NAKED aiport body scanners

format_quote Originally Posted by Billal-A

Assalaamu alaykum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakaatuhu,

Let me just add one thing for our muslimahs - may Allaah assist you all as time and time again the kuffaar are trying to make you show your zeenah to the masses, to be like their women who show not an ounce of hayaa hence no need for them to even be scanned! May Allaah cover you with the modesty of hijaab and niqaab and make you among the precious preserved pearls of Allaah both in this life and in the hereafter. Ameen.

Now more than ever, we see that we Muslims need to make a stance to stand up against those crazed sexually perverted legislators that call upon stripping the honour of our awrah for the sake of some self inflicted security control issues they themselves could easily have plotted! May Allaah disperse their plans like Qaaroon and Abrahah, may the earth eat up their rotten bodies and rotten ideas ameen ya Rabb.

It is, like the social cohesion issue, like the ongoing onslaught against the hijaab, abaya and niqaab, a time for sisters to remain firm upon their deen and the sunnatil ummahaatul mu'mineen. We need to remain steadfast upon the beautiful advice given by Allaah, Lord of the worlds to both our brothers and our sisters. Remain in hijaab, remain in niqaab, remain guarded from leeches wanting to stare at the forbidden beauty Islam has protected. Remain respectable to Allaah and Allaah will preserve your honour.

And oh you Sisters that take this lightly, guard your chastity and pray that Allaah make you among the dwellers of Al-Firdaws, for Allaahs messenger sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam advised us that the woman who reveals her body shape shall not even smell the fragrance of Jannah though its fragrance reaches far distances. Remember the shar'i rulings as regarding your dress, your look, your actions and fear Allaah wheresoever you are. The woman who reveals a hair to one forbidden to see it, shall be hung from that string of hair, the one who shapes the eyebrows is cursed, the one who is dressed but naked is rebuked and only the righteous woman who fears Allaah and knows that it incurs the wrath of Allaah is on the correct Path!

I say as, our mother A'isha radhiallahu anha said. May Allaah bless the women, when Allaah revealed the aayah for covering they all came out looking like black crows. Ameen.

instead of taking such a negitive stance against the machine why not take a negitive stance against WHY these devises were implemented. if people spent more time protesting the men who do bad things and say they are in the name of god (regardless of relgion) then we would not have to impliment all these procautions.

all this energy is being spent protesting the wrong issue(s). stop the wrong-doers. instead of silence show the world a voice of out-raged muslims. not at the extra steps that have to be taken for safety but at those who commit wrongs in the name of god. the masses are scared not only at the wrong-doers but at the silence of our mass.

format_quote Originally Posted by Grofica

instead of taking such a negitive stance against the machine why not take a negitive stance against WHY these devises were implemented. if people spent more time protesting the men who do bad things and say they are in the name of god (regardless of relgion) then we would not have to impliment all these procautions.

all this energy is being spent protesting the wrong issue(s). stop the wrong-doers. instead of silence show the world a voice of out-raged muslims. not at the extra steps that have to be taken for safety but at those who commit wrongs in the name of god. the masses are scared not only at the wrong-doers but at the silence of our mass.

SubhaanAllaah sis, why the ultra double negative bladed response?

Its amazing to see you would compromise any sense of your awrah and your deen with regards to the current so called "security threat" but to be honest you've pulled the trigger, russian roulette style on yourself. The problem is there is extremism amongst Muslims. By simply creating yet another issue for Muslims, removal of privacy, we are not tackling terrorism, we are simply breeding it. The main cause for such problems with Muslims is because of American Appartheid policies that support Israel against Palestine, UK against Afghans, US against Iraaqis. Stripping our women will only prove ever more that US is against Islamic principles! But where is your voice there? Are you speaking out against that too or just against your fellow Muslims who are disgusted with the attempts made to publicise their women? Can you not even say ameen to a dua which is calling upon Allaah to restore shariah? Do you feel that Islamic code of dress is not the greatest emancipation of the female population? I certainly do and there are many millions of Muslims who wont shy from proclaiming this.

If you consider the removal of shari'ah to be negative, then go ahead strip yourself for the Non-Muslim, what if next week the US claims that the Qur'an is the reason behind these attacks and reading it is a criminal offence, will you throw it away? Praying is something seen as extreme so leave it? Being Muslim is the cause so leave it? Sheltering legislation of this nature will only wash down any understanding of the real problem: the US GOVT. (Currently no.1 terrorist to date! Please refer to Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine for further information)

We simply will not and shall not ever stand side by side with a policy that contravenes our right to privacy, constantly undermines our ummah and consistently is at war with innocents while trying to catch the supposedly guilty al-Qaeda forces. A government, highly questioned at all levels, to the legitimacy of its claims on 9/11, a government always blaming rogue agents for plots of innocent killings but then throws bombs on women and children, claims WMD's but takes the lives of millions for black oil. Does this remind you of a just nation or one of the biggest untried war criminals in existence.

I say again. To all my sisters, DO NOT let the kuffaar strip you, DO NOT disobey Allaah almighty for the sake of men and women who are clearly opposed to what you believe in. Remember the woman, who the Jew removed her garment and she became exposed, she cried "Yaa Mu'tasim" and when Mu'tasim heard, he said 100,000 troops to exact the revenge for the oppression done against her. Fear not the disbelievers but fear Allaah and surely Allaah is with the righteous. Whatever he has written for is better if we are but patient. Do not let apologetic Muslims confuse you about your duty to Allaah and remain steadfast upon al-Qawl as-Sadeed.

I make another dua for you sister as well as all the ummah, that Allaah makes you among the upright ones that call for truth, ones that are haafidh upon their chastity and those who are in the highest levels of Jannah ameen.

"Never will the Jews nor the Christians be pleased with you (O Muhammad Peace be upon him ) till you follow their religion. Say: "Verily, the Guidance of Allâh that is the (only) Guidance. And if you were to follow their desires after what you have received of Knowledge, then you would have against Allâh neither any Walî (protector or guardian) nor any helper. " Surah al-Baqarah: 120)

"It is not for a believing man or a believing woman, when Allaah and His Messenger have decided a matter, that they should [thereafter] have any choice about their affair. And whoever disobeys Allaah and His Messenger has certainly strayed into clear error." (Surah al-Ahzaab: 36)

format_quote Originally Posted by Billal-A

SubhaanAllaah sis, why the ultra double negative bladed response?

its not an ultra double negative bladed response. everyone is complaining about the rain and wont open the umbrella to be dry. what i am saying is if you want NOT to go through the machine and you want NOT to be looked at in a negotive connotation then stop being silent about the people who are wrong for doing what their doing.

my family is of mexican decent, you dont think i get racial profiled for that too?!?!?! i get it everywhere. oulled over for brown while driving, followed in stores because they dont believe mexicans can pay for things, people think i jumped the boarder, people think i speak spanish what like every person who has hispanic blood just comes out speaking spanish or something. except i dont know what it is people everywhere think i am from somehwere close i have been called lebineese (spelling?) italian, bosnian, mexican, portarican, spanish, emeratie, iraqi, you name it i have been called it.

for a million different things. a million bad things happen to a million different people but instead of complaining about the bad thing people bond together and ferret out the wrong doers...

Stripping our women will only prove ever more that US is against Islamic principles!

Islamic principles and Christian princibles are not really that different... but no one knows that because no one hears what islam is about. when i read the koran i found out how wonderful it was but do you expect everyone is going to be so curious?

But where is your voice there?

Im not outraged. its not a perfect system but they are trying their best.

Do you feel that Islamic code of dress is not the greatest emancipation of the female population? I certainly do and there are many millions of Muslims who wont shy from proclaiming this.

I am not saying there is anything wrong with it. and am not flashing or showy with my clothes but i do wear jeans.

If you consider the removal of shari'ah to be negative, then go ahead strip yourself for the Non-Muslim

so because i am in agreement to be as safe as possibe in a crazy world and crazy time i am basically a heratic is what your saying? a blue non-identifiable picture is not striping for the masses. its a simple safety procaussion. should there be anarchy?

what if next week the US claims that the Qur'an is the reason behind these attacks and reading it is a criminal offence, will you throw it away?

its always the music that does it not the books.

Praying is something seen as extreme so leave it?

christains pray. you think this is an assult on you but its not.

I make another dua for you sister as well as all the ummah, that Allaah makes you among the upright ones that call for truth, ones that are haafidh upon their chastity and those who are in the highest levels of Jannah ameen.

and Allah also sees whats in our hearts.

From the article Gossamer skye linked:

"As the passenger stands in the scanner, the naked image of the passenger is transmitted to a sole, remote operator who is stationed in another part of the airport and will not see the face of the person inside the scanning machine.

The operator will then mark any objects present on the passenger and send a schematic diagram of the person's profile to the officers operating the scanner for further examination"

I think it would also be possible to have two remote operators, one male and one female and a system of sending images to the correct one based on gender. That should rule out most of the concerns, no?

format_quote Originally Posted by Billal-A

SubhaanAllaah sis, why the ultra double negative bladed response?

Its amazing to see you would compromise any sense of your awrah and your deen with regards to the current so called "security threat" but to be honest you've pulled the trigger, russian roulette style on yourself.

How exactly is she compromising her deen? Its not a so called "security threat", there are no inverted comma's about it, haven't you noticed that there have been quite a few attempts on aircraft over the last few months?
One person searching for a bomb or a weapon on an almost anonymous airport scanner does not constitute a removal of privacy.
You are saying protect your awra but don't worry about bombs. Does your life come first or awra?

format_quote Originally Posted by Billal-A

The main cause for such problems with Muslims is because of American Appartheid policies that support Israel against Palestine, UK against Afghans, US against Iraaqis.

This is true but doesn't change the current situation. Shall we put our lives on hold until there are no threats anywhere?

format_quote Originally Posted by Billal-A

Stripping our women will only prove ever more that US is against Islamic principles! But where is your voice there? Are you speaking out against that too or just against your fellow Muslims who are disgusted with the attempts made to publicise their women? Can you not even say ameen to a dua which is calling upon Allaah to restore shariah? Do you feel that Islamic code of dress is not the greatest emancipation of the female population? I certainly do and there are many millions of Muslims who wont shy from proclaiming this.

This is overkill in the extreme. Look at the words you're using "stripping your women", "attempts to publicise their women". Obviously you're thinking of the airport scanner which forcefully restrains the woman, takes a full colour hd picture, and then uploads it to the Internet.

format_quote Originally Posted by Billal-A

If you consider the removal of shari'ah to be negative, then go ahead strip yourself for the Non-Muslim, what if next week the US claims that the Qur'an is the reason behind these attacks and reading it is a criminal offence, will you throw it away? Praying is something seen as extreme so leave it? Being Muslim is the cause so leave it?

We are given the intellect to work out which claims are correct (have proof), and which are incorrect (have no proof).

People trying to smuggle bombs on board aircraft - Lots of evidence, it happens in all countries, and many have been successful. Scanning a person seems a reasonable means by which to detect for such material. If you have a better method then please share!

The Quran being the reason behind the attacks - No evidence.

See the difference?

format_quote Originally Posted by Billal-A

We simply will not and shall not ever stand side by side with a policy that contravenes our right to privacy, constantly undermines our ummah and consistently is at war with innocents while trying to catch the supposedly guilty al-Qaeda forces. A government, highly questioned at all levels, to the legitimacy of its claims on 9/11, a government always blaming rogue agents for plots of innocent killings but then throws bombs on women and children, claims WMD's but takes the lives of millions for black oil. Does this remind you of a just nation or one of the biggest untried war criminals in existence.

We are discussing air safety. America's downfalls can be for another thread

It might be worth finding a scholars opinion since a lot of strong feeings flying around now

format_quote Originally Posted by Muslim Woman

no

What if there is no female operators at that time ? Flight won't wait for female passengers ; so they will be forced to go through the process operated by men. Also not even women should watch other naked women .

So, what is the answer to the fear of terrorism in the underwear?

format_quote Originally Posted by PersiaBeFree

So, what is the answer to the fear of terrorism in the underwear?

so what is the answer to the fear of terrorism inside an orfice?

optical fiber camera up your backside?

Assalaamu 'alaykum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakaatuhu,

I thought that maybe our sisters would have some sort of brainstorm over the ideals that are being pushed after my response but it seems like yet again we have missed the point. The point isnt personal to start with, I am not assuming that Grofica, you are in any way a bad person or someone against hijaab or of the sort nor do I say that you are someone washing their principles, but what I am re-asserting is that there are things that will always exist in our society because of actions the US, UK, Israel is responsible for. If your stating that it is an "everyone complains about the rain and wont open the umbrella to dry" issue then even more so in your case.

The reason I say this is because as I have mentioned earlier, the problem is foreign policy, Muslims are not attacking planes and civilian posts because they just simply want to remove non-Muslims from the earth but because they hate the US govt and what it represents. They hate the fact that the US has orphaned Iraq, stole its assets and claimed to seek WMD's from a man now six feet under with no recovery of these weapons. Without a doubt the biggest lie of this decade-past is the claim that Saddaam had WMD's and could set them off in 45 minutes, this was the whole basis for the war in Iraq! Why cant we Muslims be outspoken for the many innocents who have been killed unjustly in this case? Why are people who march against the US oppressors labelled fanatics or extremist Muslims?

The answer is simple, ever since 9/11, the Muslims have split into two factions; one that tries to be apologetic and appeasing to the Non-Muslims, condemns all acts of Jihaad as "violent extremism" and is "allied with the west against the scourge of terrorism" but at the same time does not speak up against the evil atrocities the US and Israel are responsible for; the other sticking to what is in the Book and the Sunnah and not allowing any sense of allegiance with kuffaar especially ones with a track record like the US. One man does a crime, the entire populus has to be stripped? There is no logic behind this. Systematically over time the West has been deconstructing all of its democratic values but claims to be a model of democracy. Freedom of speech, freedom of religion, right to privacy, right to fair trial, all seem clouded and non-existent. I mean, sister please, we cant align with a government that places our people into orange jumpsuits and makes them bow in cages in Cuba to avoid International law breaches. They dont give trials, they torture, they force confessions how much more do they need to do before we make a real stance against that!?

Unfortunately for us, all we have to see is our fellow Muslims arguing with one another over this issue, when the blood of our ummah is more honourable than all of this! There is no disobedience to Allaah for the sake of creation and we should not allow legislation like this which is unislamic, once it is introduced and we are forced, then matters take a different direction but for now we speak against this infringement upon our rights! We fight against falsehood in all its paths, be it extremism, killing of innocents, unlawful acts in the Name of Islam, and this issue also. We cannot wash down any of our principles for the sake of a threat that is too untangible to ever detect. The worrying thing is, where do we go from here? Should we have cameras in our homes which are viewed by the government too? That would be a safety precaution! Should we remove ayahs about Jihaad? That would be a safety precaution! The list is endless.

I pray yet again, that Allaah makes us like Ibraaheem alayhis salaam, who did not remove his tawheed to please his community, to be like Nuh alayhis salaam, who gave up his son to the evil his son was upon for opposing Allaah, we be like Moosa alayhis salaam against the Fir'awns of our era, and that we are among those who sacrifice everything they have for the Sake of Allaah's pleasure ameen.

"Do you think that you will be left [as you are] while Allaah has not yet made evident those among you who strive [for His cause] and do not take other than Allaah, His Messenger and the believers as intimates? And Allaah is Acquainted with what you do." (Surah at-Tawbah:16)

"Say, [O Muhammad], "If your fathers, your sons, your brothers, your wives, your relatives, wealth which you have obtained commerce wherein you fear decline, and dwellings with which you are pleased are more beloved to you than Allaah and His
Messenger and jihaad [i.e., striving] in His cause, then wait until Allaah executes His command. And Allaah does not guide the defiantly disobedient people." (Surah at-Tawbah: 24)

[/QUOTE]It might be worth finding a scholars opinion since a lot of strong feeings flying around now [/QUOTE]

"I know that haraam things may be permissible if it becomes necessary to do them. Are there conditions governing this ruling so that it may be applied correctly?."

Praise be to Allaah.

Among the basic principles of Islamic sharee’ah, on which the scholars are agreed, is that cases of necessity make forbidden things permissible.

There is a great deal of evidence to support this principle in the Holy Qur'aan and the Prophet's Sunnah, for example, the verses in which Allah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Forbidden to you (for food) are: Al‑Maitah (the dead animals — cattle — beast not slaughtered), blood, the flesh of swine, and that on which Allaah’s Name has not been mentioned while slaughtering (that which has been slaughtered as a sacrifice for others than Allaah, or has been slaughtered for idols) and that which has been killed by strangling, or by a violent blow, or by a headlong fall, or by the goring of horns — and that which has been (partly) eaten by a wild animal — unless you are able to slaughter it (before its death) ‑ and that which is sacrificed (slaughtered) on An‑Nusub (stone‑altars). (Forbidden) also is to use arrows seeking luck or decision; (all) that is Fisqun (disobedience of Allaah and sin). This day, those who disbelieved have given up all hope of your religion; so fear them not, but fear Me. This day, I have perfected your religion for you, completed My Favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion. But as for him who is forced by severe hunger, with no inclination to sin (such can eat these above mentioned meats), then surely, Allaah is Oft‑Forgiving, Most Merciful”

[al-Maa’idah 5:3]

“And why should you not eat of that (meat) on which Allaah’s Name has been pronounced (at the time of slaughtering the animal), while He has explained to you in detail what is forbidden to you, except under compulsion of necessity?”

[al-An’am 6:119]

Examples of this principle include the following:

1. Eating dead meat for one who cannot find anything else and fears that he will die of hunger.

2. Speaking words of kufr when subjected to torture and force.

3. Warding off an aggressor even if that leads to killing him.

See: al-Ashya’ wa’l-Nazaa’ir by Ibn Nujaym, p. 85

Necessity means cases in which a person will be harmed if he does not take the haraam option, in which the harm will effect the five essentials which are: religion, life, honour, reason and wealth.

With regard to the conditions of a haraam thing becoming permissible in the case of necessity, Shaykh Muhammad ibn ‘Uthaymeen (may Allah have mercy on him) mentioned two conditions for that and he explained them in abundant detail with examples, as well as mentioning some objections and the response to them. Hence we will limit ourselves to quoting his words. He (may Allah have mercy on him) said:

This principle is one of the basic fiqhi principles which are indicated by sharee’ah: Everything that is forbidden becomes permissible in the case of necessity.

So what is forbidden becomes permissible in the case of necessity, but there are two conditions.

The first condition:

We should be compelled to do this specific haraam thing, meaning that we cannot find anything with which to meet that necessity except this haraam thing. If we can find something else, then it does not become permissible, even though it could meet our necessity.

The second condition:

The necessity should be met by that haraam thing; if that is not the case, then it remains haraam. If we are not certain whether it will meet the necessity or not, then it also remains haraam. That is because doing something haraam is definitely wrong and meeting necessity by means of it is something concerning which there is doubt, so we should not transgress by doing that which is definitely haraam for the sake of something concerning which there is doubt.

Hence the ruling varies concerning a starving man who cannot find anything but dead meat. In this case we say, Eat the dead meat. If he says that this is committing a haraam action, we say that it has become permissible because of necessity, because you have nothing else to eat apart from this and because if you eat it you will meet that necessity.

It was said to a man: If you drink alcohol, you will be cured of sickness. In this case we say: It is not permissible for you to drink alcohol even if you are told that it will heal you from sickness. Why is that?

Firstly, because there is no certainty that he will be healed by it; he may drink it and not be healed of sickness. We see many sick people taking beneficial medicines that they do not benefit from.

Secondly, the sick person may recover without any treatment, by putting his trust in Allah and praying to Him, and by means of people’s prayer (du’aa’) for him and so on. This is from the point of view of reason.

From the point of view of evidence, it is narrated in a hadeeth from the Prophet (blessings and peace of Allah be upon him) that he said: “Allaah does not put your healing in that which He has forbidden to you.” The rationale behind this hadeeth is clear, because Allah only forbade it to us because it is harmful to us, so how can that which is haraam be a healing and a remedy?

Hence it is haraam to use haraam things as treatment, as the scholars have stated, and it cannot be said that this is a case of necessity, as some people think.

If someone were to say that a person is choking and he has nothing except a cup of wine, so is it permissible for him to drink this cup to stop him choking?

The answer is yes, because the two conditions are met in this case. He is compelled to use this exact thing and we are certain that the necessity will be met by it, so we would say: Drink the wine. But once the choking has stopped, he should stop drinking.

If someone were to say that a man found some meat that had been slaughtered in the halaal manner and some meat from an animal that had died a natural death, can he eat the dead meat because he is forced to do so by necessity?

The answer is that he cannot do that, because the necessity can be met by something else, so it is not permissible because the first condition is not met.

If a person were to say, I am thirsty and I have nothing but a cup of wine; can I drink it?

The answer is no, as the scholars said, because this is not a case of necessity; rather it will only make him more thirsty, so there is no benefit in transgressing and doing something haraam, because necessity will not be warded off by it and the second condition is not fulfilled.

If a person were to say: If a sick person has no choice but to drink blood as a remedy, is it permissible for him to do that? The answer is that it is not permissible for him to do that, because the two conditions are not met. End quote.

Sharh Manzoomah Usool al-Fiqh wa Qawaa’idihi (p. 59-61)

And Allah knows best.

Shaykh Muhammad Saalih al-Munajjid

format_quote Originally Posted by Muslim Woman

no

What if there is no female operators at that time ? Flight won't wait for female passengers ; so they will be forced to go through the process operated by men. Also not even women should watch other naked women .

ok but we have already seen the list of places they are putting them and i was told today that they have a few in the states already too... EVERY airport has female security gaurds and especially in the middle eastern countries because men can not inspect women. its not a matter of IF there will be women its just a matter of switching the women already there to a new duty

and if they were going after muslims specifically (as a religion) then it would be in EVERY NATION IN EVERY CITY... we are not a region, we are not a race, we are global and come from every colour and creed.