Is Islam based on faith?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Hugo
  • Start date Start date
  • Replies Replies 51
  • Views Views 8K
H

Hugo

Account Disabled
Messages
1,528
Reaction score
72
T.I.A said:
Your religion is based on faith. In this way, you will be wanting evidence of Heaven and Hell, which you can never get - that is all based on faith. If you are wanting evidence, then you will start looking for evidence of Allah as well (naudhubillah-may Allah protect us from this), and then your mind will become that of an atheists, who says that "nothing is there until proven" and they can never believe that Allah can be proved. Comprehende?
Click to expand...

I do not quite understand you point here. Is Islam not based on faith? Do you have have incontrovertible and irrefutable proof that God exists? If so please let us see it.

Mine is a religion of faith just like that of Abraham who left his own country at the call of God and that action was testimony to his faith. He had no Bible, no Qu'ran, just the call of God. Is your faith different to that of Abraham?
 
Re: Authenticity of the Qur'an

Do you have have incontrovertible and irrefutable proof that God exists? If so please let us see it.
Click to expand...

This is what I mean. It is from here that people go into the 'Athiest' state of mind.

For me, and for most people that are Muslims, they have been bought up in such a way that the concept of Allah is involved in everything they do, all the actions they carry out, the littlest to the biggest things they do.

Evidence? What evidence will satisfy you people?! Especially regarding the Qur'aan!

- The Scientific Miracles of the Holy Qur'aan
- The Authenticity and Preservation of the Holy Qur'aan
- Jewels from the Qur'aan

and

- The Existence of God

What more will satisfy you?

Nothing.

It is only Allaah who Guides.

And regarding Abraham, the Qur'aan says;

"Ibrahim (Abraham) was not a Jew nor a Christian but he was (an) upright (man), a Muslim, and he was not one of the polytheists."
[Qur'aan, Chapter 3, Verse 67]
 
Re: Authenticity of the Qur'an

Briefly, Islam is indeed a religion of faith, but this faith is backed up by proof. This proof can be found in both the miraculous nature of the Qur'an as well as in the sincerity of Muhammad (pbuh).
 
Last edited:
Re: Authenticity of the Qur'an

T.I.A said:

This is what I mean. It is from here that people go into the 'Athiest' state of mind. For me, and for most people that are Muslims, they have been bought up in such a way that the concept of Allah is involved in everything they do, all the actions they carry out, the littlest to the biggest things they do.

Evidence? What evidence will satisfy you people?! Especially regarding the Qur'aan!

- The Existence of God

What more will satisfy you? Nothing. It is only Allaah who Guides.

And regarding Abraham, the Qur'aan says; "Ibrahim (Abraham) was not a Jew nor a Christian but he was (an) upright (man), a Muslim, and he was not one of the polytheists."
[Qur'aan, Chapter 3, Verse 67]
Click to expand...


It will take me a while to look at you references but in the meanwhile I will lave you some questions

1. Are you suggesting we should not even question whether God exists because it might lead us to unbelief - that is not a very challenging position is it?

2. When you speak of proofs (and I will look at you refs) are they like gravity or ohms law that sort of things that is testable by anyone or is it just opinions or views?

3. If it is proof like that of gravity, can you explain why billions do not accept it? That is I cannot avoid gravity but I can avoid God if I wish and therefore it cannot be a proof in any scientific sense.

4. You say God is involved in everything we do and I agree but I do also have difficulties when I consider earthquakes where thousands are killed or flu which strikes indiscriminately, cancer and suffering in general - why does GOD allow it?

5. I cannot quite see how Abraham was a Muslim, he was once described as a Hebrew but that is all and Islam was not mentioned for at least 2,500 years after Abraham died so this claim it fatuous.

6. Finally, you did not answer my question - is Islam a matter of faith or not?
 
Re: Authenticity of the Qur'an

1. Are you suggesting we should not even question whether God exists because it might lead us to unbelief - that is not a very challenging position is it?
Click to expand...

When you have been brought up with the belief of God (Allah). what is their left to challenge? You parents aren't going to tell you something completely ridiculous, are they?

2. When you speak of proofs (and I will look at you refs) are they like gravity or ohms law that sort of things that is testable by anyone or is it just opinions or views?
Click to expand...

Scientific proofs in the Qur'aan, proofs all around you and inside you!

3. If it is proof like that of gravity, can you explain why billions do not accept it? That is I cannot avoid gravity but I can avoid God if I wish and therefore it cannot be a proof in any scientific sense.
Click to expand...

Which billions do not accept God?

4. You say God is involved in everything we do and I agree but I do also have difficulties when I consider earthquakes where thousands are killed or flu which strikes indiscriminately, cancer and suffering in general - why does GOD allow it?
Click to expand...

This has been answered many, many times before; God tests people in many ways, and as much as people stay patient, He will reward them according to their patience in this world, and according to how conent they can stay with His Decree, as His Decree is always for the best of His people/

5. I cannot quite see how Abraham was a Muslim, he was once described as a Hebrew but that is all and Islam was not mentioned for at least 2,500 years after Abraham died so this claim it fatuous.
Click to expand...

The Qur'aan mentions miracles in it - when at least 80% of the Qur'an has been proved (scientifically, I heard this in a Dr. Zakir Naik's lecture), then why have any doubt in the remaining 20%?

6. Finally, you did not answer my question - is Islam a matter of faith or not?
Click to expand...

Faith and millions of proofs around it - why else do people convert to Islaam?

Peace
 
Hugo said:
I do not quite understand you point here. Is Islam not based on faith? Do you have have incontrovertible and irrefutable proof that God exists? If so please let us see it.

Mine is a religion of faith just like that of Abraham who left his own country at the call of God and that action was testimony to his faith. He had no Bible, no Qu'ran, just the call of God. Is your faith different to that of Abraham?
Click to expand...

Every belief/stance is to an extent based on faith. But what you need to distributions between blind faith and knowledgeable faith.

Keep in mind also, that Christianity relies on the former more so. A quick contrast.

1. You need to have faith that what that your Bible is accurate even though scholars admit it has errors and you have no original copy.
2. The doctrine of the Trinity is a "mystery" that "noone understands" yet everyone seems to think they can defend.

1. The Quran has been perfectly preserved and we know what we're reading is from the Prophet pbuh whom we follow.
2. The Quranic doctrine is simple and makes perfect sense so that you actually know what you're worshipping.

I'll could think of more but I think you get my gist.

BTW "Muslim" has different meanings. When calling Abraham a "muslim", you are saying that he "submitted to God's will." Which he did by being pious and righteous and obeying Allah's commands.
 
Last edited:
Re: Authenticity of the Qur'an

Hugo said:

5. I cannot quite see how Abraham was a Muslim, he was once described as a Hebrew but that is all and Islam was not mentioned for at least 2,500 years after Abraham died so this claim it fatuous.
Click to expand...

Abraham (peace and blessings be upon him) was a Muslim in the sense that he brought, taught, propagated and believed the same message that all the prophets of Islam brought which is Tawhid and to submit to the will of God.

Etymology of 'Muslim'

1615 (n.), 1777 (adj.), from Arabic muslim "one who submits" (to the faith), from root of alsama "he resigned." Related to Islam (q.v.).
Click to expand...

So, yes, Abraham (Ibraheem) alayhis salaam was a Muslim, in the root sense.
 
Last edited:
Re: Authenticity of the Qur'an

T.I.A said:
It is only Allaah who Guides.
Click to expand...

Exactly. If the ignorant are blind to the truth that's right in front of them, then that is their problem. It isn't our responsibility to convert, only to spread the message.
 
AntiKarateKid said:
Every belief/stance is to an extent based on faith. But what you need to distributions between blind faith and knowledgeable faith. Keep in mind also, that Christianity relies on the former more so. A quick contrast.

1. You need to have faith that what that your Bible is accurate even though scholars admit it has errors and you have no original copy.
2. The doctrine of the Trinity is a "mystery" that "noone understands" yet everyone seems to think they can defend.

1. The Quran has been perfectly preserved and we know what we're reading is from the Prophet pbuh whom we follow.
2. The Quranic doctrine is simple and makes perfect sense so that you actually know what you're worshipping.

BTW "Muslim" has different meanings. When calling Abraham a "muslim", you are saying that he "submitted to God's will." Which he did by being pious and righteous and obeying Allah's commands.
Click to expand...

Some points.

1. Abraham must have had blind faith then since he had nothing but God's call to respond to yet he left what looks like a brilliant civilization.

2. The Bible has a message and it is that that I respond to, it is not blind as I am well aware that it was constructed over a very long period and has suffered various corruptions but to my mind the originals have been reconstructed because of painstainking work over many thousands of ancient manuscripts.

3. Because something is a mystery does not mean it is not true and of course we defend its as a belief. If I argue as you do then consider, we read the Prophet Mohammed had his heart removed and washed with snow - not really a credible story is it yet you blindly accept it without a second thought do you not?

4. I am not sure you really know what you are saying but Muslim doctrine says the Qu'ran is from God not Mohammed, he was just the messenger. Whether it is perfectly preserved is what this thread is about and we shall see how that goes. But as I have said many times, it is what is says that matters.

5. The Christian doctrine make perfect sense to me and billions of others so your argument is of little value. As no doubt communists, Mormons and who knows what can say and will say the same.
 
Re: Authenticity of the Qur'an

Banu_Hashim said:
Exactly. If the ignorant are blind to the truth that's right in front of them, then that is their problem. It isn't our responsibility to convert, only to spread the message.
Click to expand...

No you are right, its God's place to convince and convert. But to say anyone who does not accept the truth as you see it is ignorant and blind is as blind as any faith I have seen if not paranoid.
 
1. Abraham must have had blind faith then since he had nothing but God's call to respond to yet he left what looks like a brilliant civilization
Click to expand...
.

Allah sent him angels to speak to him and granted him miracles.

2. The Bible has a message and it is that that I respond to, it is not blind as I am well aware that it was constructed over a very long period and has suffered various corruptions but to my mind the originals have been reconstructed because of painstainking work over many thousands of ancient manuscripts.
Click to expand...

The originals have been reconstructed?! Only your wishful thinking says so. Your own scholars admit to there being alterations and deletions. Each christian sect accuses the other of adding or taking away verses and you are constantly involved in searching for older and older copies but cant even find one earlier than 400 AD! :enough!:

That's not the attitude of a people with a reconstructed book. (why did it even need reconstructing either?)

3. Because something is a mystery does not mean it is not true and of course we defend its as a belief. If I argue as you do then consider, we read the Prophet Mohammed had his heart removed and washed with snow - not really a credible story is it yet you blindly accept it without a second thought do you not?
Click to expand...

It is not a mystery. Allah certainly capable of creating events which serve as powerful metaphors. Moreover my belief doesn't hinge on the event of cleasing the snow any more than it does of how Moses split the seas or turned his staff into a snake. The point is that you are banned from understanding a basic tenet of God. We say he is one. You say he is one in a trinity but you can't understand the trinity so just accept that the trinity is monotheistic!

4. I am not sure you really know what you are saying but Muslim doctrine says the Qu'ran is from God not Mohammed, he was just the messenger. Whether it is perfectly preserved is what this thread is about and we shall see how that goes. But as I have said many times, it is what is says that matters.
Click to expand...

There is plenty of evidence from legions of sources both Muslim and non-Muslim that attest to the preservation. Not to mention the oral preservation by thousands upon thousands of the first Muslims that memorized the same words that you seem to conveniently forget.

[
B]5.[/B] The Christian doctrine make perfect sense to me and billions of others so your argument is of little value. As no doubt communists, Mormons and who knows what can say and will say the same.
[/COLOR]
Click to expand...

Good for you. The Hindus say that their books make sense but both of us believe God disagrees. Faith cannot be as blind as theirs.
 
Last edited:
Re: Authenticity of the Qur'an

Hugo said:
No you are right, its God's place to convince and convert. But to say anyone who does not accept the truth as you see it is ignorant and blind is as blind as any faith I have seen if not paranoid.
Click to expand...

This is a joke right?

"That they all might be ****ed WHO BELIEVED NOT THE TRUTH, but had pleasure in unrighteousness." - Bible

Of course there are more verses where God condemns, ****s, and chastises those who reject the truth. So... in your words God is paranoid?
 
It is a religion of faith, fear, your upbringings, legitimate spiritual experiences, state mandated participation, the watchmaker argument, whatever...


Briefly, Islam is indeed a religion of faith, but this faith is backed up by proof. This proof can be found in both the miraculous nature of the Qur'an as well as in the sincerity of Muhammad (pbuh).
Click to expand...

Briefly, Christianity is indeed a religion of faith, but this faith is backed up by proof. This proof can be found in both the miraculous nature of the New Testament as well as in the universal forgiveness of the Messiah (UYDH).
 
Last edited:
Gubbleknucker said:
It is a religion of faith, fear, your upbringings, legitimate spiritual experiences, state mandated participation, the watchmaker argument, whatever...




Briefly, Christianity is indeed a religion of faith, but this faith is backed up by proof. This proof can be found in both the miraculous nature of the New Testament as well as in the universal forgiveness of the Messiah (UYDH).
Click to expand...


As Muslims we believe some parts of the New Testament which fall in line with the Quran are indeed divine. The rest is a bunch of scribal errors, forged manuscripts, and false prophecies written by those who presume themselves to be guided by the Holy Spirit and which the various churches through the centuries couldn't even agree upon.

The last sentence about "proof can be found.... in the universal forgiveness of the Messiah". Is utter nonsense (not to mention unsupported by the Bible because last I checked there was a hell so how is the forgiveness universal?)

Atheist: Show me proof that the Bible is from God.
Person A: Jesus loves all and forgives all!
Atheist: :rollseyes
 
:sl:
Yes, of course it is based on faith - it is a religion afterall! But, it does have sound and logical reasoning behind it.

* Look at the principles of Islamic jurisprudence and how they agree with modern law (rapists, murderers, theives etc are all considered criminals by both systems; only the punishments differ but principally they are the same)

* look at the economics of Islam and how modern banks are adopting them; look at the emphasis on cleanliness, manners and respect in Islam and how the ''free'' world is slowly removing them because of their ''rights''

* look at it's rulings on women and see how they continue to even this day emancipate them.

Heck, there are even hadith that say it is the duty of muslim men and women to learn about their religion ----> if Islam was based purely on faith, why would the teachings encourage us to read deeper into it?
 
Al-Salam Alaykum,

Islam is based on faith, yes it is, it is the religion which was handed down from the grandfather of humanity which was Adam(puh) until Allah's(swt) last prophet which is Muhammad Mustafa(pbuh).

Islam is also based on obedience and fear to Allah(swt) for he is our master and creator and we are His slaves.

Islam is also based on peace and justice. For it is the religion of peace and Allah(swt) loves those who are just.

Salam!
 

Similar Threads

Back
Top