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Shorty x
10-02-2007, 01:03 PM
salaamz.....

hope someone can help me

In my home town over the summer, a couple of young muslim lads had committed suicide, both are not connected, but similar age, 24-25,
it is a sin to commit suicide, so why do it?
it hit us pretty hard as we knew both boys who passed away

i was wondering, what happens to them, in the hereafter, do they get same treatment as everyone else?

w'salaams
shorty
xx
Reply

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Ibn Al Aqwa
10-02-2007, 02:03 PM
:sl:

Narrated Thabit bin Ad-Dahhak

The Prophet said, "Whoever swears by a religion other than Islam, is, as he says; and whoever commits suicide with something, will be punished with the same thing in the (Hell) Fire; and cursing a believer is like murdering him; and whoever accuses a believer of disbelief, then it is as if he had killed him."

(Bukhari)
so in other words, lets say they drowned themselves (for example) they will drown repeatedly in the hereafter

and just to elaborate...

Narrated Abu Huraira-

The Prophet said, "He who commits suicide by throttling shall keep on throttling himself in the Hell Fire (forever) and he who commits suicide by stabbing himself shall keep on stabbing himself in the Hell-Fire."

(Bukhari)
:w:
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IbnAbdulHakim
10-02-2007, 02:05 PM
subhanAllah, our local turkish masjid also informed us of two muslim youths that have recently committed suicide. Audhubillah :(

the sin is scary, you continue doing that which you murdered urself with infinity amount of times.

Allah help us..
Reply

Shorty x
10-03-2007, 12:34 PM
Salaamz

Thank you,

What is someone who commits suicide is not in the right state of mind, and suffered from a mental illness, paranoya, depression etc. resulting from abusing drugs?

Is it still the same case?

w'salaamz
Reply

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IbnAbdulHakim
10-03-2007, 12:35 PM
^ all we can say is Allahu A'lam, if someone is not in the right state of mind then doesnt it become someone elses responsibility to take care of the person?
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sevgi
10-03-2007, 12:38 PM
i dnt know why u thought it was valid to post that...but i hope noone ever goes through such depression...it is not pretty and very hard to abate and get rid of.

i hope peace and blessings upon all my LI and other bros and siss.

salams.
Reply

Re.TiReD
10-03-2007, 02:42 PM
:salamext:

None of you should long for death, for if he is a good man he may increase his good deeds and if he is an evildoer, he may stop the evil deeds and repent (Bukhaari)

May Allah help and guide us all. Ameen :w:
Reply

Anwarica
10-03-2007, 03:26 PM
:sl:
When I was a kid, I didn't exert any effort to realize that suicide is non-sense .. one should ask oneself, where is he/she going eventually?

In addition, I didn't create myself to give myself the right to end my life .. thus, it's Amanah.

What is someone who commits suicide is not in the right state of mind, and suffered from a mental illness, paranoya, depression etc. resulting from abusing drugs?

Is it still the same case?
Islamic rules are executed for sane and adult personnels. :)
Reply

bewildred
10-03-2007, 03:44 PM
Please help me with the following : If Allah (sws) has written everyone's death's day.... How come people commit suicide????

S.
Reply

Woodrow
10-03-2007, 11:50 PM
Having more then a few days experience as a psychologist. I never found a case of attempted suicide in which the person would be considered legaly sane or rational. Naturally, I never interviewed anybody who succeeded at it and do not know if they died sane and in full control of their actions. However, with the attempts that I did have contact with the most common cause was clinical depression, which is a physical disease that manifests itself in depressed thinking. It is a disease easily treated if diagnose. the second largest group were those diagnosed with Bi-Polar disorder. The final out come of BPD is suicide unless it is treated. Oddly most people with Bi-polar are most likely to attempt suicide while they are in an elated state than in a depressed state, they can not seem to comprehend they will not survive suicide.

Just my opinion, I believe most suicides are not by sane, rational people, although the family and those close to them may not see that the person is incapable of caring for his/her self. I just know Allah(swt) is all just and all merciful and I do not believe anybody will ever be punished without just cause. In other words only if the suicide is a deliberate controlled act, that the person understands and has the ability to stop.
Reply

Khayal
10-04-2007, 02:40 AM
Originally Posted by Shorty x
salaamz.....

hope someone can help me

In my home town over the summer, a couple of young muslim lads had committed suicide, both are not connected, but similar age, 24-25,
it is a sin to commit suicide, so why do it?
it hit us pretty hard as we knew both boys who passed away

i was wondering, what happens to them, in the hereafter, do they get same treatment as everyone else?

w'salaams
shorty
xx

:sl:

Sister, I hope you find this article helpful. InshaAllah.

:arabic6:

Suicide


:salamext:
The confusion on what is suicide and who may be targeted in war

A small minority of Muslims (who are not in the category of those who have nullified their Islam*) misunderstand the word shaheed (martyr) when it comes to war and the act of suicide.
Muslims may engage in defensive wars and if they happen to die in this way, doing it for the sake of Allah, insha'Allah they die shaheed, and as we know, a shaheed may attain paradise.

Hadith - Sahih Bukhari 1:35, Narrated Abu Huraira
The Prophet said, "The person who participates in (Holy battles) in Allah's cause and nothing compels him to do so except belief in Allah and His Apostles, will be recompensed by Allah either with a reward, or booty (if he survives) or will be admitted to Paradise (if he is killed in the battle as a martyr). Had I not found it difficult for my followers, then I would not remain behind any sariya going for Jihad and I would have loved to be martyred in Allah's cause and then made alive, and then martyred and then made alive, and then again martyred in His cause."

Some Muslims incorrectly think that suicidal bombings during war is not suicide but an act of defensive war. They see it the same as fighting with guns or swords in a war. However, shooting in a war, one goes in with the intention NOT to die. Using oneself as a walking or flying bomb, one goes in with the intention of killing oneself (and the perceived enemy).
Sometimes a Muslim may have enough knowledge to quote the hadith in which it was said that the companions of Prophet Muhammad (saaws) would throw their bodies on top of the Prophet and were willing to take a hit for him. However, this does not mean they were intending to kill themselves! This means they were willing to perhaps take an attack to an arm or leg to prevent death to the Prophet saaws. Or that they would shield him and escort him to safety, and by shielding him, preventing the enemy from striking at that moment since the Prophet couldn't be clearly seen in the crowd. Putting oneself at risk is not the same thing as intending to do an act that would surely kill oneself!
As we know, the religion of Islam is based upon intentions, as we are judged according to our intentions. A good deed is not accepted by Allah if we have intentions other than doing it for the sake of Allah, or if it is not in accordance with Quran and Sunnah.
SUICIDAL BOMBINGS ARE AN ACT OF WAR **AND** SUICIDE and therefore haram (prohibited) since suicide (INTENTIONALLY KILLING ONESELF) is such a terrible sin with terrible consequences.
In addition, such Muslims are completely unaware of the ayat (proof) against killing women and children. Ignorance is so sad. And any haram act by any Muslim anywhere, hurts the Muslim ummah as a whole. Hadith - Al-Muwatta 21.9 (Similar proofs in 21.8, 21.10, and 21.11) Yahya related to me from Malik from Nafi from Ibn Umar that the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, saw the corpse of a woman who had been slain in one of the raids, and he disapproved of it and forbade the killing of women and children.
Of course if any woman or child is shooting directly at you, it is permissible to act in self-defense to an immediate situation, but (unarmed) women and children cannot be an intentional target during war or any such attacks. And of course, Islam does not support women in military, but it does permit an individual woman to pick up a weapon to use in self-defense if a specific situation dictates that. The general intent is to shield women and children from the brutal fatalities of a war front altogether and to place the responsibility on the men in society to protect them.
*see http://muttaqun.com/kuf.html for a list of what disqualifies a person from being Muslim despite their claim to be Muslim, keeping in mind that Allah is the only One who knows the true status of any person as a believer or disbeliever and Allah alone knows who will enter paradise or hell. Muslims are at all different levels of faith, some committing many sins, some very little, and this should be recognized. The Muslims are one nation, a nation that must punish its own, according to the law of Quran and Sunnah, and that must pray for one another in Muslim unity.



Hadith - Bukhari 2:445, Narrated Thabit bin Ad-Dahhak
The Prophet said, "Whoever intentionally swears falsely by a religion other than Islam, then he is what he has said, (e.g. if he says, 'If such thing is not true then I am a Jew,' he is really a Jew). And whoever commits suicide with piece of iron will be punished with the same piece of iron in the Hell Fire." Narrated Jundab the Prophet said, "A man was inflicted with wounds and he committed suicide, and so Allah said: My slave has caused death on himself hurriedly, so I forbid Paradise for him."




Hadith - Bukhari 7:576, Narrated Qais bin Abi Hazim, see also Bukhari 8:361, 438

We went to pay a visit to Khabbab (who was sick) and he had been branded (cauterized) at seven places in his body. He said, "Our companions who died (during the lifetime of the Prophet ) left (this world) without having their rewards reduced through enjoying the pleasures of this life, but we have got (so much) wealth that we find no way to spend it except on the construction of buildings. Had the Prophet not forbidden us to wish for death, I would have wished for it." We visited him for the second time while he was building a wall. He said, -A Muslim is rewarded (in the Hereafter) for whatever he spends except for something that he spends on building."

Hadith - Bukhari 7:670, Narrated Abu Huraira


The Prophet said, "Whoever purposely throws himself from a mountain and kills himself, will be in the (Hell) Fire falling down into it and abiding therein perpetually forever; and whoever drinks poison and kills himself with it, he will be carrying his poison in his hand and drinking it in the (Hell) Fire wherein he will abide eternally forever; and whoever kills himself with an iron weapon, will be carrying that weapon in his hand and stabbing his abdomen with it in the (Hell) Fire wherein he will abide eternally forever."

Hadith - Muslim #6485 Hammam b. Munabbih said: Abu Huraira narrated to us ahadith from Allah's Messenger and out of these one is that Allah's Messenger said: none amongst you should make a request for death, and do not call for it before it comes, for when any of you dies, he ceases (to do good) deeds and the life of a believer is not prolonged but for goodness.



Hadith - Muslim #6480
Anas (b. Malik) reported Allah's Messenger as saying: None of you should make a request for death because of the trouble in which he is involved, but if there is no other help to it, then say: O Allah, keep me alive as long as there is goodness in life for me and bring death to me when there is goodness in death for me.






Hadith - Al-Tirmidhi #1613, Narrated Jabin ibn Abdullah [Ahmad transmitted it.]
Allah's Messenger said, "Do not wish for death, for the terror of the place whence one looks down is severe. It is part of a man's happiness that his life should be long and Allah Who is Great and Glorious, should supply him with repentance."



Hadith - Qudsi 28

There was amongst those before you a man who had a wound. He was in [such] anguish that he took a knife and made with it a cut in his hand, and the blood did not cease to flow till he died. Allah the Almighty said: My servant has himself forestalled Me; I have forbidden him Paradise.

The Noble Qur'an - An-Nisa 4:29

...And do not kill yourselves (nor kill one another). Surely, Allah is Most Merciful to you.

Ruling of Scholar of Today's Times - Sheikh Ibn 'Uthaymeen - Kayfa Nu'aalij Waaqi'unaa al-Aleem - Page 119


Question: What is the ruling regarding acts of jihaad by means of suicide, such as attaching explosives to a car and storming the enemy, whereby he knows without a doubt that he shall die as a result of this action?


Response: Indeed, my opinion is that he is regarded as one who has killed himself (committed suicide), and as a result he shall be punished in Hell, for that which is authenticated on the authority of the Prophet (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam).
[((Indeed, whoever (intentionally) kills himself, then certainly he will be punished in the Fire of Hell, wherein he shall dwell forever)), [Bukhaaree (5778) and Muslim (109 and 110)]].
However, one who is ignorant and does not know, and assumes his action was good and pleasing to Allaah (Subhaanahu wa Ta'aala), then we hope Allaah (Subhaanahu wa Ta'aala) forgives him for that which he did out of (ignorant) ijtihaad, even though I do not find any excuse for him in the present day. This is because this type of suicide is well known and widespread amongst the people, so it is upon the person to ask the people of knowledge (scholars) regarding it, until the right guidance for him is differentiated from the error.
And from that which is surprising, is that these people kill themselves despite Allaah having fordbidden this, as He (Subhaanahu wa Ta'aala) says:

{And do not kill yourselves. Surely, Allaah is Most Merciful to you},
[Soorah an-Nisaa., Aayah 29].
And many amongst them do not desire anything except revenge of the enemy, by whatever means, be it halaal or haraam. So they only want to satisfy their thirst for revenge.
We ask Allaah to bless us with foresight in His Deen and action(s) which please Him, indeed He is all Powerful over all things.


Ruling of Scholar of Today's Times - Shaykh Ibn 'Uthaymeen (Rahimahu 'Llah)- Kayfa Nu'aalij Waaqi'unaa al-Aleem - Page 120


Question: What is the ruling regarding suicide in Islaam?


Response: Suicide is when a person kills himself intentionally by whatever means. This is haraam and regarded as amongst the major sins, and likewise included in the general statement of Allaah (Subhaanahu wa Ta'aala):
{And whoever kills a believer intentionally, his recompense is Hell to abide therein, and the Wrath and the Curse of Allaah are upon him, and a great punishment is prepared for him}, [Soorah an-Nisaa, Aayah 93].
And it is established from the Sunnah on the authority of the Prophet (sal-Allaahu `alayhe wa sallam) who said:
((Indeed, whoever (intentionally) kills himself, then certainly he will be punished in the Fire of Hell, wherein he shall dwell forever)), [Bukhaaree (5778) and Muslim (109 and 110)].
In reality, the one who commits suicide, generally does so because of his desperate situation, either as a direct result of an act of Allaah or a human being. So you find him unable to cope with that which has afflicted him, and in actual fact he is like one who is calling for help from the scorching heat of the fire. So he has progressed from that which was tough (bad) to that which is worse. And if he was patient, then Allaah would have assisted him in dealing with the difficulty.


Ruling of Scholar of Today's Times - Kitaab Majmoo’ Fataawa wa Maqaalaat Mutanawwi’ah li Samaahat al-Shaykh ‘Abd al-‘Azeez ibn ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Baaz (may Allaah have mercy on him) – vol. 13, p. 122
A person who has killed himself should be washed, prayed over and buried with the Muslims, because he is a sinner but he is not a kaafir. Killing oneself is a sin but it is not kufr. If he killed himself – we seek refuge with Allaah – he should be washed, shrouded and prayed over, but the khaleefah and important people should not pray for him, by way of rebuke, lest anyone think that they approve of what he did. If the khaleefah, ruler, judges, president or mayor do not pray over him in order to denounce this action and announce that it is wrong, then this is good, but some of the Muslims should still offer the (funeral) prayer for him.


The following excerpt is taken from the book, "The Inevitable Journey Part 3: Funerals - Regulations and Exhortations by Muhammad al-Jibaly.

PRAYING FOR THE SINFUL

Sinful Muslims
As stated earlier, the janazah prayer must be offered even for a faajir (a corrupt person or sinner who had indulged in disobedience and transgression), such as one who did not pray [regularly*], did not pay zakah, was an alcohol addict, used to commit zinaa, and so on. However, those who are respected for their knowledge and piety in the community should attempt not to attend, as a form of punishment and reprimand for people like him. This was the practice of the Prophet (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam), as in the hadith of Zayd Bin Khalid (in the beginning of this chapter) regarding the man who stole from the booty.
Also, Abu Qatadah (radiyAllahu 'anhu) reported that when Allah's Messenger (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) was invited to pray janazah he would inquire about the deceased. If he is praised as having been good, he (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) would stand and pray for him. But is he is described as having been otherwise, he (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) would tell his family, "You take care of him." And he (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) would not pray for him.
And Jabir Bin Samurah (radiyAllahu 'anhu) reported that a man fell ill, and his family wailed over him. His neighbor came to Allah's Messenger (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) and told him that he died. The Prophet (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) asked him "How did you know?" The man replied, "I saw him." He (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) said, "He did not die." So he went back and heard the wailing again. His wife said, "Go to Allah's Messenger and tell him (about the wailing)." The man said, "May Allah curse him." Then he went to his neigbor's house and found that he had cut his throat with a knife. He went to the Prophet (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) and told him that he died. He (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) again asked him, "How did you know?" He replied, "I saw him cutting his throat with a blade that he had with him." He (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) asked "You saw him do that?" He said, "Yes." The Prophet (sallAllahu 'alaihi wa sallam) said, "Then I will not pray janazah for him." (Recorded by Muslim, Abu Dawud and others)
At-Tirmithi said:
This is a good hadith. The people of knowledge have differed about this; some of them say that the Muslims should pray for everyone who faces the Qiblah in prayer, and for the one who commits suicide. This is the opinion of Sufyan at-Thawri and Ishaq. Ahmad said, 'The imam should not pray for the one who commits suicide, but other people than the imam should.'" (Sunan ut-Tirmithi)
Ibn Taymiyyah said:
"If someone refuses to pray janazah for one of those (a killer, robber, and one deep in debt), as a warning for those like him from doing similar acts - this is good. And if one refused to do that in public, but makes supplication for him in secret, thereby fulfilling both interests - this is even better." (Al-Iktiyarat p. 52)

*word inserted by Muttaqun OnLine, as those who completly abandon salat are not Muslim, and if reliable witnesses establish before the Ameer (leader) that the person had undoubtedly abandoned salat altogether, the person would not be considered Muslim and would not, of course, receive a Muslim funeral. Establishing this is harder (requires a very high burden of proof) once the person is dead, as the dead person cannot defend themself.
  • Hadith - Related by Ahmad, Dawud, at-Tirmidhi, anNasa'i and Ibn Majah

    Buraidah reported that the Prophet said, "The pact between us and them is prayer. Whoever abandons it is a disbeliever."
Source.

:wasalamex

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syilla
10-04-2007, 07:19 AM
:salamext:

i don't know if anyone will agree with me on this...

But I think these days the youth are too ambitious but lack of 'humbleness' and being 'grateful'.

wassallam.
Reply

north_malaysian
10-04-2007, 07:43 AM
My sister is working with Children Protection Society (CPS). As she has a degree in psychology, her bosses ask her to evaluate/examine the kids sheltered there. 85% of the kids there are non-Muslims.

One of her cases, there is a Chinese boy (6 year-old) who witnessed his mother hanging herself in front of him.... he doesnt talk at all since he was brought into CPS... sometimes he try to hurt himself by stabbing pencil on his legs and hands, he even try to cut his wrist with a ruler..

My sister said that his mother might attempted suicide several times before she hung herself by stabbing hands/legs or cutting wrist ... as the 6 year-old can emulated whatever he had seen.:heated:


When a person commited suicide, he/she not only destroying his/her life... but also the lives of people around him/her...
Reply

syilla
10-04-2007, 07:58 AM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
My sister is working with Children Protection Society (CPS). As she has a degree in psychology, her bosses ask her to evaluate/examine the kids sheltered there. 85% of the kids there are non-Muslims.

One of her cases, there is a Chinese boy (6 year-old) who witnessed his mother hanging herself in front of him.... he doesnt talk at all since he was brought into CPS... sometimes he try to hurt himself by stabbing pencil on his legs and hands, he even try to cut his wrist with a ruler..

My sister said that his mother might attempted suicide several times before she hung herself by stabbing hands/legs or cutting wrist ... as the 6 year-old can emulated whatever he had seen.:heated:


When a person commited suicide, he/she not only destroying his/her life... but also the lives of people around him/her...
I'm so sad when hearing about the lives of young children shattered.
The case of pedophiles, child abuse, child prostitution, orphans...
It just keep disheartening... i was reading the crimeboard the other day on child abuse.... Astaghfirullah...it is sooo sad. I just can't imagine how they are surviving in this world. But i know Allah swt is fair in His judgement.

May they are been given guidance, taufiq and hidayah. And may the children be happy in this world and hereafter.
Reply

Tania
10-04-2007, 08:10 AM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
My sister said that his mother might attempted suicide several times before she hung herself by stabbing hands/legs or cutting wrist ... as the 6 year-old can emulated whatever he had seen.:heated:


When a person commited suicide, he/she not only destroying his/her life... but also the lives of people around him/her...
Its so true :( We had a student who finished 2 years ago the high school and who had so many issues than the psychology of the school said he will never be able to be healthy again because of the childhood trauma (his father hung in a tree straight in front of his window).
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north_malaysian
10-04-2007, 08:21 AM
Originally Posted by syilla
I'm so sad when hearing about the lives of young children shattered.
The case of pedophiles, child abuse, child prostitution, orphans...
It just keep disheartening... i was reading the crimeboard the other day on child abuse.... Astaghfirullah...it is sooo sad. I just can't imagine how they are surviving in this world. But i know Allah swt is fair in His judgement.

May they are been given guidance, taufiq and hidayah. And may the children be happy in this world and hereafter.
my sister live alone in Penang... because she dont want to have Iftar alone... she bring some of them to Bazaar Ramadan and have Iftar with her...

She told my mum that she want to bring all of them to our house on the first day of Eid... so we have to hide our "beef" delicacies when they come as many of those kids dont eat beef.
Reply

syilla
10-04-2007, 08:25 AM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
my sister live alone in Penang... because she dont want to have Iftar alone... she bring some of them to Bazaar Ramadan and have Iftar with her...

She told my mum that she want to bring all of them to our house on the first day of Eid... so we have to hide our "beef" delicacies when they come as many of those kids dont eat beef.
why they don't eat beefs? :?

remind me of my son who doesn't eat beef because he watched qurban last two years. He asked me back why do we have to eat beef? I don't realy know how to answer him...:phew
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Sky_flower
10-05-2007, 12:34 AM
A good friend of mine committed suicide five years ago. He wasn't like one of those weird emo's "Nobody likes me blah... blah... I'm gona slit my wrist". But he was loved by all. It was just that he had a terrible childhood, and although he tried to be stonge and move on about it. He just couldn't take it anymore. So your right it is hard for people that love them, but for me and my friends we just remembered how much of great person he was, and thats all that mattered to us.
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north_malaysian
10-05-2007, 03:39 AM
Originally Posted by syilla
why they don't eat beefs? :?
Hindus and some chinese dont eat beef. I asked my chinese friend, why some Chinese dont eat beef, do they believe it's holy as the Hindus believe.

He said, the word "cow" in Chinese has similar sound to "stupid" in Hokkien... so ... being superstitious... they dont eat beef as they afraid they would be stupid as the cows...:scared:
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Pk_#2
10-05-2007, 06:36 AM
^^ LOL

anyways :( erm ahh suicide. :'(

Someone answer Bewildred's question.
Reply

syilla
10-05-2007, 06:41 AM
Originally Posted by bewildred
Please help me with the following : If Allah (sws) has written everyone's death's day.... How come people commit suicide????

S.
commit suicide is the same as the death's day.

The way they died...is just ways / reasons.

Attempt to Commit Suicide

Q. Destiny (Taqdeer) is predetermined. Although Taqdeer Muallaq can be changed by supplication and prayers but certain things are categorized under Taqdeer Mubram, which is not to be changed like the birth or death of a person, the time, the place and cause of occurrence. But suicide is Haraam in Islam and the person committing the suicide is said to have committed a grievous sin. Since the cause of one’s death has already been determined, the suicidal deaths can also not be prevented, because a person’s death is predetermined and if one is destined to die as such, he will commit suicide.

(Farzana Feza ; Allahabad)

Ans. I do not remember any Hadith mentioning that the manner of death of a person is destined to remain unchanged. Even the time of death is extended through supplication and prayer. Anyway, whether the cause of death of a person is predetermined or subject to change according to Allah’s will, it does not alter the nature of sin of a person if he attempts suicide.

One thing is quite clear from Qur’an. A man is free to choose between the good or bad path for himself. Allah (swt) says: “We showed him the right path, whether he be grateful or ungrateful.” (76:3)

Although a human is free in opting for either way, he has no control over the actual happenings in this world. The occurrence after his attempt to act good or bad is in Allah’s control. He may shoot at an attacking beast in trying to save the life of a person but may in fact end up in killing the man instead. This happening is from Allah and while the dead was destined to die from his bullet, his act will be recorded as saving a man’s life. Similarly one may poison a person with the intention of killing him but if it so happens that the inadequate quantity of that particular poison cures him of a serious killer disease, the man who poisoned him shall get no reward for saving his life. His deed will be recorded as equivalent to murder.

Consider the following probabilities in context of a person attempting suicide.

1. He shoots himself and dies instantaneously.

2. After shooting himself, he goes into a coma and dies after a long time without ever recovering.

3. He shoots himself but before he could die of his own injury, he is bitten by a deadly snake and dies of its poison.

4. He shoots by placing the pistol over his temple but the only bullet misfires and he lives after that.

5. He attempts to shoot himself but another person intervenes and in the ensuing struggle, the one who wanted to save him gets killed by mistake.

In case 3 above, he was destined to die of snakebite at the same time and place he attempted to kill himself. It does not in any way wash him of his sin, which is same as in the earlier two cases. In cases 4 and 5, though the results are different, his sin remains the same. Whether he dies of his bullet immediately or later, or dies of some other cause at the same instant, or survives the attempt or kills someone else by mistake, the nature of his sin does not change. The results in all the five cases were in Allah’s control. He will be adjudged on the basis of his attempt to commit suicide, an act which he performed up to its end as far as he was concerned. Suicide was his act in all the above cases while the nature of his death, or his survival or some other person’s death in his place was the destiny ordained by God. It must be clear from the above that destiny does not affect a person’s free choice to do good or bad.
source
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Pk_#2
10-05-2007, 06:51 AM
Praise be to Allaah, the Lord of the Worlds. The scholars and people who are religiously committed should not pray for this man and others like him, but the ordinary people should pray for him, just as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) refrained from praying for a man who had committed suicide, and one who had stolen from the war-booty, but he said: “Pray for your companion.” They said to Samurah ibn Jundub: “Your son did not sleep last night.” He said, “Was it because he ate too much?” They said: “Yes.” He said: “If he had died I would not have prayed for him.” Samurah explained that if he died because he had eaten too much, he would not pray for him, because he would have killed himself by eating too much. And it is more appropriate that the scholars and those who are religiously-committed should refrain from offering the funeral prayer for this man who prevented others from killing the snake, and held it in his hand until it killed him, because he killed himself.

Al-Fataawa al-Kubra, 3/20, 21 :hmm: -Ibn Taymiyyah
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nocturne
10-05-2007, 09:01 AM
I am working in the ambulance service. This month, i have seen alot of muslims being involved in bad accidents early in the morning (Time of sahur)...

A couple got into the motorbike accident (one passed away and e other had severe injuries) and another guy was drinking during that time and jumped off a bridge into the sea(luckily he was found)..i hope they learn from this and become better muslims.
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Ummu Sufyaan
10-05-2007, 11:52 AM
Originally Posted by syilla
:salamext:

i don't know if anyone will agree with me on this...

But I think these days the youth are too ambitious but lack of 'humbleness' and being 'grateful'.

wassallam.
:sl:
amoungst other things. no, i agree.
:sl:
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Protected_Diamond
10-05-2007, 06:20 PM
Sucide is on the rise and it's happening in the muslim community as well. Modern life makes people forget their deen and therefore they don't have a clear head to sort their problems out. I know someone who committed sucide coz they kept failing their exams at a degree level...subhana' Allah scary eh? but you get pressure from all directions and sometimes these people forget Allah s.w.a is there for them.
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Shukri
10-05-2007, 09:24 PM
quick question I'm sort of confused on, how about the mentally ill and disturbed muslims. Does Allah give mercy or does he treat them like the rest?
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syilla
10-05-2007, 09:50 PM
Originally Posted by Shukri
quick question I'm sort of confused on, how about the mentally ill and disturbed muslims. Does Allah give mercy or does he treat them like the rest?
"There are three kinds of people who are not held responsible for their actions: The sleeping person until he wakes up, the child until he reaches the age of puberty, and the mentally ill until he becomes sane." [Related by the Five and ad-Daarimi]

:)
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Shorty x
10-05-2007, 10:22 PM
Salaamz,

sorry for not replying to messages, been so busy at uni, thot id quickly just reply, before i have to hit my bed, ive got work in the morning !!!!!! :cry:

Thank you for all the information, much appreciated.

when someone suffers from depression, there are different types, and different levels, sometimes we can help them, but sometimes we cant.
Its a shame these things happen, and it hits us harder when we learn its a muslim brother or sister. with society changing and adjusting to life, more problems are around compared to when our parents were younger, or grandparents. All we can do is help them, and encourage those who stray along the path of islam.

In summer , the young boy aged 26, was married with a wife, and living in there house, because he was a heavy drug abuser, his wife left him taking there daughter with her, and in that year he was trying his best to get better, he stopped his drugs, but unfortunatly, had major side effects, and resulted in him, being admitted to hospital, and on medication.He also suffered from paranoia. His parents, especially his mum, helped him as much as they could, but to look after a 26 yr old man, who is stubborn and wont accept his illness, is hard. you cant control what they do, 24/7, 7 days a week. u cant control, where they go, young lads will do as they please. go see there mates, maybe do a few stuff which they shouldnt.

but when someone is suffering from depression, but in and out of his phases, etc u cant tell or know that he/she is going to do something stupid. Just as he was on the road to recovery, he was looking forward to seeing his daughter, even if he knew that things would never be the same between him n his wife. She rung him and told him , that shes leaving and going to pakistan with the kid, and that he will never see them again. News like that is going to hit him hard, and when he was acting normal, everyone thought he was getting better, but he was actually, getting ready to end his life. As he walked up to the nearest railway line, he just stepped in front of an on coming train.

People, say, it is the parents responsibility, etc , or carers who should look after there sons/daughters etc. but it is hard, to keep an eye on someone 24/7, especially someone who is 26 years old, living a seperate life, and gave the impression that he is all well.
Because his dad was my dads best friend, my mum n dad agreed to help out for the janaza, but i noticed that, my dad found it hard to hold his janaza in a mosque, if you told them what happend. why? does a mosque not carry out a janaza for someone who has committed suicide?

We did get a mosque eventually, but it was after a few attempts.

W'salaamz
shorty xx
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Woodrow
10-05-2007, 10:24 PM
Originally Posted by Protected_Diamond
Sucide is on the rise and it's happening in the muslim community as well. Modern life makes people forget their deen and therefore they don't have a clear head to sort their problems out. I know someone who committed sucide coz they kept failing their exams at a degree level...subhana' Allah scary eh? but you get pressure from all directions and sometimes these people forget Allah s.w.a is there for them.
Suicide one of the biggest killers of teenagers in the world today.

The main identified causes in the USA are:

Who Is At Risk?

Some teens, because of their biochemical makeup or life experiences, are at greater risk for suicide. Risk factors for suicide include:

* Previous suicide attempts - Teens that have attempted suicide in the past are much more likely than other teens to attempt suicide again in the future. Approximately a third of teen suicide victims have made a previous suicide attempt.6
* Depression and/or alcohol or substance abuse - Over 90% of teen suicide victims have a mental disorder, such as depression, and/or a history of alcohol or drug abuse.7
* Family history of mental disorders, substance abuse, or suicide - Teens who kill themselves have often had a close family member who attempted or committed suicide. Many of the mental illnesses, such as depression, that contribute to suicide risk appear to have a genetic component.8
* Stressful situation or loss - Teens who kill themselves almost always have serious problems, such as depression or substance abuse. When they experience losses or certain stressful situations, it can trigger a suicide attempt. Such stressful situations include: getting into trouble at school or with the police; fighting or breaking up with a boyfriend or a girlfriend; and fighting with friends.9, 10
* Easy access to guns - Teens are much more likely to kill themselves when they have access to guns. When teens shoot themselves, they most often do so in their own homes. Teens are at a far greater risk for suicide when there are loaded and accessible guns in their homes.11, 12
* Exposure to other teenagers who have committed suicide - Teens are more likely to kill themselves if they have recently read, seen, or heard about other suicide attempts.13

Other risk factors include a history of physical and/or sexual abuse, poor communication with parents, incarceration, and lack of access or an unwillingness to seek mental health treatment.14-17
Source: http://www.safeyouth.org/scripts/teens/suicide.asp

Something to keep in mind, not all of these factors need to be present. Anyone by it self can be enough.
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Tania
10-06-2007, 07:42 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Over 90% of teen suicide victims have a mental disorder
I say 100%. They all have something mental because otherwise would not comit suicide. We have, like the animals too, the survival instinct. We should always avoid the death, at least to try to rescue us.
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north_malaysian
10-08-2007, 01:49 AM
Well.. the Japanese students are well known to commit suicide if they dont have straight A's in the exam.

I think the community should change their attitude too... especially among Eastern Asians... because our lives not only depends on our exam results..
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NoName55
10-08-2007, 03:51 AM
Originally Posted by syilla
commit suicide is the same as the death's day.

The way they died...is just ways / reasons.



source
so, according to this formula, a murderer should never be punished because he did not cut short some one's life?

No compensation/blood money should be paid to the victim's family since they were meant to loose the breadwinner that day anyway?

no one should look out for traffic on crossing roads since if they are meant to die that's it.
no one should oppose or try to stop any invading armies lest the interfere with pre-destiny?

STOP GOOGLING!!
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syilla
10-08-2007, 04:00 AM
Originally Posted by NoName55
o tso, according to this formula, a muderer should never be punished because he did not cut short some one's life?

No compensation/blood money should be paid to the victim's family since they were meant to loose the breadwinner that day any way?

no one should look out for traffic on crossing roads since if the are meant to die thats it.
no one should oppse or try to stop any invading armies lest the intfere with pre-destiny?

STOP GOOGLING!!
what formula? :? i never realised that there is a formula :confused:

I think you confused between taqdeer and punishment on people who killed...or am i wrong?

so sorry to say i'll not stop googling why should i?
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NoName55
10-08-2007, 04:12 AM
nevermind, forget I said anything, I should not be getting involved, my fault, apologies for butting in, happy googling!
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NoName55
10-10-2007, 02:01 AM
Originally Posted by syilla
what formula? :? i never realised that there is a formula :confused:

I think you confused between taqdeer and punishment on people who killed...or am i wrong?

so sorry to say i'll not stop googling why should i?
on second thoughts (ignore my post #34 above

Can you find me the reason from Googling and/or Internet fatwa shops for the following:

Originally Posted by JihadunNafs
:salamext:

None of you should long for death, for if he is a good man he may increase his good deeds (by living to full term until the appointed time) and if he is an evildoer, he may stop the evil deeds and repent (because (s)he has more time than if (s)he topped him/herself) (Bukhaari)

May Allah help and guide us all. Ameen :w:
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muthenna
10-10-2007, 02:54 AM
Matter and energy, time and space are all created and cotrolled by Allah, so there is no chance of doing anything without Allah knowing or determined to be; whoever believes has won whoever disbeliefs has failed, there is no escape from the one who has created everything
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NoName55
10-10-2007, 03:06 AM
Originally Posted by muthenna
Matter and energy, time and space are all created and cotrolled by Allah, so there is no chance of doing anything without Allah knowing or determined to be; whoever believes has won whoever disbeliefs has failed, there is no escape from the one who has created everything
if that was explaination for http://www.islamicboard.com/840493-post35.html then I aint impressed as it is not fitting
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IbnAbdulHakim
10-10-2007, 10:50 AM
^ *takes out adhab stick* :p lol no im kidding

NoName55 is making a good point (Unless i misunderstood the point), stop googling, sheikh google isnt always reliable! maybe a decent reference but NOT good for all ur fatwa needs !!
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tarek29
10-10-2007, 11:05 AM
Originally Posted by bewildred
Please help me with the following : If Allah (sws) has written everyone's death's day.... How come people commit suicide????

S.
Allah (swt) created us to be free to chose, and this doesnt contradict that HE knows all our life that is written before we even exsist!

http://www.islaam.com/Article.aspx?id=54

Peace
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H@fiz Aziz
12-24-2007, 04:51 AM
well its pretty simple if a muslim commits sucide they will go to hell forever.
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umar113
01-02-2008, 11:25 PM
all i know is this, if a person commits suicide, he will continue doing it forever AND when everyone if waiting in line to get their record of good and bad deeds, they will do the same thing over and over, even after they get their record.

Allah has the authority over our bodies, to give life and take away life, it is NOT our choice, our choice is, whether to follow Allah and His prophets or to go astray.
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truemuslim
01-02-2008, 11:28 PM
yes ^^^..so the written day is already known...by allah ONLY... he knows how we will die, when, everything, but it doesnt mean we can go ahead and kill ourself in a haram way... :w:
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seattlemuslimah
01-03-2008, 09:15 AM
Originally Posted by Shorty x
salaamz.....

hope someone can help me

In my home town over the summer, a couple of young muslim lads had committed suicide, both are not connected, but similar age, 24-25,
it is a sin to commit suicide, so why do it?
it hit us pretty hard as we knew both boys who passed away

i was wondering, what happens to them, in the hereafter, do they get same treatment as everyone else?

w'salaams
shorty
xx
This is very horrible to hear.

Yes Suicide is very large sin. and Well if you remember in Quran probably the one you have that is translated arabic to english you will notice that like page 63-64 possibly if you and i have the same quran which ill get the author and stuff for you... it tells you what happens to people when they do things in their lives. Liars will have their faces ripped off. Adultors will be put into a clay oven to burn, eaters of usury will swim up current while someone on the edge throws rocks in his throat. so you see. some people lose their iman and lost the taqwah and this is what happens.

I hope this helps good luck

Masalama
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ikaj
01-03-2008, 09:54 AM
We have free will and Allah already knows what we will choose in this life. He already knows who we will choose to marry, which sins we will choose to commit, which good deeds we will choose to do, how we will die etc. So if He already knows exactly what we will choose then why not skip all this time on earth and put those of us that He knows will choose good things in heaven and punish those He knows will choose evil things directly into hell.

Sometimes that crosses my mind but then I just remind myself that it may not make sense right now, perhaps Allah has not given us the ability to understand such things as yet, but Allah knows why and perhaps one day Allah will let us understand why things are the way they are...
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LUVAR
02-04-2008, 02:43 PM
Dont people who kill themselves consider what happens after am dead?
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sister7864
02-04-2008, 04:24 PM
may allah have mercy on them!
sucicide is forbiden in Islam- Allah does not burden you with other than wot u can take, therefore we must persevere!
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snakelegs
02-06-2008, 05:25 AM
Originally Posted by LUVAR
Dont people who kill themselves consider what happens after am dead?
i think that someone who has reached such a desperate state as to kill himself has lost the ability to care about anything.
i hope none of us ever experiences anything even close to what the person who kills himself must feel. imsad
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------
02-07-2008, 06:48 PM
:salamext:

i hope none of us ever experiences anything even close to what the person who kills himself must feel. imsad
^ Ameen!!
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adeeb
02-16-2008, 01:17 PM
too bad...

hope Allah makes us die in the best emaan (khusnul khatimah)

ameen!!
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Amat Allah
02-16-2008, 03:11 PM
hope Allah makes us die in the best emaan (khusnul khatimah)
Allahoma Ameeeeeeeen
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FatimaAsSideqah
02-16-2008, 03:24 PM
As Salaam Alaykum Wa Rahmatullahi Wa Barakatuhu

Some Muslims incorrectly think that suicidal bombings during war is not suicide but an act of defensive war. They see it the same as fighting with guns or swords in a war. However, shooting in a war, one goes in with the intention NOT to die. Using oneself as a walking or flying bomb, one goes in with the intention of killing oneself (and the perceived enemy).

Hadith - Bukhari 2:445, Narrated Thabit bin Ad-Dahhak

The Prophet said, "Whoever intentionally swears falsely by a religion other than Islam, then he is what he has said, (e.g. if he says, 'If such thing is not true then I am a Jew,' he is really a Jew). And whoever commits suicide with piece of iron will be punished with the same piece of iron in the Hell Fire." Narrated Jundab the Prophet said, "A man was inflicted with wounds and he committed suicide, and so Allah said: My slave has caused death on himself hurriedly, so I forbid Paradise for him."

Allah Hafiz
Sister Fatima
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toDisornottoDis
04-02-2008, 04:10 PM
Someone said, a few pages back, that if your mind isn't right and you kill yrself - it might not count as suicide? I don't want to get too personal, but if i were to keel over the tracks, next time i'm waiting for the train, in a split-second decision... would it still count as suicide?
stupid question, i know, but desperate is as desperate does...

p.s. just want to say i would rather rip myself into a squillion-shreads before i hurt anyone else, so don't get any ideas about that "suicide bombing" murder crap.

p.s.ps. pls (if anyone's reading...) don't ask me to get help;) I did my current predicament to myself... i just need a clean exit:)
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Yanal
04-03-2008, 02:17 AM
Asalam alaykum
Suicide is a bad deed. Because you do suicide in depression or anger. Both are from the Shytan( the devil). It is not from Allah (SWT). After you die Allah(SWT) will not be pleased you followed the will of the Shytan( devil).
That is my opinion about suicide
Khudafiz
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aminahjaan
04-04-2008, 12:25 AM
When people commit reeeeeal bad sins they get punishment in the grave obviously. Idk if it was already mention but the Prophet (SAW) refused to pray on someone's grave if he/she committed suicide. Every bad action that happens, shaytan is ALWAYS behind it.
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