salam all, i didnt post this thread in my refutation thread because it isnt a refutation, it is very much a comparitive topic since both muslims and christians believe in the holy spirit, but both believe that this being is someone else:
Good article, though I doubt it will satisfy the Christians, since they will always try to show that Ruhool Qudoos is God, through whichever way and means possible
Thank-you. This was a helpful article to have the basic teachings of Islam regarding the Holy Spirit in one place. It is clear from reading the article that there are indeed significant differences between Islam's understanding of the Holy Spirit and that of Christianity. There are also a few similarities.
In both the Holy Spirit is sent. As I understood it, in Islam the Holy Spirit is sent as a messenger of Allah. In Christianity the Holy Spirit is sent by God the Father and God the Son, but not as a messenger; rather the Holy Spirit comes as yet another manifestation of God's self to humankind.
Both Islam and Christianity understand Gabriel (Jibreel) to be an angel sent from God. In Islam Jibreel is seen as the name of the Holy Spirit, so the Holy Spirit is in essence nothing more and nothing less than one of God's angels. In Christianity Gabriel is just an angel and is not identified with the Holy Spirit at all.
In both Islam and Christianity it is Gabriel (Jibreel) who informs Mary (Maryam) that she will give birth to a child even though she is a virgin. Both Islam and Christianity believe that this was accomplished through the power and work of God/Allah. Islam expresses this as 'Isa being created from Maryam. Christianity expresses this as Jesus being conceived in Mary. Both are done without any man being part of the process, that it is totally a miracle accomplished by God/Allah. For Christianity, however, it is not God the Father, but God the Holy Spirit who makes it so. (Which does bring up an interesting question no one has ever asked of me -- Why is Jesus called the Son of the Father rather than the Son of the Holy Spirit? I think I'll have to put that in my Trinitarian pipe and smoke it awhile.)
In the Qu'ran, passages such as "The words of Allaah (interpretation of the meaning), and [We] supported him with Rooh al-Qudus' [al-Baqarah 2:87]", according to the most sound view, refer to Jibreel so that Islam's understanding of the Holy Spirit is as a participant in Allah's work and ministry, and also as an enabler of 'Isa in his work and ministry. In the Bible, passages such as "When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying, heaven was opened and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came from heaven: 'You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased' " (Luke 3:21-22) and "Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert," (Luke 4:1), according to the most sound view, show that in Christianity's understanding of the Holy Spirit it is the Spirit sent from the Father who enables Jesus to do what he does in his work and ministry.
In neither Christianity nor Islam is the Holy Spirit meant to imply the life of God/Allah. However, in Islam the Holy Spirit is a separate entity created by Allah and in Christianity the Holy Spirit is one with God and not created, but himself the Creator God.
In Islam one would reject that Jibreel would be a partner with God because Jibreel is created by God. In Christianity we would also reject that Gabriel would be a partner with God because Gabriel is created by God.
In Islam one would reject that the Holy Spirit would be a partner with God because the Holy Spirit is Jibreel who is created by God. In Christianity we would also reject that the Holy Spirit would be a partner with God, but the reason is because we would say that the Holy Spirit is one and the same with God.
Thus, on this subect...
...the biggest similarities between Islam and Christianity are that:
1) Gabriel/Jibreel is NOT God/Allah
2) The Holy Spirit is the source of God/Allah's power in the life of Jesus/'Isa by which he does the miraculous works and leads the righteous life that he does.
...the biggest differences between Islam and Christianity are that:
1) in Islam the Holy Spirit and Jibreel are one and the same being, whereas in Christianity the Holy Spirit and God are one and the same being (and he is not associated with the angel Gabriel at all).
2) the Holy Spirit is created by God in Isalm, and the Holy Spirit is the Creator God in Christianity.
Last edited by Grace Seeker; 03-09-2007 at 04:13 PM.
Grace Seeker, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the Hebrew word used in Genesis for the "Spirit of God", ruwach literally mean "the breath" or "wind" of God?
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
I am amused! I don't mean this in any deragatory way but what do Christians think of the other angels? Are they too one with G-D a part of G-D?
Israfael and Michael to name a few? what are their duties?
[Pickthal 2:98] Who is an enemy to Allah, and His angels and His messengers, and Gabriel and Michael! Then, lo! Allah (Himself) is an enemy to the disbelievers.
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
I am amused! I don't mean this in any deragatory way but what do Christians think of the other angels? Are they too one with G-D a part of G-D?
Israfael and Michael to name a few? what are their duties?
[Pickthal 2:98] Who is an enemy to Allah, and His angels and His messengers, and Gabriel and Michael! Then, lo! Allah (Himself) is an enemy to the disbelievers.
Christians do not believe the Holy Spirit to be an angel at all...so the answer would be no.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
Grace Seeker, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the Hebrew word used in Genesis for the "Spirit of God", ruwach literally mean "the breath" or "wind" of God?
I don't speak Hebrew, so perhaps Rabbi rebelishaulman would be a better person to answer. According to the Hebrew dictionary in my concordance, ruwach means "wind" or "breath". Because of the connection with breath, sometimes it would also be used figuratively for "life" or even "anger". However, that is Hebrew and in ther reference article provided Ruh Al-Qudus which is translated Holy Spirit is Arabic. Though there may be some visual similarities in the two words ruwach and ruh, I am unwilling to assume that they must therefore be used similarly, especially with regard to their more esoteric meanings.
The New Testament doesn't make mention of angels often, and never mentions an "archangel". Although Michael is sometimes given this title by Christians.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
I don't speak Hebrew, so perhaps Rabbi rebelishaulman would be a better person to answer. According to the Hebrew dictionary in my concordance, ruwach means "wind" or "breath". Because of the connection with breath, sometimes it would also be used figuratively for "life" or even "anger". However, that is Hebrew and in ther reference article provided Ruh Al-Qudus which is translated Holy Spirit is Arabic. Though there may be some visual similarities in the two words ruwach and ruh, I am unwilling to assume that they must therefore be used similarly, especially with regard to their more esoteric meanings.
Thanks, I should probably ask the question in the Jewish thread. I thought that was a fairly descriptive word used in the context of God in Genesis.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
I am amused! I don't mean this in any deragatory way but what do Christians think of the other angels? Are they too one with G-D a part of G-D?
Israfael and Michael to name a few? what are their duties?
[Pickthal 2:98] Who is an enemy to Allah, and His angels and His messengers, and Gabriel and Michael! Then, lo! Allah (Himself) is an enemy to the disbelievers.
And I don't take it as anything other than an honest question.
Reiterating what Keltoi said, Christians don't understand the Holy Spirit to be an angel at all. (Sorry, I thought I had made that clear in my previous post.) Going further, we don't think that any angels are anything but creatures created by God. In essence, given the we think the Holy Spirit is himself one with the Creator God, then God the Holy Spirit would be the creator of the creature the Angel Gabriel and all other angels.
With reference to archangles, while there are over 300 references to angels in the Bible, there are only two references to an archangel:
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.(1 Thessalonians 4:16)
and
But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not dare to bring a slanderous accusation against him, but said, "The Lord rebuke you!" (Jude 1:9)
Michael is also mentioned in Revelation 12, but not identified as an archangel in that passage:
Revelation 12
7And there was war in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back. 8But he was not strong enough, and they lost their place in heaven. 9The great dragon was hurled down—that ancient serpent called the devil, or Satan, who leads the whole world astray. He was hurled to the earth, and his angels with him.
Gabriel, who is only mentioned 4 times in the Bible (twice in the book of the prophet Daniel and twice in the Gospel of Luke), and all of the other angels are messengers, servants of God. Angels are sent to minister to Jesus during his time on earth, most notably while he was in the desert after being tempted by the devil and when in the garden praying before he went to face the Cross. They also are commanded by God to worship Jesus:
Hebrews 1
6And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says,
"Let all God's angels worship him." 7In speaking of the angels he says,
"He makes his angels winds,
his servants flames of fire." 8But about the Son he says,
"Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever,
and righteousness will be the scepter of your kingdom.
We also believe that some angels sinned and rebelled against God. Legend, not the Bible, says they were led in this by Lucifer who is also considered an archangel. That legend springs from the following passage, the only place that the name Lucifer is found in the Bible:
Isaiah 14
12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
13For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
14I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
15Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
According to 2 Peter 2:4, "God did not spare angels when they sinned, but sent them to hell, putting them into gloomy dungeons to be held for judgment."
No other angels are mentioned by name in the Bible.
Last edited by Grace Seeker; 03-09-2007 at 05:30 AM.
There are nearly as many different beliefs with regard to angels among Christians as there are individual Christians in the world today. This is because of an explosion in interest in angels. But as the Bible really doesn't say much more than what I have posted above, people turn to other writers to fill there appetites for more information about angles. And many writers have stepped forward to write books of all kinds, some good, some scholarly, some pop culture, some biblically based, some pure works of fanciful imagination. I believe you live in the USA, so you probably remember the TV show, Touched By An Angel. That one was pretty good. Then there was the Michael Landon show Highway to Heaven in which he played an angel, that one was a good show, but terrible theology. And let us not forget that we all know that everytime you here a bell ring an angel gets his wings -- the gospel according to Clarence from It's A Wonderful Life with Jimmy Stewart. Even churches contribute to the confusion dressing all of the little girls up as angels for children's Christmas programs and all of the little boys as shepherds and wisemen; yet, I think every angel that is identified in the Bible makes an appearance in male form.
Of one thing I am sure, pop culture is wrong when it portrays children as becoming angels when they go to heaven. On earth people may be created a little lower than the angels, but in heaven people are to become children of God, while angels are just servants.
Grace Seeker, correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't the Hebrew word used in Genesis for the "Spirit of God", ruwach literally mean "the breath" or "wind" of God?
yes.
each man thinks of his own fleas as gazelles
question authority
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