Should I accept this hadith? I can't find much reference to it anywhere

format_quote Originally Posted by Confused0122

Okay, I just found a hadith (sahih) that's similar to what the brother posted:
Book 003, Number 0608:
Anas b. Malik reported that Umm Sulaim narrated it that she asked the Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) about a woman who sees in a dream what a man sees (sexual dream). The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon bi m) said: In case a woman sees that, she must take a bath. Umm Sulaim said: I was bashful on account of that and said: Does it happen? Upon this the Apostle of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: Yes (it does happen), otherwise how can (a child) resemble her? Man's discharge (i. e. sperm) is thick and white and the discharge of woman is thin and yellow; so the resemblance comes from the one whose genes prevail or dominate.

I don't know what it means but inshallah (hopefully) I'll get an answer from a scholar and I'll post it up.

Question: I came across a statement in the Sunnah wherein the Prophet (peace be upon him) says: “Yes indeed. A man’s fluid is thick and white and a women’s fluid is thin and yellow. Whichever of the two ejaculates first will be the one the child would resemble.” Does a woman does actually ejaculate? And isn’t resemblance based on genetic make-up and not on which partner ejaculates first?

Answered by Sheikh Sulaymân al-`Îsâ, professor at al-Imâm University in Riyadh
This is an important question requiring a detailed answer.

The first part of the question regards whether a woman releases a fluid during sexual intercourse the same as a man does. We say if the hadîth is authentic, then it is true and it should be accepted. The hadîth you have mentioned is related in Sahîh Muslim and is of undoubted authenticity.

The Prophet (peace be upon him) states in the hadîth that women has a fluid that is thin and yellow.

Allah says about his Prophet (peace be upon him): “Nor does he say (aught) of (his own) desire, it is no less than inspiration sent down to him” [Sûrah al-Najm: 3-4]

This issue was discussed by Dr. Muhammad `Ali al-Bârr in his book Human Creation between Medicine and the Qur’an under the heading “Does the woman release a fluid” (page 149).

He writes:

This had been a matter of disagreement. Sheikh al-Fakhr al-Râzî in his wonderful book, al-Mabâhith al-Mashriqiyyah, mentions that Aristotle denied that women have a fluid. Then Galen, the prominent Greek doctor strongly criticized Aristotle for that and proved that women have a fluid that differs in its nature from the fluid of men. It does not come out as an ejaculation but flows on the member and is a white moisture.

Al-Râzî then mentions that Umm Sulaym came to the Prophet (peace be upon him) and said: “O Messenger of Allah, Allah does not shy from the truth. Must a woman have a bath if she has has a sexual release while sleeping?”

He replied: “Yes, if she sees the fluid.” [Sahîh Bukhârî and Sahîh Muslim]

The release of fluid from woman’s vagina is something natural. It takes place during sexual intercourse or while sleeping. It is obligatory for her to have a bath thereafter. During sexual intercourse the woman’s fluid mixes with the man’s.

Dr. al-Bârr continues:

The woman releases two types of fluid. The first is a sticky fluid that flows inside her vagina and has nothing to do with the creation of the fetus. The second is a liquid that is released at a single occasion from the Graafian follicle in the ovary when the follicle is full of a yellow liquid.

The Prophet (peace be upon him) said: “The man’s fluid is white and woman’s is yellow.”

Turning our attention to the child resembling one of its parents, this is also confirmed by the prophetic hadîth. The child may sometimes resemble his father, his mother, one of his uncles, his grandparents, or he may closely resemble none of them.

Dr. Muhammad al-Bârr, in the same book (page 164) writes:

In brief, the factors governing the child’s resembling one parent, grandparent, or even coming with new attributes that do not belong to any of his relatives – like what happened at the time of the Prophet (peace be upon him) when al-Farâzî’s wife gave birth to a black baby while none of their relatives were black – is a very complicated matter. Genetics plays a very complicated role. Some of these genes follow the Mendelian model with respect to dominant and recessive genes and others do not.

Even those genes that submit to such laws might at times not act in accordance with those laws. The gene may or may not be fully expressed.

Modern medicine is still ignorant of many of the determining factors that bring about how much a child will resemble either of its parents. Until now, we do not know the role that may be played by the release of one fluid before the other in how the child will resemble one of his parents. Until and unless this is decisively determined in the future, we have no other choice but to simply believe what our Prophet (peace be upon him) said. He does not say anything except the truth.

In fact, this should encourage medical scholars to investigate these matters and discover new things.

I have given you the answer of Dr. Muhammad al-Bârr, because this is an important issue and I found his answer to be sufficient.

We have to believe in what Allah and His Messenger (peace be upon him) tell us. We are certain of the fact that Allah says: “Of knowledge it is only a little that is communicated to you.” [Sûrah al-Isrâ’: 85]

And Allah knows best.

http://www.islamtoday.com/show_detai...main_cat_id=31

salams! guys the main thing is that we turned 2 the learnd scholars in these matters alive ones that is nt computers ..if this is a hadeeth then it wil have a source frm where it was taken...

..now only if we knw the origins of the hadith can we giv a verdict on it...who qouted the hadith ? context ? what was commentd on it? etc. there r many questions which have 2 be fuly considrd and researchd...

..this is known as the art of takhreej of hadith and is studied in many places and requires a high degree of background knowledge in hadith and usool hadith...so its not just checking weather its in bukhari or not or weather it comes up in the table of results on a search or not...
remember bro the deen is a trust and we r responsible for what we say and do so if we here some thing like this and r unsure weather it is a hadith or not then we should turn to the learned scholars and seek their help just as Allah commands from us!!!
and an important point which is that the info. we get from the net is mostly incorrect and no research has been done to check the authenticity of sites and articles except for a few!

format_quote Originally Posted by AntiKarateKid

“ He is created of both, the semen of the man and the semen of the woman. The man's semen is thick and forms the bones and the tendons. The woman's semen is fine and forms the flesh and blood.[49] „

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_and_science

Apparently it is quoted by a medieval Islamic scholar names Ibn Qayyim who wrote a book comparing Islamic embryology to Galens. This seems to be exactly what Galen says. But I have almost never heard anyone ever cite this hadith, not the people against Islamic embryology,certainly not the people for it either

The problem is, I have seen refutations of this Galen theory. Such as this:
http://www.quranicstudies.com/articl...mbryology.html

The only thing that confuses me is that some of these hadiths are way out there or might even be metaphorical and yet I don't know how to interpret them.

What do you think?

Haha ya Akhi dont worry, I have seen all of those debates regarding science, and the kuffar allways lose, I also refute their articles, they bring very very weak points, and the most funny thing is that their own Pagan Bible has billions of worse things in it!

anyway, to continue, here is a beautiful article about this yellow semen that the woman has inside of herself:

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DOMINANT CHARACTER AND GENDERING HADITHS

The Magnificent Qur'an refers to the fact that creation does not proceed except from a "mingling" - the combination of both the sperm and the ovum:

{We created man from a drop of mingled fluid (nutfatin amshajin) to test him; so We make him hearing, knowing}
(Sura "Time" also titled "Man" 76:2)

This combination is the new fetus. How is gender finally decided? What are the determining factors that cause the father's X chromosome rather than his Y chromosome - or vice-versa - to finally fuse with the mother's X chromosome, resulting in a girl or a boy?

"The ovaries are homologous with the testes in the male" (Gray's Anatomy). The male seminal fluid is thick and whitish while the ovary secretes and discharges a thin yellowish substance called corpus luteum or "golden- yellow body." 1,400 years ago the Prophet Muhammad MHMD - upon him and his house blessings and peace - mentioned both.

Further, he revealed that when the father's fluid - gamete, chromosomes and genes - prevails upon the mother's, the child will take after the father; but if the mother's fluid - gamete, chromosomes and genes - prevails, the child will take after the mother.

Imam Muslim narrated in his Sahih from Anas ibn Malik:

Umm Sulaym [Anas' mother] said that she once asked the Prophet about a woman that sees, upon waking up, [traces of an emission of fluid] just as a man can. The Prophet MHMD replied, "When a woman sees this, let her wash from head to toe." Umm Sulaym said that she felt shy to ask such a thing and added, "Can such a thing truly take place?" The Godsent Prophet said MHMD - upon him blessings and peace: "Yes, it can. Where else does [parental] resemblance originate [in the child]? Indeed, the fluid of the man is thick and white while the fluid of the woman is thin and yellow. Whichever of the two surpasses (`ala) or precedes (sabaqa) the other, dictates resemblance."

Another narration has the "prevailing fluid" determine sex rather than resemblance. Muslim narrates from Thawban:

While I was standing beside the Prophet MHMD, one of the rabbis of the Jews came [...] then said: "I have come to ask you about something no one on earth would know except a Prophet [...]. I have come to ask you about the child." The Prophet said: "The fluid of the man is white and that of the woman yellow. When they unite and the male fluid prevails upon the female fluid, their child is male (adhkaraa) by Divine permission. When the female fluid prevails upon the male fluid, their child is female (aanathaa) by Divine permission." The Jew said: "What you said is true; you are truly a Prophet!" He turned and went away. The Messenger of Allah said: "This man just asked me about things of which I had no knowledge whatever until Allah had that knowledge brought to me!"

The above hadith can be interpreted to mean that the mother's fluid somehow draws the X-carrying sperm into the egg cell and blocks the Y-carrying one. However, it is an observable fact that in the majority of cases a child mostly resembles the parent of the opposite sex. More than this, the hadith of `A'isha on marital selection stated that "women give birth to [boys] the likes of their brothers and [girls] the likes of their sisters." It is possible, therefore, to surmise two other explanations:

(i) The "male" and "female" fluids mentioned in the second hadith are not parent-differentiated as in the first but rather both refer to the father's sperm in the sense that the male-chromosome-bearing part of the sperm is thick and white at the microscopic level while the female-chromosome-bearing part of the same sperm is thin and yellow.

(ii) The narrator(s) of the second narration might have made a mistake in the wordings "their child is male" and "their child is female" which should read, instead, "their child takes after the male line" and "their child takes after the female line" respectively. If so, the second hadith is in substance a repetition of the first. Allah knows best.

The latter alternative is the strongest in light of al-Bukhari's variant version of Thawban's hadith from Anas ibn Malik, identifying the rabbi as `Abd Allah ibn Salam:

News of the coming of the Prophet to Madina reached `Abd Allah ibn Salam. He went to see him and ask him questions: "I want to ask you of three things which none but Prophets know. What is the first of the conditions of the last Hour? What is the first meal the people of Paradise eat? Why does a child resemble his father or mother?" The Prophet MHMD said: ... The first of the conditions of the last Hour is a fire that will gather them from East to West. The first meal the people of Paradise eat is whales' sweetbreads. As for the child, then if the man's fluid precedes that of the woman, he draws the child to him; if hers, she draws the child to her." He said: "I bear witness that there is no God but Allah and that you are the Messenger of Allah."

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I hope this helped!

And secondly, everything that came from Muhammed (Religiously) was from Allaah, including the Sunnah!

format_quote Originally Posted by Imam

The writer erred twice: he wrote


As a matter of fact Ibn Qayyim also quotes a different hadith but not from the same collection....it is from Mosnad Ahmed not from Sahih Muslim !!!

fortunately the Arabic source is online

http://arabic.islamicweb.com/Books/T...ook=102&id=215

Arabic:

فقال الإمام أحمد في مسنده حدثنا حسين بن الحسين حدثنا أبو كريب عن عطاء بن السائب عن القاسم بن عبد الرحمن عن أبيه عن عبد الله بن مسعود قال مر يهودي برسول الله وهو يحدث أصحابه فقالت قريش يا يهودي إن هذا يزعم أنه نبي فقال لأسألنه عن شيء لا يعلمه إلا نبي فجاء حتى جلس ثم قال يا محمد مم يخلق الإنسان فقال من كل يخلق من نطفة الرجل ومن نطفة المرأة فأما نطفة الرجل فنطفة غليظة منها العظم والعصب وأما نطفة المرأة فنطفة رقيقة منها اللحم والدم فقام اليهودي فقال هكذا يقول من قبلك


English :

Imam Ahmed wrote in his mosnad , Hussein ben alhussen ,abu kareeb narrated from Ataa ben saeb ,alkasem ben abdulrahman ,ben masood , said once A jew passed by the prophet while talking with his companions ,and quraish said .o Jew this man claim to be a prophet ,he said i will ask him about things only a prophet would know !then he asked from what is created the human ,The prophet answered “ He is created of both, the semen of the man and the semen of the woman. The man's semen is thick and forms the bones and the tendons. The woman's semen is fine and forms the flesh and blood,then the Jew said what you said is similar to what other prophets before you said .


How Authentic such hadith?


http://www.dorar.net/enc/hadith/+%D9...D8%B5%D8%A8/+w


الراوي: عبدالله بن مسعود المحدث: أحمد شاكر - المصدر: مسند أحمد - الصفحة أو الرقم:
6/200
خلاصة الدرجة: إسناده ضعيف

the degree of the hadith: weak

The reasons :in its chain of narrators Amer ben Modrek and also Atta ben alsayeb and both rejected by most scholars......

Note: I noted another thing after reflecting the text itself...
It is the language of the hadith itself...who is this Jewish guy and upon what basis The guy claim that (what the prophet said is similar to what other prophets before said too,with regard to human creation).?

there is no Old Testament clue for any prophet ever claims the same!!
more absured is that the guy claims that the answer of such question is only known for prophets !! if so then how he knew the answer ?!!!

This so called hadith is indeed so weak not only in its chain of narrators but its language is incredible too !!

peace.

Ok but there's Saheeh Ahadith about this, so I dont get it, you're trying to say a Weak hadith is weak while we have a simillar hadith in a Saheeh collection

format_quote Originally Posted by Imam

The writer erred twice: he wrote


As a matter of fact Ibn Qayyim also quotes a different hadith but not from the same collection....it is from Mosnad Ahmed not from Sahih Muslim !!!

fortunately the Arabic source is online

http://arabic.islamicweb.com/Books/T...ook=102&id=215

Arabic:

فقال الإمام أحمد في مسنده حدثنا حسين بن الحسين حدثنا أبو كريب عن عطاء بن السائب عن القاسم بن عبد الرحمن عن أبيه عن عبد الله بن مسعود قال مر يهودي برسول الله وهو يحدث أصحابه فقالت قريش يا يهودي إن هذا يزعم أنه نبي فقال لأسألنه عن شيء لا يعلمه إلا نبي فجاء حتى جلس ثم قال يا محمد مم يخلق الإنسان فقال من كل يخلق من نطفة الرجل ومن نطفة المرأة فأما نطفة الرجل فنطفة غليظة منها العظم والعصب وأما نطفة المرأة فنطفة رقيقة منها اللحم والدم فقام اليهودي فقال هكذا يقول من قبلك


English :

Imam Ahmed wrote in his mosnad , Hussein ben alhussen ,abu kareeb narrated from Ataa ben saeb ,alkasem ben abdulrahman ,ben masood , said once A jew passed by the prophet while talking with his companions ,and quraish said .o Jew this man claim to be a prophet ,he said i will ask him about things only a prophet would know !then he asked from what is created the human ,The prophet answered “ He is created of both, the semen of the man and the semen of the woman. The man's semen is thick and forms the bones and the tendons. The woman's semen is fine and forms the flesh and blood,then the Jew said what you said is similar to what other prophets before you said .


How Authentic such hadith?


http://www.dorar.net/enc/hadith/+%D9...D8%B5%D8%A8/+w


الراوي: عبدالله بن مسعود المحدث: أحمد شاكر - المصدر: مسند أحمد - الصفحة أو الرقم:
6/200
خلاصة الدرجة: إسناده ضعيف

the degree of the hadith: weak

The reasons :in its chain of narrators Amer ben Modrek and also Atta ben alsayeb and both rejected by most scholars......

Note: I noted another thing after reflecting the text itself...
It is the language of the hadith itself...who is this Jewish guy and upon what basis The guy claim that (what the prophet said is similar to what other prophets before said too,with regard to human creation).?

there is no Old Testament clue for any prophet ever claims the same!!
more absured is that the guy claims that the answer of such question is only known for prophets !! if so then how he knew the answer ?!!!

This so called hadith is indeed so weak not only in its chain of narrators but its language is incredible too !!

peace.

Also, about the questioner knowing the answer, I think he must have carried the answers from relatives (Only in his family), Allahu 'Alam, better ask a scholar (Or imam) about this!

Peace

format_quote Originally Posted by corner

you're trying to say a Weak hadith is weak

Aren't you satisfied with the scholars' opinions,which I linked,regarding such Hadith?

format_quote Originally Posted by corner

while we have a simillar hadith in a Saheeh collection

first:
where is such similar hadith that mention that The man's semen is thick and forms the bones and the tendons. The woman's semen is fine and forms the flesh and blood ?!

Second : My post is specific,is to show the degree of the hadith which brother Anti-karatekid posted......

format_quote Originally Posted by corner

I think he must have carried the answers from relatives (Only in his family), Allahu 'Alam

If he get the answers from relatives,other Jews ,then his claim (only prophets know the answer )makes no sense.....

anyway I provided the reasons why such Hadith is to be rejected ,as its Isnad is classified as weak by classic Hadith scholars.....


peace