The Event: How Racist are you?

[Eliphaz]

I'm not even sure how to respond to that, the accusation itself is so mind-boggling.

I'm not accusing white people, but rather the system: the media presenting ethnic minorities as a problem, the European-centric version of history taught in schools, the entertainment industry promoting lighter-skinned heroes and heroines, the list goes on. The whole thing is creates a superiority complex in white people without them even knowing it.

And I may have been hasty in agreeing with her "all" but I would still say a "great many". Some are able to break out of that but some aren't. As much as I thought the woman was a crazy witch, this phrase did have some truth in it.

 

[Iris]

^And sadly enough, I agree to that too.

In some of these middleeastern countries, the 'whites' have separate passport controls and get to go faster. Heck one airport has the best,most elite terminal, Just for whites.

 

[Woodrow]

I am now curious as to what defines a White person? Where did white people originate? Since we all have the same ancestors at what point in time did any group come to be identified as White?


The answers to these questions can be answered in a short review of modern history. Before I post any answers. I would like to see what you think or know.

 

[GuestFellow]

I am now curious as to what defines a White person? Where did white people originate? Since we all have the same ancestors at what point in time did any group come to be identified as White?


The answers to these questions can be answered in a short review of modern history. Before I post any answers. I would like to see what you think or know.

I'm not sure. All I know is the colour of your skin is affected by the sun. Those who live in hot countries are more darker than those who live in cold countries.... :/

A white person skin can get darker by visiting a hot country...

 

[IAmZamzam]

Do I detect prejudice in your statement? Seems to be a touch of racism against those who believe all people are racist.

That makes absolutely no sense at all if it's a serious statement and if it's a joke then I'm sorry but it's just not funny.

 

[Woodrow]

That makes absolutely no sense at all if it's a serious statement and if it's a joke then I'm sorry but it's just not funny.

It was not intended to be funny. I apologize if it makes no sense.

My point was that each and every one of is is prejudiced and biased to some extent.

When each of us recognizes that quality in our selves we can use it as a tool to reduce some of the tensions in communications with those who we perceive to differ from ourselves.

 

[JaffaCake]

I'm not accusing white people, but rather the system: the media presenting ethnic minorities as a problem, the European-centric version of history taught in schools, the entertainment industry promoting lighter-skinned heroes and heroines, the list goes on. The whole thing is creates a superiority complex in white people without them even knowing it.

And I may have been hasty in agreeing with her "all" but I would still say a "great many". Some are able to break out of that but some aren't. As much as I thought the woman was a crazy witch, this phrase did have some truth in it.

1. I don't ever recall the media presenting ethnic minorities as a problem. Immigrants yes, but that's not on the basis of race, but economics. People are just as upset by large numbers of white (e.g. Polish) immigrants as non-white.

2. European centric history taught in Europe is... understandable, no? There are limits to the amount that can be taught in a certain time, and trying to teach a little of every culture in existence would almost certainly lead to students receiving just a superficial outline of most topics, doesn't it make sense for European students to learn European history? Look at the UK GCSE history syllabus, it has sections on world affairs including colonisation and the Arab-Israeli conflict.

3. Entertainment industry.. I had a look at this myself and here are a few numbers (UK specific).

Overall the white population is about 92%, so non-whites are about 8%

70% of this weeks UK top ten singles are non-white artists
30% of Premiership footballers are non-white
40% of the England football team are non-white
23% of the England cricket team are non-white
~20-25% of BBC presenters are non-white

Are you just talking about Hollywood films or entertainment in general? Any counter examples?

 

[Raphael]

^And sadly enough, I agree to that too.

In some of these middleeastern countries, the 'whites' have separate passport controls and get to go faster. Heck one airport has the best,most elite terminal, Just for whites.

What?! For real?

 

[Iris]

^Yeah, in Dubai, it's there. (Okay my bad it's not really white-only, but more like exclusive for all europeans ands americans, that's racism!!) Middle eastern countries Really put down the Subcontinental people as compared to the respect they give to Americans etc. I don't even know why.

 

[Woodrow]

^Yeah, in Dubai, it's there. (Okay my bad it's not really white-only, but more like exclusive for all europeans ands americans, that's racism!!) Middle eastern countries Really put down the Subcontinental people as compared to the respect they give to Americans etc. I don't even know why.

One thing I found to be common in some Mid-Eastern countries is Non-Arab Non-Muslims are treated very well but, Non-Arab Muslims are treated poorly. Sadly it is not uncommon for Muslims thinking they will find the strongest support among Arabs too often find themselves treated poorly.

I should point out this is not true in all predominately Arab nations. To be fair I have actualy seen the opposite occur. It is much more common for an Arabic Muslim to be treated poorly in Non Arabic Muslim countries ie: Turkey, Iran, Syria, Jordan

 

[S_87]

This might sound odd, but Asians from the Indian subcontinent are quite racist themselves. They literally slander each other based on variations on skin pigmentation. A light skin vs dark skin battle, and I'm talking about people who are ethnically the same!

Crazy stuff. :hmm:

veru true and unfortunately not only asians. dark skinned is seen as ugly even by people who are dark themselves. Why anyone would hate the skin Allah blessed them with :hmm: ?

 

[Woodrow]

veru true and unfortunately not only asians. dark skinned is seen as ugly even by people who are dark themselves. Why anyone would hate the skin Allah blessed them with :hmm: ?

To be ridiculous to the extreme Here in the US Dark Skinned people spend a fortune on bleaching creams to makes their skin lighter and white people spend just as much going to tanning salons to make their skin darker. Nobody ever seems to be happy with what they have. If Allaah(swt) had made us with black and wite stripes, we would have people hollering "I'm better I'm white with black stripes but you are black with white stripes."

 

[Raphael]

^Yeah, in Dubai, it's there. (Okay my bad it's not really white-only, but more like exclusive for all europeans ands americans, that's racism!!) Middle eastern countries Really put down the Subcontinental people as compared to the respect they give to Americans etc. I don't even know why.

I guess it shows in their public policies as well!

One thing I found to be common in some Mid-Eastern countries is Non-Arab Non-Muslims are treated very well but, Non-Arab Muslims are treated poorly. Sadly it is not uncommon for Muslims thinking they will find the strongest support among Arabs too often find themselves treated poorly.

Sad isn't the word Woodrow!

veru true and unfortunately not only asians. dark skinned is seen as ugly even by people who are dark themselves. Why anyone would hate the skin Allah blessed them with :hmm: ?

Its usually the culture that they are brought up in that make them feel that way. I have heard that the reason that some women what to be lighter maybe because someone in their family, like a sister, cousin etc, have light skin - and everyone sings praise about her looks, but she is ignored.

Did you hear that Asian magazines sometimes use white women and dress them up in Asian clothes to promote the desire for lighter skin?!!

Its hard to say racists discriminate against skin colour when their own community is at it too!

 

[Eliphaz]

1. I don't ever recall the media presenting ethnic minorities as a problem. Immigrants yes, but that's not on the basis of race, but economics. People are just as upset by large numbers of white (e.g. Polish) immigrants as non-white.

2. European centric history taught in Europe is... understandable, no? There are limits to the amount that can be taught in a certain time, and trying to teach a little of every culture in existence would almost certainly lead to students receiving just a superficial outline of most topics, doesn't it make sense for European students to learn European history? Look at the UK GCSE history syllabus, it has sections on world affairs including colonisation and the Arab-Israeli conflict.

3. Entertainment industry.. I had a look at this myself and here are a few numbers (UK specific).

Overall the white population is about 92%, so non-whites are about 8%

70% of this weeks UK top ten singles are non-white artists
30% of Premiership footballers are non-white
40% of the England football team are non-white
23% of the England cricket team are non-white
~20-25% of BBC presenters are non-white

Are you just talking about Hollywood films or entertainment in general? Any counter examples?

1. Firstly do you watch the same news channels as everyone else, and secondly do you think any news network in its right mind would openly admit to its coverage being "on the basis of race"?

2. I am not saying that the curriculum in European countries shouldn't focus on European history, but I am criticising the European-centric way history is taught.

Take the Renaissance for instance. It is taught as if it was some bright spark of bright ideas which paradoxially came out of nowhere (the Dark Ages), when we all know it had its roots in the intellectual and cultural revolution which took place in Medieval Spain under Islamic rule several centuries earlier. Ask any U.K. school pupil about this and you'll just get a blank look. The most they will attribute (from memory) to a non-European civilisation is Ancient Egypt inventing papyrus or China inventing fireworks!

3. Sports is not considered part of the entertainment industry, although there is cross-promotion between the two nowadays. Sports is also one of the few arenas where people of different backgrounds can (are allowed to) compete equally (as long as we politely don't mention South Africa).

But by looking at cold hard statistics of non-white artists in the music charts (70% a more convincing way of saying 7 out of 10 huh?) I'm afraid you are missing the point. The music industry is more destructive than any nowadays in perpetrating racial stereotypes, today's "gangsta rap" being a prime example. Many music videos featuring black artists conform to this kind of destructive stereotype of black people abusing drugs, women and violence, and reinforcing that in the eyes of a predominantly white audience.

Yes, I am talking more about the entertainment industry otherwise known as the 'mass media': music, film, television. videogames, and everything in between. When you talk about "just talking about Hollywood films" you do realise that you are talking about the single largest entertainment industry in the world and most far-reaching in terms of cultural globalisation? I do not need to quote the countless films featuring handsome do-no-evil white lead actor against some barbaric ruthless enemy of colour? I don't deny that lately the trend seems to be an effort to reverse this but the last few decades speak for themselves. To try and pull examples would be an insult to the gravity of the problem.

 

[JaffaCake]

Firstly do you watch the same news channels as everyone else

I don't watch TV much any more, I just picked the most popular and went through the presenting staff. I couldn't find a list for ITV, but do you seriously think a station that had Sir Trevor McDonald OBE as host of it's flagship news & current affairs shows for two decades is promoting white supremacy?

Have you ever sat and watched children's TV, surely if there was a good time to indoctrinate people it would be when they're young and impressionable. Non-whites are more than adequately represented, and were when I was watching it 20 years ago.

do you think any news network in its right mind would openly admit to its coverage being "on the basis of race"?

You're right, so how could you possibly know their intentions?

Take the Renaissance for instance. It is taught as if it was some bright spark of bright ideas which paradoxially came out of nowhere (the Dark Ages), when we all know it had its roots in the intellectual and cultural revolution which took place in Medieval Spain under Islamic rule several centuries earlier.

I'm not sure why you associate Europe-centric with white superiority, there are plenty of European nations who are not ethnically white. Nobody pretends that the ideas of the Renaissance came out of nowhere, "During this period, there was an enormous renewal of interest in and study of classical antiquity." However you look at it, it's hardly promoting white superiority as the Greeks certainly weren't white either.

3. Sports is not considered part of the entertainment industry, although there is cross-promotion between the two nowadays. Sports is also one of the few arenas where people of different backgrounds can (are allowed to) compete equally (as long as we politely don't mention South Africa).

You were talking about heroes, for a great many young boys in the UK their heroes are their favourite footballers.

(70% a more convincing way of saying 7 out of 10 huh?)

Sorry for being consistent in my formatting. Even 7 out of the top 100 would be proportionally representative of the minorities in the UK, and there are far more than that.

But by looking at cold hard statistics of non-white artists in the music charts I'm afraid you are missing the point. The music industry is more destructive than any nowadays in perpetrating racial stereotypes, today's "gangsta rap" being a prime example. Many music videos featuring black artists conform to this kind of destructive stereotype of black people abusing drugs, women and violence, and reinforcing that in the eyes of a predominantly white audience.

I'm pretty sure they didn't drag all these guys out of ballet classes and force them to act like hooligans. If that is how black artists want to be perceived that is entirely up to them. You can't just go and sling the blame on some invisible white overlord who manipulates the work of innocent young minority artists for some unknown racist agenda. Even if you could, what about the black owned record labels and production companies? Chart positions are based partly on sales anyway, that's what the racist white public seems to want to buy.

Besides, if you wanted to reinforce those stereotypes, just film someone walking around Brixton until they get stabbed.

Yes, I am talking more about the entertainment industry otherwise known as the 'mass media': music, film, television. videogames, and everything in between. When you talk about "just talking about Hollywood films" you do realise that you are talking about the single largest entertainment industry in the world and most far-reaching in terms of cultural globalisation? I do not need to quote the countless films featuring handsome do-no-evil white lead actor against some barbaric ruthless enemy of colour? I don't deny that lately the trend seems to be an effort to reverse this but the last few decades speak for themselves. To try and pull examples would be an insult to the gravity of the problem.

Comparatively speaking, how much time do you think your average person spends watching non-white TV presenters, listening to non-white artists and speaking to non-white colleagues/schoolmates versus the time they spend going to see a 'white good/black evil' Hollywood release? Is that all it takes to 'brainwash' a whole population? After all the time I spent watching Fresh Prince I should want to be black.

 

[Iris]

But the superiority of white color is what makes it different. It's a concept that's prevailed through centuries before, it's not a new development.

 

[Supreme]

veru true and unfortunately not only asians. dark skinned is seen as ugly even by people who are dark themselves. Why anyone would hate the skin Allah blessed them with :hmm: ?

Something I've never understood is this view. I'm currently in a relationship with a black girl, and can I just say, black women are amazing and beautiful, if not more so that white women.

 

[IAmZamzam]

My point was that each and every one of is is prejudiced and biased to some extent.

And my point, which you've just reinforced again, yourself, with your own example, is about the supreme offensiveness of people justifying or projecting or presuming their own prejudicial nature into everyone else via, ironically, yet another prejudice. "I'm prejudiced and so I'm creating yet another prejudice: the stereotype that everyone else is prejudiced too." I don't know what the motive or possible psychological reason is for this extremely common phenomenon or why what we might call the EIRP (the "Everyone Is Racist" Prejudgment) is the most common form of this sort of projective sterotypic thought I've seen, and I don't really care. All I know is that whether or not it's a valid line of thought, it's still hypocritical and, again, itself a form of prejudice, and that's why it makes my blood boil. If you really must know, not only have I never had a racist thought in my life, racism confuses me so much that I even started a thread at this very board trying to gain aid in understanding it (and at the Understanding Islam board too).

 

[Supreme]

Can I just say, did anyone else find it rather ridiculous how the black woman complained of subtle racism and then said people 'push in front of her in line'? People push in front of me in the line, but I never once suspected racism. Obviously racism exists, but that woman did not justice to victims of racism by using such a ridiculous example.

 

[Uthman]

Greetings,

Can I just say, did anyone else find it rather ridiculous how the black woman complained of subtle racism and then said people 'push in front of her in line'? People push in front of me in the line, but I never once suspected racism. Obviously racism exists, but that woman did not justice to victims of racism by using such a ridiculous example.

From what I remember, she said that the cashiers would serve the person behind her in the queue while totally ignoring her. That's subtle because it's not something ostensibly racist but it's racism nonetheless. I would argue that, not only does racism exist, it is actually quite common. However, I wouldn't go as far as to say that all, or even the majority of white people, are racist.

As part of my A-Level French course, we were studying racism in France as one of our modules. My French teacher (who is white) also remarked that she believes racism is more common in Britain than it is in France but that racism in France is much more open and explicit as opposed to more subtle and discrete here in Britain.