Which religion is closest to Islam?

[Woodrow]

I don't think either Christianity or Judaism is closer to Islam. The rites of Islam don't follow either of these two religions and neither do the principles of what constitutes a sin, the fact that Islam has predestination, and also Salvation by Works. It isn't clear what, or how many, good works are required to bypass predestination either.

And the scales of good and bad are also not of either of the other two religions. If the scales tip towards the good, does that bypass predestination?

Sorry, but predestination is not part of Islam. We do believe that Allaah(swt) knows all things. The Jews and Christians also believe that. If you can call it being all-knowing in Christianity, why does it become predestination when you reference it to Islam.

also we do not believe our good works get us into heaven. It is only the Mercy and forgiveness of Allaah(swt) that can do that.

 

[Willow]

Sorry, but predestination is not part of Islam. We do believe that Allaah(swt) knows all things. The Jews and Christians also believe that. If you can call it being all-knowing in Christianity, why does it become predestination when you reference it to Islam.

also we do not believe our good works get us into heaven. It is only the Mercy and forgiveness of Allaah(swt) that can do that.

There are a lot of things that lead to me coming up with predestination in islam. Here we read that Allah and an angel predestin humanity.

Bukhari:V4B54N430 "Allah's Apostle, the true and truly inspired said, 'Regarding the matter of the creation of a human being: humans are put together in the womb of the mother in forty days. Then he becomes a clot of thick blood for a similar period. He becomes a piece of flesh for forty days. Then Allah sends an angel who is ordered to write four things: the new creature's deeds, livelihood, date of death, and whether he will be blessed or wretched. He will do whatever is written for him.'"

Bukhari:V6B60N473 "While we were in a funeral procession, Allah's Apostle said, 'Every created soul has his place written for him either in Paradise or in Hell. They have a happy or miserable fate predestined for them.' A man said, 'Apostle! Shall we depend upon what is written and give up doing deeds? For whoever is destined to be fortunate, will join the fortunate and whoever is destined to be miserable will go to Hell.'"


And in the Quran, these have led me to think that there is predestination:
Qur'an 97:1 "We have revealed it (the Qur'an) in the Night of Predestination."

Qur'an 64:11 "No calamity occurs, no affliction comes, except by the decision and preordainment of Allah."

Qur'an 3:145 "No person can ever die except by the permission of Allah, the term being fixed as by writing."

Quran 2:272 "It is not required of thee (O Messenger), to set them on the right path, but Allah sets on the right path whom He pleaseth..."

And the historian:
Ishaq:395 "No soul can die but by Allah's permission in a term that is written."


As far as good works, I got that from:
Quran 23:102-103 "Then those whose balance (of good deeds) is heavy,- they will attain salvation: But those whose balance is light, will be those who have lost their souls, in Hell will they abide."

Quran 22:23 "Allah will admit those who believe and work righteous deeds, to Gardens beneath which rivers flow: they shall be adorned therein with bracelets of gold and pearls; and their garments there will be of silk."

I should have put these in the original post. Sorry for not making my position more clear.

 

[Woodrow]

There are a lot of things that lead to me coming up with predestination in islam. Here we read that Allah and an angel predestin humanity.

Bukhari:V4B54N430 "Allah's Apostle, the true and truly inspired said, 'Regarding the matter of the creation of a human being: humans are put together in the womb of the mother in forty days. Then he becomes a clot of thick blood for a similar period. He becomes a piece of flesh for forty days. Then Allah sends an angel who is ordered to write four things: the new creature's deeds, livelihood, date of death, and whether he will be blessed or wretched. He will do whatever is written for him.'"

Bukhari:V6B60N473 "While we were in a funeral procession, Allah's Apostle said, 'Every created soul has his place written for him either in Paradise or in Hell. They have a happy or miserable fate predestined for them.' A man said, 'Apostle! Shall we depend upon what is written and give up doing deeds? For whoever is destined to be fortunate, will join the fortunate and whoever is destined to be miserable will go to Hell.'"


And in the Quran, these have led me to think that there is predestination:
Qur'an 97:1 "We have revealed it (the Qur'an) in the Night of Predestination."

Qur'an 64:11 "No calamity occurs, no affliction comes, except by the decision and preordainment of Allah."

Qur'an 3:145 "No person can ever die except by the permission of Allah, the term being fixed as by writing."

Quran 2:272 "It is not required of thee (O Messenger), to set them on the right path, but Allah sets on the right path whom He pleaseth..."

And the historian:
Ishaq:395 "No soul can die but by Allah's permission in a term that is written."


As far as good works, I got that from:
Quran 23:102-103 "Then those whose balance (of good deeds) is heavy,- they will attain salvation: But those whose balance is light, will be those who have lost their souls, in Hell will they abide."

Quran 22:23 "Allah will admit those who believe and work righteous deeds, to Gardens beneath which rivers flow: they shall be adorned therein with bracelets of gold and pearls; and their garments there will be of silk."

I should have put these in the original post. Sorry for not making my position more clear.

From that I can understand how you came to your conclusion that we believe in predestination. English translations are so much fun to work with.

I will get back to this discussion after I read the Arabic and some of the tafsir associated with your post. I am slow so please bear with me, it may be a few days before I find what I am looking for. My memory is not all that reliable and I do not want to post just my opinion or what I think I remember.

 

[Willow]

From that I can understand how you came to your conclusion that we believe in predestination. English translations are so much fun to work with.

I will get back to this discussion after I read the Arabic and some of the tafsir associated with your post. I am slow so please bear with me, it may be a few days before I find what I am looking for. My memory is not all that reliable and I do not want to post just my opinion or what I think I remember.

I take these from the accepted translations. Please use one of those translations. Don't make your own up.

 

[saba muslimah]

so now what is the question? It has been answered, It should be obvious that Christianity is closer to Islam than Judaism is

Might possible....
But i Agree with u... by ur thoghts..about ques??which is closest to islam...?? Not sustitute, hhmmmm

 

[Woodrow]

I take these from the accepted translations. Please use one of those translations. Don't make your own up.

I am going to stick with the translations you used. But, keep in mind I am not a scholar and for the understanding of the Ahadeeth it is a science of it's self and does require the knowledge of one learned in the science of Hadeeth. The Ahadeeth are very easily misunderstood and for that I am going to rely heavily on the works of Dr. Saleh as-Saleh and his book "Fate in Islam'' al-qadar is what is described in the hadeeth you quoted and it is understandable it is often seen as the English concept of predestination.


Hopefully you will be patient with my lack of speed.

 

[Woodrow]

I should have added in my above post that to understand Qadar there are other factors to understand. such as:

The Four Aspects Of Qadar:

In order to correctly understand the issue of Qadar, the following four terms need to studied in detail:-
1. Al-Ilm (Knowledge)
2. Kittabah (Writing)
3. Mash’eeah (Will)
4. Al-Khalq (Creation)

Sheikh ul-Islaam, Ibn Taimeeyah has summerized these ranks in his famous book on the creed (Aqeedah) of the Ahlus-Sunnah, “Al-Aqeedah al-Wasitiyyah”.

I am trying to brush up on Al-Ilm, Kittaba, Mash'eeah and Al-Khalq sufficiently to give you true answers in regards to your post.

 

[Grace Seeker]

While you are checking on determinism, Woodrow, I would like to reflect on something I thought of today.

What if one were to ask which animal is closest to a bat, a squirrel, a bird, or a fly. Now the bat flies, as does the bird and the fly. But the bird, squirrel and bat all have interior skeletons, while the fly has an exoskeleton. Flies and birds lay eggs from which their young emerge, but bats and squirrels bear live young. Science would tell us that bats and squirrels are most closely related, and birds are closer to bats than are flies. But a young child might just group things by what the animal does or where it lives. That would lead a child to say something else is closest.

I wonder if our different answers to this question are because we all think that there is ONE right answer to it, but in reality the right answer might be determined by what you consider important and what is not. In other words, our inner values effect the way we even process looking for the answer and thus of course the various answers we are going to get. Unless we can agree on similar values, we are not going to agree on the answer no matter how much substance one's answer has to it.

So, I suspect all of these various answers really tell us more about ourselves than about the question.

 

[Woodrow]

While you are checking on determinism, Woodrow, I would like to reflect on something I thought of today.

What if one were to ask which animal is closest to a bat, a squirrel, a bird, or a fly. Now the bat flies, as does the bird and the fly. But the bird, squirrel and bat all have interior skeletons, while the fly has an exoskeleton. Flies and birds lay eggs from which their young emerge, but bats and squirrels bear live young. Science would tell us that bats and squirrels are most closely related, and birds are closer to bats than are flies. But a young child might just group things by what the animal does or where it lives. That would lead a child to say something else is closest.

I wonder if our different answers to this question are because we all think that there is ONE right answer to it, but in reality the right answer might be determined by what you consider important and what is not. In other words, our inner values effect the way we even process looking for the answer and thus of course the various answers we are going to get. Unless we can agree on similar values, we are not going to agree on the answer no matter how much substance one's answer has to it.

So, I suspect all of these various answers really tell us more about ourselves than about the question.

Peace Gene,

I agree with you I also add:

We all haves different concepts of what is meant by closest.

Closest by proximity? In that case Christianity is the closest in time to Islam, While Christianity is closest in time to Judaism.

Closest by belief? I feel that Christianity is closest in belief to Islam and we have one main difference. The Divinity of Christ(as) while we seem to have numerous belief differences with Judaism.

Closest by practices: In this are I feel Islam is closest to Judaism.

Now to answer the first part:

As we speak I am writing (on wordpad) my reply on determinism/predestination. I'm just being cautious as I do not want to err and accidentally state an invalid belief.

 

[جوري]

There are a lot of things that lead to me coming up with predestination in islam. Here we read that Allah and an angel predestin humanity.

Bukhari:V4B54N430 "Allah's Apostle, the true and truly inspired said, 'Regarding the matter of the creation of a human being: humans are put together in the womb of the mother in forty days. Then he becomes a clot of thick blood for a similar period. He becomes a piece of flesh for forty days. Then Allah sends an angel who is ordered to write four things: the new creature's deeds, livelihood, date of death, and whether he will be blessed or wretched. He will do whatever is written for him.'"

Bukhari:V6B60N473 "While we were in a funeral procession, Allah's Apostle said, 'Every created soul has his place written for him either in Paradise or in Hell. They have a happy or miserable fate predestined for them.' A man said, 'Apostle! Shall we depend upon what is written and give up doing deeds? For whoever is destined to be fortunate, will join the fortunate and whoever is destined to be miserable will go to Hell.'"


And in the Quran, these have led me to think that there is predestination:
Qur'an 97:1 "We have revealed it (the Qur'an) in the Night of Predestination."

Qur'an 64:11 "No calamity occurs, no affliction comes, except by the decision and preordainment of Allah."

Qur'an 3:145 "No person can ever die except by the permission of Allah, the term being fixed as by writing."

Quran 2:272 "It is not required of thee (O Messenger), to set them on the right path, but Allah sets on the right path whom He pleaseth..."

And the historian:
Ishaq:395 "No soul can die but by Allah's permission in a term that is written."


As far as good works, I got that from:
Quran 23:102-103 "Then those whose balance (of good deeds) is heavy,- they will attain salvation: But those whose balance is light, will be those who have lost their souls, in Hell will they abide."

Quran 22:23 "Allah will admit those who believe and work righteous deeds, to Gardens beneath which rivers flow: they shall be adorned therein with bracelets of gold and pearls; and their garments there will be of silk."

I should have put these in the original post. Sorry for not making my position more clear.

Title

Divine Predestination & Man's Free Will​

Question

As-Salamu `alaykum. I never understand how we are mukhayyarin (have free will in doing what we wish) and not musayyarin (have no free will in doing what we wish). Did not Allah create time? Therefore, all the events since the moment of creation to the end of time must be already created. In addition to this, how can we even begin to imply that Allah does not know what is to happen in the future? How can a man control what he does if it is already written? So far I have received many interpretations that all seemed to be weak. Can anyone tell me or would it better just to say that Allah did not intend everything to be understood by man? Thank you.​

Date

24/Feb/2003​

Name of Counsellor

A Group of Islamic Researchers​

Topic

Muslim Belief​

Answer​

​

Wa `alaykum As-Salamu wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh.

In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.

Dear brother in Islam, we would like to thank you for your interesting question the great confidence you place in us. We implore Allah Almighty to help us serve His cause and enlighten our hearts with the light of Islam!

As regards the issue you raised, we’d like to furnish you with a detailed discussion of the differnt queries regarding qadar as given by Dr Ja`far Sheikh Idris, professor of Islamic studies, Institute of Islamic and Arabic Sciences, Washington, who states:

“The original meaning of the Arabic word qadar is a specified measure or amount whether of quantities or qualities. It has many other usages, which branch out from this core. Almighty Allah says, “We have created every thing by measure (bi-qadar).” (Al-Qamar: 49)

Allah (Mighty and Exalted bre He) knows before creating anything, that He is going to create it and that it shall be of such and such magnitude, quality or nature, etc. He also specifies the time of its coming into being and its passing away, and the place of its occurrence. If so, then one who believes in the true God should believe that there are no accidents in nature. If something disagreeable happens to him, he should say “Allah qaddara (ordained), and He did what He willed” and not grieve himself by wishing that it had not occurred, or worrying why it should occur. If, in contrast, something agreeable happens to him he should not boast of it, but thank Allah for it. In this context, Allah says, “Naught of disaster befalleth in the earth or in yourselves but it is in a Book before We bring it into being. Lo! That is easy for Allah. That ye grieve not for the sake of that which hath escaped you, nor yet exult because of that which hath been given. Allah loveth not all prideful boasters.” (Al-Hadid: 22-23)

If Allah Almighty predetermines everything, that includes our so-called free actions, in what way can they be said to be free, and how are we responsible for them? This question occasioned the appearance, at a very early history of Islam, of two extreme theological sects. One of them, called the Qadariyyah, asserted man’s free will and responsibility to the extent of denying Allah’s foreknowledge, and claiming that Allah knows our free made actions only after we have performed them. The other, called the Jabriyyah, held the opposite view and claimed that there was no difference between the motions of inanimate things and our movements in performing so-called free actions, and that when we use intentional language we speak only metaphorically.

But there is no need to go to such extremes, since it is not difficult to reconcile Divine qadar (predestination) and human responsibility. Allah decided to create man as a free agent, but He knows (and how can He not know!) before creating every man how he is going to use his free will; what, for instance, his reaction would be when a Prophet clarifies Allah’s message to him. This foreknowledge and its registering in a ‘Book’ is called qadar.

“But if we are free to use our will” a Qadari might say, “we may use it in ways that contradict Allah’s will, and in that case we would not be right in claiming that everything is willed or decreed by Allah.”

The Qur’an answers this question by reminding us that it was Allah who willed that we shall be of free will, and it is He who allows us to use our will. Allah, Most High, says, “Lo! This is an Admonishment, that whosoever will may choose a way unto his Lord. Yet ye will not, unless Allah willeth. Lo! Allah is Knower, Wise.” (Al-Insan: 29-30)

“If so,” a Qadari might say, “He could have prevented us from doing evil."

Yes indeed He could. Allah says, “Had Allah willed, He would have brought them all together to the guidance; if thy Lord had willed whoever is in the earth would have believed, all of them, all together.” (Yunus: 99) “Had Allah willed, they were not idolaters; and We have not appointed thee a watcher over them neither art thou their guardian.” (Al-An`am: 107)

But Allah has willed that men shall be free especially in regard to matters of belief and disbelief. Allah Almighty says, “Say: The truth is from your Lord; so let whosoever will believe, and let whosoever will disbelieve.” (Al-Kahf: 29)

But men would not be so free if whenever any of them wills to do evil Allah prevents him from doing it and compels him to do good.

“If our actions are willed by Allah,” someone might say, “then they are in fact His actions.”

This objection is based on a confusion that Allah wills what we will in the sense of granting us the will to choose and enabling us to execute that will, i.e., He creates all that makes it possible for us to do it. He does not will it in the sense of doing it, otherwise it would be quite in order to say, when we drink or eat or sleep for instance that Allah performed these actions. Allah creates them, He does not do or perform them.

Another objection, based on another confusion, is that if Allah allows us to do evil, then He approves of it and likes it.

However, to will something in the sense of allowing a person to do it is one thing; and to approve of his action and commend it, is quite another, NOT everything that Allah wills He likes. He has, as we have just read in the Qur’an, granted man the choice between belief and disbelief, but He does not, of course, like men to disbelieve (to be thankless). Allah Almighty says, “If you art ungrateful, Allah is independent of you. Yet He approves not ungratefulness in His servants; but if you are grateful, He will approve it in you.” (Az-Zumar: 7)”

Based on Dr. Ja`far Sheikh Idris’s article “Belief in Qadar”. (Source: http://isgkc.org/pillars_qadar.htm).

 

[Woodrow]

There are a lot of things that lead to me coming up with predestination in islam. Here we read that Allah and an angel predestin humanity.

Bukhari:V4B54N430 "Allah's Apostle, the true and truly inspired said, 'Regarding the matter of the creation of a human being: humans are put together in the womb of the mother in forty days. Then he becomes a clot of thick blood for a similar period. He becomes a piece of flesh for forty days. Then Allah sends an angel who is ordered to write four things: the new creature's deeds, livelihood, date of death, and whether he will be blessed or wretched. He will do whatever is written for him.'"

Bukhari:V6B60N473 "While we were in a funeral procession, Allah's Apostle said, 'Every created soul has his place written for him either in Paradise or in Hell. They have a happy or miserable fate predestined for them.' A man said, 'Apostle! Shall we depend upon what is written and give up doing deeds? For whoever is destined to be fortunate, will join the fortunate and whoever is destined to be miserable will go to Hell.'"

I am going to just address the Ahadeeth in this post. The Ahadeeth are not the Qur'an but are the words of man. As such they are subject to interpretation, misunderstanding and error. Most Muslims will not attempt to interpret the hadeeth unless they have spent considerable time studying the science of Hadeeth under qualified scholars. I am not qualified. However, I will quote from people I believe are qualified.

Qadar does translate into English as predestined. But, what is meant by predestination and how does it keep from conflicting with freedom of choice and free will? It is not the paradox it seems to be if you understand qadar.


Quoting from Dr. Saleh as-Saleh



"The First Aspect of Qadar - Knowledge

Al-Ilm [Allaah’s Knowledge]

In this regard it is essential to believe that...

1. Allah knows everything about His Creation, even before He created them

2. Allah alone chooses on whom to bestow guidance, the choice being related to his Knowledge

3. Allah knows the outcome of His choice

Allah’s Knowledge compasses everything. He knew what had occurred and what will occur, and all that did not occur. He knew everything about His creation even before He created it. In His Eternal Knowledge is the provision, life-spans, sayings, moves and deeds of His creation; and knows who among them is obedient or disobedient, and who will be among the people of al-Jannah (Paradise) or the people of an-Nar (Hell-Fire). The following Qur'aanic verses further emphasize this point

“Verily Allaah is the All-Knower of everything.” [Soorah al-Anfaal (8):75]

“And that Allaah surrounds (comprehends) all things in His Knowledge.” [Soorah at-Talaq (65):12]

“With Him alone are the keys of the Ghayb (all that is hidden), none knows them but He. And He knows whatever there is on the earth and in the sea; not a leaf falls but He knows it. There is not a grain in the darkness of the earth nor anything fresh or dry, but is written in a Clear Record.” [Soorah al-An'aam (6): 59]"

"Ibn Abbas narrated that the Prophet (salallahu alaihi wa salalam) was asked about the children of the Mushrikeen (polytheists) whereupon he said: “Allaah alone knows what they would be doing (were they to live).” [Sahih al-Bukhari (english trans.) vol.8. no.596 and Sahih Muslim (english trans.) vol.4, no.6433]

Commenting on this Hadeeth, Sheikh ul-Islaam Ibn Taimeeyah said: “Allaah knows who among them will be a Kaafir or a Mu’min once they reached the age of puberty.” [Reported in al-Fatawa, vol.4, p.246]

He also said, “It cannot be ruled out whether a particular child from the children of the Mushrikeen will be in the Hell or Paradise. As it is mentioned in many Hadeeth, that on the Day of Judgment they will be subjected to trials in which they will be ordered to comply with or abstain from certain commands. Those who will obey will enter al-Jannah and those who disobey will enter an-Naar…” [Reported in al-Fatawa, vol.4, p.303 & vol.24, p.372]

Allah alone knows the actions of all children, if they were to live and grow up, as the Messenger of Allaah explained, “No child is born except on Fitrah (Islaam). It is his parents who make him a Jew or a Christian, just as you help the animals give birth to their young ones, do you find any deficiency in them before you mutilate them (cut their ears after birth) yourselves?” The Companions said, “What do you think about the one who dies in infancy”. The Prophet (salallahu alaihi wa salalam) said, “Allaah knows what they would be doing (were they to live)” [Sahih al-Bukhari (english trans.) vol.8, no.597 and Sahih Muslim (english trans.) vol.4, no.6428]"



Source: http://www.ahya.org/amm/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=12&page=3

The point I am trying to show is that Qadar is not the predestination as portrayed in English religious thought. It is knowledge of all that will happen, and it is unchangable. But, the result is because of man's choices and his own free will.

I will conitinue with this line of thought, particulary in terms of Man's free will. But, I think it is best to address one thought at a time.


I did find some websites with Dr. Saleh as-Saleh's writings so I will be pasting from them rather then trying to type from my books, it will spare you from deciphering my typo errors.

 

[Woodrow]

Now to return to the topic of discussion.

Qadar in Islam does not remove free will, it is not a predestination in terms that the individual has no choices.

To understand free choice we need to have at least a small understanding of what is meant by the will of Allaah(swt)

"“And you cannot will unless Allah wills. Verily! Allah is ever all-Knowing, all-Wise.” [Soorah al-Insan (76): 30]

* The above evidences from the Qur'aan and Sunnah confirm the absolute Mashee’ah (universal will) of Allah, as well as the will of humans, and that the later is not independent from Allah’s will. Allah tells us that everything in the Universe is by His will, and what He did not will, would not take place. He also confirms that if He wills, the outcome would be different from what exists. If He wills He would not be disobeyed, and that He would have gathered His creation on guidance - making them one nation. This is because, He is the only Owner and the only Rabb, as He says:

“Verily, your Rabb creates whatever He wills and chooses.” [Soorah al-Qasas (28): 68]

“And We cause whom We will, to remain in the wombs for an appointed term.” [Soorah al-Hajj (22): 5]

“To Allah belongs the Kingdom of the heavens and the earth, He creates what He wills. He bestows female (offspring) upon whom He wills, and bestows male (offspring) upon whom He wills, or He bestows both males and females, and He renders barren whom He wills. He is all-Knowing, all-Able.” [Soorah ash-Shura (42): 50]

“Allah guides to His Light whom He wills.” [Soorah an-Nur (24): 35]

“Verily! Allah does what He wills.” [Soorah al-Hajj (22): 14 ]

“And whomsoever Allah wills to guide, He opens His breast to Islam, and whomsoever He wills to send astray, He makes his breast closed and constricted, as if he is climbing up to the sky.” [Soorah al-An'aam (6): 125]

Ibn Abbas said: “It means that Allah opens up one’s heart for the acceptance of and belief in Tawheed.” See Tafseer Ibn Katheer for the quoted verse

On the other hand, whomsoever He wills to lead astray, He would make his chest strictly closed from knowing Allah and loving Him. “This is a Just punishment for those who do not properly estimate Allah, and those who deny Allah’s favors. Allah shuts the doors of His Guidance to them and this is why their breasts become confined and restricted.. The Guidance is a favor from Allah; He makes it settle in the person who is suitable to recognize it and give thanks to his Creator, by obeying Him and worshipping Him alone.” [Shifaa’ul Aleel, vol.1, p.274-278]

Understanding Mashee’ah (Will) and Iradah (What Allah wants):

In order to understand correctly the relation between Mashee’ah and Iradah, two terms need to be explained; ? Al-Iradah al-Kawniyyah ? Al-Iradah ash-Shariyyah

1. Al-Iradah al-Kawniyyah or the Universal will:

It is the will (Mashee’ah) of Allah in which His intention is carried out. It is not necessary that all actions of His creation are liked by Him, rather many of their acts are disliked by Him, but He willed for them to pass. This is Al-Iradah al-Kawniyyah.

For Example: Allah created Shaitaan, yet He hates him. Likewise, He created the Kuffar, but He hates them. Whatever Allah permits to exist, does not mean that He loves them. This is Al-Iradah al-Kawniyyah (or Universal will). Under this will, Allah may decree to pass things which He does not command His slaves to follow (like Kuffr and disobedience).

2. Al-Iradah ash-Shariyyah or Judicial will:

It is that which is in accordance with Allah’s legislation. It is related to what Allah likes, whether it takes place or not.
For Example: The acts of obedience from the angels, prophets and believers are loved by Allah and are passed by His Universal will. Under Al-Iradah ash-Shariyyah it is not necessary that His commands will be executed. The Kuffar rebel against Al-Iradah ash-Shariyyah."

Source:http://www.ahya.org/amm/modules.php?name=Sections&op=viewarticle&artid=12&page=5

More on free will to come---- along with tying all of this back
to the original question "Which religion is closest to Islam?"

 

[PCJ]

Well first of all, how do you compare religions? What makes religion different from other religions is the most important aspect of that religion. Therefore, the most important aspect of any religion can not match the most important aspect of any other and that's what makes them different...

 

[//-Asif-\\]

The closest religion to Islam, like someone previously stated, depends on how you look at it and what one finds important. On practices, Islam and Judaism seem like they are closer, on certain beliefs for instance the afterlife Christianity is closer to Islam and Judaism is closer depending on the topic of Jesus' divinity etc.

On the Unitarian argument that was debated in the previous pages, the Unitarian sect of Christianity (whether mainstream Christianity accepts them as Christian or not) is by far the closest belief-wise to Islam and what was argued by the Muslim side of the debate was that the early followers of Jesus had a Unitarian belief technically making them believers/Mum'mineen/Muslims according to Islamic belief as referenced in the Qur'an.

The confusion that arises to non-Muslims is when we refer to Abraham, Jesus, Moses etc. as Muslim. That's when pupils become dilated and people go "WHAT? Islam wasn't around at that time!" At that time if you had the pure monotheistic belief of one God and worshiped just that one God as Abraham did, as Moses did, David and Jesus, whether they had the Jewish label on them or not, they were Muslim because of that pure monotheistic belief. That's why Islam has always been around and is known as the first and last religion.

 

[Willow]

Well first of all, how do you compare religions? What makes religion different from other religions is the most important aspect of that religion. Therefore, the most important aspect of any religion can not match the most important aspect of any other and that's what makes them different...

I wonder why they even ask this. Why are Muslims so concerned with this? From my readings they don't even try to understand the Trinity, or Resurrection, from a Christian perspective. I read many Christians, and not only on this forum, trying to understand Islam but the reverse is not true. The Muslims only take their viewpoint from the Quran and in order to understand another's faith then one must go to the other person's texts.

So how can they even categorize Islam if they do not understand the other's religions?

Even the Quran says to read the 'books before them' because they are the 'truth from the Lord'. (10:94)

And as far as Buddhism or Hinduism (I can't think of any other religion off hand) there is even less concern with those religions to try to understand them.

And if Islam is closer to Judaism, I don't see that either. They have completely thrown out the 10 Commandments in at least in regards to unbelievers. I don't know all of the halal and haram rules (seems like a whole heck of a lot of rules and regulations in Islam) in regards to the believers either, but they seem to consider each other at a different level than unbelievers. The Sharia laws show us that in how they subjugate them.

In regards to Judaism, the Old Testament Biblical stories are different in Islam and in different order than from the Biblical accounts.

The whole thing doesn't make sense to me - why would they be changed? What is the motive behind changing them, or is there a motive?

I can actually understand why they don't understand the Trinity more than I understand why the Biblical stories are different. But, even so the lack of trying to understand another's perspective is puzzling.

Now let me see how soon this post will be deleted.

 

[Woodrow]

Although we all seem to have personal opinions as to which Religion is closest to Islam, perhaps we should simply accept what the Qur'an says:

Strongest among men in enmity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and Pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, "We are Christians": because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant.
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #82)

 

[Willow]

Although we all seem to have personal opinions as to which Religion is closest to Islam, perhaps we should simply accept what the Qur'an says:

Strongest among men in enmity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and Pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, "We are Christians": because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounced the world, and they are not arrogant.
( سورة المائدة , Al-Maeda, Chapter #5, Verse #82)

That doesn't mean that Islam's theology is closer to Christianity. that is only saying the people are not arrogant or mean.

This is part of the problem with a question like the one asked, the Muslims are not studying Judaism, or Christianity, from their texts and are instead using the Quran which is only for Islam. And once again, I will say that the Quran even says to read those books. And not to 'cut down' those religions, but to understand them because they are the 'truth from the Lord'.

 

[YusufNoor]

I wonder why they even ask this. Why are Muslims so concerned with this? From my readings they don't even try to understand the Trinity, or Resurrection, from a Christian perspective.

we understand it as polytheism

I read many Christians, and not only on this forum, trying to understand Islam but the reverse is not true.

actually, most of my views on Christianity predate my Islam, being a former Catholic.


The Muslims only take their viewpoint from the Quran and in order to understand another's faith then one must go to the other person's texts.

the Qur'an is direct Revelation from the One True God, the "New Testament" is not and the Old Testament [Tanakh] has been changed.

So how can they even categorize Islam if they do not understand the other's religions?

Even the Quran says to read the 'books before them' because they are the 'truth from the Lord'. (10:94)

the Qur'an is referring to the monotheists, Haneefa, that remain of those faiths

And as far as Buddhism or Hinduism (I can't think of any other religion off hand) there is even less concern with those religions to try to understand them.

And if Islam is closer to Judaism, I don't see that either. They have completely thrown out the 10 Commandments in at least in regards to unbelievers. I don't know all of the halal and haram rules (seems like a whole heck of a lot of rules and regulations in Islam) in regards to the believers either, but they seem to consider each other at a different level than unbelievers. The Sharia laws show us that in how they subjugate them.

In regards to Judaism, the Old Testament Biblical stories are different in Islam and in different order than from the Biblical accounts.

see Richard Elliott Friedman's Who Wrote The Bible?; link':
http://www.amazon.com/Who-Wrote-Bible-Richard-Friedman/dp/0060630353

The whole thing doesn't make sense to me - why would they be changed? What is the motive behind changing them, or is there a motive?

I can actually understand why they don't understand the Trinity more than I understand why the Biblical stories are different. But, even so the lack of trying to understand another's perspective is puzzling.

Now let me see how soon this post will be deleted.

Peace be upon those who follow the guidance,

i would like to address this:

And if Islam is closer to Judaism, I don't see that either. They have completely thrown out the 10 Commandments

let's look at those Commandments, shall we? taken from Exodus 20.

#1) “I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. “You shall have no other gods before Me."

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that. in fact, associating partners with Allah is a Major sin.

#2) You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#3) You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain, for the LORD will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it

Islam does NOT keep the Jewish Sabbath, HOWEVER, Friday Prayer, Jummuah is MANDATORY on all adult males unless too sick to attend [they may be a few other valid excuses]. it is our position that the day has manifold blessings in it, Adam was created on Friday. during the Exodus, we see that on Fridays, a double portion of Manna was sent down to the Hebrews! thus the day has double Blessings in it!

#5) Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the LORD your God is giving you.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#6) You shall not murder.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#7) You shall not commit adultery.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#8) You shall not steal.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#9) You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#10) You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

now, what about Christianity? let's compare:

#1) “I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. “You shall have no other gods before Me."

Nope, must have a minimum of 3 Gods, Trinity. Catholics add Mary, the Mother of Jesus. they also pray to saints, considered shirk in Islam.

#2) You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

nope, crosses and statues abound as well as prayer to Icons and worshiping relics.

#3) You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain, for the LORD will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

nope, Christians DON'T EVEN KNOW Gods name! but calling Jesus, god in His place WOULD be taking the name in vain!

#4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it

nope, the VAST majority of Christian DENY the Sabbath!

#5) Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the LORD your God is giving you.

#6) You shall not murder.

#7) You shall not commit adultery.

#8) You shall not steal.

#9) You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

#10) You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s

Christians have abandoned these and prefer to live in secular societies although murder, theft and perjury ARE considered crimes in most secular states.

all except #10 are punishable under the Shariah in Islam.

thus this:

And if Islam is closer to Judaism, I don't see that either. They have completely thrown out the 10 Commandments

is not a logical statement.

 

[Woodrow]

I wonder why they even ask this. Why are Muslims so concerned with this? From my readings they don't even try to understand the Trinity, or Resurrection, from a Christian perspective. I read many Christians, and not only on this forum, trying to understand Islam but the reverse is not true. The Muslims only take their viewpoint from the Quran and in order to understand another's faith then one must go to the other person's texts.

For most Muslims these concepts are so alien, it is virtually impossible to understand them.

So how can they even categorize Islam if they do not understand the other's religions?

There is enough understood to know that they hold believes in contrast to Islam. Not necessarily anti-Islam but not in agreement. There can be no agreement unless everybody is working from the same sources of information and accepting the sources to be true.

It is actually quite ridiculous to try to categorize religions. The 4 most similar religions should be the 4 Abraha'mic faiths, But each differs from the other in multitudes of ways.

Even the Quran says to read the 'books before them' because they are the 'truth from the Lord'. (10:94)

True but those books no longer exist. We are to believe the truths of them, wherever we find those truths.

And as far as Buddhism or Hinduism (I can't think of any other religion off hand) there is even less concern with those religions to try to understand them.

Perhaps we are making too much ado about nothing.

And if Islam is closer to Judaism, I don't see that either. They have completely thrown out the 10 Commandments in at least in regards to unbelievers. I don't know all of the halal and haram rules (seems like a whole heck of a lot of rules and regulations in Islam) in regards to the believers either, but they seem to consider each other at a different level than unbelievers. The Sharia laws show us that in how they subjugate them.

and how does Sharia subjugate unbelievers?

In regards to Judaism, the Old Testament Biblical stories are different in Islam and in different order than from the Biblical accounts.

Why should they be in order? The Qur'an did not come as a replacement of what was revealed, but as a correction and guide for all people. What is retained as true was in no need of correction.

The whole thing doesn't make sense to me - why would they be changed? What is the motive behind changing them, or is there a motive?

Example of what was changed please.

I can actually understand why they don't understand the Trinity more than I understand why the Biblical stories are different. But, even so the lack of trying to understand another's perspective is puzzling.

Most Muslims do try to understand another's perspective. But, I can only speak in regards to Muslims I know personally

Now let me see how soon this post will be deleted.

I do not see any violation of forum rules here.

 

[Willow]

Peace be upon those who follow the guidance,

i would like to address this:



let's look at those Commandments, shall we? taken from Exodus 20.

#1) “I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. “You shall have no other gods before Me."

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that. in fact, associating partners with Allah is a Major sin.

#2) You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#3) You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain, for the LORD will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it

Islam does NOT keep the Jewish Sabbath, HOWEVER, Friday Prayer, Jummuah is MANDATORY on all adult males unless too sick to attend [they may be a few other valid excuses]. it is our position that the day has manifold blessings in it, Adam was created on Friday. during the Exodus, we see that on Fridays, a double portion of Manna was sent down to the Hebrews! thus the day has double Blessings in it!

#5) Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the LORD your God is giving you.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#6) You shall not murder.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#7) You shall not commit adultery.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#8) You shall not steal.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#9) You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

#10) You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s

Islam ABSOLUTELY agrees with that

now, what about Christianity? let's compare:

#1) “I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. “You shall have no other gods before Me."

Nope, must have a minimum of 3 Gods, Trinity. Catholics add Mary, the Mother of Jesus. they also pray to saints, considered shirk in Islam.

#2) You shall not make for yourself a carved image—any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; 5 you shall not bow down to them nor serve them. For I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children to the third and fourth generations of those who hate Me, 6 but showing mercy to thousands, to those who love Me and keep My commandments."

nope, crosses and statues abound as well as prayer to Icons and worshiping relics.

#3) You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain, for the LORD will not hold him guiltless who takes His name in vain.

nope, Christians DON'T EVEN KNOW Gods name! but calling Jesus, god in His place WOULD be taking the name in vain!

#4) Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the LORD made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it

nope, the VAST majority of Christian DENY the Sabbath!

#5) Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the LORD your God is giving you.

#6) You shall not murder.

#7) You shall not commit adultery.

#8) You shall not steal.

#9) You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

#10) You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his male servant, nor his female servant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s

Christians have abandoned these and prefer to live in secular societies although murder, theft and perjury ARE considered crimes in most secular states.

all except #10 are punishable under the Shariah in Islam.

thus this:



is not a logical statement.

Islam only agrees with the 10 Commandments in regards to other Muslims. If Muslims regarded the 10 Commandments to all people there would be no subjugation, or disallowing anyone to vote on the laws that govern subjugation. Because in these laws (Sharia) there is nothing to stop killing, persecution, torture, etc of anyone not a Muslim.

Here is something that you might not read in the 10 Commandments... that God did not qualify the 10 Commandments to just include Jews, or just Christians, or just one group.

And as for the Trinity, or Resurrection, you would have to get yourselves out of the Quran and read the New Testament, and any other texts that the Christians have. There is no attempt to do that. And that is what I am trying to say - the lack of trying on the part of Muslims to do such a thing.

No one says that you have to totally understand or agree/believe in it. But, to let others believe as they will without thinking that Islam is the only way to God. Or that Islam should be the law of the land when it should be kept at home and/or in the mosque.

And there have been historians that had no vested interest in the Resurrection, or Crucifixion, and they wrote about it.

Jesus' crucifixion was written about by not only his prophets, but also includes Josephus (37-97AD) a Jewish historian who was ordered by Pontius Pilate to record the crucifixion of Jesus. He also mentions Jesus appearing to the apostles on the 3rd day.

Lucien, a Greek satirist (120-180AD) was a critic of the Christians and Christ; and Tacitus (55-117AD) who was a great historian of Rome both wrote about the Crucifixian of Jesus.

Woodrow mentions that the books, or Bible, no longer exists. Well, where did it go? There are actually documents (dead sea scrolls), the Torah (the books of Deuteronomy) that exist and also so many volumes that are still around from before Christ that this argument isn't correct.

The ones who actually were with Christ wrote about Christ from firsthand experience.

And even over and above that - if one wants to understand anyone else's religion - that means to read their texts as they have it. Otherwise, reading your own that contains prejudices is not even a criticism that can hold up.

It goes back to the thread of whether or not others of different religions think that the Quran was written by Muhammad (well, at least dictated by Muhammed since he couldn't read or write). If other's of other religions don't believe that the Quran is a book inspired by God then the arguments fall short. There is no proof in the Quran that anything was corrupted except the word of someone who contradicted himself quite often, let alone contradicting the Bible.

Just the fact that Muhammad couldn't read or write should tell you something right there that he did not have first hand knowledge that the Bible was correct or not if he couldn't read it.

And this is a long explanation of more reasons why I don't see Islam as being close to either Christianity or Judaism. But, I don't see why anyone is upset - just believe in what you will. If you want to believe in the Quran, so be it. I just don't think that anyone should be subjugated under it if they do not believe in it.