Need the truth.What's right and what's wrong? (Muslims Only)

format_quote Originally Posted by Gintoki

Hello.
I was born in a muslim family,they have a strong belief in God.I once had a strong belief,used to pray and such. I don't know why i had a strong belief,maybe i was a kid and believed everything easily,but i once saw 'Allah' written in the sky in clouds form. I still think to this day i was just imagining things,but i know that's the not true because apparently i was out that time,and many people were like taking pictures of it. Then i stopped praying,Mainly because I'm a lazy person.( was like 10 around that time.)2 or 3 years ago i started thinking 'what if' there's no God. I don't really know why i started thinking like that,but just so it happen. As a year passed by,then i questioned that if the muslims are indeed wrong? Maybe there's no God at all? What if the religions are just a fairy tale made by people? What if there's no heaven or hell? What if there's no afterlife and once you die,it's the end of everything.It is said that God is nice,but explain the suffering in this world like murder and rape. I know some people are going to say this life is a test.

yes, the concept is that life is a test, but most of the harm in life seems to come from others failing their tests.

But my point is does God enjoy these things? If he was kind He wouldn't let have let these things happen now would He?

why would you think that Allah enjoys it? we'd all be irate if we didn't have free will,yet everyone likes to look at moments and declare that Allah should have intervened. to me, that is illogical.


During this time,i was also in the phase of depression. Last year later had a panic attack while masturbating and my anxiety started since then. Some of that anxiety is about if Islam is true or not,also some other things. Which made me questioned more about my religion. So i guess I'm a Atheist/Agnostic at the moment. I would wish to believe there's a God and an afterlife but it's hard to believe so. That's enough of the back story about me.

Now my problems with Islam which i would like to discuss.
First thing first,How do you Muslims know that your religion is the correct one? They are many religions out there,and they think they are right and such. Some Muslims are going to say that Islam is the correct one and Quran is a miracle. Allah send signs,the scientific evidence and etc. Anyone would research their religion and find that their religion is correct. According to what i read on the internet,some atheists are saying that these scientific evidence was long discovered before islam by the greeks.

Tawhid is the foundation of Islam, not the works of Socrates, Plato, Aristotle or Pythagoras. you can however, find much of their thinking interwoven with Christianity. Philo is said to have remarked that Plato is simply Moses in Greek. the problem with the Pagan (and atheist may be more appropriate) Philosophers is that they were trying, and trying really hard, to "figure out" the truths about the Universe. the only real way to understand Allah would be by direct revelation, so the Prophets are of utmost import here.

It's unfair for non-muslims to be born in a non-muslim family. I already know some people are going to say that Allah sends them signs about Quran in some way. But the fact ismsome are going to ignore it as they are already brainwashed from their family that their current religion is correct. Why would they even give a chance to islam when they are already brainwashed? Or some people might not even heard about Quran in their entire life. One of the points why i think Quran is man-made.( No offence to you muslims.)

if we are the signs for non-Muslims, then perhaps that is why they will get a second chance. cuz we kinda...suck...

Even believing in Angels and the devils is harder. Devil whispers in our ears to make us do bad deeds? Really?

no, listening to them does!


Secondly, the Adam and Eve story. So the world was created because Adam ate the forbidden apple.......Seriously? No matter how you look at it,it sounds like a some fairy tale story similar to Santa Claus or unocrns,of course to us non-believers...Some people are going to bring up the arguement that where did we humans come from? To Muslims it's Adam and Eve. But as my counter-arguement,one word 'Evolution'. Atleast that's what atheists believe. Even the apes and humans DNA are 98% the same. Science has proven that we can't have come from Adam and Eve. A while ago i even read an article of old skeletons skull structure being the same as apes. Don't tell me it's false or i will facepalm myself so hard my nose breaks. Even some scientists believe that's there's a 50% chance there's no God,if you research into the creation of universe,there's a chance that world was made by a mere coincidence.

Thirdly,the concept of hell. This one is disturbing me alot. So half of the population was made to be roasted in hell? Eternal hell for not being a Muslim? Then maybe God should have us more proofs if He truly loved us,that is if He exists. According to some comments i read here,It's offensive to God for not believing him with all the clear proofs send. Well,if He was all-loving he wouldn't want people to burn in hell and that too eternally. In daily life If a person was to get burned on anywhere on the part of his body,he would be in pain. He can't survive a day without the pain. But eternal hell? A person would go insane. No normal unbeliever deserves that kind of punishment. But maybe those people who liked murdering and raping people deserve it. But normal unbelievers? No. But this contradicts the nature of God. It is said according to you Muslims,that he is the most merciful and kind. But that doesn't seem like that to me. Cause if he was he wouldn't make half of the population JUST to burn in hell. And Muslims are not in majority in the world.

Allah is the Most Merciful, i bet there will be more Muslims in the hellfire than non-Muslims.

A square circle is impossible because it contradicts it's very nature. A square has four sides,a circle has infinite. God is impossible because He contradicts His very nature. God is described as fair and just,but creates infinite punishment for finite sins. This is a pretty and vengeful God. God is described as infinitely loving,but he allows millionns of children to starve every day. He has the power to stop it,but He does nothing. Again life is a test? Really? So this all is a game to Him and watch us suffer as His entertainment?

in my mind, i see that Allah should override our freewill and just make us robots. we CHOOSE not to obey, yet want Allah to save us from the fruits of our disbelief.


Another question,if there's an atheist who died at the age of 17.(My friend is at her dying bed)Would she burn in hell? She could have reverted to Islam.

I listened to many Dr. Zakir Naik lectures and some part of me get convinced. But after few days my mind returns to the atheist/agnostic mind set.


you can listen to Dr Naik if you want, personally, i don't see the benefit. i would take about ZERO amount of fiqh from him. he is just a daiyee.

Another question, after this world ends,another world would emerge,and process will continue with new people....this process will keep on repeating...this doesn't make sense.

I said it before and i will say it again, I wish to believe there's a God but i find it hard to believe. But I'm hoping someone can convince me and show me the truth.

Will update thread if anything new comes to my mind.
Thanks.

if you are interested, i could post some, what i find, dazzlingly awesome lectures on Tawhid. being ignorant of Arabic, Dr Bilal Philips is my favorite instructor on Tawhid. though he can sure make some bloopers now and then.

for character, i simply love Mufti Menk from Zimbabwe. he's Hanafi because of his Asian background, but in Africa he teaches the local Shafii'e mudhab.

for history, i love a dude who even wants it known that he is not a scholar! Dr Bashar Shala is a neurologist/cardiologist who spends Sunday nights teaching in the Masjjid. and talk about prepared! he's numero uno in my book, simply adore his lectures!

May Allah make it easy on you!

ma salaama

1. “How do we know our religion is the correct one?” Boy was Francis Bacon right when he said that plurality in beliefs inclineth a man’s mind to atheism. I don’t know whether to call this argument a gambler’s fallacy or a fallacy of appeal to probability but it kind of amounts to the same, I guess. Just Google those terms and you should get the idea of how what you’re saying begs the question.

Answering even slightly briefly why Islam is correct is kind of impossible for me but since you used to believe, what were your reasons? That’s the more important question, I think.

2. We are judged for our intentions, not for our successes.

3. Devils “whispering” in our ears is not the only kind of bad influence on us, and can’t make us do anything. In fact do we even really know how often it ever happens?

4. That’s funny...mostly it’s believers that I hear promoting the false dilemma of “evolution = atheism”. Personally the subject is of little interest to me. If I absolutely must talk about this with you then maybe I will eventually but it’s such a huge message board cliché that I reached the point years ago where I felt like I was going to pull my hair out if I had to do it even one more time. People nowadays are positively obsessed with evolution. In the old days arguments from design would actually focus on whether the whole world was designed and not bother with trifles like the specific timeframe or with the bloodlines of lifeforms on Earth. Stop and think about it: when was the last time you ever heard anyone describe something as fiction which was written more than a few hundred years ago? The same principle applies to allegory. The older something is the more literally it gets taken. Chronological snobbery is the only reasonable explanation for this. Those ancient Romans must have really believed that the sun was a chariot—never mind that it looks nothing like one. I’ve heard that Maurice Bucaille’s book “The Bible, The Qur’an and Science” is a good resource on this matter but I haven’t read it.

5. No one is actually made to be roasted. Those who are found with even a mustard seed of piety or goodness in them will be transferred to Paradise. Who’s to say that it was already there when they entered?

Look, people usually go through something like this when they're young. The name "Allah" is written everywhere. You just have to keep your eyes peeled.

The cure to doubt is certainty through knowledge. Since you see yourself as an atheist/agnostic then you must first think about whether your position is grounded upon knowledge or not. To me the atheist position is illogical as you ignore your reason and conclude solely based on "scientific evidence". Scientific evidence referring to empirical evidence. According to this understanding, whatever that you cannot perceive with your five senses does not exist. If you agree with this then you probably wouldn't have believed in the existence of microbes before the microscope was invented. This is not to say that God should be seen in the same way but it is for us to understand that our senses are limited.

Despite our limited senses however we have our intellect, our ability to reason. Whatever you can perceive around you, you know that it must've had a source; even yourself. There are lots of threads around here that might help you InshaaAllah.

Some would use the "scientific miracle" argument for Islam but personally for me if there are indeed evidence of the Quran being in agreement with modern scientific discovery then it is additional knowledge to what is already clear.

format_quote Originally Posted by Gintoki

Yes i know that. As for the microbes example,it makes sense.
As you said there's a source of everything,but then Who created God? Surely He must also have an origin. How can he magically appear?

If I were to be more specific it would have been every creation has a Creator. When we understand this then we will see that a question like "Who created God?" is a form of absurdity.

format_quote Originally Posted by Gintoki

It's clearly mentioned in the Quran that all Muslims will go to heaven and all Non-Muslims to hell for eternity

You do know that muslim means “submitter”, right?

You’re contradicting yourself:

Isn't it the humans own free will to do bad things?

Oh you're not a Muslim,You were born in the wrong time and you were born in the wrong part of the world,Oh sorry you're going to hell for eternity!

Not to mention…

It was more like a blind belief

I know the arguments I'm bringing is not logical,But then again doubts confuses a person.

The very last thing you need to be doing is going from blind belief to blind disbelief.

The Qur’an specifically denies that anything in this world was made as entertainment for The Deity. Indeed, it says that if He actually needed any entertainment, which He doesn’t, then He could have easily enough found it on His own. In what universe are “test” and “entertainment” synonyms??

The creator is He who creates. Creature is created by the creator

God is uncreated by definition. We take Allah as a God because He is uncreated. If he was created He would not be God, and therefore we would not take him as God. By definition Eternal is forever with no beginning; therefore the question is absurd. Only temporal/non-eternal beings are created.




Does God Almighty send good people to HELL?
http://www.islamicboard.com/islamic-...ople-hell.html
http://islamnewsroom.com/news-we-nee...plegotohellwhy
http://www.islamsgreen.org/islams_green/2006/04/do_good_people_.html


You said that human & chimpanzee DNA are the same. Actually they share 96% (source)--the human genome contains over 3 billion base pairs so the difference = 120,000,000 base pairs - The similarity isn't something unexpected. We already knew there was a vast amount of similarity between humans and primates both in terms of physical characteristics and structure. It is a mistake to assume that observing similarities necessarily brings you to the conclusion of common descent. Taxonomy based on physical characteristics was already a very well established science when the idea of common descent came on the scene. Note that 99% of mouse genes turn out to have analogues in humans (source)

format_quote Originally Posted by Gintoki

Yes please do that. But i think the lectures wont help me at the moment because the hell concept is disturbing me alot. I would appreciate if you can clear that doubt of mine.

BismiAllah ArRahman Ar Raheem,

as you can clearly see on this board, Muslims, sadly, love to tell all non-Muslims that they are going to the hellfire, whilst all the Muslims are going to Jannah.

perhaps the term Muslim confuses everyone, Allahu Alam.

i apologize in advance if this doesn't make any sense to you, but consider:

On the authority of Abu Hurayrah (may Allah be pleased with him), who said: I heard the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) say:

“The first of people against whom judgment will be pronounced on the Day of Resurrection will be a man who died a martyr. He will be brought and Allah will make known to him His favours and he will recognize them. [The Almighty] will say: ‘And what did you do about them?’ He will say: ‘I fought for You until I died a martyr.’ He will say: ‘You have lied - you did but fight that it might be said [of you]: ‘He is courageous.’’ And so it was said. Then he will be ordered to be dragged along on his face until he is cast into Hell-fire. [Another] will be a man who has studied [religious] knowledge and has taught it and who used to recite the Qur’an. He will be brought and Allah will make known to him His favours and he will recognize them. [The Almighty] will say: ‘And what did you do about them?’ He will say: ‘I studied [religious] knowledge and I taught it and I recited the Qur’an for Your sake.’ He will say: ‘You have lied - you did but study [religious] knowledge that it might be said [of you]: ‘He is learned.’’ And you recited the Qur’an that it might be said [of you]: ‘He is a reciter.’ And so it was said. Then he will be ordered to be dragged along on his face until he is cast into Hell-fire. [Another] will be a man whom Allah had made rich and to whom He had given all kinds of wealth. He will be brought and Allah will make known to him His favours and he will recognize them. [The Almighty] will say: ‘And what did you do about them?’ He will say: ‘I left no path [un-trodden] in which You like money to be spent without spending in it for Your sake.’ He will say: ‘You have lied - you did but do so that it might be said [of you]: ‘He is open-handed.’’ And so it was said. Then he will be ordered to be dragged along on his face until he is cast into Hell-fire.”

It was related by Muslim (also by at-Tirmidhi and an-Nasa’i)

so...are ALL Muslims going directly to Jannah? absolutely not! one would imagine that not only these Muslims thought they were "great Muslims", but those around them probably thought so as well. but...they were wrong.

do ALL non-Muslims go to the hellfire?

Narrated Abu Huraira:
Allah's Apostle said, "A prostitute was forgiven by Allah,
because, passing by a panting dog near a well
and seeing that the dog was about to die of thirst,
she took off her shoe, and tying it with her head-cover
she drew out some water for it.
So, Allah forgave her because of that."
(Book #54, Hadith #538)

the answer? no!

Allah is Makliki Yawmid Din, not us!

nice post on the subject:

http://seekersguidance.org/ans-blog/...e-thirsty-dog/

further, we know, or should know, that those who never received the Message of Islam will be given an opportunity. (my browser is full, i can seek the hadith later if you want, in shaa Allah.) so let me posit the question, are we delivering the Message?

listen to what RasoolAllah, pbuh, has to say about us:

Rasul Allah (sal Allahu alaihi wa sallam) said: "A time will come when the nations (of the world) will surround you from every side, just as diners gather around the main dish. Somebody asked, 'Oh Messenger of Allah, will it be on account of our scarcity at that time?' He said, 'No, but you will be scum, like the scum of flood water. Feebleness will be in your hearts, and fear will be removed from the hearts of your enemies, on account of your love for the world, and your abhorrence of death.'" [Ahmad, Abu Dawud]

so...we are basically like the scum of the [earth]...IF we were proper Muslims AND we were spreading the Din properly, then that hadith would NOT apply to us...but...it DOES!

ergo, if we are NOT delivering the Message, ie, doing our job, then humanity is still deserving a second chance!

yet somehow, we must rely on the Mercy of Allah. here's one of my favorite hadiths:

HADITH 42
On the authority of Anas, who said: I heard the messenger of Allah say:

p Allah the Almighty has said: "O son of Adam, so long as you call upon Me and ask of Me, I shall forgive you for what you have done, and I shall not mind. O son of Adam, were your sins to reach the clouds of the sky and were you then to ask forgiveness of Me, I would forgive you. O son of Adam, were you to come to Me with sins nearly as great as the earth and were you then to face Me, ascribing no partner to Me, I would bring you forgiveness nearly as great as its."

related by Al-Tirmithi, who said that it was a good and sound Hadith.

Allah is the Most Merciful, we just need to assess shirk, and eliminate it from our lives. i like my little formula:
Taqwah + Tawbah = Tawhid

Taqwah isn't just fear of Allah, it is a consciousness of Allah. so, learn Tawhid, which entails totally defining shirk; make this your life's goal, all the while seeking Allah's assistance and forgiveness for falling short.

many question Allah's Mercy, but again, another Glorious Hadith:

·Narrated Abu Hurairah:
I heard Allah's Apostle saying, "Allah divided Mercy into one-hundred parts and He kept its ninety-nine parts with Him and sent down its one part on the earth, and because of that one single part, His creations are Merciful to each other, so that even the mare lifts up its hoofs away from its baby animal, lest it should trample on it."
(Bukhari)

we are totally clueless when it comes to Allah's Mercy. actually, when we "think we know better than Allah", we are committing shirk! thus, An Nawawi's Hadith no 42 is imperative to understand.

i want to keep this post short, but i forgot the 5th in my top 5 speakers. and this brother is mad rad! i'll post this lecture just because i watched it yesterday, but the brother is very gifted:



May Allah guide us all to the straight way, idhinas siratul mustaqeen!

ma salaama

How did I avoid the question?? And how did you miss Qur'an 2:62 and 2:286?