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Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

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    Adam and the 60 cubit confusion (OP)


    Narrated Abu Huraira: The Prophet said, "Allah created Adam, making him 60 cubits tall. When He created him, He said to him, "Go and greet that group of angels, and listen to their reply, for it will be your greeting (salutation) and the greeting (salutations of your offspring." So, Adam said (to the angels), As-Salamu Alaikum (i.e. Peace be upon you). The angels said, "As-salamu Alaika wa Rahmatu-l-lahi" (i.e. Peace and Allah's Mercy be upon you). Thus the angels added to Adam's salutation the expression, 'Wa Rahmatu-l-lahi,' Any person who will enter Paradise will resemble Adam (in appearance and figure). People have been decreasing in stature since Adam's creation.

    Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah's Apostle said, "The first group of people who will enter Paradise, will be glittering like the full moon and those who will follow them, will glitter like the most brilliant star in the sky. They will not urinate, relieve nature, spit, or have any nasal secretions. Their combs will be of gold, and their sweat will smell like musk. The aloes-wood will be used in their centers. Their wives will be houris. All of them will look alike and will resemble their father Adam (in statute), sixty cubits tall."


    Is 60 cubits a metaphor? Allah has repeatedly revealed that some things in heaven are very large. I view these as metaphors to explain their grandness. We are Allah's greatest creations, higher than the jinn, animals or angels and thus when we are describes as gians, Allah is metaphorically asserting our superiority. Also when it is mentioned that the subsequent generations of humans would be smaller is stature, could it be interpreted that we are not as pious or as great as the sahaba and are smaller in stature. Allah did say that we would grow corrupt near the end of times and this decrease in stature might pertain toa spiritual decrease.

    Is this interpretation right? Or the literal one which is expounded on by this scientific article?

    TEL AVIV, ISRAEL - At the recent Israeli colloquium on science and religion, Dr. Shlomi Lesser of Hebrew University, and the Chairman of the Hofesh V'Mada Society (a stalwart for deeply skeptical Israeli scientists), led a heated debate between biologists and ultra-orthodox Rabbis on the origins of life. Many of the spectators, including those of a deeply religious stance, came away with the feeling that the Rabbis had not done very well against their "Epicurean" counterparts.

    The hi-light of the evening came when Dr. Lesser engaged in a one-on-one question exchange with Rabbi Dovid Brown of Yeshiva University. At one point Dr. Lesser asked R. Brown how tall the first man was, to which the esteemed Rabbi replied "he was roughly the size of an average man according to chazal [Jewish sages]." From there Dr. Lesser revealed that genetic research has revealed that the human race coming from a single pair of parents is impossible in light of the biological bottle-neck [a term for the strain put on successive generations by inbreeding] they would have to travel through.

    "Our research, in conjunction with the research of other respected institutions around the world, has demonstrated that the entire human population descending from a single pair of human ancestors is highly unlikely." stated Dr. Lesser. "It would seem that the traditional view of groups, not individuals, evolving has been corroborated; the only way man could descend from a single pair (rather than from an entire group of transitional hominids) is if the original pair were literally giants in the pre-nutrition age."

    As Dr. Lesser pointed out, prior to the breakthroughs in nutrition that took place in the 17th and 18th centuries, genetic evidence revealed that man would have been shrinking if he came from a single human ancestor. His calculations revealed that in order for the human race to reach the state it was in during the 17th century, the "Adam and Eve" story would only be plausible if the first man was 90 feet tall (which is fantastic to say the least). "There is no other way man could traverse the genetic bottleneck" Dr. Lesser again said. "If Adam was the size of any other man according to the learned Rabbis of the Jewish religion, this demonstrates an obvious absurdity to this myth."





    What do YOU guys think?
    Last edited by AntiKarateKid; 04-30-2008 at 02:01 AM.

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

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    format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama View Post
    I just said that i found such an article on the topic few years back. Anyways, what i believe is what i believe and same goes for you. My belief has stood test of time for 1400yrs and so it helps me to know the facts where as you will have just wait till the scientists get smart enough to shed some light on this (if they ever stop being monkey's uncle )
    Well, there is not a major religion in the world whose adhearents will admit that their books are flawed in any way. I for one don't think any religious text is flawless including the Quran.
    This topic is about Adam being 90 feet tall and I seriously doubt that a humanlike being could be 90 feet tall and survive, for the reasons I sated previously.
    So, this is one of the reasons I remain an agnostic.

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    If dinosaurs were huge back in the days, then i wouldn't be surprised if humans survived in a similar enironment.


    Anyway guys, remember that absence of proof is not proof of absence

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    Well, there is not a major religion in the world whose adhearents will admit that their books are flawed in any way. I for one don't think any religious text is flawless including the Quran.
    This topic is about Adam being 90 feet tall and I seriously doubt that a humanlike being could be 90 feet tall and survive, for the reasons I sated previously.
    So, this is one of the reasons I remain an agnostic.
    Why not? And survive for how long? Just imagine it a walking giant, able to take cover in giant trees, could eat giant crops, travel to places in a couple of leaps to get things needed etc. Also it must be cool being able to get to places in a fraction of time

    i'm sure that the average lifetime in that era was a couple hundred years
    Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    33 43 1 - Adam and the 60 cubit confusion
    He it is Who sends blessings on you, as do His angels, that He may bring you out from the depths of Darkness into Light: and He is Full of Mercy to the Believers. [Quran {33:43}]
    www.QuranicAudio.com
    www.Quran.com

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    I can't imagine humans being 7 feet tall. That is just not possible, it's unstainable i tell ya!
    -says one 3ft midgyet to another....

    What! My ancestors were that huge and ruled the earth? Impossible!!
    -says one lizard to the other....

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama View Post
    I can't imagine humans being 7 feet tall. That is just not possible, it's unstainable i tell ya!
    -says one 3ft midgyet to another....
    It's not at all that simple..

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    It's not at all that simple..
    Sometimes it is as simple as that. This earth is big enough to have giant lizards roaming it then it's big enough to have giant humans walking it. Those 300ft trees aren't there for a show. You want to believe in evolution, then this is the real evolution. Humans evolving according to their needs over long long period of times.

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    lol
    NOBODY try.
    this pointless guy is pointless... ahmedjunior knos lool
    itsa waste of time he will go in circles over and over and over as if he has never been on a merry go round........if u havent then try it..it aint fun...
    Wasalaam

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    format_quote Originally Posted by islamirama View Post
    Sometimes it is as simple as that. This earth is big enough to have giant lizards roaming it then it's big enough to have giant humans walking it. Those 300ft trees aren't there for a show. You want to believe in evolution, then this is the real evolution. Humans evolving according to their needs over long long period of times.
    Well, it's not that simple in this case.
    And this has nothing to do with evolution, except for the part that muslims believe humans shrinked somehow troughout history..
    Dinousaurs and giant trees are designed to be that big, a human being is not. Unless Adam was anatomically significantly different from the modern day human he can't have been 90 feet tall. So technically, if you believe Adam was 60 cubits tall, you must also acknowledge evolution, God led evolution if you will.

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion



    Can i have the pleasure to say:

    ?

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    format_quote Originally Posted by - Brok3n - View Post


    Can i have the pleasure to say:

    ?

    hold on let em bang heads a bit. its sorta fun watching ...gets u dizzy but still......lol

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    Even people who are 7/8 feet tall have real trouble with back and joint pains because of the increased pressure. The materials are the same as in an average size person but would have to cope with much greater forces, as a result of leverage on long limbs and compression of the spine and joints.

    The largest dinosaur was roughly 75 feet long and 40 feet tall, weighing 80 tons.
    A bipedal man who was bigger than this would probably crush his own bones under the weight or have limbs so heavy he could hardly move.

    Calculations on animal size

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    format_quote Originally Posted by Azy View Post
    The largest dinosaur was roughly 75 feet long and 40 feet tall, weighing 80 tons.
    Calculations on animal size
    Hush! I was having a good vision of Adam riding on the back of a Brontosaurus like it was a pony, now youve gone and spoiled it.

    And Actually I think you'll find that if you measure Barney the dinosaur, he is only about 7 ft tall in his suit, and he sings and dances and dosnt suffer from this "back pain" despite having a man inside the suit. So that totally blows your point out of the water.
    Last edited by barney; 05-07-2008 at 06:25 AM.
    Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    Occupation: The term of control of a territory by foreign military forces: Iraq 2003-2005
    Liberation:when something or someone is freed: Operation Telic 2003

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    Re: Adam and the 60 cubit confusion

    I'm sure when he was a boy he rode them like ponies

    Barney and Denver should form some sort of prehistoric Steps and go on tour.


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