Okay I duno how to put this buh am jus gonna be straightforward.. As boys/men, would you go for someone that wears a ninja head to toe or someone who don't cover herself.. Now I know, I mean it's obvious that gurlz who don't cover themselves are more attractive buh on a serious note, who would you as a guy go for and why? Btw, this has NOTHING to do with Islam.. Am jus sayin generally.. I know some guys get put off if they see a gurl in a ninja cuz they feel she's too "Islamic" or too "extreme" or wahever.. Yet deep down that gurl could be an outgoing person.. Similarly, a gurl who don't cover herself properly, a guy could turn her down & yet deep down she could have the most amazing of characters.. So yeaaa, I was wonderin wah are your views on this? :><:
" Its sometimes better people don't get to know you..
Cuz the more they know you, the less they understand & accept you..
Alone is better, what say " - SRK
Subhallah! Sister, I have been through hell with my current marriage. It is falling apart but that wouldn’t stop me from getting married. Marriage is the most beautiful thing in this world. Do you have children? If you don’t then you haven’t fulfilled the duty you owe to Allah (swt). I'm shocked at someone that gives up on life like you. I dont mean to offend.
Again thank you for your concern but no thanks. You and me are two different people.
I fullfilled the duty marriage invloved, I certainly dont need to do it again. I did ever part of that duty. I dont think I am going against Allah (swt) when I choose to not marry ever again. I hope all goes well for you.
The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) said: "Help your brother, whether he is an oppressor or he is an oppressed one.." [Bukhaari].
no i dont. maybe the truth hurts? but what would i know, im just the ignorant woman. yay, go me.
but whatever...
Okay. Have it your way. Let me crush your little uprising.
You should make your position and stance clear ahkee and not when someone opposes your idea holdup the victim card and cry “wait a minute that’s not what i said.” And you’d be right, that isn’t what you said, but the way you constructed your post, you can’t blame anyone for taking it the way they did.
Hold up. I don't have to type everything and anything and waste my effort when it is up to the READER to inquire about what bits they don't understand and not ASSUME the contrary to what is meant anyway.
Everything you mentioned in your post practically implied that the emotional needs for women ought to be disregarded and that a good husband is a man who fears Allah ONLY whilst being disregarded to her emotional needs. Not to mention that a woman who wants a kind and considerate husband, is irrational and is walking all over her husband (that’s where the quote about the ansaar, etc was relevant).
You don't know how to read. If this is the message you take from my post, then you serioiusly do not know how to read. Either that or you just want to argue for the sake of it, as I mentioned.
I don't need to go through my post and highlight the kindness etc that a man must show, it's visible to all.
what peeves me off, is that you “mask” your whole argument on “as long as he is all deen, then stuff the rest.” “hey is is only looking out for you”
Please akhee, don’t insult my intelligence. I am not stupid.
Don't even understand what you're getting at here. I'm not masking anything. It's your naive mind that's assuming such silly notions.
Did I say 'as long as he is all deen, then stuff the rest'? I repeatedly said otherwise. Clearly, you can't read.
and for the record, we all know you men behind closed doors cry like a girl. as if men are anymore emotionally stable then women. You guys are just as worse (actually, in some cases you’re alot worse)...
What are you on about? Who said anything about crying is wrong? Who even mentioned crying??
If a guy were to cry for legitimate reasons then good on him. What's your problem? Context is everything. There is a time and place to be strong and a time to be soft.
seriously though, i get where you're coming from when you say the man is the head of the house, etc and that he cares about his "subjects."
the problem is, i feel this is just a mask for something deeper and a deeper argument that you dont want to directly say, knowingly or unknowingly.
this seems to stemmed from and fueled by a sense of dominance (not directed at you, but speaking generally) and not so much caring for the wife and children per se. you seem to be using the importance of marrying a pious man, to get your point across about obedience to the husband and that women are controlling men by wanting a sensitive man.
these 2 just seem to be a justification to support his exercise of power. if it is part of the sunnah that the man is in charge, fine no worries wallahi, but again i don't feel this has anything do with what the sunnah says, but rather a husband being in authority and his sense of dominance in that respect.
COMPLETELY FALSE. Maybe some men have this desire not me and not what I would ever argue for.
i dislike for my sisters to be unaware and mislead that their husbands should be only praying,etc and this is the be all and end all in a husband....rasoolullah sallaahu aleyhi wa sallam was both a pious and affectionate man...I've seen brothers use the exact same excuse that you have used (i.e authority) when in reality it is nothing to do with the crowd she maybe with, but rather about that he is the man and this deeply annoy's me. i dislike deceit and i will not settle for my sisters to be mislead.
My post is CLEAR that I do NOT support what you are suggesting. Don't know why you bring these issues up.
The guy is fed up because she is not adhering to her deen, or he is fed up because she is not listening to him. There is a difference.
Talk about taking it out of the context. He is fed up cos she is not listening AND cos she is sinning. BOTH are important. A wife that doesn't listen is obviously a hindrance to a good marriage as is a wife that sins. What's your point?
Simple question: Is a guy that thinks beard is not from the deen or doesn't consider it praiseworthy and FOR THAT reason, does not adopt it, a good muslim? Categorically, it is proven to be wajib. Anyone that neglects it is sinful.
HOWEVER, all along, I have said that it is OKAY (so to say) if a person does not have one but NOT OKAY if he thinks there is no virtue attached with it.
If you personally honestly do not find any virtue in a beard, then I'm frankly disappointed. I expected better from you, brother.
FYI, when I made the initial post to the sister, it was relative in the sense that she has a choice between two:
1. best character, full salah etc but no beard (DUE SPECIFICALLY TO ATTACHING NO IMPORTANCE TO IT).
VS
2. best character, full salah etc but full beard.
So all these issues people have created in this thread is due to misunderstandings in the first place.
Seriously. How can any muslim entertain that guy number 1 is the better option than the latter for an Islamically focused sister?
The argument hasn't been about a beard making a marriage in the first place. That is not what I was saying or arguing. Despite the sister's question.
Marriage is not an end. It is a tool. The end goal is Allah. Marriage is ibaadah. Guy 2 obviously has more importance on beard/sunnah than guy 1, hence more likely to guide her and the family to a more fulfilling Islamic wedded life.
This is what the sister asked btw:
She said 'perfect' in every way. Hence the option between guys 1, 2 above. Which any person can see that guy two is better (also note that my reply was IN THE EVENT that the brother does not attach importance to beard and doesn't keep it for that reason, not simply being beardless per se (for any valid reason).
Whilst I agree there are more important issues, at the end of the day, it's not like we are spending our entire lives just hinging on this one sunnah issue. It's just a discussion on a forum that will end in a couple of days most likely.
What about if somebody came and started arguing that the sunnah acts in salah are not really important? When salah is the first thing Allah will question us about, would you really say well, it's only sunnah, there are more important issues vis. "Divorce rates, drugs, alcohol, fornication, adultery, depression, disconnected youth, apostasy etc"?
No muslim with his head screwed on right would argue that sunnah is not important. It is what defines us. The kind of problems you mention divorce, alchohol etc is a SYMPTOM of not leading an Islamic lifestyle and HUGE part of the Islamic lifestyle is following the sunnah. Not just the outward but the internal aspect to. I.e smiling at people, thinking well of others etc.
If everyone followed EVERY act of Sunnah, this world would be a much better place. Sunnah cannot be emphasised enough.
HOWEVER, in saying this, I do AGREE that there are people that focus TOO MUCH on the external and I UNDERSTAND why you feel repulsed by the attitude and RIGHTLY SO.
Where there's any matter of Islam; its not based on the two restricted criteria. I'm not saying that you're wrong; what I'm saying is you missed out a number 3, which would be that he says its wajib to keep a beard, but chooses not to do so.
(61:2-3) "O you who have believed, why do you say what you do not do? Great is hatred in the sight of Allah that you say what you do not do."
Subhallah! Sister, I have been through hell with my current marriage. It is falling apart but that wouldn’t stop me from getting married. Marriage is the most beautiful thing in this world. Do you have children? If you don’t then you haven’t fulfilled the duty you owe to Allah (swt). I'm shocked at someone that gives up on life like you. I dont mean to offend.
Whether someone has fulfilled their duty towards Allah; is between that person and Allah. There have been Muslim women in history who didn't have children; this includes early Islamic History. We can only judge based on ma'roof and munkar, and keep faith in Allah. Allah is the best judge.
Where there's any matter of Islam; its not based on the two restricted criteria. I'm not saying that you're wrong; what I'm saying is you missed out a number 3, which would be that he says its wajib to keep a beard, but chooses not to do so.
(61:2-3) "O you who have believed, why do you say what you do not do? Great is hatred in the sight of Allah that you say what you do not do."
Wa alaykum salam,
Thank you. This is not relevant to my post, however.
@ bedouin - you have some valid points but the way you put them out aint the best (i havent read all ur posts but i do understand SOME of what youre saying) but maybe a more polite approach in what youre saying will get rid of the 'harshness'
@sweet106- If you had a bad experience in marraige then dont let anyone tell you that your wanting to not remarry again affect you. @ those people- a bad bad experience makes u shy away from something and not want to go through it again. instead of telling the sister she is wrong in her choice (which was caused by an experience!!) maybe you should show that not all men are bad and expect a slave?
Last edited by S_87; 08-19-2010 at 01:11 PM.
Our Lord! Verily, we have heard the call of one calling to Faith: 'Believe in your Lord,' and we have believed.
Our Lord! Forgive us our sins and expiate from us our evil deeds, and make us die (in the state of righteousness) along with Al-Abrar
May I ask why everyone is attacking each other? I remind everyone here that Islam is not like this, if you want to clear your point and give your comment then say it gently without being mean or rude. It seems that anger is overwhelming everyone's hearts here, say Aouthu bilahi min al shaitan al rajeem and ask Allah forgiveness my brothers and sisters. If someone says something you don't like just don't keep countering, say Jazakum Allah khiir and keep silent, nothing wrong in that.
For me, No Hijaab = No Prospect. As far as the ninjabi-ness is concerned... As long as she's not a social hermit, I'm completely okay. It's always awkward discussing the type of spouse you're looking for on the public Internet space. Especially while thinking she might be reading this right now, but anyhoo...
Ninjabi-ness is NOT a turn off as long as she does have social skills and is out there in her own way. I hope that makes sense.
istikhara before marriages should resolve all problems.
marrying for the religion should resolve all problems.
^ combine these two and i guarantee a successful marriage.
yes i go so far as to guarantee it.
THAT is the REASON why I would never consider a hijaabless girl, it annoys me enough that they fall into my sight
Pray two rak'ahs and say the following:
اللهم إني أستخيرك بعلمك ، واستقدرك بقدرتك ، وأسألك من فضلك العظيم ، فإنك تقدر ولا أقدر ، وتعلم ولا أعلم ، وأنت علام الغيوب . اللهم إن كنت تعلم أن هذا الأمر - ويسمي حاجته - خير لي في ديني ومعاشي وعاقبة أمري فاقدره لي ، ويسره لي ، ثم بارك لي فيه . وإن كنت تعلم أن هذا الأمر شر لي في ديني ومعاشي وعاقبة أمري عاجله وآجله فاصرفه عني واصرفني عنه ، واقدر لي الخير حيث كان ثم أرضني به
istikhara before marriages should resolve all problems.
marrying for the religion should resolve all problems.
^ combine these two and i guarantee a successful marriage.
yes i go so far as to guarantee it.
THAT is the REASON why I would never consider a hijaabless girl, it annoys me enough that they fall into my sight
unfortunately it is not as black and white as that. there were pious Allah fearing people (sahabas) who divorced. sure the above definitely helps but unfortunately it isnt a guarantee
Our Lord! Verily, we have heard the call of one calling to Faith: 'Believe in your Lord,' and we have believed.
Our Lord! Forgive us our sins and expiate from us our evil deeds, and make us die (in the state of righteousness) along with Al-Abrar
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I know some guys get put off if they see a gurl in a ninja cuz they feel she's too "Islamic" or too "extreme" or wahever.. Yet deep down that gurl could be an outgoing person.. Similarly, a gurl who don't cover herself properly, a guy could turn her down & yet deep down she could have the most amazing of characters.. So yeaaa, I was wonderin wah are your views on this? :><:
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