Can Sufi Islam counter the Taleban?
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modern language translation,
there was wine and houses where people would gather and drink but i dont think they had electricity sockets to plug their juke boxes into and no kareoke machines obviously as no contact with japan yet.
are you going to start this "sunnah" in England any time soon if so is there any help coming from combat 18 troops (don't think the street skinheads are gonna like it)?
only when we establish the shariah here inshallah!
i.e i was talking about a muslim country not darul kufr
in other words inciting trouble abroad from safety and comfort of England!
(disregarding the semi-hindus, yogis and malangs portrayed as Sufi-Muslims in OP) which of the following, in your opinion or according to your sect, is a proper Muslim
Yusuf Islam (Cat Stevens)
al-munnajjad
bakri
al-masri
David Myatt
Sufi Zulkader Siddiqui http://www.islamicboard.com/miscellaneous/134273647-haram-halal-meat.html
would it be halal to destroy what is Maal (wealth:e.g. brewries, bars, piggeries, slaughterhouses etc.) for non-Muslim in your version of khilaafat?
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yusuf islam, al-munajjad, bakri, al-masri are as far as i am aware aswj, though of-course that doesnt mean agree 100%
david myatt and zulkader siddiqui i dont know, other than this one article relating to this post and the one you put up.
also akhi could i warn you, it is actually an act of kufr akbar to mock a believer, abu hamza was disabled whilst in the path of Allah so stop mocking him as could lead you to leaving the fold of islam,
if you dont know then you should, but the verses of the Quran where Allah says...
"And if you question them, they declare emphatically: "We were only talking idly and joking." Say: "Was it at Allah, His Aayat and His Messenger you were mocking?" Make no excuses! You have rejected faith after you had accepted it, if We pardon some of you, We will punish others amongst you because they were sinners" (Qur'an 9:65-66)
this verse was revealed in relation to some munafiqeen in the times of the prophet muhammad (saws) who mocked some believers on their way back from the battlefield, saying they were eating too much and were fat.
^
any people under oppression will fight, the war needs to be stopped, then there will be peace. no stupid solution ever works/ed, when will they ever learn..
the muslims are more educated and knowledgeable about their religion to fall in such ... anymore.
Open a book or talk to an Afghan, there hasn't been peace in that country for the last 30 years. So it has little to do with the war.
NazariteofEhyah
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Judgment under a different name
"Every time I return to a Muslim land I am aware of two things. First, how many Muslims seem to be Muslim in name only, imitating as they seem to do the ways of the kaffir; second, of what this modern world really needs. Does this world really need more wealth, more luxuries, more materialism, more development, created by the idea of "progress"? Does the so-called "under developed world" have to play the Western game according to Western rules in order to achieve something called "happiness" and something called "prosperity" and something called "progress"?"
Progress is an conceptual idea. What do you think 'progress' actually is? Progress could be understood to be social reform, economic boost and increased security. When you speak of the 'kaffir' whom exactly do you speak off? Do you speak of those in power, whether by peerage or election? I do seriously hope that your not refering to every Westerner in this pretence. I agree on your views concerning materialism for we Nazarites/Nazarenes would stamp it out gradually not by making judgements but to help show a way of liberation from worldy lifes. However, word are soo easy to say and judgement can be made before you even think. Helping fellow man realise this earthly indulgence you speak of is three steps ahead of calling him a 'kaffir', to which would only devide, not unite.
Every time I return - and especially now as I sit here under a beautiful blue sky, with desert beyond the small patches of food-producing land - I ask myself what is the true meaning of prosperity, of happiness, of progress, of wealth? Is the fisherman there, casting his net again, happier than the vastly more wealthy Western man I saw on my journey through London, sitting in his expensive car? Is there true wealth here, in a simple living, in a simple submission to Allah Subhana wa Ta'ala? In a simple acceptance of this life as a gateway to another, eternal, life? The answers to such question all depend on our perspective, on one fundamental question: what is the meaning and purpose of our lives, as individuals?
Your given a view concerning the Muslim, in comparison to the Atheistic shapped lifestyle, where it's all about the self. When you say Westerner your implying judgment, and I don't recommend that. If you give an example be more precise.
It occurred to me - as I travelled, talked to Muslims, and read and studied all I could - that the Taliban were an example of the recent revival of authentic Islam: that they had perceived, and understood, the essential simplicity and beauty of Islam, and thus rejected any and all attempts to imitate the kuffar; that is, any and all attempts, from whatever reason or motive, to move away from the fundamental truths of Islam.
Two wrongs can never correct a right. If the taliban are anything like what you describe then they would have the wisdom of saying to the occupiers, "look, lets reason and stop this conflict". But however if a truce is agreed, will the Taliban resort to thier former governing of Afganistan? Yet again, your haven't given clear detail as to what extactly is a kuffar!
Understood thus, all the rhetoric of the kuffar - all the rhetoric of the tame and moderate Muslims subverted by the kuffar - about prosperity, about the poverty of the Taliban and their land, about the "backwardness" of the Taliban, is seen for what it is: irrelevant; un-Islamic.
The Taliban would appear to be like that, for when they were in power the economic wealth of Afganistan wasn't much to boost about. As you assumbly speak in their favour, what difference will the Taliban mean for Afganistan?
Those in the West who disliked Islam and who had worldly plans of their own for the world thus came to consider the Taliban a threat, and so began a campaign against the them, using the power of the Western Media - which was in their control, directly or indirectly - to try and discredit the Taliban, in the eyes of the both Muslims and non-Muslims, and using as they often did the services of the many tame and "moderate" Muslims who believed that imitation of the kuffar way of life was "a good thing" and that "Islam needed modernizing". In addition, the so-called leaders of many Western nations began agitating for sanctions against the Taliban, with some advocating direct intervention by that kaffir organization, the mis-named "United Nations".
The media isn't a level playing field. Yet you continue to judge others, because you fail to explain who exactly is a Kaffir, and another question why do you think the UN is a kaffir organisation? Just as Islam has its principle organisation, non-Muslims have their own.
This campaign, by the kuffar, by the enemies of Islam, culminated in the invasion of Afghanistan by Amerika, and in the installation of a puppet, pro-Amerikan regime.
Your putting all Westerner's into one group!
If the recent events in Afghanistan, in Iraq and elsewhere, reveal anything, it is this - that we, as Muslims, have a choice: we can allow ourselves to be influenced by the kuffar, by the ways and ideas of the kuffar, by the temptations, the materialism, of this world, or we can follow the clear and noble and quite simple guidance given to us by Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'ala.
What is a kuffar? Are you speaking of all non-Mislims? Not all non-Muslims are closely tied into the world and it's indulgences.
"Every time I return to a Muslim land I am aware of two things. First, how many Muslims seem to be Muslim in name only, imitating as they seem to do the ways of the kaffir; second, of what this modern world really needs. Does this world really need more wealth, more luxuries, more materialism, more development, created by the idea of "progress"? Does the so-called "under developed world" have to play the Western game according to Western rules in order to achieve something called "happiness" and something called "prosperity" and something called "progress"?"
Progress is an conceptual idea. What do you think 'progress' actually is? Progress could be understood to be social reform, economic boost and increased security. When you speak of the 'kaffir' whom exactly do you speak off? Do you speak of those in power, whether by peerage or election? I do seriously hope that your not refering to every Westerner in this pretence. I agree on your views concerning materialism for we Nazarites/Nazarenes would stamp it out gradually not by making judgements but to help show a way of liberation from worldy lifes. However, word are soo easy to say and judgement can be made before you even think. Helping fellow man realise this earthly indulgence you speak of is three steps ahead of calling him a 'kaffir', to which would only devide, not unite.
Every time I return - and especially now as I sit here under a beautiful blue sky, with desert beyond the small patches of food-producing land - I ask myself what is the true meaning of prosperity, of happiness, of progress, of wealth? Is the fisherman there, casting his net again, happier than the vastly more wealthy Western man I saw on my journey through London, sitting in his expensive car? Is there true wealth here, in a simple living, in a simple submission to Allah Subhana wa Ta'ala? In a simple acceptance of this life as a gateway to another, eternal, life? The answers to such question all depend on our perspective, on one fundamental question: what is the meaning and purpose of our lives, as individuals?
Your given a view concerning the Muslim, in comparison to the Atheistic shapped lifestyle, where it's all about the self. When you say Westerner your implying judgment, and I don't recommend that. If you give an example be more precise.
It occurred to me - as I travelled, talked to Muslims, and read and studied all I could - that the Taliban were an example of the recent revival of authentic Islam: that they had perceived, and understood, the essential simplicity and beauty of Islam, and thus rejected any and all attempts to imitate the kuffar; that is, any and all attempts, from whatever reason or motive, to move away from the fundamental truths of Islam.
Two wrongs can never correct a right. If the taliban are anything like what you describe then they would have the wisdom of saying to the occupiers, "look, lets reason and stop this conflict". But however if a truce is agreed, will the Taliban resort to thier former governing of Afganistan? Yet again, your haven't given clear detail as to what extactly is a kuffar!
Understood thus, all the rhetoric of the kuffar - all the rhetoric of the tame and moderate Muslims subverted by the kuffar - about prosperity, about the poverty of the Taliban and their land, about the "backwardness" of the Taliban, is seen for what it is: irrelevant; un-Islamic.
The Taliban would appear to be like that, for when they were in power the economic wealth of Afganistan wasn't much to boost about. As you assumbly speak in their favour, what difference will the Taliban mean for Afganistan?
Those in the West who disliked Islam and who had worldly plans of their own for the world thus came to consider the Taliban a threat, and so began a campaign against the them, using the power of the Western Media - which was in their control, directly or indirectly - to try and discredit the Taliban, in the eyes of the both Muslims and non-Muslims, and using as they often did the services of the many tame and "moderate" Muslims who believed that imitation of the kuffar way of life was "a good thing" and that "Islam needed modernizing". In addition, the so-called leaders of many Western nations began agitating for sanctions against the Taliban, with some advocating direct intervention by that kaffir organization, the mis-named "United Nations".
The media isn't a level playing field. Yet you continue to judge others, because you fail to explain who exactly is a Kaffir, and another question why do you think the UN is a kaffir organisation? Just as Islam has its principle organisation, non-Muslims have their own.
This campaign, by the kuffar, by the enemies of Islam, culminated in the invasion of Afghanistan by Amerika, and in the installation of a puppet, pro-Amerikan regime.
Your putting all Westerner's into one group!
If the recent events in Afghanistan, in Iraq and elsewhere, reveal anything, it is this - that we, as Muslims, have a choice: we can allow ourselves to be influenced by the kuffar, by the ways and ideas of the kuffar, by the temptations, the materialism, of this world, or we can follow the clear and noble and quite simple guidance given to us by Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'ala.
What is a kuffar? Are you speaking of all non-Mislims? Not all non-Muslims are closely tied into the world and it's indulgences.
no, it's not, brother Dawud. the verse is case specific, they were mocking Allah,his messenger and the signs/verses of the qur'an, these aren't synonymous with believers.
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NazariteofEhyah
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So the moral is thay you can be my personal critic!
tsk tsk tsk
there goes munnajjad again,massacring Arabic and changing Qur'anic Ayats with al-lagv
Proper hijab is to be masked? naughty man!!!
you mean war against Soviets was a love affair?
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MinAhlilHadeeth
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Excuse me? Did you just refer to the niqaab as a mask? I don't think there is any dispute that covering the hands and face, as well as the rest of the body is the complete hijaab for a Muslimah. The only dispute is on whether it is obligatory or simply highly recommended. Therefore, mocking the Muslimah's hijaab is mocking a part of Islaam.
Wears the Proper Hijab and Covers Her Face (implication being that the majority are improperly dressed)
translate to English >> what is the face covering called?
BTW. this fatwah is being used to stop me "mocking" hizb ut tahrir chiefs and a neo-Nazi-cum-Muslim a mr. myatt (thread had nothing to do with hijab to start with, originally, it was meant to be a Sufi bashing thread and I tried, I think successfully, to show that all is not well anywhere and with anyone sect for all have their disgusting practices and nasty frauds amongst them)
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MinAhlilHadeeth
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Because you disagree with Saalih al-Munajjid's fatwa does not give you an excuse to use such a silly phrase to describe the niqaab. To be honest, as a niqaabi that offended me. Saalih al-Munajjid is not the only one who holds that opinion. Many 'Ulamaa, past and present, hold the same view. And as I stated, whether the covering of the hands or face is obligatory is not the point, just that it is a part of Islaam.
And as for the rest of the discussion, I'll choose to opt out.
P.s., the face covering (niqaab) would be translated as a veil, according to the Hans Wehr Arabic-English dictionary.
(and i will keep giving salaams on here as it is an islamic messageboard, knowing i still get the reward for it even if nobody else bothers with the proper ettiquettes)
if you disagree with someone then disagree, show evidence, give Quran ayats and ahaddith to show your point.
if you call names you only demean your argument as well as yourself, give away your good deeds to this person and so harm yourself several times over.
and as already pointed out, mocking a believer in matters of the deen is a matter of kufr akbar so please refrain from it, it is dangerous to you not us.
i am also not trying to silence you, i am happy to get these issues out in the open and have the debate and discussion relating to them but there are certain ways we go about such things, but you keep trashing such good manners and abusing people instead.
so if you want to have a discussion regarding certain ulema and da'ees you have mentioned then lets do so either on the board or by pm but please for your own sake stop mocking believers, we are trying to warn you for your own good.
Omar_Mukhtar
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those look like extreme Sufis..........and what is with the rastas?
NazariteofEhyah
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north_malaysian
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I dont think that he's refering to you.... it's the "sufi" dude with dreadlock on the pic...