So it's clear that the bible is not the direct wod of God, and as we muslims believe it has been fabricated by mankind which the video clearly explains so why then do christians follow it blindfoldedly?
So it's clear that the bible is not the direct wod of God, and as we muslims believe it has been fabricated by mankind which the video clearly explains so why then do christians follow it blindfoldedly?
Only a small percentage of Christians claim it is the direct word of God. But we follow it (though not blindly) because we believe it to be the writing of men as inspired by God. It is thus a collabrative effort in which God used men who were instruments that received revelation, and in their own words (and sometimes editting) passed their understanding of that revelation on to others in written form. As such it can guide us into righteousness, knowledge of God and his activity in this world, and ultimately life in the will of God. Surely such a collection of inspired writings is worthy of our attention.
Adding to what Graceseeker pointed out, the Bible is not meant to be characterized as the "direct Word of God", meaning God wrote it. It is an account of man's interaction with God, beginning with the Jewish people. Yes, we believe these accounts to be inspired by revelation, but that is much different than the Muslim understanding of the Qu'ran, which they believe to be the direct word of God.
So making the claim that God didn't write the Bible isn't exactly a mindblowing epiphany. Most Christians would agree with that aspect. What Christians will not agree with is the claim that the Bible is "fabricated". It is our guide for our relationship with God.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
I dont want any book written by paul,john or some other dude, what i want is the gospel of Jesus
I think what you mean to say is a book written by Jesus. There is no evidence at all that Jesus ever physically wrote anything meant to be kept as a religious text. I know Muslims believe differently, but that is a faith issue. As Christians we believe what is important is what Christ accomplished for us, which is indeed contained with the Gospel account.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
I dont want any book written by paul,john or some other dude, what i want is the gospel of Jesus
Given that the word "gospel" means "good news", then what you want is a book that tells the good news about Jesus. That good news is NOT found in his teachings. However important and valued they are, the good news about Jesus is found in what he did and who he is in our lives. For this reason, the gospels of Jesus that are recorded by Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John focus primarily on the last week of Jesus life more than all the rest of his life and ministry combined. It is that act of the cross and the resurrection that is the true gospel and the message of good news for humankind is found in them. If you don't want that, then (and I don't mean this in any pejorative way) you may talk all you want about some mythical Injil, but you'll never have the Gospel if you don't include that message.
The Gospels or good word are four different biographies of the Prophet Jesus, peace be upon him, written by Matthew, Mark, Luke and John, whose identities are widely disputed. In addition, the New Testament contains the epistles of Paul, Peter and John. This is as well as the Acts - also due to Paul or Luke - and the Visions of John. It is quite clear that these are human made texts which in most cases most of these Gospel writers never even saw Jesus neither lived with him so I don't think you could get much good news from it let alone trust it to be anywhere close to the word of God.
And thats why this world is so corrupt because its been corrupt by the hands of Men and the alteration of the true teachings of God Almighty. I guess thats just another proof why the Bible has so many different versions and still being created today. Hey why don't we just go and create a whole new bible inspired by the bible and just add a few more different things that would please us and we can all follow that.
Well this I've never understood, why christians follow the views of normal everyday life people(in the form of mark, luke.....) These people are as imperfect as we are, they are no angels. Humans are bound to make stuff up, or make things look better then they are, or lie about a certain thing. How can a person write a whole book when he never met Jesus himself or seen him? That book will be based upon stories he heared, and everytime someone tells a story he tends to add more flavouring to it. I would like to see the views of christian on this.
Yes I agree, And May Allah guide them to the right path. I truly hope that Allah will open the hearts to the truth and find the true happiness beyond what this world will provide.
Only a small percentage of Christians claim it is the direct word of God. But we follow it (though not blindly) because we believe it to be the writing of men as inspired by God. It is thus a collabrative effort in which God used men who were instruments that received revelation, and in their own words (and sometimes editting) passed their understanding of that revelation on to others in written form. As such it can guide us into righteousness, knowledge of God and his activity in this world, and ultimately life in the will of God. Surely such a collection of inspired writings is worthy of our attention.
salam
if such collection of inspired writing is worthy of your attention, and this is what human beings wrote, then why does the actual word of God Almighty the noble Quran not the centre of your attention?
Now why on earth would God use men not a man but men ( as in many in numbers) to inspire them with His revelation and these so called "men" are not even mentioned in any of the scriptures as being prophets or messengers of God????
On top of all that why would God not reveal or inspire His noble messengers and prophets to do that instead?? wouldnt then the authenticity of the message that He is trying to convey be more evident???
I mean as you can see these so called men that have put together the bible, did so by focusing on the agendas that suited them, therefore you have many versions focusing portraying the message in different ways and differing from each other!!!
i mean that in itself surely would not make sense to anyone?
this is what you call FABRICATION! in the end result the word and message of the Almighty was changed and altered to suit these arrogant men (sorry but they are far from pious, inspired by God or noble scholars ) and distorted the message for which i am sure Allah swt will punish them in the fire of Hell.
if such collection of inspired writing is worthy of your attention, and this is what human beings wrote, then why does the actual word of God Almighty the noble Quran not the centre of your attention?
Now why on earth would God use men not a man but men ( as in many in numbers) to inspire them with His revelation and these so called "men" are not even mentioned in any of the scriptures as being prophets or messengers of God????
On top of all that why would God not reveal or inspire His noble messengers and prophets to do that instead?? wouldnt then the authenticity of the message that He is trying to convey be more evident???
I mean as you can see these so called men that have put together the bible, did so by focusing on the agendas that suited them, therefore you have many versions focusing portraying the message in different ways and differing from each other!!!
i mean that in itself surely would not make sense to anyone?
this is what you call FABRICATION! in the end result the word and message of the Almighty was changed and altered to suit these arrogant men (sorry but they are far from pious, inspired by God or noble scholars ) and distorted the message for which i am sure Allah swt will punish them in the fire of Hell.
No offense, and this shouldn't come as a surprise, but as Christians we do not believe the Qu'ran to be the direct word of God.
As to the rest, insulting the authors of the Gospel record is all well and good, but your claims are nothing but claims. There was another thread that dealt with this question, but this thread begs it again.
Why exactly would the early Christians, the men who recorded the Gospel account, knowingly fabricate that account? What would they possibly gain besides persecution and premature death? That line of reasoning runs dry fairly quickly.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
When debate in religion comes at hand and when you claim that something is not the word of God you must put forward reasoning and proof with evidence from that book. What proof can you bring forward from the Quran itself explaining why christians don't believe it is not the word of Allah?
Your answer would be much appreciated,Thankyou
When debate in religion comes at hand and when you claim that something is not the word of God you must put forward reasoning and proof with evidence from that book.
That's actually rather difficult to do... I could explain why I don't believe the Qur'an was written by God and indeed why its human authors did write it, but it would be virtually impossible to do so on an Islamic forum without offending somebody... so I won't.
All of this 'proof' stuff is pointless, amyway - we've been here so many times before. Billions of people accept Bible or Qur'an as their principle guide as to how to live; why not just accept that and move on to discuss genuine issues in comparitive religion?
When debate in religion comes at hand and when you claim that something is not the word of God you must put forward reasoning and proof with evidence from that book. What proof can you bring forward from the Quran itself explaining why christians don't believe it is not the word of Allah?
Your answer would be much appreciated,Thankyou
When I take a look at the simple historical evidence that there was indeed a man named Jesus of Nazareth who existed in history, a life attested to not only in the Christian writings but also spoken of by 1st century Jews and Romans who make the following claims regarding him themselves:
1) that this man was executed
2) that his followers claim he was resurrected
And despite this, I see that the Qur'an claims that these things never happen, then it puts the veracity of the Qur'an in significant doubt. And, whereas the Qur'an (unlike the Bible) makes a claim of being direct revelation, such a discrepancy in one part puts the whole of it in doubt. The arguments put forth that God fooled people into merely believing it was Jesus when it was really somebody else seem very contrived and not credible, and speak of a God who is dishonest in his dealings with people; by this very testimony of his own actions he cannot be trusted.
That's actually rather difficult to do... I could explain why I don't believe the Qur'an was written by God and indeed why its human authors did write it, but it would be virtually impossible to do so on an Islamic forum without offending somebody... so I won't.
All of this 'proof' stuff is pointless, amyway - we've been here so many times before. Billions of people accept Bible or Qur'an as their principle guide as to how to live; why not just accept that and move on to discuss genuine issues in comparitive religion?
Quoting FROM the Quran why you believe the Quran is not the word of God would certainly not offend Anybody and certainly won't offend me. This procedure should be quite easy for you to do if you could do it. I can easily state passages from the Bible why I believe its NOT the word of God and I once again don't think it would offend anybody because I'm stating facts written for the books of evidence.
"All of this 'proof' stuff is pointless"??? How can it be pointless when its a fundamental part of belief in a system you and I would follow for a way of life. I surely think it is a largely genuine issue facing us in this world today because to us as humans it directs our existence and were we will end up. We were not created for no reason and we need a law from the one that created us to know which is the best way to follow it and I would be largely wanting to follow the right path so that I know my existence was lived in the most righteous manner available, so we must scrutinise all the evidence that we have so we know what is true and what is false.
As Grace Seeker mentioned, the reason I do not believe the Qu'ran to contain the direct Word of God is because of its version of Jesus, primarily. There are other reasons, but I don't feel it is productive to mention them. What Trumble says is accurate. We are talking about faith issues. Nothing you say about the Bible is going to make me a Muslim, and nothing I say about the Qu'ran is going to make you a Christian. It is futile exercise.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
yeah it has been fabricated by human kind and this is well known by all muslims, muslims all know that the real bible is not rela any more .. and a lot has been changed to it now .. do u know why they change it ?
to keep up with the developments of life ...
but alhmadulilah the quran will never be changed as it is protected by Allah and it is suitable for any era and at any time ...
actually the qu'ran reveals many things in nature, and many things of what will happen in the future and everyday scientists find new things in nature which has been actually recorded in the qu'ran since million of years ago .. Thanks to Allah who gave us Islam and the Qu'ran ...
As Grace Seeker mentioned, the reason I do not believe the Qu'ran to contain the direct Word of God is because of its version of Jesus, primarily. There are other reasons, but I don't feel it is productive to mention them. What Trumble says is accurate. We are talking about faith issues. Nothing you say about the Bible is going to make me a Muslim, and nothing I say about the Qu'ran is going to make you a Christian. It is futile exercise.
Praise Be to Allah who has preserved the most beautiful stories about Jesus (Peace be upon him) in the Quran. His story in the Quran has Caused historical kings to shed tears and accept islam and if this is not enough to show you how much we respect Jesus (Peace be upon him) in islam then so be it, Allah guides whom he wills and misguides whom he wills, Whom he guides none can misguide and whom he misguides none can guide. If Allah wanted to guide you believe me he can do it quite easily but he must find in you something worthy of guidence and I pray that hopefully he will one day find something in you worthy of guideing you.
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.
When you create an account, we remember exactly what you've read, so you always come right back where you left off. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and share your thoughts. Sign Up
Hide
Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.
Bookmarks