Yes it happens, how does Islam look at people born with handicaps or things like this?
From what i remember Islam teaches children are born Muslim and without sin.
How come Allaah creates people like that
Whats the idea behind that in Islam?
In Christianity it's because mankind is born sinful and the devil that cause these things if i remember correctly.
But i stand to be corrected if it's different by any Christian that has more knowledge about these things.
Last edited by - Qatada -; 09-01-2006 at 09:21 PM.
This is from another thread: And cherub - have some respect, if you really want to know the truth - realise that it comes through asking in a good manner.
First of all i want you to remember that God is the Most Just, this means that he is even Just to the non muslims - the ones who dont even believe in God.
The first point is, God will test those whom he loves - like its been mentioned in the verse:
[29.2] Do men think that they will be left alone on saying, We believe, and not be tried?
[29.3] And certainly We tried those before them, so Allah will certainly know those who are true and He will certainly know the liars.
That means that God will test the people (the believers) he loves in this life. This means putting them through different sorts of hardships, so it is a Just way of forgiving the persons sins.
this relates to the hadith of our beloved Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) who said:
“Whatever befalls a Muslim of exhaustion, illness, worry, grief, nuisance or trouble, even though it may be no more than a prick of a thorn, earns him forgiveness by Allah of some of his sins.”
But you have to keep in mind:
2:286 On no soul doth Allah Place a burden greater than it can bear. It gets every good that it earns, and it suffers every ill that it earns.
This way - God is being Just and the believers sins will be forgiven.
Whereas, God will keep giving goodness to the non-believers in this life, for the deeds they have done. For instance, if a person who is a kafir (a person who rejects faith) has smiled at a person in this life - God will reward them in some way for that deed they have done,
so the person may get alot of riches in this life. This is the Justness God gives to all people whether they believe or not.
Whereas God may keep testing the believer in this life, but we will stay pleased and remain steadfast, like our beloved Prophet
Muhammad (peace be upon him) said:
" Wondrous are the believer's affairs. For him there is good in all his affairs, and this is so only for the believer. When something pleasing happens to him, he is grateful, and that is good for him; and when something displeasing happens to him, he is enduring (sabar), and that is good for him " (sahih Muslim )
but the rejectors of faith will try to stop the believers..
Those in sin used to laugh at those who believed, (83:29)
And whenever they passed by them, used to wink at each other (in mockery); (83:30)
And when they returned to their own people, they would return jesting; (83:31)
And whenever they saw them, they would say, "Behold! These are the people truly astray!" (83:32)
But this doesn't mean that the people who reject faith and do bad acts get away with it, no - they will get the fire in the afterlife.
For those who reject their Lord (and Cherisher) is the Penalty of Hell: and evil is (such), Destination. (67:06)]
Say: "See ye?- If Allah were to destroy me, and those with me, or if He bestows His Mercy on us,- yet who can deliver
the Unbelievers from a grievous Penalty?" (67:28)
But the disbelievers keep rejecting faith:
..their messengers came to them with clear arguments; so it was not Allah Who should do them injustice, but they were unjust to themselves. (9:70)
The people in hell will be in different punishments, which will be affected by the amount of sins they had commited in this life, we know
this because our beloved Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him and his beloved family) said:
Hadith - Qudsi 38
When Allah Almighty created Paradise and Hell-fire, He sent Gabriel to Paradise, saying: Look at it and at what I have prepared therein for its inhabitants.
The Prophet May Allah's peace and praise be on him said: So he came to it and looked at it and at what Allah had prepared therein for its inhabitants. The Prophet May Allah's peace and praise be on him said: So he returned to Him and said: By your glory, no one hears of it without entering it. So He ordered that it be encompassed by forms of hardship, and He said: Return to it and look at what I have prepared therein for its inhabitants. The Prophet May Allah's peace and praise be on him said:
So he returned to it and found that it was encompassed by forms of hardship. Then he returned to Him and said: By Your glory, I fear that no one will enter it. He said: Go to Hell-fire and look at it and what I have prepared therein for its inhabitants, and he found that it was in layers, one above the other.
Then he returned to Him and said: By Your glory, no one who hears of it will enter it. So He ordered that it be encompassed by lusts. Then He said: Return to it. And he returned to it and said: By Your glory, I am frightened that no one will escape from entering it.
...That was because they rebelled and used to transgress. (5:78)
They restrained not one another from the wickedness they did. Verily evil was that they used to do!
The believers are treatedly unjustly;
Those who have been expelled from their homes without a just cause except that they say: Our Lord is Allah. And had there not been Allah's repelling some people by others, certainly there would have been pulled down cloisters and churches and synagogues and mosques in which Allah's name is much remembered; and surely Allah will help him who helps His cause; most surely Allah is Strong, Mighty. (22:40)
Those who, should We establish them in the land, will keep up prayer and pay the poor-rate and enjoin good and forbid evil; and Allah's is the end of affairs. (22:41)
"The believers, men and women, are friends of one another. They command what is right and forbid what is wrong." (9:71)[/color]
Those who say: Our Lord! surely we believe, therefore forgive us our faults and save us from the chastisement of the fire. (3:16)
The patient, and the truthful, and the obedient, and those who spend (benevolently) [in charity] and those who ask forgiveness in the morning times. (3:17)
Those who faithfully observe their trusts and their covenants; (23:08)
And who (strictly) guard their prayers;- (23:09)
These are they who are the heirs, (23:10)
Who will inherit Paradise: they will dwell therein (for ever). (23:11)
"Say, 'Shall I bring your attention to things far better than those? For the righteous are gardens in nearness to their Lord, with rivers flowing beneath, eternal therein, with pure companions and the good pleasure of Allah. For within Allah's sight are all His servants – especially those who say, "Our Lord, we have indeed believed, so forgive us our sins and protect us from the agony of the Fire." Those who are patient, are truthful, who worship devoutly, who spend in the way of Allah and who prays for forgiveness in the pre-dawn hours.'"
[ali'-Imran, 3: 15-17]
"Allah will admit those who believe and work righteous deeds to gardens beneath which rivers flow, they shall be adorned with bracelets of gold and pearls, and their garments therein will be silk. They have been guided in this life to good speech, and they have been guided to the path of Him, the All Praised."
[Hajj, 22: 23-24]
"Their salutation on the day they meet Him will be 'Peace!; and He has prepared for them a generous reward."
[Ahzab, 33: 44]
This is the just a taster of the Justness of Allah the Most Beneficial, the Most Merciful to His servants.
If you need more info, or dont understand - please do ask. & i hope you understand insha Allaah (God willing.)
wa Allaahu ta'aala a'lam. (and Allaah the Most Beneficial, the Most Merciful knows best.)
Fi_Sabilillah sorry if i said anything wrong, i'm not a Muslim so correct me if i say something wrong.
From the first link you posted i read.
2. Allah has placed a physical law and a moral law in this universe. Allah allows suffering to occur when one or more of these laws are broken.
So does that mean that if a couple has a handicapt child they sinned?
And how is the child to perform the things promised mankind in Islam as a mercy?
If he can't even pray to his Lord? He can't marry or have children?
What did the child do to suffer in such a way? Or is the idea that the child does not suffer at all? And is still blessed somehow?
Even though Allah made him blind,deaf,and dumb?
I also wonder about this verse.
Those who have been expelled from their homes without a just cause except that they say: Our Lord is Allah. And had there not been Allah's repelling some people by others, certainly there would have been pulled down cloisters and churches and synagogues and mosques in which Allah's name is much remembered; and surely Allah will help him who helps His cause; most surely Allah is Strong, Mighty. (22:40)
Are there names for these places in Arabic? I thought Allah always refered to a place of worship as a masjid/mosque?
And how can Allah's name be mentioned there?
Wasn't the first place of worship that of the Masjid?
Or did churches , synagogues and cloisters already exist before masjids?
The verse does seem to suggest this.
Sorry btw if i'm going off-topic if it's bothersome , i wouldn't mind making a different thread about that verse
Yes it happens, how does Islam look at people born with handicaps or things like this?
From what i remember Islam teaches children are born Muslim and without sin.
How come Allaah creates people like that
Whats the idea behind that in Islam?
In Christianity it's because mankind is born sinful and the devil that cause these things if i remember correctly.
But i stand to be corrected if it's different by any Christian that has more knowledge about these things.
Hi Cherub
Can I clarify the Christian perspective somewhat?
This issue was addressed directly by Jesus in the gospel.
As he went along, he saw a man blind from birth. His disciples asked him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he was born blind?"
"Neither this man nor his parents sinned," said Jesus, "but this happened so that the work of God might be displayed in his life."(John 9:1-4)
I guess that answer may seem unsatisfactory.
I believe that we don't know why God allows such things, but we trust that he allows them for the greater good.
I work with people who have disabilities, physical and/or mental disabilities.
You know, I sometimes wonder, who are we able-bodied people to assume that those with twisted bodies and/or simple minds are not leading more worthy lives for God than we are???
Some parents describe their disabled children as the greatest joy and blessing in their lives!
Some of these people with profound disabilities bring out the best in others!
We cannot possibly see the purpose and God's greater picture behind such things. Only God can - and we have to learn to trust him.
Peace.
Peace glo
Here I stand.
I can do no other.
May God help me.
Amen.
Come, let us worship and bow down •
and kneel before the Lord our Maker
[Psalm 95]
^Thats right, we see things locally, whereas God sees thing universally, we cant always understand that there is a greater good in something, no matter how evil it might seem to us, we need to accept that God allowed this to happen and it must be for a greater good. subhanaallah.
First thing ..the children are handicapped by human perception not by Allah.
The body or alck of it does not affect faith,it only a reason just like a person of hale and hearty body of mind can also reject guidance.
so the body is no obstacle to praying or having faith.
In Islam if you stiall cannot move you can still pray in a chair or bedridden,the intent is there.
but that does not mean that if you are able bodied you need not perfomr the actions.
and your question on why if a parent sin then it brought upon the child,that is a total alien concept in islam.
every person is born free and clear,their slate unwritten.they write what is on it.
A person whom is disabled will face mroe and more hardship but does that mena that they should not be raised as loving and as cared for as any able bodied perosn.
Such are test for the parent for the child and for society.
These handicapped people are a sign that we have in our bodies well formed,are able to do many things but we dont do them.
Same as for normal epople whom horde wealth and follow their lust and so on,,they can see otehrs whom share and practise decency,,,these are sign .
As Allah say tehre are sign for everywhere for those the understadning
Yes it happens, how does Islam look at people born with handicaps or things like this?
From what i remember Islam teaches children are born Muslim and without sin.
How come Allaah creates people like that
Whats the idea behind that in Islam?
In Christianity it's because mankind is born sinful and the devil that cause these things if i remember correctly.
But i stand to be corrected if it's different by any Christian that has more knowledge about these things.
salaam,
May i ask,if then why arent every person in the wrold born hadicapped since chrisitna say the sin is apssed down thru generations?
why is god selective?
why do chrisitan too face this sinful chidlren if their parents are already forgiven?
Yes,in Islam all are born sinless ,we make the sin and carry it to our doom.
why does Allah casue children ot be handicapped?
the asnwer begs another question,it is said Allah breathe lives into each ebing,or put a soul in each,but again to waht extent can we balme allah for our own misfortunes,if it our own making?
Consider a woman who takes durg,knowing it affects,
Or a woman who smokes,or a poor woman who is not able to for one reason or another to affect her health?
a woman whom lives in poor condition,in haphazard life and so on.
all these factors are the result of our own choices,should a pregnant woman dring and smoke and take drugs?
And the resuly int eh chidlren as studies show are excessive,so is it Allah fault or the uncaring mother or parents?
Let take a another sceanrio,a mother who takes durg while pregnat,knowing the affect of it,continues,,,gives birth to a handicapped child..whose fault is it?
Allah?
is it allah fault that the woman takes drugs?
Is it allah fault that the woman is preganant?
is it Allah fault that the child is born handicapped?
All the asnwer is NO..
It is our own individual choice,the miracle of birth itself is a MIRACLE IN ITSELF,the quran states cleary the step of from a sperm to a foetus..this miracle allah has already granted to mankind,,..
More and more question can be asked about abomination int he world like
wy does ALlah create plant for durgs?
why does Allah create human to create weapons?
why does allah....why why why...sop many and the asnwer is the same..
excuse me , i heard that those who are born handicapt have a better chance of going to jannah( paradise) especially those mentaly challenged ones. correct me if im wrong. thanks !
May i ask,if then why arent every person in the wrold born hadicapped since chrisitna say the sin is apssed down thru generations?
why is god selective?
why do chrisitan too face this sinful chidlren if their parents are already forgiven?
If you are interested in the Christian perspective, please refer to my previous post, where I have quoted what Jesus said on this.
Consider a woman who takes durg,knowing it affects,
Or a woman who smokes,or a poor woman who is not able to for one reason or another to affect her health?
a woman whom lives in poor condition,in haphazard life and so on.
all these factors are the result of our own choices,should a pregnant woman dring and smoke and take drugs?
And the resuly int eh chidlren as studies show are excessive,so is it Allah fault or the uncaring mother or parents?
Let take a another sceanrio,a mother who takes durg while pregnat,knowing the affect of it,continues,,,gives birth to a handicapped child..whose fault is it?
Allah?
is it allah fault that the woman takes drugs?
Is it allah fault that the woman is preganant?
is it Allah fault that the child is born handicapped?
All the asnwer is NO..
I agree with much you say in your post, Zulkiflim, but your statements make me realise that there is still much I don't understand about Islam.
Do you not believe that Allah is all-powerful?
If so, by giving people free choice to make decisions in life (such as the woman taking drugs), is he not allowing the child to be born handicapped?
If Allah is allowing the child to be born handicapped, is the child not in some way carrying the burden caused by the sins of the mother?
(I'm not trying to be difficult, or to catch you out .. just thinking aloud, that's all! I guess this is bordering on the free-will debate - something I haven't come across in this forum yet. )
Any comments and clarifications are welcome!
It is our own individual choice,the miracle of birth itself is a MIRACLE IN ITSELF,the quran states cleary the step of from a sperm to a foetus..this miracle allah has already granted to mankind,,..
More and more question can be asked about abomination int he world like
wy does ALlah create plant for durgs?
why does Allah create human to create weapons?
why does allah....why why why...sop many and the asnwer is the same..
What is the answer? That it is not Allah's doing?
peace
Peace glo
Here I stand.
I can do no other.
May God help me.
Amen.
Come, let us worship and bow down •
and kneel before the Lord our Maker
[Psalm 95]
If you are interested in the Christian perspective, please refer to my previous post, where I have quoted what Jesus said on this.
I agree with much you say in your post, Zulkiflim, but your statements make me realise that there is still much I don't understand about Islam.
Do you not believe that Allah is all-powerful?
If so, by giving people free choice to make decisions in life (such as the woman taking drugs), is he not allowing the child to be born handicapped?
If Allah is allowing the child to be born handicapped, is the child not in some way carrying the burden caused by the sins of the mother?
(I'm not trying to be difficult, or to catch you out .. just thinking aloud, that's all! I guess this is bordering on the free-will debate - something I haven't come across in this forum yet. )
Any comments and clarifications are welcome!
It is our own individual choice,the miracle of birth itself is a MIRACLE IN ITSELF,the quran states cleary the step of from a sperm to a foetus..this miracle allah has already granted to mankind,,..
What is the answer? That it is not Allah's doing?
peace
Salaam,
inshallah i shall read your answer.
As for your question,isnt Allah all powerful?
Yes?
But tell me,how do you define power and will?
Should Allah always protect those who who disdain and not follow his commandment?
Should allah always try to appease those that he created even when they willignly disobey him?
Does not Allah too punish men in the Bible for atrocities,sodom and gammorah and otehr instances?
Why then did god create such situation for men to be punished?
Is it Allah fault?
Such thinking lead to make Allah into a servant,a god whom is beholden to his worhsipper,who must please his worshipper to no end.Will people learn and grow and pass the test if for every tribulation Allah makes a miracle?
Allah has siad a guider has been sent toward all races and yet these guiders are killed or ignored.
It is not upon Allah to please you,it is upon mankind to please Allah.
A woman who is pregnant ,takes drugs and gives birth...where is the miracle?
as i said before,her ability to bear chidlren,the baby formed in her womb,a soul placed inside..
All these are miracles.
the Prophet has said,children are a great gift.It is the duty of the parent to care for them and to provide for them.
Irregardless if the woman ill treat or disdain this great gift,the child is still innocent,by its very being it is a sign,for sympathy,love and the shortness of life.
If the child dies then Inshallah,its tribulation on earth is short,to Jannah it will go for it is sinless,but the mother is a different story.
So this time of micro situation is simple put a question by many who do nto understand why we are put here..we are here to worship Allah and nothing else.
Allah sent sent guiders for us to follow,it is our choice to folow or not.
Why do we consider children with handicaps sinners or product of sin? actually if you look at any child with let's say down syndrome... they are very happy people... only people around them are sad... we aren't all created the same... but equality and forgivness and entrance into heaven isn't contingent on perfection or what we deem perfection... I am always amused that we are fast to blame God for anything that goes wrong yet never thank him for the thousand things that are right... today in the morning I woke up with the worst migraine... I was vomiting ad infinitum... was upset with the world... I take for granted that most days I wake up without a headache, I don't get up everyday thanking God that I don't have a headache, it just doesn't cross my mind... if we truly thank him for the infinte gifts it will not be enough... I don't think that a child born less than stellar is necessairly a bad thing or a result of sin... I look at it as a chance to learn something new, to be humbled by the human condition and to believe in God's boundless love and other gifts that might be superior to make up for the ones that aren't... does it not say "lys 3la almreed 7raj" practically they have a free pass to paradise, why do we consider that a bad thing? why do we not consider a chance for better appreciation, a chance to learn, a chance to treat someone better? a chance to be bound by that thing that makes us all human even if we are different somehow?
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
I believe we try to complicate the answer and the reasons. Genetic abnormalities are actually not a sinfull or evil act. They are simply the result of the DNA combinations that occur. Some DNA combinations will produce healthy beautifull children other combinations will result in what we term birth defects.
Why dosen't Allah(swt) intervene and prevent such things? Possibly because Allah(swt) has given us a gift above all creatures. The gift of choice. But, choice carries a heavy responsibility, with it comes the need to accept all things in the Universe to occur according to the initially physical laws that came about as a result of our living in a physical world. Because we are in a physical world there are things we will have little control over. Such as the rules of gravity. We suffer the consequences it we go against it. So it is with the physical laws of biology, everything is neat and orderly, but we are just begining to learn what physical laws are in place. Our freedom of choice restricts us to living in this physical world and makes us subject to the outcome of the physical laws. Yes, Allah(swt) could prevent all of this, but it would mean our lose of choices.
Now what about Children born in these conditions. Remember our phyiscal bodies are very short term. They only serve the pupose of teaching us and preparing us for Jannah. Each of us is an individual, each of us has to face choices and limitations. Allah(swt) knows what is the best school for each of us, and we are each placed in the condition that is best for us. Our job is to learn our lesson's and prepare for Jannah. So a deformed child is not different, simply in the classroom that offers the best opportunity for that child to reach Jannah.
[QUOTE=PurestAmbrosia;475738]Why do we consider children with handicaps sinners or product of sin? actually if you look at any child with let's say down syndrome... they are very happy people... only people around them are sad... we aren't all created the same...QUOTE]
I am probably in a fairly unique position on this forum in that I am the mother of 2 adorable, beautiful, disabled children. My son is 10 and is autistic and my daughter is 5 and is also autistic, nearly blind and has cerebral palsy (though fairly mildly). Both of them have learning difficulties, my son's are quite mild and my daughter's are severe. The biggest handicap to them though is not their disabilties, it is society's attitude and expectations of them. The problem with autism is that my kids *look* normal, just like any other kid. When you see a child with Downs then you can see instantly the distinctive features of Downs. Not so with autism.
Despite all that, I am not sad, and neither are most of the other parents of disabled kids that I know. When you have a disabled child you appreciate their successes so much more. Yes you have the grieving process when your child is diagnosed but each little step of progress that my children make fills my heart with so much joy. I do not beleive they were made disabled by a vengeful God to punish me. I beleive that God placed these special, precious children with me as a blessing and I will be forever more grateful to him for that.
Why do we consider children with handicaps sinners or product of sin? actually if you look at any child with let's say down syndrome... they are very happy people... only people around them are sad... we aren't all created the same...QUOTE]
I am probably in a fairly unique position on this forum in that I am the mother of 2 adorable, beautiful, disabled children. My son is 10 and is autistic and my daughter is 5 and is also autistic, nearly blind and has cerebral palsy (though fairly mildly). Both of them have learning difficulties, my son's are quite mild and my daughter's are severe. The biggest handicap to them though is not their disabilties, it is society's attitude and expectations of them. The problem with autism is that my kids *look* normal, just like any other kid. When you see a child with Downs then you can see instantly the distinctive features of Downs. Not so with autism.
Despite all that, I am not sad, and neither are most of the other parents of disabled kids that I know. When you have a disabled child you appreciate their successes so much more. Yes you have the grieving process when your child is diagnosed but each little step of progress that my children make fills my heart with so much joy. I do not beleive they were made disabled by a vengeful God to punish me. I beleive that God placed these special, precious children with me as a blessing and I will be forever more grateful to him for that.
Peace
CG
That is incredibly well said... thank you so much for sharing that... I know how much courage that takes considering people's attitudes... There will always be small minded persons walking around.... it is unfortunate for them as they not only isolate themselves but they alienate everyone around them and truly miss out on so much... I believe firmly that we are all here for a purpose and that we are here to teach and learn from one another... people with hatred and prejudices deprive themselves of these opportunities... you are blessed and may God reward you for your courage and bless your family....
Peace be upon you and yours
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
Yes it happens, how does Islam look at people born with handicaps or things like this?
From what i remember Islam teaches children are born Muslim and without sin.
How come Allaah creates people like that
Whats the idea behind that in Islam?
In Christianity it's because mankind is born sinful and the devil that cause these things if i remember correctly.
But i stand to be corrected if it's different by any Christian that has more knowledge about these things.
I think everybody is born with different challenges... it is wrong to think God is punishing us or the devil is attacking us when a child is born with a handicapped...
....how does Islam look at people born with handicaps or things like this?...
I think Brother Fi_Sabilillah has gone into a nice bit of detail in order to responde to your question, I would just like to add a couple of Ahadeeth which I have come across when reading on this topic, I hope they help.
The Brother mentions:
format_quote Originally Posted by Fi_Sabilillah
“Whatever befalls a Muslim of exhaustion, illness, worry, grief, nuisance or trouble, even though it may be no more than a prick of a thorn, earns him forgiveness by Allah of some of his sins.”
Also I would like to add a very similar Hadeeth on this topic, of which there are a handfull which I have seen.
Patience is entrusted and is one of the important aspects of a Muslim, in Bukhari's collection we read:
Volume 7, Book 70, Number 545:
The Prophet said, "No fatigue, nor disease, nor sorrow, nor sadness, nor hurt, nor distress befalls a Muslim, even if it were the prick he receives from a thorn, but that Allah expiates some of his sins for that."
So as to why people are created in such manners it could be this.
I had read a Hadeeth about a blind person or the reward of being blind. But I cannot find that, heres a beautiful hadeeth which shows the virtue of patience in such circumstances:
I found it in Muslim:
Book 032, Number 6245:
'Ata' b. Abi Rabih said: Ibn Abbas said to me: May I show you a woman of Paradise? I said: Yes. He said: Here is this dark-complexioned woman. She came to Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) and said: I am suffering from falling sickness and I become naked; supplicate Allah for me, whereupon he (the Holy Prophet) said: Show endurance as you can do and there would be Paradise for you and, if you desire, I supplicate Allah that He may cure you. She said: I am prepared to show endurance (but the unbearable trouble is) that I become naked, so supplicate Allah that He should not let me become naked, so he supplicated for her.
So we see, the Prophet peace be upon him, told her, I can pray for you, but Paradise will be with you if you are patient with your Illness, so she took the route of patience and paradise, but as a beautiful Muslimah she asked for her body not to be uncovered.
Also you went further on to ask, I think in response to Fi_Sabilillah's reply:
2. Allah has placed a physical law and a moral law in this universe. Allah allows suffering to occur when one or more of these laws are broken.
So does that mean that if a couple has a handicapt child they sinned?
And how is the child to perform the things promised mankind in Islam as a mercy?
If he can't even pray to his Lord? He can't marry or have children?
What did the child do to suffer in such a way? Or is the idea that the child does not suffer at all? And is still blessed somehow?
Even though Allah made him blind,deaf,and dumb?
I cannot see the number one point you made, but with regards to number two, it is not only when laws are broken but rather, it is a test, as shown, in the previous Hadeeth, the Woman's test was for her to be patient with her Illness, and thus she would enter paradise.
With regards to your other questions about if a Child can't do things or if a person who isn't totally sane can't do things I hope the hadeeth below helps to see those individual's place, and we also need to focous beyond this life, we see that a person who is patient in the face of Illness will be rewarded.
At this point I would jus like to mention a Hadeeth I have read in a Fatwa, I have not checked the reference, so please check it, since I have been lookin for a while now:
“The Pen has been lifted from three: from a child until he reaches puberty, from one who is asleep until he wakes up, and from the insane person until he comes to his senses.” Narrated by Abu Dawood, 4402; al-Nasaa’i, 3432; al-Tirmidhi, 1423; Ibn Maajah, 2041. classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood.
In the Light of all this we must also remember that, as I said before, we should not view the pain and sufforing here, as the final part, Islam teaches that the After life, is more better, and everlasting, Islam also teaches that:
The most miserable man in the world of those meant for Paradise will be dipped once in Paradise. Then he will be asked, “Son of Adam, did you ever face any misery? Did you ever experience any hardship?” So he will say, “No, by God, O Lord! I never faced any misery, and I never experienced any hardship.”
Saheeh Muslim, Again I do not have the exact number, someone maybe able to refer you to that if needed, INsha'Allah also if anyone finds the number please give me it.
So even someone who may have had Illness, or any type of pain, as small as a thron prick, they will be rewarded for it, and when, if, they go Paradise, the most mirserable man out of them will answer “No, by God, O Lord! I never faced any misery, and I never experienced any hardship.” when asked “Son of Adam, did you ever face any misery? Did you ever experience any hardship?” What about those less miserable than him.
I hope we all make it to Paradise, InshaAllah, and may Allah, grant us the patience of bearing through hardships, AMeen.
With regards to the Christian position, I have read a couple of Quotations, and they seem very nice, another thing I came across in my Christian days was a passage with regards to God punishin the kids for the Sins of the Parents, and a girl who preached in my college had a skin desise, and she said it was God punishin her because of her parent's sin or something, here is the passage:
9 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the fathers to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 10 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.
Peace be upon those who follow truth when they see it, The Followers of Adam, Abraham, Noah, Moses, David, Jesus and Muhammad, Peace be upon all of them.
I hope this helped a little, anything I said wrong is my fault and anything good then Praise be to G-d.
The path is long but I hope we meet,
After the grave and the Day, in paradise in bliss upon a reclined seat.
A traveler traveling - travelled from shirk to tawheed,
If I'm remembered for anything - let it be the Mercy I seek.
That is incredibly well said... thank you so much for sharing that... I know how much courage that takes considering people's attitudes... There will always be small minded persons walking around.... it is unfortunate for them as they not only isolate themselves but they alienate everyone around them and truly miss out on so much... I believe firmly that we are all here for a purpose and that we are here to teach and learn from one another... people with hatred and prejudices deprive themselves of these opportunities... you are blessed and may God reward you for your courage and bless your family....
Peace be upon you and yours
Thankyou very much for your kind words. I wish more people were like you in this world. If there was the world would be a much more accepting place for children like mine.
Thankyou very much for your kind words. I wish more people were like you in this world. If there was the world would be a much more accepting place for children like mine.
Peace
CG
you know.... when you are in a bad situation you always think you are alone.... but trust me everyone has some burden which is their plight to bear and show courage and perseverance ... I know your life is challenging but I just wanted to share this with you... my best friend has been having many health issues as of late.. didn't want to go seek medical attention as she doesn't have medical insurance, just last week after much coaxing she went and regrettably was diagnosed with premature ovarian failure... she is only 26... I have never met anyone that speaks of wanting children more than she, for five years that I have known her she would constantly talk about children and how she wanted me to be their guardian should something become of her...I wanted to leave her alone with the news, but felt I should call her to just check on her and console her and I found her crying.. someone just ended her career as a woman... it really broke my heart, I can't sleep at night thinking of the awful things around me... but we have to find a balance to be able to go on... All I can do is be a friend... but you see I know she would give anything to be able to have children even if they don't fit the "norm" what you might view as a challenging situation can be the envy of another human being... some of us find our purpose much sooner than others... become human much faster and that can't be all that bad...please feel free to PM if I can be of any help or comfort to you... be well
peace to you and your family
Last edited by جوري; 09-04-2006 at 01:10 AM.
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
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& i hope you understand insha Allaah (God willing.)
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