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    Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

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    I found this interesting, an argument in support of the idea that Aisha was 17 years old when she was married. By Jamal Badawi.

    Some background information, he rejects the hadiths in Bukhari that say she was 9 because they all go back to one person who, although he was trustworthy, suffered from bad memory at later age.

    5. It is known that between the marriage contract and Aisha's moving to the Prophet's household, there was a 3-year gab during which she stayed with her parents.

    6. It is also known that her moving to the Prophet's household took place in the first or second year after migration from Makkah to Madina. It is also known that the Makkan period lasted for 13 years, and the famous biographer Ibn Is-haq lists the name of Aisha among the very early persons who accepted Islam in the first few months of the Prophet's mission. If we were to add a minimum age of Aisha to understand what she was accepting, say 4 + the 13 years in Makkah + 1 or 2 years in Madina, it adds up probably to 19 years and not only 9, which is the number reported in Al-Bukhari.

    7. While the above is more than enough, it is noted also that many historians have debated the age of Aisha when she married the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him). One is that some say that Aisha died at the age of 50 after migration, at the age of 67, which means that she was born 17 years old before migration, and since her marriage was consummated one or two years after migration, it must have taken place at the age of 19.

    8. It is also known that her sister Asmaa was 10 years her senior. It is interesting to note that Asmaa died in the year 73 after migration, at the age of 100, this means she was born 27 years before migration (100-73). Since she was 10 years older, then Aisha was born 17 years before migration, which is consistent with these other reports.

    http://www.islamonline.net/livedialo...GuestID=s905I1

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    Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument


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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    A`udhu Billahi mina Shaytanir Rajeem,

    Bismillahir Rahmanir Raheem

    Assalamu alaykum wa'rahma-tullahi, wa'barakatahu Malaikah,

    i don't know at what age they were marrried, but most accounts that i've listened to or read say A'isha(ra) was 9 when she consumated her marriage the Rasulullah(pbuh).

    i would be interested in hearing more, but at any rate, i have no problem at all with any aspect of their marriage. after his(pbuh) first love Khadija(ra), the Rasulullah(pbuh) loved A'isha more than any other person he ever met, AND she was the only one of his(pbuh) wives in whom's presence revelation was revealed; that indicates acceptance by Allah(SWT) and that's good enough for me!

    not to mention that her(ra) father was Abu Bakr as Saddiq(ra). if there are 3 people that we can safely assume were on the right path, you can't pick 3 better people! know what i mean?

    Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    Yes, 9 does seem to be the most promoted age, however as I mentioned Badawi rejects this idea because almost all the hadiths that state this are based on a person who had weak memory later in life...

    God knows best what her true age was, but I find this prospect interesting, especially the maths part...
    Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument


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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    Allahu A'lam

    Authenticity of hadith regarding Aisha's age

    Reports regarding Aisha's age were recorded during the Abbasid caliphate when Aisha's youth might be deliberately emphasized by scholars to reject Shi'a claims for the descendants of Ali ibn Abi Talib.

    (D. A. Spellberg, Politics, Gender, and the Islamic Past: the Legacy of A'isha bint Abi Bakr, Columbia University Press, 1994)

    Most of the narratives regarding Aisha's age are reported only by Hisham ibn Urwa reporting on the authority of his father. All the narratives of this event have been reported through narrators from Iraq, where Hisham ibn Urwa is reported to have shifted after living in Madinah for seventy-one years. It is reported in one of the most well known books on the life and reliability of the narrators of the traditions ascribed to Muhammad that Yaqub ibn Shaibah said, "narratives reported by Hisham are reliable except those that are reported through the people of Iraq". It further states that Malik ibn Anas objected on those narratives of Hisham, which were reported through people of Iraq.[20] Another book on the narrators of the traditions of Muhammad reports that when he was old, Hisham's memory suffered quite badly.[21]
    ( Ibn Hajar Asqalani, Tahdhib al-Tahdhib, Dar Ihya al-turath al-Islami, 15th century. Vol 11, p. 50 )
    (Al-Dhahabi, Mizanu’l-ai`tidal, Al-Maktabatu’l-athriyyah, Sheikhupura, Pakistan, Vol. 4, p. 301)

    Muhammad is attributed to say, "A woman must be consulted and get her permission to make the marriage valid".(Mishkat al-Masabih, translation by James Robson, Vol. I, p.665) According to another report, Aisha at the age of nine was rather more interested to play with toy-horses than to take up the responsible task of a wife. (Musnad Ahmad ibn Hanbal, vol.6, p. 33 and 99) The permission of an immature girl cannot be a valid authorization for marriage.

    Comparison of hadith of Aisha's age with hadith of Laylat al-Qadr, in which 1 was used for 21, 3 for 23, 5 for 25 and so on, suggest that maybe Aisha's reports were transmitted literally and 16 became 6 and 19 became 9, as it is a way of talking in Arabic language when base is already known.(
    (Hakim Niaz Ahmad, تحقیق عمرعا،ہ صدیقہ (Research on the age of Ayesha), Mashkoor Academy, Karachi.)

    Evidences from Islamic literature

    According to hadith in Bukhari and Muslim, Aisha is said to have joined Muhammad on the raid that culminated in the Battle of Badr, in 624 CE (Sahih Muslim, 19:4472) and then in 625 CE in the Battle of Uhud. (Sahih Bukhari, 4:52:131) As no one below the age of fifteen was allowed to accompany raiding parties,(Sahih Bukhari 5:59:423 , Sahih Muslim 19:4466 ) Aisha should have been at least fifteen in 624 CE and thus at least thirteen when she was married following the Hijra in 622 CE.

    Ibn Hisham's recension of Ibn Ishaq's Sirat Rashul Allah, the earliest surviving biography of Muhammad, records Aisha as having converted to Islam before Umar ibn al-Khattab, during the first few years of Islam around 610 CE. In order to accept Islam she must have been walking and talking, hence at least three years of age, which would make her at least fifteen in 622 CE.(Ibn Hisham, Al-Sirah al-Nabawiyyah, Vol. 1, p.227 - 234, Arabic, Maktabah al-Riyadh al-hadithah, Al-Riyadh )

    Tabari reports that Abu Bakr wished to spare Aisha the discomforts of a journey to Ethiopia soon after 615 CE, and tried to bring forward her marriage to Mut`im ibn `Uday's son. Mut`am refused because Abu Bakr had converted to Islam, but if Aisha was already of marriageable age in 615 CE, she must have been older than nine in 622 CE.(Tabari, Vol. 1, pg. 493, Habib ur Rahman Kandhalwi, Age of Aisha, Al-Rahman Publishing Trust, Karachi ) (p.91)

    Tabari also reports that Abu Bakr's four children were all born during the Jahiliyyah, (Al-Tabari, Tarikhu’l-umam wa’l-mamlu’k, Vol. 4, p. 50, Arabic, Dara’l-fikr, Beirut, 1979) the pre Islamic period, which is said to have ended in 610 CE, making Aisha at least twelve in 622 CE when Aisha started living with Muhammad.

    Aisha is reported to have said that at the time Surah Al-Qamar, the 54th chapter of the Qur'an , was revealed, "I was a young girl".(Sahih Bukhari 6:60:399) The 54th Surah of the Qur'an was revealed nine years before Hijrah.(M. M. Khatib, The Bounteous Koran, 1989 ISBN 0-333-34738-2) According to this tradition, Aisha had not only been born before the revelation of the referred Surah, but was actually a young girl, not even only an infant at that time. So if this age is assumed to be 7 to 14 years then her age at the time of marriage would be 16 to 23.

    According to almost all the historians, Asma bint Abu Bakr, the elder sister of Aisha, was ten years older than Aisha. (Al-Dhahabi, Siyar A`la’ma’l-nubala’, Vol. 2, p. 289, Arabic, Mu’assasatu’l-risalah, Beirut, 1992
    Ibn Kathir, Al-Bidayah wa’l-nihayah, Vol. 8, p. 371, Dar al-fikr al-`arabi, Al-jizah, 1933)
    Asma is reported to die in the 73 AH, when she was 100 years old.Ibn Kathir, Al-Bidayah wa’l-nihayah, Vol. 8, p. 372, Dar al-fikr al-`arabi, Al-jizah, 1933
    Ibn Hajar Asqalani, Tahdhib al-Tahdhib, p. 654, Arabic, Bab fi’l-nisa’, al-harfu’l-alif, Lucknow)
    Now, obviously if Asma was 100 years old in the 73 AH, she should have been 27 or 28 years old at the time of Migration to Medina (1 AH). If Asma was 27 or 28 years old at that time, Aisha should have been 17 or 18 years old at the same time. Thus, Aisha - if she got married in 1 AH or 2 AH - was between 18 to 20 years old at the time of her marriage.




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    Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument




    subhaan Allaah.. whats the strongest view then?

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    The issue of `A’ishah bint Abi Bakr has arisen purely around the fact that she married Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) when she was young and as you said, “Do we know what her true age was?” The problem is that we are dependent on reports of information. Even with accurate reporting, it is difficult to sustain that level of accuracy 100% of the time, all the time.

    The true records that are referred to by Muslims for guidance are the Qur’an and the Hadiths (traditions) of Prophet Muhammad, the essence of both of which is the religion of Islam. They are not sociology textbooks although Islam covers all aspects of life. One of the foremost records depended upon is the collection of hadiths of Prophet Muhammad in the Sahih of Al-Bukhari. From the translation of Dr. Amin Al-Masri of Cambridge University, England and Head of Shari`ah at the College of Shari`ah and Islamic Studies in Makkah, we are informed:

    `A’ishah reported that the Prophet wrote the marriage contract with her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old. Hisham said: “I have been informed that `A’ishah remained with the Prophet for nine years (i.e., till his death).” (Al-Bukhari 7: 65)

    The Prophet wrote the (marriage contract) with `A’ishah while she was six years old and consummated his marriage with her while she was nine years old and she remained with him for nine years (i.e., till his death). (Al-Bukhari 7: 88)

    Islamic scholar Maulana Muhammad Ali was one of the first to challenge `A’ishah’s age. In his books Muhammad, the Prophet and Living Thoughts of the Prophet Muhammad, he states:

    A great misconception prevails as to the age at which `A’ishah was taken in marriage by the Prophet. Ibn Sa`d has stated in the Tabaqat that when Abu Bakr (father of `A’ishah) was approached on behalf of the Prophet, he replied that the girl had already been betrothed to Jubair and that he would have to settle the matter first with him. This shows that `A’ishah must have been approaching maturity at the time.

    Again, the Isaba, speaking of the Prophet’s daughter Fatimah, says that she was born five years before the Call and was about five years older than `A’ishah. This shows that `A’ishah must have been about ten years at the time of her betrothal to the Prophet, and not six years as she is generally supposed to be.

    This is further borne out by the fact that `A’ishah herself is reported to have stated that when the fifty-fourth chapter [i.e., surah] of the Qur’an entitled “The Moon” [Al-Qamar] was revealed, she was a girl playing about and remembered certain verses then revealed. Now the fifty-fourth chapter was undoubtedly revealed before the sixth year of the Call. All these considerations point to but one conclusion, viz., that `A'ishah could not have been less than ten years of age at the time of her nikah, which was virtually only a betrothal.

    And there is one report in the Tabaqat that `A’ishah was nine years of age at the time of nikah. Again it is a fact admitted on all hands that the nikah of `A’ishah took place in the tenth year of the Call in the month of Shawwal. This is while there is also preponderance of evidence as to the consummation of her marriage taking place in the second year of Hijrah in the same month, which shows that full five years had elapsed between the nikah and the consummation. Hence, there is not the least doubt that `A’isha was at least nine or ten years of age at the time of betrothal, and fourteen or fifteen years at the time of marriage.

    If we dig deeper, we find that the great Islamic historian Ibn Jarir At-Tabari in his History iterated:

    In the time before Islam, Abu Bakr married two women. The first was Fatila daughter of `Abdul `Uzza, from whom `Abdullah and `Asmaa’ were born. Then he married Umm Ruman, from whom `Abdur-Rahman and `A’ishah were born. These four were born before Islam.

    The issue of `A’ishah bint Abi Bakr has arisen purely around the fact that she married Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) when she was young and as you said, “Do we know what her true age was?” The problem is that we are dependent on reports of information. Even with accurate reporting, it is difficult to sustain that level of accuracy 100% of the time, all the time.

    The true records that are referred to by Muslims for guidance are the Qur’an and the Hadiths (traditions) of Prophet Muhammad, the essence of both of which is the religion of Islam. They are not sociology textbooks although Islam covers all aspects of life. One of the foremost records depended upon is the collection of hadiths of Prophet Muhammad in the Sahih of Al-Bukhari. From the translation of Dr. Amin Al-Masri of Cambridge University, England and Head of Shari`ah at the College of Shari`ah and Islamic Studies in Makkah, we are informed:

    `A’ishah reported that the Prophet wrote the marriage contract with her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old. Hisham said: “I have been informed that `A’ishah remained with the Prophet for nine years (i.e., till his death).” (Al-Bukhari 7: 65)

    The Prophet wrote the (marriage contract) with `A’ishah while she was six years old and consummated his marriage with her while she was nine years old and she remained with him for nine years (i.e., till his death). (Al-Bukhari 7: 88)
    Islamic scholar Maulana Muhammad Ali was one of the first to challenge `A’ishah’s age. In his books Muhammad, the Prophet and Living Thoughts of the Prophet Muhammad, he states:

    A great misconception prevails as to the age at which `A’ishah was taken in marriage by the Prophet. Ibn Sa`d has stated in the Tabaqat that when Abu Bakr (father of `A’ishah) was approached on behalf of the Prophet, he replied that the girl had already been betrothed to Jubair and that he would have to settle the matter first with him. This shows that `A’ishah must have been approaching maturity at the time.

    Again, the Isaba, speaking of the Prophet’s daughter Fatimah, says that she was born five years before the Call and was about five years older than `A’ishah. This shows that `A’ishah must have been about ten years at the time of her betrothal to the Prophet, and not six years as she is generally supposed to be.

    This is further borne out by the fact that `A’ishah herself is reported to have stated that when the fifty-fourth chapter [i.e., surah] of the Qur’an entitled “The Moon” [Al-Qamar] was revealed, she was a girl playing about and remembered certain verses then revealed. Now the fifty-fourth chapter was undoubtedly revealed before the sixth year of the Call. All these considerations point to but one conclusion, viz., that `A'ishah could not have been less than ten years of age at the time of her nikah, which was virtually only a betrothal.

    And there is one report in the Tabaqat that `A’ishah was nine years of age at the time of nikah. Again it is a fact admitted on all hands that the nikah of `A’ishah took place in the tenth year of the Call in the month of Shawwal. This is while there is also preponderance of evidence as to the consummation of her marriage taking place in the second year of Hijrah in the same month, which shows that full five years had elapsed between the nikah and the consummation. Hence, there is not the least doubt that `A’isha was at least nine or ten years of age at the time of betrothal, and fourteen or fifteen years at the time of marriage.
    If we dig deeper, we find that the great Islamic historian Ibn Jarir At-Tabari in his History iterated:

    In the time before Islam, Abu Bakr married two women. The first was Fatila daughter of `Abdul `Uzza, from whom `Abdullah and `Asmaa’ were born. Then he married Umm Ruman, from whom `Abdur-Rahman and `A’ishah were born. These four were born before Islam.

    Looking at `A'ishah's impressions of her early life, we can indeed see that she was born before the Call:

    Since I reached the age when I could remember things, I have seen my parents worshiping according to the right faith of Islam. Not a single day passed but Allah’s Messenger visited us both in the morning and in the evening. When the Muslims were persecuted, Abu Bakr set out for Ethiopia as an emigrant. When he reached a place called Bark Al-Ghimad, he met Ibn Ad-Daghna, the chief of the Qara tribe, who asked Abu Bakr, “Where are you going?” Abu Bakr said, “My people have turned me out of the country and I would like to tour the world and worship my Lord.” Ibn Ad-Daghna said, “A man like you will not go out, nor will he be turned out, as you help the poor earn their living, keep good relations with your kith and kin, help the disabled (or the dependents), provide guests with food and shelter, and help people during their troubles. I am your protector. So, go back and worship your Lord at your home.”

    Ibn Ad-Daghna went along with Abu Bakr and took him to the chiefs of Quraysh saying to them, “A man like Abu Bakr will not go out, nor will he be turned out. Do you turn out a man who helps the poor earn their living, keeps good relations with kith and kin, helps the disabled, provides guests with food and shelter and helps the people during their troubles?” (Al-Bukhari 3: 37 #494)

    570 CE: Prophet Muhammad born
    595 CE: Married Khadijah, his first wife
    610 CE: Received the revelation that led to his Call to Islam
    613 CE: Started preaching publicly
    615 CE: His daughter Fatimah born
    622 CE: Left Makkah for Madinah
    623 CE: `A’ishah entered the household of Prophet Muhammad
    625 CE: Battle of Uhud


    The famous classical commentator on the Qur’an, Ibn Kathir, wrote in Al-Bidayya wan-Nihaya: “Asmaa’ died in 73 AH at the age of one hundred years. She was ten years older than her sister `A'ishah.”

    It might be worth noting that pubescence is characterized by the proliferation of sex cells which begins with the menarche, or first menstruation, in girls. Research has noted that the average age at which the menarche begins has been decreasing among Western European girls and apparently among girls of the United States and Canada, as well, since as far back as 1976. What this means is that we should try to avoid generalizations about when menstruation begins; this differs from culture to culture as well as epoch to epoch. If you want to take this further: puberty comes from the Latin word pubertas, which means “adult”. The Qur’an states what means:

    *{And when the children among you have attained to puberty, let them seek permission as those before them sought permission; thus does Allah make clear to you His communications, and Allah is Knowing, Wise}* (An-Nur 24: 59)



    Sister of Islam

    http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/S...AskAboutIslamE
    Last edited by FatimaAsSideqah; 04-07-2007 at 02:24 PM.

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    salaam,

    The most authentic book in the world after the Qur'an is Bukhari. Do not listen to anyone who tries to tell you that a hadith in Bukhari is not authentic.
    Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    قُلْ هَـذِهِ سَبِيلِي أَدْعُو إِلَى اللّهِ عَلَى بَصِيرَةٍ أَنَاْ وَمَنِ اتَّبَعَنِي وَسُبْحَانَ اللّهِ وَمَا أَنَاْ مِنَ الْمُشْرِكِينَ

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuAbdallah View Post
    salaam,

    The most authentic book in the world after the Qur'an is Bukhari. Do not listen to anyone who tries to tell you that a hadith in Bukhari is not authentic.


    That is true, brother!

    I have been posted above you..I put some of Bukhari's evidence about Aisha's age..


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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuAbdallah View Post
    salaam,

    The most authentic book in the world after the Qur'an is Bukhari. Do not listen to anyone who tries to tell you that a hadith in Bukhari is not authentic.


    exactly!

    from here and more

    Due to the apparent ignorance of many Muslims, possibly due to reading "modernist" apologetic literature like that mentioned above, a look at what the authentic sources of Islam say about the age at which 'Aishah married the Prophet is in order. This way, before we move on to an analysis of the facts, we will first establish what the authentic Islamic facts are. At this point, it should be mentioned that it is absolutely pointless from an Islamic standpoint to say that the age of 'Aishah is "not found in the Qur'an", since the textual sources of Islam are made up of BOTH the Qur'an and the Sunnah - and the Qur'an tells us that. For those wanting (or needing) to learn more about the status of the Sunnah in Islam, please read The Meaning of Sunna and Probativeness of Sunna (Parts: [1][2][3][4][5][6][7]). Now in regards to what the authentic Islamic sources actually say, it may come as a disappointment to some "modern" and "cultured" Muslims that there are four ahadith in Saheeh al-Bukhari and three ahadith in Saheeh Muslim which clearly state that 'Aishah was "nine years old" at the time that her marriage was consummated with the Prophet . These ahadith, with only slight variation, read as follows:

    'Aishah, may God be pleased with her, narrated that the Prophet was betrothed (zawaj) to her when she was six years old and he consummated (nikah) his marriage when she was nine years old, and then she remained with him for nine years. (Saheeh al-Bukhari, Volume 7, Book 62, Number 64)

    Of the four ahadith in Saheeh al-Bukhari, two were narrated from 'Aishah (7:64 and 7:65), one from Abu Hishaam (5:236) and one via 'Ursa (7:88). All three of the ahadith in Saheeh Muslim have 'Aishah as a narrator. Additionally, all of the ahadith in both books agree that the marriage betrothal contract took place when 'Aishah was "six years old", but was not consummated until she was "nine years old".

    Additionally, a hadeeth with basically the same text (matn) is reported in Sunan Abu Dawood. Needless to say, this evidence is-Islamically speaking-overwhelmingly strong and Muslims who deny it do so only by sacrificing their intellectual honesty, pure faith or both.

    This evidence having been established, there doesn't seem much room for debate about 'Aishah's age amongst believing Muslims. Until someone proves that in the Arabic language "nine years old" means something other than "nine years old", then we should all be firm in our belief that she was "nine years old" (as if there's a reason or need to believe otherwise!?!). In spite of these facts, there are still some Muslim authors that have somehow (?) managed to push 'Aishah's age out to as far as "fourteen or fifteen years old" at the time of her marriage to the Prophet . It should come as no surprise, however, that none of them ever offer any proof, evidence or references for their opinions. This can be said with the utmost confidence, since certainly none of them can produce sources more authentic than the hadeeth collections of Imams al-Bukhari and Muslim! Based on the research that I've done, I feel that there is a common source for those who claim that 'Aishah's age was "fourteen or fifteen years old" at the time of the marriage. This source is "The Biographies of Prominent Muslims" which is published in book form, on CD-ROM and is posted in several places on the Internet. Just another example of why going to the sources is important . .
    .
    Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    Our Lord! Verily, we have heard the call of one calling to Faith: 'Believe in your Lord,' and we have believed.
    Our Lord! Forgive us our sins and expiate from us our evil deeds, and make us die (in the state of righteousness) along with Al-Abrar

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    Really, I find this amazing that something established will have to be changed based on "new" evidence. Bukhari is the most authentic book after the Qur'an, and Imam Bukhari knew more about the Rijaal in the chains then any contemporary scholar, and so did those established scholars of Hadith who have gone over every nook and cranny in Sahih Bukhari for the past millenium.

    Someone might read the article and be like, "Ok, now I'll convert to Islam". What happens when he picks Sahih Al Bukhari and it is narrated that the Messenger married her when she was six and consumated the marriage when she was nine?? Either the person will leave Islam because the reason he converted was because he thought Aisha r.a. was older, or he'll start doubting the hadith and both will lead to the person's own destruction. Not to mention that these narrations are Mutafaq Alay..which means there can be no doubt regarding it whatsoever.
    Last edited by Ibn Abi Ahmed; 04-08-2007 at 01:51 AM.
    Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    Do not argue with your Lord on behalf of your soul, rather argue with your soul on behalf of your Lord.” - Dhul-Nun

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    I have make clear about Sahih Bukhari..

    Sunni Muslims believe that al-Bukhari spent sixteen years collecting and writing down those traditions he thought trustworthy. They recount that Bukhari collected over 300,000 hadith and transmitted only 2,602 traditions that he believed to be Sahih. It is said that before he placed a hadith in his collection, he would perform ghusl (full\greater ritual ablution) and prayed two Rakah (Islamic unit for form of prayer) Nafl (voluntary prayer) to ask God for guidance.

    Sunnis believe that al-Bukhari finished his work in 846 CE (232 AH), and that he spent the last twenty-four years of his life visiting other cities and scholars, teaching the hadith he had collected. They say that in every city that he visited, thousands of people would gather in the main mosque to listen to him recite traditions. Regarding Western academic doubts as to the actual date and authorship of the book that bears his name, Sunni say that notable hadith scholars of that time, such as Ahmad Ibn Hanbal (855 CE/241 AH), Ibn Maīn (847 CE/233 AH), and Ibn Madīni (848 CE/234 AH), all accepted the authenticity of his book. Thus, the collection's inmediate fame makes arguments regarding its being changed after the author's death highly improbable.

    During this long period of twenty-four years, Bukhari made minor changes to his book, in particular its chapter headings. Each version is named by its narrator. According to Ibn Hajar Asqalani in his book Nukat, the number of hadiths in all narrations (versions) is the same. The most famous one today is the version narrated by al-Firabri (d. 932 CE/320 AH), who is a trusted student of Bukhari. Khatib al-Baghdadi in his book History of Baghdad had quoted Firabri saying: "There were about seventy thousand people who have heard Sahih Bukhari with me".

    Firabri is not the only transmitter of Sahih al-Bukhari. There were many others that narrated that book to later generations, such as Ibrahim ibn Ma'qal (d. 907 CE/295 AH), Hammad ibn Shaker (d. 923 CE/311 AH), Mansur Burduzi (d. 931 CE/319 AH), and Husain Mahamili (d. 941 CE/330 AH). There are many books that noted differences between these versions; Fath al-Bari is the most famous among them.

    Sahih Bukhari is a collection of sayings and deeds of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), also known as the sunnah. The reports of the Prophet's sayings and deeds are called ahadith. Bukhari lived a couple of centuries after the Prophet's death and worked extremely hard to collect his ahadith. Each report in his collection was checked for compatibility with the Qur'an, and the veracity of the chain of reporters had to be painstakingly established. Bukhari's collection is recognized by the overwhelming majority of the Muslim world to be one of the most authentic collections of the Sunnah of the Prophet (pbuh).



    Sister of Islam

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    Quote Originally Posted by AbuAbdallah View Post
    salaam,

    The most authentic book in the world after the Qur'an is Bukhari. Do not listen to anyone who tries to tell you that a hadith in Bukhari is not authentic.
    i couldn't agree more. I'm not going to listen to a "scholar" who rejects what bukhari says.

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    Oh come on! If we start doubting Sahih al-Bukhari, halft our religion is destroyed.

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    I seek refuge in Allah Ta'ala from the whispered of Shaytan!

    1) Prophet Muhammed has said: "Ask your heart regarding it. Piety is that which contents the soul and comforts the heart, and sin is that which causes doubts and perturbs the heart, even if people pronounce it lawful and give you verdicts on such matters again and again.''

    2) Hasan bin `Ali (May Allah be pleased with them) reported: I have retained these words of Messenger of Allah , "Leave what causes you doubt and turn to what does not cause you doubt.''


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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    Please, if u wanna 'debate' on something, do it on something that is worth debating about!

    Don't try to change ur religion to fit in in with society! Astagfirullâh!!

    Bukhari is the most reliable Hadith there is, and if people start to doubt that then....

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    Hazrat Aaisha (razi Allahu anha) was 6 when she got married. End of story.

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    It seems most of us Muslims agreed with view of Aisha who was married at age of 6 years old..

    I will repeat that Sahih Bukhari is the most authentic and most true!

    Nothing doubts about it!!


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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    Regardless of her age, It was no1 other than the Prophet (saw) that married Aisha (ra), so there was Hikma(Wisdom) in the decision. Leave it at that.

    This is a 17 year old arguement which has been done to death.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abu Zakariya View Post
    Oh come on! If we start doubting Sahih al-Bukhari, halft our religion is destroyed.
    lol, can you please think twice before making such statements?

    Ofcourse a person would be stupid to reject a Sahih Bukhari, but to say that half of that persons religon is destroyed because of the rejection is stepping the line a tad bit.

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument

    I have found this on another forum :

    Its crystal clear that she (r.a) was not 9.

    The hadith that suggests this and its narrator were rejected by Imam Malik (ra) 100 years before it was included in the collections of Bukhari and Muslim and labeled 'Sahih'.

    The clearest tradition that goes against it is the one that says all of Abu Bakr's (r.a) children were born in the Jahiliya.

    Anyway, there are many discussions on this topic already in this forum.

    For me, it is one of the proofs that the further down the scholarly line we go (i.e. the longer the time since the Prophet asws) the more mistaken we get.
    * Reports regarding Aisha's age were recorded during the Abbasid caliphate when Aisha's youth might be deliberately emphasized by scholars to reject Shi'a claims for the descendants of Ali ibn Abi Talib.

    * Most of the narratives regarding Aisha's age are reported only by Hisham ibn Urwa reporting on the authority of his father. All the narratives of this event have been reported through narrators from Iraq, where Hisham ibn Urwa is reported to have shifted after living in Madinah for seventy-one years. It is reported in one of the most well known books on the life and reliability of the narrators of the traditions ascribed to Muhammad that Yaqub ibn Shaibah said, "narratives reported by Hisham are reliable except those that are reported through the people of Iraq". It further states that Malik ibn Anas objected on those narratives of Hisham, which were reported through people of Iraq. Another book on the narrators of the traditions of Muhammad reports that when he was old, Hisham's memory suffered quite badly.

    * Muhammad is attributed to say, "A women must be consulted and get her permission to make the marriage valid". According to another report, Aisha at the age of nine was rather more interested to play with toy-horses than to take up the responsible task of a wife. The permission of an immature girl cannot be a valid authorization for marriage.

    * Comparison of hadith of Aisha's age with hadith of Laylat al-Qadr, in which 1 was used for 21, 3 for 23, 5 for 25 and so on, suggest that maybe Aisha's reports were transmitted literally and 16 became 6 and 19 became 9, as it is a way of talking in Arabic language when base is already known.

    * According to hadith in Bukhari and Muslim, Aisha is said to have joined Muhammad on the raid that culminated in the Battle of Badr, in 624 CE and then in 625 CE in the Battle of Uhud. As no one below the age of fifteen was allowed to accompany war parties, Aisha should have been at least fifteen in 624 CE and thus at least thirteen when she was married following the Hijra in 622 CE.

    * Ibn Hisham's recension of Ibn Ishaq's Sirat Rashul Allah, the earliest surviving biography of Muhammad, records Aisha as having converted to Islam before Umar ibn al-Khattab, during the first few years of Islam around 610 CE. In order to accept Islam she must have been walking and talking, hence at least three years of age, which would make her at least fifteen in 622 CE.

    * Tabari reports that Abu Bakr wished to spare Aisha the discomforts of a journey to Ethiopia soon after 615 CE, and tried to bring forward her marriage to Mut`am's son. Mut`am refused because Abu Bakr had converted to Islam, but if Aisha was already of marriageable age in 615 CE, she must have been older than nine in 622 CE.

    * Tabari also reports that Abu Bakr's four children were all born during the Jahiliyyah, which is said to have ended in 610 CE, making Aisha at least twelve in 622 CE when Aisha started living with Muhammad.

    * Aisha is reported to have said that at the time Surah Al-Qamar, the 54th chapter of the Qur'an , was revealed, "I was a young girl". The Surah was revealed nine years before Hijrah. According to this tradition, Aisha had not only been born before the revelation of the referred Surah, but was actually a young girl, not even only an infant at that time. So if this age is assumed to be 7 to 14 years then her age at the time of marriage would be 16 to 23.

    * According to almost all the historians, Asma bint Abu Bakr, the elder sister of Aisha, was ten years older than Aisha. Asma is reported to die in the 73 AH, when she was 100 years old. Now, obviously if Asma was 100 years old in the 73 AH, she should have been 27 or 28 years old at the time of Migration to Medina (1 AH). If Asma was 27 or 28 years old at that time, Aisha should have been 17 or 18 years old at the same time. Thus, Aisha - if she got married in 1 AH or 2 AH - was between 18 to 20 years old at the time of her marriage.
    But then Shaykh Gibril Haddad refutes all those points on **************, unfortunetly, i cannot post a link.

    And there is more..


    No, its crystal clear A'isha RadiAllahu Anha was 9 when she married. Its those Muslim apologists who feel ashamed and try appease the non-muslims by saying she was otherwise. We, as Muslims, don't have a problem with her being 9 and if non-muslims have any objection, then thats their problem, not ours.
    Hey, I'm a non muslim and I don't have an issue with Aisha being 9 years old, you have to relate the event to the times and this was the norm in that era. Anyone who doesn't do that is ignorant.
    Spot on!
    Reminded me of shaykh Yusuf Alqaradwi- one of the most respected scholars in the muslim world- said once that in order to understand this issue, you cant take it as an isolated incident but rather we have to look at the whole picture and circumstances at that time. One of the things I remember he mentioned is that at that time they lived in the desert, and the climate and other factors at that time and place led to women being mature at a very early age.
    Salam wr wb

    Tabari has also reported that at the time Abu Bakr planned on migrating to
    Habshah (8 years before Hijrah), he went to Mut`am -- with whose son Ayesha
    (ra) was engaged -- and asked him to take Ayesha (ra) in his house as his
    son's wife. Mut`am refused, because Abu Bakr had embraced Islam, and
    subsequently his son divorced Ayesha (ra). Now, if Ayesha (ra) was only
    seven years old at the time of her marriage, she could not have been born at
    the time Abu Bakr decided on migrating to Habshah. On the basis of this
    report it seems only reasonable to assume that Ayesha (ra) had not only been
    born 8 years before hijrah, but was also a young lady, quite prepared for
    marriage.

    According to a number of narratives, Ayesha (ra) accompanied the Muslims in
    the battle of Badr and Uhud. Furthermore, it is also reported in books of
    hadith and history that no one under the age of 15 years was allowed to take
    part in the battle of Uhud. All the boys below 15 years of age were sent
    back. Ayesha's (ra) participation in the battle of Badr and Uhud clearly
    indicate that she was not nine or ten years old at that time. After all,
    women used to accompany men to the battle fields to help them, not to be a
    burden on them.


    Also the hadith in bukhari,is a khabur hadith,it was,nt said by the prophet,also imam malik who is the leader schalor of all ahul sunna rejected this,even my teacher,the great dr.ibrahim abu muhammad said the same thing.

    Anyway Allah knows best.
    Why do we even have to justify this today? That's the way it was then and not just in the Arab world but the world in general. It is not the way it is now. Period. Get over it.

    Peace
    Ghaith
    So.......... as you can see, this is an arguement that has been going on for a long time, and it will go on for a long time.

    Either you can engage yourself in this pointless arguement, and waste alot of your time, or you can simply say

    "Regardless of her age, It was no1 other than the Prophet (saw) that married Aisha (ra), so there was Hikma(Wisdom) in the decision. Leave it at that."

    Allah (swt) knows best.

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    Re: Aisha's age- the 17 years old argument



    A lengthy discussion can be found here:

    http://www.islamicboard.com/refutati...phet-pbuh.html



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