You'll have to refresh me on the context in which I stated what sounds like a paraphrase of my comments. I don't think my 5-year old granddaughter could explain the Trinity as she is young enough not to have seriously reflected on any of these things. And
I don't think that I could explain the Trinity, as the nature and character of God is beyond any human explanation, and certainly mine. But, yes in general, I do think that any Christian with a modicum of understanding should be able to both articulate and explain the Trinity in at least some rudimentary form. Are there some persons, accepted as a part of the greater Christian community or self-identifyed as such who might have done enough book study to perhaps even wax eloquently about it yet not themselves actually hold to those beliefs? I have no doubt.
and yet, when question by another member of the forum regarding said trinity:
Originally Posted by
moslima
If you ask an average Christian about trinity, they will tell you that they don't understand it, if you ask them why you do so and so, you will not get a satisfying answer.
now even though the trinity is a riddle wrapped up inside a mystery wrapped up inside an enigma, you replied:
Originally posted by
Grace Seeker
Well, tomorrow I will see a number of "average" Christians. I will ask them and see if they tell me that they don't understand. I suspect they understand more than you give them credit for. You just don't like their understanding and don't appreciate the explanations that they give, because you have yet to understand as they do.
just to remind you of what you posted:
I don't think that I could explain the Trinity, as the nature and character of God is beyond any human explanation, and certainly mine
PERHAPS you meant that members of your church could explain it better than you can? or perhaps...well, i'll let you explain...
I have reported on Polycarp on past threads. In one of the first one of those I actually quoted from Iraneus' letter. It isn't something I have at my fingertips, so you might just want to do a search for "Polycarp" and "John" under my name using the LI search engine.
i guess i want your "current" answer! kay:
Now, I will see your
The Interpreters One-Volume Commentary on the Bible, and raise you
The Interpreters Bible, Volume 7, copyright 1951, Abingdon Press, in the "Introduction to Matthew", by Sherman E. Johnson:
And elsewhere, discussing the gospel's authorship, Johnson writes:
Of course, I can quote you scholar after scholar who will reject Matthew as the author of Matthew. Some will date the book half way through the second century (even though it is already quoted before then). And I can find you scholar after scholar who will insist that it was written by Matthew in Hebrew even before Mark, while others claim that Matthew borrowed from Mark and a "
Q" source document. Still others that Matthew himself wrote a collection of the "Sayings of Jesus" in Aramaic that became the "
Q" source and that Matthew later actually quotes from himself and Mark in composing his Greek-languaged gospel account. There seem to be no end of theories. What is your point?
Khalid said that we know it was NOT Matthew. We don't know that. If he had said that we don't know that it was Matthew, I might have said that I tend to lean toward it being Matthew, but I would have agreed that he was making a factually correct statement. But to say that WE KNOW WHO THE AUTHOR WAS NOT is, since we are emphasizing this terminology, a FACTUALLY INCORRECT statement.
i see your point, BUT if NOONE KNOWS who wrote Mark, then you CANNOT DEFINITVELY say that Brother Khalid is wrong because you are doing the same thing that he is!
Btw, here is another scholar's take on that key extract from Papais:
One contributing factor to the debate [over authorship] is the quotation from Papias (c. A.D. 135) recorded by Eusebius (Ecclesiastical History 3.39.16). Several of Papias's expressions are ambiguous: "Matthew synetaxeto (composed? compiled? arranged?) the logia (sayings? Gospel?) in hebraidi dialekto (in the Hebrew (Aramaic?) language?, in the Hebrew (Aramaic?) style?); and everyone hermeneusen (interpreted? translated? transmitted?) them as he was able (contextually, who is 'interpreting' what?)." The early church understood the sentence to mean that the apostle Matthew first wrote his Gospel in Hebrew or Aramaic and then it was translated. But few today accept this. Although Matthew has Semitisms, much evidence suggests that it was first composed in Greek.
D.A. Carson, from his introduction to "Matthew" in The Expositor's Bible Commentary, Vol. 8, Zondervan Publishing, c. 1984
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