Censorship on this Site...

Serious point - if any forum member has problems with the actions of a certain moderator:

a) Discuss it with that moderator via PM if possible

b) If that is not possible for whatever reason, report the behaviour of that moderator using the report function or contact an admin (the ones with red-coloured names)

format_quote Originally Posted by soloqi

Clearly this site is run by a bunch of twisted individuals, my posts in the music thread have been edited without my consent and others deleted because they do not agree with a particular brand of islamic fanatics....

You can hide the truth and barr member from speaking their minds, but in the end such action will be come back and haunt them...

None of the mods on Li "censor" any individual and you are no exception to this rule. We do however prohibit anything that goes against the clear texts of the Qur'an and Sunnah.

After skimming over your posts in your last thread, I can see that you defend music based solely on logic, empiric (I.e. based on experience and intellect) and reason. None of these qualify as fields that determine what is Islamically prohibited and what is Islamically permissible, as what is prohibited and permissible is strictly restricted to the authority of Allah and His Messenger. While reason, empiric and logic is used to get al-insaan to reflect and ponder over Allah, His creation and His signs, they are not used to determine the laws of Allah and their correctness as all the laws of Allah are perfect and correct.

This area that you are indulging in to stand up for music is called 'Ilm al kalaam (Arguing and discussing about Islam based purely on reason, logic and intellect), all of which can be summarized as "human endeavour". And all human endeavour is limited, restricted and confined within the boundaries and realms of a human being. If man did not bring himself into this world, who is he to determine for himself what is right or wrong? And who is he to determine what the One who has brought him into this world has allowed and disallowed?

Among the greatest companions of the Messenger , Ibn Abbaas has explicitly said that the ayah condemning "idle speech" in Quran is specifically talking about music and singing.

After this general prohibition of all music, the Messenger made exceptions only for the days of marriage and 'Eid. The only exception in these days is to beat the duff drum. Even then this drum can only be beaten by women and not men.

I have discussed this in some depth on my thread here: Music

After this explanation it should become clear that we do not allow anyone's posts to go against the Qur'an and Sunnah, including a topic like music. What is prohibited is clear and what is permitted is also clear. But if you seek to dispute this based on calling music "sound waves" without the backing of the Qur'an and Sunnah then we cannot allow such posts to remain, as the reasons for their deletion have been made clear.

Furthermore, if we limit one aspect of something prohibited to "sound waves" then we can also call insulting Islam and insulting Allah and proclaiming false idols as true Gods as merely "sound waves". The truth however is that we cannot because music is not just "sound waves", they have an effect that influence and cause people to behave and act in ways contrary to Islam.

We can discuss this further if you still have issues but it should be made clear by now that we do not censor any individual and the reasons as to why your post may have been edited/deleted.

There are a number of problems to point out here:

1. Accusations against moderators

format_quote Originally Posted by soloqi

my posts in the music thread have been edited without my consent and others deleted

Looking at your post history since you returned to the forum, I find only one post deleted. The reason for that was sent in an automated PM which you have read:

Reason: Sorry, I misakenly edited your post instead of replying to it.

So accusations about being framed or slandered are totally untrue. This kind of behaviour tends to come from forum trolls who, in last-minute desperation, turn to childish insults and distortion of facts. As you are making noble claims to propagate the truth, one also wonders what kind of truth you seek to promote here if this thread is your idea of being truthful.

2. Using the Helpdesk

The forum has a special section for discussing moderators' actions. The automated PMs clearly state, 'If you have any questions, you can ask an administrator for assistance by creating a thread in the Helpdesk.' Most members follow this request very well, and you would have done well to do likewise.

3. Freedom of speech

I will not accept anybody that wants to give the imprssion this is an open forum...

And nobody has done so. In fact, if you read the forum rules, it is made very clear that:

While some may complain that there is "freedom of speech" please remember this is a privately owned discussion board which was created and is maintained to serve the purpose of promoting Islam. What is allowed in speech is determined by the Admin and not the member...

There are other forums where this type of prohibited behaviour is tolerated or even encouraged. If you can not follow these guidelines while on this forum we ask that you post elsewhere.

If somebody comes on here claiming it is acceptable to interpret the Qur'an based on whims and desires, then describes everyone who disagrees as 'fanatics' and 'fascists', not only have they no idea how to have a discussion but also their views are not worth wasting time on. The very beginning of the Qur'an highlights its purpose as a book of guidance. If you believe your own intellect is superior then please go back and read what Allaah (swt) has said and humble yourself to His words. It was clear from your former stay on this forum that you held some blasphemous views about the Qur'an, hence this is a case where censorship is necessary and why the rules do not allow complete freedom of speech.

Kindly delete my profile from this corrupt site....

As you wish. May Allaah (swt) guide you.

Jazakallaahu khayran for some of the comments in this thread, they are much appreciated. For any further suggestions regarding the site, it would be best to create a dedicated thread as this one is not deserving of that discussion.

I'd just like to clarify something before closing:

format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa

Mods are not allowed to use their power to ensure they get the last word in a debate.

Having the 'last word' is not always something negative. Perhaps it depends on what kind of 'debate' is going on. Quite often a thread goes on page after page with every opinion under the sun, and usually by people who have very little knowledge and should not be posting in that topic. Or one view has been expressed without due consideration of the other. Or the opinions that have been mentioned are so clearly in error that they promote shirk or go against mainstream Islam/consensus of Muslim scholars. In these sorts of threads, I think it is very prudent that someone ends the discussion on a point of clarification, otherwise it can be quite harmful. Yes, there may also be times when a moderator was not justified in such an action and we are not error-free. But let us not paint all such closures with the same brush. And it should also be noted that there are occasions when moderators avoid closing threads for this very reason and even check with other moderators to decide what is the best course of action.

If there are any further points or suggestions, they can be made in a new thread Insha'Allaah.

Wassalaamu Alaykum.