you're going to live alone, wouldn't you need to find a way to feed yourself and the dog you want to have? So why are you malnourished at all if you have the capabilities of nourishing yourself? And what is it you'd need protection from that you'd need a dog?

There are things which are not adding up here and this course of action seems quite immature. I wouldn't suggest any girl run away or move out of her family's home especially when there's no valid context.
 
If this is serious and that girl lives in the U.S. she should contact Child Protective Services so they can investigate it.
 
Misbah-Abd said:
If this is serious and that girl lives in the U.S. she should contact Child Protective Services so they can investigate it.
Click to expand...

So imagine you have a major conflict with your parents. They neglect you...they abuse you...
You have the opportunity to move out...and live on your own...if it is halal of course...but you do not want disappear so quitly...you want revenge...you want to see your parents burn...so you call child protective services and turn your parents in...

This is good advice according to you?
 
It is difficult for third parties to give a responsible answer one must know more facts....I do agree something doesn't add up, if the parents are abusive and neglectful...and the girl feels she has no choice but to move, and making that choice for herself, I don't see how having a dog would be a conflict.... personally we don't know the young lass or her parents... so no-one can make a sound judgment or give clear advice..or options that may help both parents and young person to find the middle ground and compromise... our days had a different respect and valued our parents guidance...now days children feel they should be able to explore clubbing, drinking, dating freely, taking drugs and parents have to set harsher boundaries.... and for a young person that cannot seen as abuse....both parents working can be seen as neglect... where the need of having a dog for protection ...it's not a haram or halal matter...rather what is reasonable and sensible for her circumstance....this is where family mediators come in handy, who have enough information from both sides to help support the right decision ...and hope that's the avenue she looks into..

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Little confused how this ended up here..lol sorry was meant for the another post I wrote under, will delete the above not to cause confusion.. saying this brother ...heartbreak isn't an easy thing to deal with..and today to you get generation do not know what commitment actually means...and therefor as young people are so desperately looking for love ...they have yet to learn about love....in this situation my young friend...you have every reason to request she doesn't contact you as you need this time to continue healing from the heartbreak... we can make things easy for ourselves or difficult....if you feel it is hindering your process ...don't be afraid to request for no contact... sometimes we are a catalyst for one another to come close to God and coming to understand the reality of life and how Devine structure wishes to protect us...always ask for guidance from Allaah...you will find peace in it...
 
umie said:
So imagine you have a major conflict with your parents. They neglect you...they abuse you...
You have the opportunity to move out...and live on your own...if it is halal of course...but you do not want disappear so quitly...you want revenge...you want to see your parents burn...so you call child protective services and turn your parents in...

This is good advice according to you?
Click to expand...

I said "IF THIS IS SERIOUS" I don't know if English is your primary language since you live in Germany but my statement contained a condition. And if it is true then she as a minor has a right to contact authorities so they can determine the seriousness of it.
 
It is difficult for third parties to give a responsible answer one must know more facts....I do agree something doesn't add up, if the parents are abusive and neglectful...and the girl feels she has no choice but to move, and making that choice for herself, I don't see how having a dog would be a conflict.... personally we don't know the young lass or her parents... so no-one can make a sound judgment or give clear advice..or options that may help both parents and young person to find the middle ground and compromise... our days had a different respect and valued our parents guidance...now days children feel they should be able to explore clubbing, drinking, dating freely, taking drugs and parents have to set harsher boundaries.... and for a young person that cannot seen as abuse....both parents working can be seen as neglect... where the need of having a dog for protection ...it's not a haram or halal matter...rather what is reasonable and sensible for her circumstance....this is where family mediators come in handy, who have enough information from both sides to help support the right decision ...and hope that's the avenue she looks into..
 
Misbah-Abd said:
If this is serious and that girl lives in the U.S. she should contact Child Protective Services so they can investigate it.
Click to expand...

I'd agree with you bro, but at the very least someone who has any issues with their family would try to find a solution first before thinking of leaving their family or reporting them. It seems like this could be a case of teen angst and she's looking for any excuse to leave and teach them a lesson. We don't know the full story though but by what is being stated, this doesn't seem too genuine. We don't know what she defines as physical or emotional abuse. Sometimes if a parent punishes or disciplines the child, it's seen that way.

If it were indeed abuse, then that's a different story of course, but there's a lot of alternatives to leaving the house. She could, for example, stay at a relatives house, seek help from a local masjid, speak to a counselor, etc.
 
Why's everyone being a little harsh to op
Sometimes families can be brutal in the way they treat each other, maybe she needs to move out for her own sanity
 
Leela said:
As you have just read ^ is it haram or halal for an unmarried Muslim girl to move out if she is being abused emotionally, physically and being neglected e.g. Not allowed to eat food everyone else is eating etc. This is causing her to be depressed & have anxiety since childhood and is also malnourished.

if she is allowed to move out is it haram for her to own a dog for protection and emotional support.
Click to expand...

Is it all happening with you in family
 
eesa the kiwi said:
Why's everyone being a little harsh to op
Sometimes families can be brutal in the way they treat each other, maybe she needs to move out for her own sanity
Click to expand...

İ am not being harsh. İ agree...sometimes families can be brutal. İt may be the case here too...however...99% of the time both sides are more or less to blame.
İf you read through her story...it sounds legit at first sight...but then, when you read about the dog, it gets suspicious.
She is talking about abuse. She is talking about neglection. She talks about leaving the house...all three are heavy threats...a serious problem....
Then she talks about wanting a dog. She even thought about how to justify the dog...it protects and give comfort.
İ might be wrong on this one but according to me...this sounds like she is not telling the whole truth.
And of course...no one should be abused...and she should seek help if she really gets abused...
But İ would not advise her to move out and take a dog based on this story alone.

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eesa the kiwi said:
Why's everyone being a little harsh to op
Sometimes families can be brutal in the way they treat each other, maybe she needs to move out for her own sanity
Click to expand...

İ am not being harsh. İ agree...sometimes families can be brutal. İt may be the case here too...however...99% of the time both sides are more or less to blame.
İf you read through her story...it sounds legit at first sight...but then, when you read about the dog, it gets suspicious.
She is talking about abuse. She is talking about neglection. She talks about leaving the house...all three are heavy threats...a serious problem....
Then she talks about wanting a dog. She even thought about how to justify the dog...it protects and give comfort.
İ might be wrong on this one but according to me...this sounds like she is not telling the whole truth.
And of course...no one should be abused...and she should seek help if she really gets abused...
But İ would not advise her to move out and take a dog based on this story alone.
 
Islam is not impractical... we live in reality..the real world where I'm sure many people in the past lived by themselves, not everyone has family nor friends who will take responsibility...most problems we face today are not new, again haram and halal the issue here.....we can't make everything haram or halal...there are clear mentions what harm and halal are in the Quran....Muslim's are making Islam far more complicated than it is...and hence further chaos is created for many matters...a woman travelled alone even then ..not everyone woman has a merham..so Islam will not discriminate..God doesn't...what complication man creates out of it is a different matter...the idea a lady being alone has nothing to do with halal or haram...so permissiblity isn't an issue, if it is to protect her from harm...we have to again review the reality and be practical..and a dog certainly isn't how sadly man has been bombarded or brainwashed to think..we do need to come out of some unreasonable thinking that doesn't match God's ways...the reason why Muslim's are so behind ...common sense becomes difficult because we deprive ourselves of reasonable thinking...
 
Same girl let me elaborate a little bit, I live in the UK so if I move out I get help from the council to get food pay bills etc.

Ive been abused since childhood, and out of my siblings it was only me who has been abused.

What at I mean by emotional abuse is getting home from school, constantly told that I am fat (I've starved myself and lost a lot of weight now even tho I was skinny already I was a size 8) have been told that I've ruined my mothers life, that she doesn't want me, that she doesn't love me, that she would kill me if she could, that I am unworthy, that I will go to hell etc.

What at I mean by physical abuse is my mum would hit me using objects to the point that it would break, she did this since childhood, I self harmed as a child but I didn't know what it meant, I do now and I don't self harm. And just last month I didn't hear her calling my name, she pulled me by the hair dragged me out of bed, I was exposed from hip down, my dad was there and I was crying.

As for the neglect happened since childhood too but emotional abuse didn't start till I was a teen and that hurt me the most more than anything. I told my mum I was depressed and didn't realise she was emotionally abusing me until later on when we were learning about it. And guess what she didn't care I would go to her every single day hoping she would say something to me, anything! But she didn't.

She he said the only good thing I'll be is for marrying off, I've had to live with this my whole life, I've had depression and anxiety, she would never let me leave the house so I live in social isolation now I'm in college, and I can't take it anymore just last month I tried to hang myself.

Why I wanted a dog was if I live on my own I'll have no one to protect me, it would also help me emotionally because I'd have to get out of bed to help the dog (feed him, walk him etc)

does this add up now, my mood goes down every time I'm home and I can't take it anymore!
 
I would like to add that I threatened to move out and all I got was a laugh, I got told that I will have no money (though I know I will) that I will come crawling back, I got told moving out will only ruin the family reputation that's all they care about NOT ME. That I will go to hell if I move out, I still want to stay in contact with them because their my family, I still care from regardless what they did to me, but they all told me if I move out that they will cut contact from me an that I can never come back. I know they care about family reputation since my aunt killed herself and they covered it up by saying it was an asthma attack.
 
hi sis, being a parent myself, im now privileged to see both sides, and one thing i do agree is this honour thing that is so drilled in us, there is an imbalance in understanding. i was having a difficult time letting go of my daughter to go to uni, its painful, why because she is my baby, and i cant protect her, she is left to the vulnerability of the elements, but her reasoning, level headedness and her pursuit in in what she wants to do, has given me the courage to not step in her way.. its not easy for a parent, because we feel responsible if something happends, we know we are going to deal with the 'i should have put my foot down' nagging voice.. i dont know your parents, but i know our thinking, parents will say things in anger, make stupid comments that are not mature,they also do have great fear, there are so many emotions going inside them, that yes seem selfish, but are really about protection and will use any way to protect and hence the control.. parents doesn't make us perfect.. where society is concerned yes, sadly it does have hindrance in our ability to grow.. speak to them with reason and if you retaliate it will only make things difficult, contemplate on your reasons, question if in yourself you also have been fairgiving, once upon a time we got smacked, even an odd shoe thrown, and we never saw it as wrong, because our parents wouldnt loose their temper until we knew when it happend, we did test them.. :) we knew where we claimed that right and it did get us to realise how we pushed their buttons.. they didnt do it to abuse, but to discipline, even though for children now adays that seems abuse, we actually knew, because we were loved, maybe that is why.... just at least, give yourself a little time, and observe how your also projecting yourself... is there anything that is also a contributory from your side that you can recognise that is rebelling see before you make up your mind... if your life is in danger, than by all means take the step, but remember the world out there isnt easy.. you will come across many shifty characters in sheeps clothing.. what i do see, is a child wanting so desperately to live under her own rules, i see this in my own daughter..and i could be very wrong, but learning to live with others prepares us for our future, when we marry, it teaches us to learn to give and take.. or in my better words with the more evolved souls, offering and receiving, as that is what takes place with such relationships.. Ask Guidance from Allaah always before making your decision, be honest and sincere with your own reasons.. and in sha Allaah i pray the best comes out of it for you..

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and for all concerned.. :)
 
Leela1 said:
Same girl let me elaborate a little bit, I live in the UK so if I move out I get help from the council to get food pay bills etc.

Ive been abused since childhood, and out of my siblings it was only me who has been abused.

What at I mean by emotional abuse is getting home from school, constantly told that I am fat (I've starved myself and lost a lot of weight now even tho I was skinny already I was a size 8) have been told that I've ruined my mothers life, that she doesn't want me, that she doesn't love me, that she would kill me if she could, that I am unworthy, that I will go to hell etc.

What at I mean by physical abuse is my mum would hit me using objects to the point that it would break, she did this since childhood, I self harmed as a child but I didn't know what it meant, I do now and I don't self harm. And just last month I didn't hear her calling my name, she pulled me by the hair dragged me out of bed, I was exposed from hip down, my dad was there and I was crying.

As for the neglect happened since childhood too but emotional abuse didn't start till I was a teen and that hurt me the most more than anything. I told my mum I was depressed and didn't realise she was emotionally abusing me until later on when we were learning about it. And guess what she didn't care I would go to her every single day hoping she would say something to me, anything! But she didn't.

She he said the only good thing I'll be is for marrying off, I've had to live with this my whole life, I've had depression and anxiety, she would never let me leave the house so I live in social isolation now I'm in college, and I can't take it anymore just last month I tried to hang myself.

Why I wanted a dog was if I live on my own I'll have no one to protect me, it would also help me emotionally because I'd have to get out of bed to help the dog (feed him, walk him etc)

does this add up now, my mood goes down every time I'm home and I can't take it anymore!
Click to expand...

Having a bit more context helps. It seems your mom is controlling and I'm not making any excuses for her because what she's doing is wrong, however I still don't think running away is the solution. I'm wondering if you and your mom butt heads a lot compared to your other siblings? There's something you're not mentioning because it looks like your mom is reacting to your behavior or actions (not that what you're doing deserves that type of reaction) as if you leading a lifestyle she does not agree with compared to your siblings. Would you agree with that? I'm also going to guess your parents are not originally from the UK right? Maybe from your mom's perspective this is how she disciplines but she doesn't fully understand the implications of her methods.
 
*charisma* said:
Having a bit more context helps. It seems your mom is controlling and I'm not making any excuses for her because what she's doing is wrong, however I still don't think running away is the solution. I'm wondering if you and your mom butt heads a lot compared to your other siblings? There's something you're not mentioning because it looks like your mom is reacting to your behavior or actions (not that what you're doing deserves that type of reaction) as if you leading a lifestyle she does not agree with compared to your siblings. Would you agree with that? I'm also going to guess your parents are not originally from the UK right? Maybe from your mom's perspective this is how she disciplines but she doesn't fully understand the implications of her methods.
Click to expand...

No ive always listened to her, ALWAYS. It makes me sick that some people here think I'm some sort of rebellious teenager, I've been mature since I was 6, I've always listened to my parents. She just hits me for no reason, she also hit me when I've done things wrong like accidentally broke something as a kid which I understand was to teach myself a lesson. But to randomly hit me, and to eat my food off of my own piss when I wet the bed at the age of 6. Do you think that's excusable? See I've held this anger all my life now I feel like some sort of monster. If I shouldn't leave what should I do? Wait till I hang myself. Please just put yourself in my shoes for one second. Maybe the people who think I'm being stuck up are illicit and can't understand what I'm saying. 30% of those who are abused turn to abuse their own children I am one of those 30%. Now all I can ask is....is it haram or halal no one answered my question other than judge me I am almost 20 now, all you can think about is your life, I know the worlds is not easy I've been sexually assaulted before no one cares oOOo very surprised. NOT. Now answer my question so I can make a decision that can be life changing, I either stay and get married off to an old man because obviously I have no choice whilst being abused or see what the worlds has to offer
 

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