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Female circumcision

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    جوري's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Like salt to a wound...

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    you think you are so helpful... yet you are so incredibly offensive...
    I am offended as I am a woman A muslim woman
    who can guarantee that I have had a better upbringing and a better education and life style than you... I can tell just by reading your posts as they display nothing but ignorance... if you were as learned as you'd have us believe.. you'd know something about the basic rights of women in Islam.....
    travel a little... traveling is a great killer of prejudices, bigotry and obtuse views... oh great liberator!

    Women's rights in Islam for the newbie who thinks he is on top of it all.....

    Women in the Sunnah
    Thanks to bros Ansar.
    There is certainly no shortage of statements from the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) which honor women and promote their rights, beginning with the explicit mandate: 'I command you to be kind to women.' (Sahîh Bukhâr&#238.

    He often described a man's treatment of women to be reflective of his own nobility or worth. The Prophet said: 'None but a noble man treats women in an honorable manner. And none but an ignoble treats women disgracefully' (Sunan At-Tirmidh&#238

    The Prophet said: 'The most perfect believers are the best in conduct and the best of you are those who are best to their wives.' (Musnad Ahmad)

    The Prophet said: 'The most perfect of the believers in faith are the best of them in moral excellence, and the best of you are the kindest to their wives. (Sunan At-Tirmidh&#238

    Muslims are commanded to always follow the example of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). In light of this, the Prophet said: 'The best of you is the one who is best to his wife. I am the best of you to his wife and I'm the best to my wife.' (Sunan At-Tirmidhî, Sunan Ad-Dârimî, Sahîh Ibn Hibbân)

    There is no one who could describe better about how the Prophet (peace be upon) was with his wives, then the latter themselves. A'isha, the wife of the Prophet, was asked, "What did the Prophet used to do at home?" She answered, "he kept himself busy helping the members of his household, and when the time for prayer came, he would go out for the prayer". (Sahîh Bukhâr&#238. The Prophet Muhammad participated in the household chores and helped his wives. "He would attend to his clothes, milk his sheep and serve himself." (Musnad Ahmad)

    The Prophet advised one of his companions, Abdullah ibn 'Amr ibn al-'Aas, who used to fast all day and pray all night: 'Do not do that. Fast and break your fast, pray qiyaam and sleep, for your body has a right over you, your eyes have a right over you, your wife has a right over you and your visitors have a right over you.' (Sahîh Bukhârî, Sahîh Muslim)

    The Prophet censured those who quarreled with their wives, describing them as being driven by the most evil of devils:

    "Iblîs (Satan) sets up his throne on water, then he sends out his armies of devils (to incite humans to do evil). The closest to him of these troops are the ones who cause the most tribulation. One devil comes and says, 'I have done such and such.' Iblîs says, 'You have not done enough.' Then another one comes and says, 'I never left him alone until I created trouble and caused division between him and his wife.' Then Iblîs comes close to this devil and says, 'How excellent you are!' " (Sahîh Muslim)

    Likewise, the Prophet denounced those men who were unfaithful regarding their wives' secrets:

    'Verily among the most evil of people with Allah in ranking on the Day of Resurrection is a man who goes to his wife and whose wife goes to him, and then he spreads her secrets.' (Sahîh Muslim, Musnad Ahmad, Sunan Abû Dawûd)

    Prophet Muhammad forbade hostility towards one's wife: 'The believer should not harbor hatred towards his wife. If he dislikes something in her, then surely he will be pleased with another quality in her.' (Sahîh Muslim)

    Instead, he encouraged both men and women to be patient with their spouses: 'If any man shows patience with his wife's bad temper, Allah will give him a reward similar to the reward of Ayyub for his patience, and if any woman shows patience with her husband's bad temper, Allah will give her a reward similar to the reward of Asiyah daughter of Muzahim, the wife of Pharoah (Cf. Qur'an 66:11).' (Al-Kabâ'ir of Adh-Dhahab&#238

    The Prophet encouraged couples to enjoy time together: 'All activities of a man in which there is no mention of God are frivolity, except for four things: A man enjoying time with his wife, training his horse, walking between two purposeful goals, and teaching another man to swim.' (Sunan An-Nasâ'î, Mu'jam At-Tabarân&#238

    He spoke of the mutual rights of men and women on many occasions: 'Consult with women. Indeed, you have some rights over your women and they have some rights over you. It is their right on you that you provide for their food and clothing generously, and your right on them is that they do not let anyone whom you dislike in the house, walking upon your floor. (Sunan Ibn Mâjah, Sunan At-Tirmidh&#238

    And he said concerning the virtuous woman:
    'The life of this world is bountiful, and the best of bounties is the righteous woman.' (Sahîh Muslim)

    Perhaps the clearest example of Islam's honoring of women is in its directives for man to be dutiful to his mother. The Prophet said in a famous narration: 'Paradise lies at the feet of your mother' (Musnad Ahmad, Sunan An-Nasâ’i, Sunan Ibn Mâjah)

    Scholars have proven the preference of the mother over the father from the following narration:
    A man came to Prophet Muhammad asking “ O Messenger of God, who among the people is the most worthy of my good company?” The Prophet said “Your mother”. The man said “then who else?” The Prophet said “Your mother”. The man asked, “then who else?” The Prophet replied “Your mother” When the man asked for the fourth time, only then did the Prophet say, “Your father” ( Sahîh Bukhârî, Sahîh Muslim)

    The Prophet did not stop at commanding kindness to wives and honoring one's mother. He continually singled out daughters when emphasizing the good treatment of one's children. The Prophet said: 'Anyone who cares for three daughter, gives them a good upbringing, marries them to good husbands and treats them well, they will enter paradise. The companions asked, "What about two daughters?" He said, "Even two daughters". They asked what about one daughter? He said "even one". (Sunan Abi Dawûd, Musnad Ahmad, Mustadarak Al-Hâkim). It is significant that in the above narration, the Prophet has promised nothing short of paradise to the believer on account of good treatment to women. Can there be any weightier statement in favor of women?

    The Prophet explictly forbade any gender bias towards one's children, though it was prevalent in pre-islamic arabian culture. The Prophet said: 'Whoever has a daughter born to him, and he did not prefer his son over him, Allah will admit him to Paradise because of her.' (Mustadarak Al-Hâkim)

    The Prophet also extended honorable treatment to include one's sisters in addition to daughters: 'There is no one who has three daughters, or three sisters, and he treats them well, but Allah will admit him/her to Paradise.' (Al-Adab Al-Mufrad of Bukhâr&#238

    The Prophet said: 'There is no one among my ummah who has three daughters, or three sisters, and he supports them until they are grown up, but he will be with me in Paradise like this – and he held up his index and middle fingers together.' (Mu'jam At-Tabarân&#238

    Thus, the Prophet not only made virtuous treatment of women a path to paradise, but he said it would bring one close to the Prophet himself in paradise.

    In another narration, the Prophet Muhammad said that a believing woman's sacrifice for he daughters was a cause for her entrance to paradise. A'isha, the wife of the Prophet (peace be upon him), said: 'A poor woman came to me carrying her two daughters. I gave her three dates to eat. She gave each child a date, and raised the third to her own mouth to eat it. Her daughters asked her to give it to them, so she split the date that she had wanted to eat between them. I was impressed by what she had done, and told the Messenger of Allah about it. He said, “Allah has decreed Paradise for her because of it”.' (Sahîh Muslim)

    At a time when a woman was valued only for material benefits or superficial qualities, the Prophet Muhammad taught his companions to value women for their piety. The Prophet said: 'A woman is married for four reasons: for her property, her status, her beauty, and her religion; so marry one who is religious, may you be blessed.' (Sahîh Bukhâr&#238

    The Prophet also said: 'Whoever Allah has blessed with a virtuous woman has been helped with half of his religion. So let him be mindful of God concerning the remaining half.' (Mu'jam At-Tabarânî, Mustadarak Al-Hâkim)

    He also upheld women's right in choosing their spouse, as seen in the following narration:
    Al-Khansaa’ bint Khidaam complained to the Prophet that her father wanted her to marry someone she didn’t want, saying “I do not wish to accept what my father has arranged.” The Prophet said, “Then this marriage is invalid, go and marry whomever you wish.” Al-Khansaa’ said, “I have actually accepted what my father has arranged, but I wanted women to know that fathers have no right in their daughter’s matters” (i.e. they have no right to force a marriage on them). (Fath Al-Barî Ibn Hajr, Sunan Ibn Mâjah)

    The Prophet said: 'Assuredly, women are the twin halves of men.' (Sunan Abî Dawûd, Sunan At-Tirmidhî, Musnad Ahmad).

    In light of the numerous teachings honoring women, it would be no exaggeration to say that the greatest advocate of women's rights was none other than the Prophet Muhammad himself, peace be upon him.


    http://www.load-islam.com/artical_de...bsection=Women
    Last edited by جوري; 10-11-2006 at 03:29 AM.
    Female circumcision

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    Re: Like salt to a wound...

    format_quote Originally Posted by PurestAmbrosia View Post
    you think you are so helpful... yet you are so incredibly offensive...
    I am offended as I am a woman A muslim woman
    who can guarantee that I have had a better upbringing and a better education and life style than you... I can tell just by reading your posts as they display nothing but ignorance... if you were as learned as you'd have us believe.. you'd know something about the basic rights of women in Islam.....
    travel a little... traveling is a great killer of prejudices, bigotry and obtuse views... oh great liberator!

    Women's rights in Islam for the newbie who thinks he is on top of it all.....
    Ah so this is all just myth is it?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_circumcision

    fgmmapnm6 - Female circumcision
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    جوري's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Like salt to a wound...

    that isn't an Islamic practice it is however a practice prevalent in Africa........ Anyone can write for wiki........ but no one can rewrite the history which stands true and unchanged for the last 1400 years... how people choose to practice overshadowed by cultural restrictions are free and independent from the religion. The religion in fact came to free them from such practices including burial of female infants.......
    Again, if you had done some reading on Islamic beliefs and women's rights.. you'd have known that, and wouldn't be successively displaying your ignorance in big bombastic words.....
    peace
    Last edited by جوري; 10-11-2006 at 09:55 AM.
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    Ulysses's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Like salt to a wound...

    I'll be honest with you ambrosia. I believe that Islam is complicit with this sort of thing. I believe that there is no true single "Islam" but that the core features of the religion have been highly misinterpreted. The Taliban, FGM, the practice of covering the female form as a putative act of modesty, etc., are reflections of such misinterpretations. There is simply a need for a reform movement that can unify and revitalize the faith, much like Martin Luther's Theses revitalized the stagnant Christian faith and allowed it to keep pace with intellectual developments in the Renaissance.
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    Re: Like salt to a wound...

    format_quote Originally Posted by Ulysses View Post
    I'll be honest with you ambrosia. I believe that Islam is complicit with this sort of thing. I believe that there is no true single "Islam" but that the core features of the religion have been highly misinterpreted. The Taliban, FGM, the practice of covering the female form as a putative act of modesty, etc., are reflections of such misinterpretations. There is simply a need for a reform movement that can unify and revitalize the faith, much like Martin Luther's Theses revitalized the stagnant Christian faith and allowed it to keep pace with intellectual developments in the Renaissance.
    Thank you. That is your belief. Not to mention that you have no right to say what has been "misinterpreted" as you have no knowledge of Islam whatsoever except what youve learned through CNN. Youve never even read the Quran and you are speaking out of your ignorance and your posts are evident of that. Ill say thank you to you to keep your views to yourself or propagate them elsewhere. Not many people here will take you seriously. You mock at us and the Truth but we mock at you for your mocking
    Last edited by Ibn Abi Ahmed; 10-11-2006 at 04:18 AM.
    Female circumcision

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    جوري's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Like salt to a wound...

    funny you should mention that.... let me give you this video about a journalist from England who was captured by the taliban ..... then when released went back to England......... read the Quran really with the intent of fighting against it. only to end up converting... I am not suggesting you do that... I am only suggesting you open your mind a little that we are not all colored by the images in your head or the ones portrayed on your TV... in fact if I say so myself we are wonderful folk......

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...e+ridley&hl=en

    so many of us out there... we are not all from Africa, or Asia, or china, or ancient mesopatmia, or France...... we are everywhere and from every culture REALLY... I kid you not!

    It was Islam that gave the world enlightenment in the midst of the Dark ages... surely you have read some history? Surely you must know that there are no Islamic countries currently and the current state of the so-called Muslim world is but the outcome of their secularist govt. Controlled by outside influence............
    There is a wind of change indeed... in spite of all this... Islam is fastest growing religion....... 14000 new converts in England alone post 911 since you seem fond of stats.... why do you think the appeal in spite of "popular opinion"?
    I'll answer in my simplistic way....... people picked a book and learned it from the source, not secondary political opinions based on America's hope of world domination....
    Last edited by جوري; 10-11-2006 at 04:28 AM.
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    Re: Like salt to a wound...

    Thank you all for your recommended reading and viewing lists. My preference is to read ethnographies of Islamic societies.
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    Re: Like salt to a wound...

    lol ok can we please get bak 2 the topic...... ulysses you've got issues... i mentioned that once the divorce happens..the two are non-Mahrams... so why should soemone feel sorrow for the action of the other?

    women are allowed to get engaged the day after their divorce, and consummate their marriage the day after if they didnt sleep with their x-husband... otherwise she can consummate her marriage 3months n 10 days after her divorce (to clear up doubts incase she becomes pregnant... as to who the baby belongs, as well as for physiological reasons.... multiple men sleeping with same woman in short period fo time is major cause of aids)

    same goes for men... once he's divorced, he too has right to remarry the next day if he wants....

    so what's the big deal? i know divorce isnt something to be happy about (may allah keep it away from all of us). But dwelling on it is destructive.
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