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Western perception of niqaab

  1. #1
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    Western perception of niqaab (OP)


    I came across this newspaper column about how niqaab may be perceived by Westeners. (It is an opinion piece, so it really doesn't do any more than reflect the authors opinion)

    I know that this kind of topic quickly leads to strong reaction - but I hope this article won't!
    Personally, I think it raises some interesting points.

    I would like to ask if you can understand concerns and even 'fears' from Westerners about niqaab (as outlined in the article), and what you think about the notion of adjusting to Western cultural values?

    Funny to return from Lebanon, Syria and Turkey - where women go unveiled - and return to Britain, the land of the full hijab. I see more women with their faces covered in Tower Hamlets than I did in Damascus.

    I used to think that covering the whole face except for the eyes was the normal Islamic custom (in a week in Afghanistan I hardly saw a woman's face) and so was surprised to find that even in Syria, the most culturally conservative of the Middle Eastern countries I've just visited, not a tenth of the women seem to cover their faces. Most (by no means all) cover their heads, but you don't get that closed, turning-away feeling you sense along the Whitechapel Road in the East End of London. In the Damascus streets, women in all-women groups, and women with men, chat and laugh; and I saw to be true (what some Muslims have already told me) that the full hijab cannot be considered a religious duty, but is simply a cultural feature of some societies that are Muslim, but not others.

    If so, how far should we tolerate it? Spitting is a cultural feature in China but we discourage it here. In Syria I took my shoes off to enter mosques, though that is not in my culture; and wouldn't have worn clothing like skimpy shorts or vests, or drunk alcohol in the streets: practices offensive not to me but to the mainstream culture where I was.

    Knowingly to disturb people's feelings is to be offensive. In Western European society, to go out in public with your face masked is (unless done for comic effect) disturbing. Hiding the face is felt to be threatening, and slightly scary, and subliminally this goes way back, and quite deep I think: it certainly frightens children.

    Would it be wrong to try to convey to communities in Britain who adopt the full hijab that, though it is a woman's legal right to dress as she chooses, she should recognise that she's in a country where many people will find a masked face disturbing, and that (without meaning to) she is acting in a culturally inappropriate manner, which may offend? Do the masked women I see in the street in Whitechapel actually know this? I cannot say, because I've never spoken to them: or, rather, when I do, they look away and walk away.

    This too, in Britain, is rude. Do they know? Shouldn't they?
    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/com...cle6374844.ece

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    Western perception of niqaab

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    glocandle ani 1 - Western perception of niqaab

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  2. #141
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    Report bad ads?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Light of Heaven View Post
    Yea im not really trying to keep up u know....O.O
    Ok

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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    I know, but should they decide to check it - bad luck for the niqaabis.
    Of course, no bank would make any fuss over it, but they should be protected in case they do.
    No they shopuldnt - taking Riba(interest) saves the bank right - But as you said its not gonna happen so bad luck.
    Western perception of niqaab

    Do you think the pious don't sin?

    They merely:
    Veiled themselves and didn't flaunt it
    Sought forgiveness and didn't persist
    Took ownership of it and don't justify it
    And acted with excellence after they had erred - Ibn al-Qayyim

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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Zafran View Post
    No they shopuldnt - taking Riba(interest) saves the bank right - But as you said its not gonna happen so bad luck.
    What does a niqaabi even do in a non-islamic bank?
    It's not and niqaab is not really an issue for me. Immigration is far more fatal and we can see how most countries are turning right on immigration, even where the governments are generally liberal.

  6. #144
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    What does a niqaabi even do in a non-islamic bank?
    It's not and niqaab is not really an issue for me. Immigration is far more fatal and we can see how most countries are turning right on immigration, even where the governments are generally liberal.
    Thats off topic anyway - your anti immigaration doesnt mean the countries are.
    Western perception of niqaab

    Do you think the pious don't sin?

    They merely:
    Veiled themselves and didn't flaunt it
    Sought forgiveness and didn't persist
    Took ownership of it and don't justify it
    And acted with excellence after they had erred - Ibn al-Qayyim

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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    What does a niqaabi even do in a non-islamic bank?
    thats like asking whats a agnostic Islamaphobe doing on a muslim forum? Non of your business.
    Western perception of niqaab

    Do you think the pious don't sin?

    They merely:
    Veiled themselves and didn't flaunt it
    Sought forgiveness and didn't persist
    Took ownership of it and don't justify it
    And acted with excellence after they had erred - Ibn al-Qayyim

  9. #146
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Zafran View Post
    Thats off topic anyway - your anti immigaration doesnt mean the countries are.
    But they are.

  10. #147
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by zafran View Post
    thats like asking whats a agnostic islamaphobe doing on a muslim forum? Non of your business.
    haha

  11. #148
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    But they are.
    No they not its you and matthews opnion
    Western perception of niqaab

    Do you think the pious don't sin?

    They merely:
    Veiled themselves and didn't flaunt it
    Sought forgiveness and didn't persist
    Took ownership of it and don't justify it
    And acted with excellence after they had erred - Ibn al-Qayyim

  12. #149
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Zafran View Post
    No they not its you and matthews opnion
    Nope.
    And Matthew doesn't even mention immigration, does he?

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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    Would it be wrong to try to convey to communities in Britain who adopt the full hijab that, though it is a woman's legal right to dress as she chooses, she should recognise that she's in a country where many people will find a masked face disturbing, and that (without meaning to) she is acting in a culturally inappropriate manner, which may offend? Do the masked women I see in the street in Whitechapel actually know this? I cannot say, because I've never spoken to them: or, rather, when I do, they look away and walk away.
    that's the crux of the whole issue and IMHO the answer is no, it wouldn't.

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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    At least we're getting closer to the millionth post..

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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    Nope.
    And Matthew doesn't even mention immigration, does he?
    ah Mattew - forgets to write about Immigration yet draws the camrparsion of syria and the UK.
    Western perception of niqaab

    Do you think the pious don't sin?

    They merely:
    Veiled themselves and didn't flaunt it
    Sought forgiveness and didn't persist
    Took ownership of it and don't justify it
    And acted with excellence after they had erred - Ibn al-Qayyim

  17. #153
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Zafran View Post
    ah Mattew - forgets to write about Immigration yet draws the camrparsion of syria and the UK.
    Bad Matthew.

  18. #154
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    Bad Matthew.
    Yes bad bad Matthew - anyway I'm off.

    peace
    Western perception of niqaab

    Do you think the pious don't sin?

    They merely:
    Veiled themselves and didn't flaunt it
    Sought forgiveness and didn't persist
    Took ownership of it and don't justify it
    And acted with excellence after they had erred - Ibn al-Qayyim

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  20. #155
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Zafran View Post
    Yes bad bad Matthew - anyway I'm off.

    peace
    Me too, it was fun!

  21. #156
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    What have you guys done with this thread??!
    Pages and pages on meaningless ramble in one night ... go to bed!
    Western perception of niqaab

    Peace
    glocandle ani 1 - Western perception of niqaab

    Here I stand.
    I can do no other.
    May God help me.
    Amen.

    Come, let us worship and bow down •
    and kneel before the Lord our Maker

    [Psalm 95]


  22. #157
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    I know, but should they decide to check it - bad luck for the niqaabis.
    Of course, no bank would make any fuss over it, but they should be protected in case they do.
    ive had my face checked in the bank before for valid purposes and why is it bad luck or even a big deal? the airports always check faces too and again how is it bad luck? the niqab isnt worn to be difficult and i dont know of any niqabi who for identification purposes would kick up a fuss.
    and just so you know- you can have your interest cancelled in non islamic banks and banks like lyods have shariah accounts

    format_quote Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint View Post
    You cannot and converts are not an issue as they don't make a difference.
    so whats the issue?

  23. #158
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    Re: Western perception of niqaab

    Somewhere in this jumbled mess the original topic must have been covered.

    :
    Western perception of niqaab

    Herman 1 - Western perception of niqaab



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