"To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what Allah hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee..."
If the Sriptures were considered to be Truth when Muhammad received this revelation; if the Scriptures were guarded by Allah in safety; if any behavior or approach to life that did not conform to the Sriptures was considered by Allah to be a divergence from the Truth...why do Muslims believe the Scriptures have been corrupted? It is clear that the Scriptures as they are written today, are in accord with the Scriptures written three years before the Qu'ran. If these Scriptures are today what they were when first written; if Allah is guarding them in safety; if Allah considers these scriptures to be the truth, how can these Scriptures have been corrupted?
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
As declared repeatedly in the Quran, Allah is oft-merciful to the believers when they sincerely repent after they have committed any acts of sins. But for those who refuse to believe and obey, Allah will punish them.
What is your definition of mercy?
Sincerely,
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
“According to your ideas, the Qur'an should not have asked anyone to follow it until it was completely revealed. Yet this is clearly not the case. The Qur'an contains hundreds of verses telling believers to obey its commandments.”
I understand all you are saying. I was trying to understand clearly what you were meaning when making reference to “the Qur’an” back in Muhammad’s day. Back in his day, “the Qur’an” as you have it today (which is actually not the Qur’an as it exists today—another thread), only came into existence when his final revelation was recorded. If my understanding is correct, yes the revelations were learned, memorized, and preached—but only the revelations that had come to Muhammad. Ones that were still to come were not preached or memorized.
“The first verses of Al-Alaq were the first verses revealed. How you can conclude from that that Al-Alaq is the entire Qur'an is beyond me.”
This was never my conclusion. I was trying to understand better what you were saying. You kept referring to what I considered to be revelations, as "the Quran." For eg,
“The Prophet Muhammad pbuh was pointing out that the Jews and Christians had deviated from their scriptures and that the only way for them to return to the original message of the scriptures, thus 'establishing' themselves upon it, would be to follow the Qur'an.”
What I assume you were meaning by this was that Muhammad was telling the Jews and Christians to follow the revelations he had received and preached—yes, nitpicky, but important I think.
“The Prophet Muhammad pbuh asked the People of the Book to tuqeemu (establish) the Injeel and Tawra and the only way for them to do that was to accept the Qur'an as a criterion as the Prophet Muhammad pbuh pointed out.”
Am I correct in saying that you are saying that the Injeel and the Tawra in their original form can be found as such within the Quran?
5.69 (Al-Maeda [The Table, The Table Spread])
“Those who believe (in the Qur'an), those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Sabians and the Christians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness,- on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.”
Is not Muhammad making a clear distinction here between the Qur’an and the Jewish Scriptures?
5.46
“And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him: We sent him the Gospel: therein was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Law that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear Allah.”
What is meant by “confirming the Law that had come before Him”?
5.47
“Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed therein. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) those who rebel.”
Why would Muhammad encourage the people of the Gospel to judge by what Allah had revealed "therein"? Why did he not encourage them to judge but what he was now revealing? For Muhammad to encourage people of the Gospel to judge by what was in the Gospel, was for Muhammad in his time to accept the Gospels for what they were and to accept their authority.
Sincerely and with thanks for your dialogue ,
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
The term 'Mercy' is generally used to signify compassionate treatment, especially of those under one's power. It is a disposition to be kind, forgiving and alleviating distress. Accordingly, I think, God's mercy denotes His kindness, forgiveness and compassionate treatment to His slaves, that is, to those humans who submit to His wills expressed through Divine Revealations and His Messangers starting from Adam to Mohammed(pbuh), the seal of the prophetic chain.
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
One who accepted "the divinely revealed code of faith and conduct" ordained for the mankind by God in form of revealations and guidance through His messangers, sent from time to time, was always a submitter, meaning , in Arabic, a Muslim. But all people never accepted the divine code of faith and conduct as Allah says about the disbelievers and misbelievers:
In the past, many Prophets have fought, in the Way of Allah, with a large number of godly people. They did not lose heart during the adversities that befell them in the path of Allah; they neither showed weakness nor submitted to falsehood. Allah loves the steadfast. Their only words were, “Our Rabb! Forgive our sins and our excesses; establish our feet firmly and give us victory over the unbelievers." Therefore, Allah gave them the reward in this world and also an excellent reward awaits them in the Hereafter. Allah loves the righteous who are good to others.[3:146-148]
The same recurred at the time of Mohammed(pbuh). As regards corruption in the faith and conduct among some of the people who already had Divine Books and prophetic guidance before Mohammed (pbuh), Allah says:
Are they looking for a religion other than the Deen (religion and Way of Life) of Allah knowing well that everything in the heavens and in the earth, willingly or unwillingly, has submitted to Him? And to Him they shall all return. O Prophet, say: “We believe in Allah and what is revealed to us and what was revealed to Ibrãhïm (Abraham), Isma`il (Ishmael), Ishãq (Isaac), Ya'qoob (Jacob) and their descendants; and in that which was given to Musa (Moses), Isa (Jesus) and other Prophets from their Rabb; we do not discriminate between any one of them, and to Allah do we submit in Islam." If anyone is looking for a religion other than Islam, then let it be known that it will not be accepted from him; and in the Hereafter he will be among the losers. [3:83-85]
Allah further says:
Anyone who obeys the Rasool, in fact, obeys Allah. As for those who pay no heed, they should know that We have not sent you as a taskmaster over them. They will say: “We are at your service!” Yet when they leave you, some of them meet together secretly at night to plot against what you have said. Allah notes down all their plots. Therefore, leave them alone and put your trust in Allah. Allah is your all sufficient trustee.[4:80-81]
O Muhammad, We have sent revelations to you just as We sent to Nüh (Noah) and the Prophets who came after him; We also sent revelations to Ibrãhïm (Abraham), Isma`il (Ishmael), Ishãq (Isaac), Ya'qoob (Jacob), his descendants, Isa (Jesus), Ayüb (Job), Yünus (Jonah), Haroon (Aaron) and Sulaimãn (Solomon), and to Dawõõd (David) We gave the Psalms.Revelations were also sent to those Rasools whom We have already mentioned to you and to those whose name We have not mentioned; to Musa Allah spoke directly. All these Rasools conveyed good news to mankind and admonished them so that, after conveying the message through the Rasools, people should have no excuse to plead against Allah. Allah is Mighty, Wise.People may or may not believe it, but Allah bears witness that what He has sent to you, O Muhammad, He has sent with His own Knowledge and so do the angels;though Allah’s testimony alone is sufficient.[4:163-166]
"To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what Allah hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee..."
If the Sriptures were considered to be Truth when Muhammad received this revelation; if the Scriptures were guarded by Allah in safety; if any behavior or approach to life that did not conform to the Sriptures was considered by Allah to be a divergence from the Truth...why do Muslims believe the Scriptures have been corrupted? It is clear that the Scriptures as they are written today, are in accord with the Scriptures written three years before the Qu'ran. If these Scriptures are today what they were when first written; if Allah is guarding them in safety; if Allah considers these scriptures to be the truth, how can these Scriptures have been corrupted?
If you look at the pronoun "it" in "To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety" you may find that "it" signifies the Quran by the expression ""To thee We sent the Scripture in truth".
Am I correct in saying that you are saying that the Injeel and the Tawra in their original form can be found as such within the Quran?
The message of the Tawra and the Injeel is found in the Qur'an. If someone reads something in the Bible and wishes to know if it was truly revealed from god they must check to see if it is consistent with the Qur'an.
5.69 (Al-Maeda [The Table, The Table Spread])
“Those who believe (in the Qur'an), those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Sabians and the Christians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness,- on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.”
What is meant by “confirming the Law that had come before Him”?
It means that the revelation given to Prophet Jesus pbuh confirmed the revelation given to Prophet Moses pbuh.
Why would Muhammad encourage the people of the Gospel to judge by what Allah had revealed "therein"?
This is like the other verse. What are they to judge? They are to judge the truth - one of the signs for the People of the Book concerning the veracity of the Qur'an was that its message was in accordance with that of their scriptures and their scriptures prophesized the coming of Prophet Muhammad pbuh. So the People of the Book had to judge whether Prophet Muhammad pbuh was a true messenger with a true message or not. They were to build their judgement upon what they knew was preached in the scriptures by earlier Prophets. This is why most of them accepted Islam (see Qur'an 28:51-55).
Regards
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
"To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what Allah hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee..."
If the Sriptures were considered to be Truth when Muhammad received this revelation; if the Scriptures were guarded by Allah in safety; if any behavior or approach to life that did not conform to the Sriptures was considered by Allah to be a divergence from the Truth...why do Muslims believe the Scriptures have been corrupted? It is clear that the Scriptures as they are written today, are in accord with the Scriptures written three years before the Qu'ran. If these Scriptures are today what they were when first written; if Allah is guarding them in safety; if Allah considers these scriptures to be the truth, how can these Scriptures have been corrupted?
Hi POBook !
If you look at the pronoun "it" in "To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety" you may find that "it" used twice in the sentence signifies the Quran by the expression ""To thee We sent the Scripture in truth".
I think the debate will never end whether you should accept "the code of faith and conduct" as recorded in the now available Bible or "the code of faith and conduct" as recorded in the Quran (the direct speeches of God) and Al-Hadith (speeches of Mohammed). You must apply your reasoning power to perceive that there is one God, the only Creator of everything in the earth and in heavens including the humans who will be punished or rewarded in the hereafter on the basis of their code of faith and conduct in this life. The "code of faith and conduct" for the entire mankind of a time must be one. The "code of faith" must have been the same from the time of Adam until now and it must be so for ever, even in the hereafter. You must be convinced that all the prophets were sent with the same "code of faith". God is one, the first and the last. He is not dependent on any of His creations; on the contrary, the entire creation is dependent on Him. Best stated by Allah Himself in chapter 112 of the Quran: "Say: He is Allah the One and Only; Allah is the Self-Sufficient (independent of all, while all are dependent on Him); He begets not, nor is He begotten; And there is none comparable to Him."
To enumerate:-
* Allah the One and Only.
* He is Self-Sufficient [independent of all, while all are dependent on Him].
* He is not a father to any.
* He has no parent as well.
* There is none comparable or equal to Him
* "And the places of worship are for God: So invoke not any one along with God." [72:18]
The prophets were from among humans and they were of no exception from complying with "the code of faith and conduct" they were ordered to teach the people. While the "code of faith" is a constant, "the code of conduct" has varied from time to time with the advent of new prophets.
You may ponder over Allah's sayings:
Have you not considered the case of those to whom a portion of the Book was given? They purchased error for themselves and wish to see you lose the Right Way. Allah knows your enemies very well. Sufficient is Allah to protect you, and Sufficient is Allah to help you. Among the Jews there are some who take the words out of their context and utter them with a twist of their tongues to slander the true Deen (faith) and say: “We hear and we disobey;” and “Hear, may you (O Muhammad) hear nothing!” And “Rã'ina” (an ambiguous word meaning: "listen, may you become deaf," or "our shepherd," or "in judeo-Arabic language conveying the sense of "our evil one"). If only they had said: “We hear and we obey;” and “Hear us;” and “Unzurna ("look upon us," or " pay attention to us"): it would have been better for them and more proper. Due to all this Allah has cursed them for their unbelief. In fact with the exception of a few, they have no faith. O people of the Book (Jews and Christians)! Believe in what We have now revealed (The Qur'an), confirming your own scriptures, before We obliterate your faces and turn them backward, or lay Our curse on you as We laid Our curse on the Sabbath-breakers: and remember that Allah’s command is always executed. Surely Allah does not forgive shirk (associating any partner with Him); and may forgive sins other than that if He so pleases. This is because one who commits shirk with Allah, does indeed invent a great sinful lie. Have you not seen those who speak very highly of their own purity even though they are committing shirk. In fact, Allah purifies whom He wishes. If the mushrikïn are not purified, no injustice - even equal to the thread of a date-stone - is being done to them. See how they invent a lie against Allah, and this in itself is enough to show their manifest sin. Have you not seen those who were given a portion of the Book? They believe in superstition and Tãghüt (forces of Shaitãn) and say about the unbelievers that they are better guided to the Right Way than the believers! Those are the ones whom Allah has cursed, and the one who is cursed by Allah can find no helper. Do they have a share in the kingdom? If they had any share they would have not given other people equal to a speck on a date-stone.Or do they envy other people because Allah has given them from His grace? If so, let them know that We did give the Book and Wisdom to the descendants of Ibrãhïm (Abraham), and blessed them with a great kingdom. But some of them believed in it and some turned away. Sufficient is hell to burn those who turned away.[4:44-55]
Ponder Again:
They do blaspheme who say: "God is Christ the son of Mary." But said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship God, my Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with God,- God will forbid him the garden, and the Fire will be his abode. There will for the wrong-doers be no one to help. They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them. Why turn they not to God, and seek His forgiveness? For God is Oft- forgiving, Most Merciful.Christ the son of Mary was no more than an apostle; many were the apostles that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food. See how God doth make His signs clear to them; yet see in what ways they are deluded away from the truth!
[5:72-75]
As some Christians misbelieve that only God exists in trinity[ God Himself, Mary and Jesus], a similar misbelief has cropped up among a group of Mohammedans, contrary to what declared in the holy Quran, that the only God exists in duality[ God Himself and Mohammed]. The proponents of the duality theory are not yet a distinct class. They have invented fake saying of Mohammed by attributing obviously lies that he (Mohammed) was created out of the light of God and was sent in human shape, while the Quran declares that Adam was the first human and all the prophets were from among the humans.
Now think! When many coruptions with resultant groups and sub-groups have already taken place among the followers of Mohammed (pbuh), how could you assert that the earlier Scripture Books contain God's revealations in toto. If so, why are there so many groups? Why so many groups even among those who claim to have accepted the Quran and guidance of Mohammed (pbuh) as their code of life? If the term 'Islam'' means complete 'Submission to God', then, I think, not the Jews, nor the Christians, nor all the Muslims are in Islam or 'Submission to God' today; because Jews and Christians do not accept Mohammed (pbuh) as a prohet and some groups among the Mohamedans themselves have attributed lies upon him even in glare violation of the Quranic truth.
I pray that you find the real truth about Submission to God, Who may help you find the true divinely ordained code of belief and conduct which is meant for the present day mankind on earth !!! To conclude, to quote from the Quran,"Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in God hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And God heareth and knoweth all things. Qur'an 2:256
**
According to the Bible, it is customary to call any prophet of God, or righteous man, a son of God. Jesus (pbuh) called himself the son of man, not God or God's literal son.
[Matt. 13:37; Luke 12:10; 1 Tim. 2:5.]
**
Evidently, Paul was most responsible for elevating the status of Jesus (pbuh) to the son of God, distorting the teachings of Jesus (pbuh).
[Acts 9:20]
**
Jesus (pbuh) is not considered now by many Christians to be the 'begotten' son of God (as it used to be in John 3:16) since this story has been removed from the Revised Standard Version (RSV), as well as many other new versions of the Bible. Furthermore, God emphatically says in the Qur'an that He does not have a son.[19:88-92.] However, God also declared that He created Adam (pbuh) and Jesus (pbuh): "Indeed, the example of Jesus to God is like that of Adam. He created him from dust; then He said to him "Be", and he was." (3:59)
**
Subsequently, emperors and clergy made further fabrications, contrary to what Jesus (pbuh) had said or done. One such fabrication is the concept of Trinity in which Jesus (pbuh) is one of the three manifestations of the Trinitarian God [the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost].[1 John 5:7.] In the Bible, this verse is used as the best proof for the Doctrine Trinity, even though this doctrine was never brought forth by Jesus (pbuh), his disciples, or any Christian scholars. In fact, it was enacted after much disagreement and conflict among Christians in the year 325 AD at the Council Nicea. Interestingly, this verse has been expunged from the Bibles of the modern age. In addition, the Qur'an warns the Jews Christians to refrain from disbelieving in revelation of God and against believing in Trinity.[ 3:19; 4:171; 5:73.]
The message of the Tawra and the Injeel is found in the Qur'an. If someone reads something in the Bible and wishes to know if it was truly revealed from god they must check to see if it is consistent with the Qur'an.
When exactly was the message of the Tawra and the Injeel corrupted from their original form?
Al-Qur'an, 005.047 (Al-Maeda [The Table, The Table Spread])
Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed therein. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) those who rebel.
Was the Gospel the Qur’an or was the Gospel some other piece of writing to which Muhammad was referring? Of what was this Gospel comprised—a few words a few chapters—what? Were the “people of the Gospel” Muslims or were the people of the Gospel Jews and Christians? Are the people of the Gospel told to judge by what Allah has revealed in the Gospel or are they told to judge by what Allah has revealed in the Qur’an?
one of the signs for the People of the Book concerning the veracity of the Qur'an was that its message was in accordance with that of their scriptures and their scriptures prophesized the coming of Prophet Muhammad pbuh
1.Please quote the Scripture in the Gospel that specifically prophesied the coming of Muhammad.
2.Where is this exact same verse found in the Qur’an to prove its authenticity?
Sincerely,
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
According to the Bible, it is customary to call any prophet of God, or righteous man, a son of God. Jesus (pbuh) called himself the son of man, not God or God's literal son.
[Matt. 13:37; Luke 12:10; 1 Tim. 2:5.]
The first question I want to ask you, is this: are the above scriptures from the Gospel corrupt or not? I assume if you think the above verses are not corrupt, you will not consider the below verses corrupt. Is the Apostle Paul who wrote 1 Timothy, telling the truth here or is he lying?
Consider the following words by Jesus,
“Joh 3:16 "For God loved the world in this way: He gave His One and Only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17 For God did not send His Son into the world that He might judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.
Joh 3:18 Anyone who believes in Him is not judged, but anyone who does not believe is already judged, because he has not believed in the name of the One and Only Son of God.”
Consider the following words by the Apostle Paul,
Gal 2:20 “I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the flesh, I live by faith in the Son of God who loved me and gave Himself for me.”
Rom 1:4 “And was established as the powerful Son of God by the resurrection from the dead according to the Spirit of holiness.”
If you would like some explanation concerning Jesus as the Son of Man, the Son of God, and the Son of David, (all three references used of His idenity) please let me know.
Evidently, Paul was most responsible for elevating the status of Jesus (pbuh) to the son of God, distorting the teachings of Jesus (pbuh).
[Acts 9:20]
Are you aware that Paul wrote 1 Timothy—the book you are quoting above that contains reference to Jesus as a man—“For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, a man, Christ Jesus” (1 Tim 2:5)? So why do you have a problem with Paul? If Jesus claimed Himself as the Son of God, why do you have a problem with Paul claiming Jesus as the Son of God? Either they are both evil liars or they are both telling the truth.
Jesus (pbuh) is not considered now by many Christians to be the 'begotten' son of God (as it used to be in John 3:16)
I can only say that people who do not consider Jesus to be the Son of God are not Christians. They are members of a sect that call themselves Christians—but they are not true Christians.
since this story has been removed from the Revised Standard Version (RSV), as well as many other new versions of the Bible.
Various versions of the Bible today are based upon the oldest Greek manuscripts of scripture that we have. Some of these manuscripts have scriptures that are not found in other manuscripts. This does not mean that content was not written. Some manuscripts have lost content while others have maintained content.
Concerning the term “Son of God”: Jesus was not born into this world as a result of God having sex with Mary. Jesus birth was a miraculous birth implemented by the Father through the Holy Spirit. All three—Jesus, The Father, the Holy Spirit are not three gods, but one. If you are interested in reading more about the Trinity, check out Atonement under comparative religions.
Sincerely and I look forward to your reply .
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
Salams
The Tawrat and the Injeel were true messages sent by God to the people they were meant for. They contained the words of wisdom and guidance. However, the people either turned agains their prophet or took him to such a high level that they placed him as a lord or son of the lord (a'udhubillah).
Once the revelation of the Qur'an was made, it immediately cancelled out the other scriptures (the Tawrah & Injeel). The Qur'an is the last word of Allah to mankind and it has been preserved. As Allah says
"It is we who have revealed this rememberance (the Qur'an) and it is we who will protect it"
We are given to understand that all the divine revelations made to Messangers of God contained the words of wisdom and guidance for the mankind.The tasks of the Messangers were to guide the people according to the revelations. But never all people accepted the guidance;some readily accepted and some rejected. This is not all; many prophets were even killed by the rebellious. With passage of time, when most people relapsed into disbelief and misbelief and misguidance, God sent new Messangers sometimes with new books and sometimes without books. Mohammed (pbuh) is the last of Messangers and the Quran, which has remained untainted from corruption, is the last of the divine books.
The Quran was learnt by heart, written down and disseminated as soon as the revelations were received by Mohammed(pbuh). But Al-Hadith, which consisted of religious sayings in the own words of Mohammed(pbuh), were written much later, nearly 200 years after his death, by various scholars from hearsays. As a result, despite taking extraordinary precaution, corruption took place in Al-Hadith to some degree for limitations of human memory. I think, also read in various writings, that the Testaments, which are now available in various editions with varying contents, were compiled in the same manner. If so, the result was the corruption in writing or re-writing the revelations and consequently in the guidance in the way God. I think such form of corruption necessitated sending Messangers from time to time to guide the people in the divinely ordained way.
Remeber ! The only One God has ordained only One Code of Faith and Conduct for the only One Mankind. So we must find that only code of faith and conduct if we want to save ourselves from hellfire. Allah says:
And remember when Isa (Jesus) the son of Maryam said: “O children of Israel! I am the Rasool of Allah towards you, confirming the Torah which came before me, and to give you good news of a Rasool that will come after me whose name shall be Ahmed (another name of Muhammad, meaning ‘The praised one’)." But when he (Muhammad) came to them with clear signs, they said “This is plain magic."[61:6]
Was the Gospel the Qur’an or was the Gospel some other piece of writing to which Muhammad was referring? Of what was this Gospel comprised—a few words a few chapters—what? Were the “people of the Gospel” Muslims or were the people of the Gospel Jews and Christians? Are the people of the Gospel told to judge by what Allah has revealed in the Gospel or are they told to judge by what Allah has revealed in the Qur’an?
The important question here, as I already pointed out to you, is what they were being asked to judge. What was being debated? It was the Prophet Muhammad's prophethood, and they were informed that if they followed their own scriptures they would find that the essence of the message was the same, and that Muhammad pbuh was prophesized in their scriptures.
The gospel (ar. Injeel) was the message preached by Jesus pbuh. God knows exactly how long it was in length.
And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom...” (Matthew 9:35)
The people being discussed were Christians. If they judged by the essential message of the revelations sent to them, they would realize that the Qur'an is the word of God, and His final criterion.
Please quote the Scripture in the Gospel that specifically prophesied the coming of Muhammad.
Please refer to pages 153-227 of In Defense of Islam for an in-depth discussion of Prophet Muhammad pbuh in the Old and New Testament. We have so many threads discussing this on the forum already.
Where is this exact same verse found in the Qur’an to prove its authenticity?
The proof of its authenticity is found in many Qur'anic verses, eg. Surah 61:6 which explicitly mentions that Prophet Jesus prohesized the coming of Prophet Muhammad pbuh.
Regards
The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik]
The Tawrat and the Injeel were true messages sent by God to the people they were meant for. They contained the words of wisdom and guidance. However, the people either turned agains their prophet or took him to such a high level that they placed him as a lord or son of the lord (a'udhubillah).
Once the revelation of the Qur'an was made, it immediately cancelled out the other scriptures (the Tawrah & Injeel). The Qur'an is the last word of Allah to mankind and it has been preserved. As Allah says
"It is we who have revealed this rememberance (the Qur'an) and it is we who will protect it"
If both the Tawrat and Injeel as well as the Qur'an were true messages sent by God, why would God choose to protect the Qur'an and not the Tawrat and the Injeel?
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
I really want to gain a clear understanding of this passage. I ask that you please answer my questions clearly and simply. I know that I may be repetative and somewhat "dumb", but I want to make sure I understand this correctly.
Al-Qur'an, 005.043 (Al-Maeda [The Table, The Table Spread])
But why do they come to thee for decision, when they have (their own) law before them?- therein is the (plain) command of Allah; yet even after that, they would turn away. For they are not (really) People of Faith.
"But why do they come to thee for decision..."
Who is "they"?
Who is "thee"?
"When they have their own law before them?"
Who is "they"?
What is "their own law"?
What does it mean to have this law "before them"?
What was the purpose of this question, "But why do they come to thee for decision when they have (their own) law before them?
"Therein is the (plain) command of Allah;"
In where was this plain command of Allah?
What was this "plain command" of Allah?
"Yet even after that, they would turn away."
Even after what?
Who would turn away?
From what would they turn away?
"For they are not really People of Faith."
Who were the People of Faith?
What was used to define People of Faith so that one could tell the difference between those who were People of Faith and those who wee not People of Faith?
Thanks for your willingness to help me better understand these verses !
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
Please help me to understand this. Muslims believe the Gospels have been corrupted. Yet, over and over again, including the book you referenced me to see on the internet, Muslims use verses of Scripture to support their thinking and their perspective. I cannot understand that Please correct me if I am wrong. If someone takes a verse from a source they say is corrupt in order to support their perspective, who is to say that the verse they are using is not corrupt? Please help me to understand this. You have quoted a verse to illustrate your point but I'm sure you will be one of the first people to say the Injeel is corrupt. How do you know that the verse you used to make your point is not a verse that is corrupt and therefore does not mean what it actually says?
Sincerely,
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
If both the Tawrat and Injeel as well as the Qur'an were true messages sent by God, why would God choose to protect the Qur'an and not the Tawrat and the Injeel?
Hi PO Book !
The following verses may be of helpto you:
057.025
We sent aforetime our messengers with Clear Signs and sent down with them the Book and the Balance (of Right and Wrong), that men may stand forth in justice; and We sent down Iron, in which is (material for) mighty war, as well as many benefits for mankind, that Allah may test who it is that will help, Unseen, Him and His messengers: For Allah is Full of Strength, Exalted in Might (and able to enforce His Will).
057.026
And We sent Noah and Abraham, and established in their line Prophethood and Revelation: and some of them were on right guidance. But many of them became rebellious transgressors.
005.044
It was We who revealed the law (to Moses): therein was guidance and light. By its standard have been judged the Jews, by the prophets who bowed (as in Islam) to Allah's will, by the rabbis and the doctors of law: for to them was entrusted the protection of Allah's book, and they were witnesses thereto: therefore fear not men, but fear me, and sell not my signs for a miserable price. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) Unbelievers.
005.046
And in their footsteps We sent Jesus the son of Mary, confirming the Law that had come before him: We sent him the Gospel: therein was guidance and light, and confirmation of the Law that had come before him: a guidance and an admonition to those who fear Allah.
57.027
Then, in their wake, We followed them up with (others of) Our messengers: We sent after them Jesus the son of Mary, and bestowed on him the Gospel; and We ordained in the hearts of those who followed him Compassion and Mercy. But the Monasticism which they invented for themselves, We did not prescribe for them: (We commanded) only the seeking for the Good Pleasure of Allah; but that they did not foster as they should have done. Yet We bestowed, on those among them who believed, their (due) reward, but many of them are rebellious transgressors.
[048.029
Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, and those with him are firm of heart against the unbelievers, compassionate among themselves; you will see them bowing down, prostrating themselves, seeking grace from Allah and pleasure; their marks are in their faces because of the effect of prostration; that is their description in the Taurat and their description in the Injeel; like as seed-produce that puts forth its sprout, then strengthens it, so it becomes stout and stands firmly on its stem, delighting the sowers that He may enrage the unbelievers on account of them; Allah has promised those among them who believe and do good, forgiveness and a great reward.
003.003
It is He Who sent down to thee (step by step), in truth, the Book, confirming what went before it; and He sent down the Law (of Moses) and the Gospel (of Jesus) before this, as a guide to mankind, and He sent down the criterion (of judgment between right and wrong).
005.048
To thee We sent the Scripture in truth, confirming the scripture that came before it, and guarding it in safety: so judge between them by what Allah hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, diverging from the Truth that hath come to thee. To each among you have we prescribed a law and an open way. If Allah had so willed, He would have made you a single people, but (His plan is) to test you in what He hath given you: so strive as in a race in all virtues. The goal of you all is to Allah; it is He that will show you the truth of the matters in which ye dispute;
05.077
Say: "O people of the Book! exceed not in your religion the bounds (of what is proper), trespassing beyond the truth, nor follow the vain desires of people who went wrong in times gone by,- who misled many, and strayed (themselves) from the even way
005.078
Curses were pronounced on those among the Children of Israel who rejected Faith, by the tongue of David and of Jesus the son of Mary: because they disobeyed and persisted in excesses.
007.157
"Those who follow the messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find mentioned in their own (scriptures),- in the law and the Gospel;- for he commands them what is just and forbids them what is evil; he allows them as lawful what is good (and pure) and prohibits them from what is bad (and impure); He releases them from their heavy burdens and from the yokes that are upon them. So it is those who believe in him, honour him, help him, and follow the light which is sent down with him,- it is they who will prosper."
05.049
And this (He commands): Judge thou between them by what Allah hath revealed, and follow not their vain desires, but beware of them lest they beguile thee from any of that (teaching) which Allah hath sent down to thee. And if they turn away, be assured that for some of their crime it is Allah's purpose to punish them. And truly most men are rebellious.
005.051
O ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust.
005.047
Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed therein. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) those who rebel.
Recording of Gopsels:
The humans have been given very limited knowledge. If you believe in God
to be all-powerful over all things in the earth and in the heavens, you cannot
question the rationale of God's work. The Quran was learnt by heart, written down and disseminated as soon as the revelations were received by Mohammed (pbuh). But Al-Hadith, which consisted of religious sayings in the own words of Mohammed (pbuh), were written much later, nearly 200 years after his death, by various scholars from reliable hearsays. As a result, despite taking extraordinary precaution, corruption took place in Al-Hadith to some degree for limitations of human memory. I think, also read in various writings, that the Testaments, which are now available in various editions with varying contents, were compiled in the same manner by different individuals much later after the death of Jesus (pbuh). If so, the result was the corruption in writing or re-writing the revelations and consequently in the guidance in the way of God. I think such form of corruption necessitated sending Messangers from time to time to guide the people in the divinely ordained way.
I appreciate your response but I feel you did not answer the question. Why would God not protect the Gospel and the Tawrah but protect the Qur'an?
Sincerely,
“The force of reason is capable of compelling the
other party to accept one's argument.” Shaykh Salman al-Oadah
------------
"But set apart the Messiah as Lord in your hearts, and always be ready to
give a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you."
1 Peter 3:15
I appreciate your response but I feel you did not answer the question. Why would God not protect the Gospel and the Tawrah but protect the Qur'an?
Sincerely,
The answer is beyond human reasoning. You cannot know the rationale of God's work unless God Himself has made it known to you. Inventing stories to justify the rationale of God's action in human reasoning will be transgressing the limits set by God, Who has said regarding the limitation of human knowledge:"They cannot gain access to any thing out of His knowledge except what He pleases." 2:55
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Please correct me if I am wrong. If someone takes a verse from a source they say is corrupt in order to support their perspective, who is to say that the verse they are using is not corrupt? Please help me to understand this. You have quoted a verse to illustrate your point but I'm sure you will be one of the first people to say the Injeel is corrupt. How do you know that the verse you used to make your point is not a verse that is corrupt and therefore does not mean what it actually says?
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