A Marriage Section for IB

**Umm Abed** · 05-12-2016

I was thinking of having another addition to the forum where we could have a specific Marriage Section where all marriage related stuff can be posted in.

Right now they are all over the place and it would be a great idea if this could be implemented.

Please if mods could think about adding it that would be great.

**Bhabha** · 05-13-2016

So why not have requirements to join that forum anyhow? Like requirements to join the sisters and brother section? Depending on your behaviour and so on ?

**Arfa** · 05-14-2016

A worthy suggestion!there should be one here.

**MuslimInshallah** · 05-14-2016

Assalaamu alaikum,

(sigh) The idea that it is "easy" to look for a good spouse through the masaajid or Islamic centres is just not true. Nor is it necessarily particularly safe. And finding a real wali is quasi impossible. Yes, your local imam (or random Muslim man) can sign you away to a stranger, but that is not the function of a wali. A wali is supposed to protect a woman and investigate potential suitors, and help draw up a proper Nikkah. And this is just not done, at least in my country. No one has the time.

Islamic marriage sites on the internet (even the ones touted as being more reliable), are frankly dangerous and degrading places to look for a spouse. I have not had much in the way of feedback from men, but the stories I have heard from women (and things I have observed myself)... are truly shocking.

I don't know what the best solutions are. But, it seems to me, that knowing something of a person's character is an absolute necessity. The question is: how can you get to know a person's character? It seems to me that a good way is to observe his or her behaviour, over time, and with different people/circumstances. The thing that differentiates the Muslim marriage sites from a discussion board such as IB, is that on IB you can see some of a person's character. (mildly) of course, a person can feign being a good person. But this is true offline as well as on. And I find indeed, that people tend to be less guarded about their true characters online. (smile) At least for now; I suspect this will change with time, as we get accustomed to this technology.

I don't think that throwing open the doors for IB to be a matchmaking service would be a good idea. I think that this would distort and dilute the community. But I wonder whether, as in the case for the Brothers and Sisters section, there might not be an opportunity for stable and participating members, who have a history of thoughtful posts, to let it be known that they are available for marriage, and to investigate other members who might be available. And this could be moderated, like other Forums. (pensively) It would be even more useful if people's identities could be verified, and some basic security checks made. And this, I think, would cost. So that paying a fee for this service would also be something reasonable.

(smile) And if someone liked another enough to consider marriage with them, after seeing how they behave over time, and after inquiring in more depth about their particular situations... and all this before ever seeing pictures of the other... wouldn't this actually fulfil the requirements set forth in the fatwa @ibn-Adam posted? And if there was input and help drawing up a Nikkah and screening of potential spouses by a third party... would't this also help with the problem of the dearth of walis, and the mistreatment of vulnerable people?

May Allah, the Guide to the Right Path, Help those who would like to marry to find decent and safe ways to find spouses.

**s.ali123** · 05-14-2016

Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah

Assalaamu alaikum,

(sigh) The idea that it is "easy" to look for a good spouse through the masaajid or Islamic centres is just not true. Nor is it necessarily particularly safe. And finding a real wali is quasi impossible. Yes, your local imam (or random Muslim man) can sign you away to a stranger, but that is not the function of a wali. A wali is supposed to protect a woman and investigate potential suitors, and help draw up a proper Nikkah. And this is just not done, at least in my country. No one has the time.

Islamic marriage sites on the internet (even the ones touted as being more reliable), are frankly dangerous and degrading places to look for a spouse. I have not had much in the way of feedback from men, but the stories I have heard from women (and things I have observed myself)... are truly shocking.

I don't know what the best solutions are. But, it seems to me, that knowing something of a person's character is an absolute necessity. The question is: how can you get to know a person's character? It seems to me that a good way is to observe his or her behaviour, over time, and with different people/circumstances. The thing that differentiates the Muslim marriage sites from a discussion board such as IB, is that on IB you can see some of a person's character. (mildly) of course, a person can feign being a good person. But this is true offline as well as on. And I find indeed, that people tend to be less guarded about their true characters online. (smile) At least for now; I suspect this will change with time, as we get accustomed to this technology.

I don't think that throwing open the doors for IB to be a matchmaking service would be a good idea. I think that this would distort and dilute the community. But I wonder whether, as in the case for the Brothers and Sisters section, there might not be an opportunity for stable and participating members, who have a history of thoughtful posts, to let it be known that they are available for marriage, and to investigate other members who might be available. And this could be moderated, like other Forums. (pensively) It would be even more useful if people's identities could be verified, and some basic security checks made. And this, I think, would cost. So that paying a fee for this service would also be something reasonable.

(smile) And if someone liked another enough to consider marriage with them, after seeing how they behave over time, and after inquiring in more depth about their particular situations... and all this before ever seeing pictures of the other... wouldn't this actually fulfil the requirements set forth in the fatwa @ibn-Adam posted? And if there was input and help drawing up a Nikkah and screening of potential spouses by a third party... would't this also help with the problem of the dearth of walis, and the mistreatment of vulnerable people?

May Allah, the Guide to the Right Path, Help those who would like to marry to find decent and safe ways to find spouses.

Lol I got mix understanding from this post of yours. So you are in favor or against the idea of having such service on IB?

**MuslimInshallah** · 05-14-2016

Assalaamu alaikum,

(smile) I am in favour, but with limits.

Jazakumullah khairan.

**ardianto** · 05-14-2016

Assalamualaikum.

In one thread I've ever told my story when I was scolded by mother because I proposed marriage to a girl while I haven't ready to get married. Indeed, one nature of the boys is, take action first, thinking later. And this is what make me worry if we have matrimonial section for members who are looking for spouses.

I am worry, there are young brothers who register, but actually haven't ready to get married. If there's no sister who interested to this brother, no problem. But how if a sister accept this brother, but then his family prevent him to get married because he is still study and haven't had a job?.

So, if admin decide to make section like this, admin must examine the member readyness to get married. Request him (or her) to show ID card, show the proof that he is already has a job, check the adress through phone to his home, etc.

**sister herb** · 05-14-2016

Originally Posted by ardianto

So, if admin decide to make section like this, admin must examine the member readyness to get married. Request him (or her) to show ID card, show the proof that he is already has a job, check the adress through phone to his home, etc.

Call to his parents to make sure that they are aware what he is doing or is he just a playing kid...? I think this would to be full time job for admin.

Are we ready to pay to him a decent salary too?

**MuslimInshallah** · 05-15-2016

Originally Posted by ardianto

So, if admin decide to make section like this, admin must examine the member readyness to get married. Request him (or her) to show ID card, show the proof that he is already has a job, check the adress through phone to his home, etc.

Originally Posted by sister herb

Call to his parents to make sure that they are aware what he is doing or is he just a playing kid...? I think this would to be full time job for admin.

Are we ready to pay to him a decent salary too?

Assalaamu alaikum,

(smile) Yes, this is exactly what I believe is needed. Right now, the so-called Islamic Marriage sites have no such checks. People just "meet". And no one has any idea who the other really is, or whether anything they say is true (and this is particularly problematic when people are from different countries). Furthermore, how is it possible to get a good feel for a person's true personality, if there is no context to see him/her in?

And yes, I think this should be a paid job. Because to do a more thorough check would take time. Frankly, I would suggest not just seeing someone's ID over Skype (very easy to fake), but requesting and verifying notarized documents that would be accepted by immigration authorities for identity, health, finances, education. Having a non-emotionally involved person to do these things would really help.

(smile) And yes, I have checked out 4 "Islamic Marriage" sites myself, including 2 that I saw recommended on IB (PureMatrimony and HalfOurDeen). And I have spoken with various people about their experiences, or the experiences of people they know. The reality is that people feel obliged to turn to the internet to find spouses, because they can't find them in any other way. And they can end up having some really bad experiences, and can get into some really bad situations. And even if they are able to avoid the worst scenarios and find a good spouse, they will have likely been exposed to non-halal things along the way.

Honestly, I wonder if it is not a fard kifaya for the ummah to try to find ways to facilitate safe, halal ways to find spouses via the internet (because the traditional routes do not work in some contexts). And right now, I know of no such way.

IB has certain advantages that marriage sites do not:1) if the members had to be long-term posters before offering themselves to the marriage section, then this would give a prospective spouse an opportunity to see how he/she behaves, what he/she believes in, with a variety of different people, in a variety of different situations. 2) There are a pool of people on the Board from different countries. These people understand local conditions better than any foreigner could, and could help advise those seeking marriage overseas. 3) Over time, people on IB tend to connect with others in their locality (smile. I've noticed this is especially true of people in the UK!). These connections could help verify other members who are seeking marriage. 4) IB is already quite well known, and pops up on search engines fairly easily. It already has a structure, a reputation and does not need much in the way of start-up and advertising costs.

Having a marriage section could also help IB, I believe. 1) It would increase the traffic, yes, but 2) it would likely also increase serious posting, because that would be one of the requirements for the marriage section. 3) I suspect it would also decrease foolish and troll-like posts. Because even if the person was not looking for a spouse in the present... who knows what might be in the future? And as posts are rather indelible, a future prospective spouse might check for a person's old posts... 4) Adding a marriage section would be consonant with the idea of building an online community. 5) With the increased traffic, advertising revenues might be more interesting. Furthermore, if people were willing to pay for access to various services (fee to join the marriage section, identity and other verifications, Nikkah negotiations facilitator...)- and I believe they would be- IB could offer better, smoother service with paid people who could become proficient in their tasks. 6) Finally, providing this service could be a good for the ummah. (smile) And a form of worship.

(smile) Or so it seems to me.

May Allah Reward you all, my brothers and sisters in Islam, for taking the time to consider these ideas, whether you agree with them or not.

**Sakina'141** · 05-15-2016

NO, I personally think its a very bad idea. It will lead to a lot of nonsense...lots of unnecessary talks, trolls and annoy many. In my humble opinion, this shouldn't turn into a matrimonial site either...there are plenty out there already (can try PureMatrimony - for practising muslims says the slogan!).

**'Abd-al Latif** · 05-15-2016

Erm.

No.

**Sakina'141** · 05-15-2016

Originally Posted by MuslimInshallah

Assalaamu alaikum,

(smile) Yes, this is exactly what I believe is needed. Right now, the so-called Islamic Marriage sites have no such checks. People just "meet". And no one has any idea who the other really is, or whether anything they say is true (and this is particularly problematic when people are from different countries). Furthermore, how is it possible to get a good feel for a person's true personality, if there is no context to see him/her in?

And yes, I think this should be a paid job. Because to do a more thorough check would take time. Frankly, I would suggest not just seeing someone's ID over Skype (very easy to fake), but requesting and verifying notarized documents that would be accepted by immigration authorities for identity, health, finances, education. Having a non-emotionally involved person to do these things would really help.

(smile) And yes, I have checked out 4 "Islamic Marriage" sites myself, including 2 that I saw recommended on IB (PureMatrimony and HalfOurDeen). And I have spoken with various people about their experiences, or the experiences of people they know. The reality is that people feel obliged to turn to the internet to find spouses, because they can't find them in any other way. And they can end up having some really bad experiences, and can get into some really bad situations. And even if they are able to avoid the worst scenarios and find a good spouse, they will have likely been exposed to non-halal things along the way.

Honestly, I wonder if it is not a fard kifaya for the ummah to try to find ways to facilitate safe, halal ways to find spouses via the internet (because the traditional routes do not work in some contexts). And right now, I know of no such way.

IB has certain advantages that marriage sites do not:1) if the members had to be long-term posters before offering themselves to the marriage section, then this would give a prospective spouse an opportunity to see how he/she behaves, what he/she believes in, with a variety of different people, in a variety of different situations. 2) There are a pool of people on the Board from different countries. These people understand local conditions better than any foreigner could, and could help advise those seeking marriage overseas. 3) Over time, people on IB tend to connect with others in their locality (smile. I've noticed this is especially true of people in the UK!). These connections could help verify other members who are seeking marriage. 4) IB is already quite well known, and pops up on search engines fairly easily. It already has a structure, a reputation and does not need much in the way of start-up and advertising costs.

Having a marriage section could also help IB, I believe. 1) It would increase the traffic, yes, but 2) it would likely also increase serious posting, because that would be one of the requirements for the marriage section. 3) I suspect it would also decrease foolish and troll-like posts. Because even if the person was not looking for a spouse in the present... who knows what might be in the future? And as posts are rather indelible, a future prospective spouse might check for a person's old posts... 4) Adding a marriage section would be consonant with the idea of building an online community. 5) With the increased traffic, advertising revenues might be more interesting. Furthermore, if people were willing to pay for access to various services (fee to join the marriage section, identity and other verifications, Nikkah negotiations facilitator...)- and I believe they would be- IB could offer better, smoother service with paid people who could become proficient in their tasks. 6) Finally, providing this service could be a good for the ummah. (smile) And a form of worship.

(smile) Or so it seems to me.

May Allah Reward you all, my brothers and sisters in Islam, for taking the time to consider these ideas, whether you agree with them or not.

You do have some good points but its not an easy thing to start and moderate over time. Also will require some dedication from various members of position.

**muslimah_B** · 05-15-2016

it Could potentially be a very good idea or turn out horrendous into a free mixing fest where inappropriate conversations take place.. which does happen... but if its moderated properly then it could be a good thing in sha Allah

i agree showing i.d and other forms of identification, and maybe a call over Skype from the same gender to confirm they are infact a brother/sister and are serious about marriage. then after that they could fill out a form describing what they are looking for in a spouse, their interests etc and then once the 2 potentials are found and would like to talk, maybe a new layout where you cannot click on the persons name to private message, its left annoynomous and ofcouse a 3rd person during the whole conversation.... it would require a lot of moderators but you could make it by an appointment system where there are times available for people to choose to speak to the potential ?

just throwing ideas out there lol