Need help!!!!!!!

[freezium]

Salaam!!!!!!!

its freezium here...

I recieved an email yesterday from friend who's friend(reverted to islam)asked these question as they were confusing him...To be honest wen i read these questions i got confusins too....Please help me by answering these questions with proper refferences...


1] Surah Al-Kahf ayah 86-90... tells about Zulqarnain travelling west and reaching the "setting-place of the sun", and finding the "sun setting in a muddy pool"... This does not make sense from a factual point of view, because there is no real "setting place of the sun" because the earth is round.. [unless the Qur'an thought the earth was flat?].. many Muslims explained that these ayah are to be understood metaphorically, and Tafsir Ibn Kathir explains that Zulqarnain went to the farthest possible land in the west, where he saw the sunset... However, there is still the problem of "farthest possible land in the west", because the earth is round there is no such thing.. [unless Ibn Kathir also thought the earth was flat?].. how metaphorical must these ayah be understood??

2] Sahih Hadith from Al-Bukhari volume 4, book 54, no. 421... Abu Zarr narrates that Rasulullah SAW told him that after the sun sets, the sun goes and does sujud at the bottom of the 'Arsh, and asks permission from Allah to rise again... This does not make any sense from a factual point because the earth is round and the sun never disappears from the earth [if it disappears from Australia, it appears over America]... many Muslims say that this Hadith must be understood metaphorically, and not literally that the sun goes and does sujud at the 'Arsh.. but the problem is that in Islam [as far as I know] the 'Arsh is real, and really above the 7 Heavens, so I cannot see how we can use a metaphorical view for the "sun doing sujud at the bottom of the 'Arsh".. unless we say that the 'Arsh is also a metaphor??

3] Islam says that the Qur'an is the Speech of Allah, preserved perfectly by Allah, and that there are only different readings [Qira'at] with only minor differences in pronunciation... However, Sahih Al-Bukhari volume 6, book 60, no. 468, reports that the Sahabi Abdullah Ibn Mas'ud read Surah Al-Layl slightly differently.. he read ayah 3 as "By the male and the female" instead of "By Him who created male and female" [which is the reading of Zaid Ibn Thabit and the version Khalifa Uthman ordered to be standardized].. that means that several words were different between the version of Ibn Mas'ud and the standard version, which is a problem considering the Qur'an claims to be the completely preserved Speech of Allah... In fact, according to Ibn Sa'd, Tabaqat Al-Kabir volume 2, p.444, Ibn Mas'ud strongly disagreed with the standard Qur'an version [of Zaid Ibn Thabit] and even said that "the people have been decieved.".... More problems on this issue can be found in the book Al-Itqan Fii Ulum Al-Qur'an, p. 152-153 by Imam Suyuti, who reports that the Sahabi Ubayy Ibn Ka'b included 2 extra surahs [Al-Hafd and Al-Khali', that were short ayahs used for du'a in qunut] in his collection [mushaf].. if this is true, then there is a big problem with the Islamic claim that the Qur'an has been completely preserved as the Speech of Allah....

So please help me clarify these 3 issues if u can....

Apart from these 3 issues, I still have problems understanding the concept of Jahannam [eternal hellfire] in Islam, and that non-Muslims [Kuffar / Kaafirun] will suffer and burn in Jahannam forever. The Islamic description of Jahannam is really painful [fire is 70 times hotter than fire in this world], and the punishment will last forever and ever... My mind understands the theory but my heart has trouble accepting it.

I really appreciate it if you could help clarify these issues... thanks, Wassalam

 

[Alpha Dude]

Wa alaykum salam,

Apart from these 3 issues, I still have problems understanding the concept of Jahannam [eternal hellfire] in Islam, and that non-Muslims [Kuffar / Kaafirun] will suffer and burn in Jahannam forever. The Islamic description of Jahannam is really painful [fire is 70 times hotter than fire in this world], and the punishment will last forever and ever... My mind understands the theory but my heart has trouble accepting it.

Those non-muslims that enter hell would choose disbelief again and again, even if they were to be given more chances (inshaAllah someone can provide where this is mentioned, I am sure it is true).

If Allah were to give man a million years in this life, disbelievers would remain and die in the same state as they would in the present circumstance, despite the length of time given.

So the position that a infinite punishment for finite crime is unfair etc becomes a non-issue.

Another point worth noing, is that paradise is also forever. It would be inifinitely better than everything in this world. We don't see that as unfair, do we? Infinite pleasure for finite good deeds.

We have both the reward and the punishment known to us and we are given the freewill to make the choice.

Nothing unfair or unjust there.

 

[Muslim Woman]

Salaam Alaykum

Sis , Welcome to the forum .

InshaAllah I will try to find answers of your question. But I do not understand what's ur problem with eternal punishment of the disbelievers ? Those who obeyed Allah and those who rebelled against Allah - they are not same , right ? If both groups go to heaven , where is the justice ?

And Allah Knows Best.


Sun sets in Murky/Muddy water?


The following script is taken from a Debate titled: "Quran & bible in the Light of Science". Dr William Campbell attempts to prove Quran has scientific errors, Dr Zakir Naik refutes his attempts in the following manner:



Dr. William Campbell raised a point regarding Surah Kahf Chapter No.18, Verse No.86, that… ‘Zulqarnain sees the sun setting in murky water… in turbid water - Imagine sun setting in murky water… unscientific.’

The Arabic word used here is 'wajada' meaning, ‘it appeared to Zulqarnain.’ And Dr. William Campbell knows Arabic. So 'wajada' means - if you look up in the dictionary also, it means it appeared.’


http://www.islamic-shield.com/2007/10/sun-sets-in-murkymuddy-water.html

 

[أحمد]

Question 1: You asked about sunset. This concept is simple; the sun appeared to set as if it were to set in the water. It was what Dhulqarnayn could see; its not the scientific refutation to whether or not the sun actually sets. It is clear even in modern science that we still use the terms "sunrise" and "sunset"; these terms are even used by scientific organisations. It doesn't mean they are ignorant of the fact the Earth revolves on its Axis.

As for Ibn Katheer's explanation of the "farthest possible land in the west", its again about the "farthest possible land in the west" as known to the people; it has nothing to do with the "farthest possible land in the west" that exists.

As for any other movement of the Sun; its clear from studies in macro physics, that smaller objects connected to larger objects on a gravity field orbit them. The Earth takes 365.25 days to orbit the Sun, and the Sun takes 226 million years in orbit of the Milky Way.

:wa:

 

[Vigno]

Salaam!!!!!!!

Apart from these 3 issues, I still have problems understanding the concept of Jahannam [eternal hellfire] in Islam, and that non-Muslims [Kuffar / Kaafirun] will suffer and burn in Jahannam forever. The Islamic description of Jahannam is really painful [fire is 70 times hotter than fire in this world], and the punishment will last forever and ever... My mind understands the theory but my heart has trouble accepting it.

I really appreciate it if you could help clarify these issues... thanks, Wassalam

Waalekum Asalam

I can only clarify on the quoted matter above. You need to know and be sure that Allah subhanah wa Taalah is the Most Merciful but He also is of Great Punishment like none other.
So many Prophets sent, so many signs shown, so many blessings upon everyone, 3 books sent at different times, first the toorah then Engeel then the Quran each approving the one before it.
All spoke of Allah's words, and what was that countered by? Prophets were called liars or magicians, signs were not accepted, blessings were not realized, books changed (toorah and Engeel) in a way that matches the likes of people that you don't even know now if there are any real scripts left.
Now about the Quran, you see so many ayahs talking about Allah's mercy and punishment, Allah subhanah wa Taalah warns us and orders that we believe and worship Him alone, He created us and He deserves that alone. Now what do the disbelievers counter that with? They either say there is no God or they say Prophet Isa(Jesus) alihi asalam is God or they say he is Allah's son and other things which Allah subhanah wa Taalah is clear off.
Nothing gives the right to humans to say such lies about Allah subhanah wa Taalah.

So after all this and more, when Allah sends the disbelievers to Hell, then its quite fair, for Allah subhanah wa Taalah forbids unfairness on Himself.
Imagine someone who solves an exam well and the other totally bad, can they both pass?

 

[Salahudeen]

1] Surah Al-Kahf ayah 86-90... tells about Zulqarnain travelling west and reaching the "setting-place of the sun", and finding the "sun setting in a muddy pool"... This does not make sense from a factual point of view, because there is no real "setting place of the sun" because the earth is round.. [unless the Qur'an thought the earth was flat?].. many Muslims explained that these ayah are to be understood metaphorically, and Tafsir Ibn Kathir explains that Zulqarnain went to the farthest possible land in the west, where he saw the sunset... However, there is still the problem of "farthest possible land in the west", because the earth is round there is no such thing.. [unless Ibn Kathir also thought the earth was flat?].. how metaphorical must these ayah be understood??

Verse 86: Untill, when he reached the setting place of the sun, he found it setting in a spring of black muddy (or hot) water. And he found near it a people. We (Allah) said by (inspspiration): "O Dhul Qarnain! either you punish them, or treat them with kindness".

Whoever heads to the West is bound the reach the ocean. This is where one witnesses the setting of the sun. To an individual who only believes in what he sees and has no knowledge of astronomy, all that he sees is the sun setting in the ocean and it appears to set in black muddy or hot water, while we know now that the sun is actually in the heavens.

When he reached the West coast he found a great nation which he apparently fought and then was comanmanded by Allah to either kill them all or do well to them by pardoning them.

When we are looking at the ocean it looks as if the sun is setting in the ocean to our eyes, look at the picture below and tell me where you see the sun setting. It's setting in the water to our eyes.

 

[freezium]

Waalekum Asalam

I can only clarify on the quoted matter above. You need to know and be sure that Allah subhanah wa Taalah is the Most Merciful but He also is of Great Punishment like none other.
So many Prophets sent, so many signs shown, so many blessings upon everyone, 3 books sent at different times, first the toorah then Engeel then the Quran each approving the one before it.
All spoke of Allah's words, and what was that countered by? Prophets were called liars or magicians, signs were not accepted, blessings were not realized, books changed (toorah and Engeel) in a way that matches the likes of people that you don't even know now if there are any real scripts left.
Now about the Quran, you see so many ayahs talking about Allah's mercy and punishment, Allah subhanah wa Taalah warns us and orders that we believe and worship Him alone, He created us and He deserves that alone. Now what do the disbelievers counter that with? They either say there is no God or they say Prophet Isa(Jesus) alihi asalam is God or they say he is Allah's son and other things which Allah subhanah wa Taalah is clear off.
Nothing gives the right to humans to say such lies about Allah subhanah wa Taalah.

So after all this and more, when Allah sends the disbelievers to Hell, then its quite fair, for Allah subhanah wa Taalah forbids unfairness on Himself.
Imagine someone who solves an exam well and the other totally bad, can they both pass?

Awww!!!!it seems like didn't clearly mentioned what was actually confusing me.
the things confused me were above mentioned 3 points or issues.this one was jus by the person who asked the question genuinely ...

for me its clear like Crystal that"if one gets message even once in life(in any form)and he/she still remains in kuffar,he/she is goin to hell"simply...
but i must say i cud never gather those elaborative words as u did,though idea's are same .thankx for ur words
JazaK ALLAH

 

[Salahudeen]

The sun prostrates however it is not like the prostration of a human, the prostration of the sun could be a number things. I found the below answer, someone was asking how do all things prostrate to Allah (swt)

The prostration of everything in the universe to Allaah
It says in Soorat al-Hajj 22:18 that the dawaab (moving living creatures, beasts, etc.) prostrate to Allaah. What is the nature of this prostration?

Praise be to Allaah.

Note that this universe and all the created beings in it is in thrall to Allaah, whether by choice or by force. The believer worships Allaah by choice and is rewarded for his worship. Even though the kaafir may be alienated from his Lord and failing to worship Him, the atoms of his body and everything in him is worshipping Him and glorifying Him, but because our understanding and perception are limited, we are unaware of that tasbeeh (glorification of Allaah) and unable to understand its nature. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“The seven heavens and the earth and all that is therein, glorify Him and there is not a thing but glorifies His Praise. But you understand not their glorification. Truly, He is Ever Forbearing, Oft-Forgiving”

[al-Isra’ 17:44]

What this means is that every created being is in a state of submission to Allaah and worships Him in a manner appropriate to its situation. The sun, moon, stars, trees and animals are all in a state of subjugation to Allaah and prostrate to Him, and all of them worship Him in an appropriate manner. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“See you not that whoever is in the heavens and whoever is on the earth, and the sun, and the moon, and the stars, and the mountains, and the trees, and Ad-Dawaabb [moving (living) creatures, beasts], and many of mankind prostrate themselves to Allaah. But there are many (men) on whom the punishment is justified. And whomsoever Allaah disgraces, none can honour him. Verily, Allaah does what He wills”

[al-Hajj 22:18]

“Have they not observed things that Allaah has created: (how) their shadows incline to the right and to the left, making prostration unto Allaah, and they are lowly?

And to Allaah prostrate all that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth, of the moving (living) creatures and the angels, and they are not proud [i.e. they worship their Lord (Allaah) with humility]”

[al-Nahl 16:48-49]

Imaam Ibn Katheer said: Allaah is telling us of His Might, Majesty and Pride, for everything submits to Him and all things and creatures humble themselves before Him, inanimate objects and animals, and those which are accountable among mankind and the jinn, and the angels. Allaah tells us that everything that has a shadow that inclines towards the right and towards the left – i.e., morning and evening – prostrates to Allaah. Mujaahid said: When the sun passes its zenith everything prostrates to Allaah.

Allaah has confirmed that all beings prostrate to Him, and He has explained how some of them prostrate, which is by the inclining of its shadow towards the right and the left. It does not mean that everything prostrates on seven parts of the body; that applies only to the Muslims. The prostration of all other beings is in accordance with their nature. The fact that this prostration is prostration in the real sense is indicated by the apparent meaning of the text, because there is no valid reason for not interpreting the text as it appears to be, so we must accept it. That is also supported by the fact that the prostration of the sun, moon, stars, trees and animals is mentioned in conjunction with the prostration of the angels and humans, which indicates that this is prostration in a real sense for all the entities mentioned. Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

Prostration is a form of humility, so the prostration which includes all creatures implies the utmost submission and humility. For every created thing submits to His greatness and humbles itself before His might and power. This does not mean that everything prostrates like human beings do, on seven parts of the body, putting the forehead on the ground. This kind of prostration is only for human beings. Some other nations bow but do not prostrate, and that is their prostration. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

‘and enter the gate in prostration (or bowing with humility) and say: “Forgive us”’

[al-Baqarah 2:58]

It was said that this means enter it bowing, and some of them prostrate on their sides like the Jews. Sujood (prostration) is a generic term but because the way in which Muslims prostrate is so well known, many people think that this is how everything prostrates.

Jaami’ al-Rasaa’il, 1/27

And he said:

It is known that everything prostrates according to its nature, and the prostration of these created entities does not mean that they put their foreheads on the ground.

Majmoo’ al-Fataawa, 21/284

This prostration includes the submission and humbling of these created entities to Allaah and their surrendering to His Lordship, Might and Sovereignty. Imam Ibn al-Qayyim said:

“It is the prostration of humility and submission, for everything submits to His Lordship, humbles itself before His Might and is subject to His Sovereignty.”

Madaarij al-Saalikeen, 1/107

The prostration of these created entities is a prostration in a real sense as befits each of these entities. So man prostrates in the manner that suits him, in the manner that is well known, on seven parts of the body. The sun prostrates in the manner that suits it, as mentioned in the saheeh hadeeth of Abu Dharr (may Allaah be pleased with him) who said: “The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said to Abu Dharr when the sun had set, ‘Do you know where it went?’ I said, ‘Allaah and His Messenger know best.’ He said, ‘It has gone to prostrate beneath the Throne, then it asks for permission to rise, but soon it will prostrate and its prostration will not be accepted, and it will ask for permission to rise and that will not be granted to it, and it will be said to it, “Go back from whence you came,” and it will rise from the west. This is what Allaah says:

“And the sun runs on its fixed course for a term (appointed). That is the Decree of the All-Mighty, the All-Knowing”

[Yaa-Seen 36:38].’”

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 3199)

So it prostrates in a real sense, as is suited to the sun, but how does it prostrate to Allaah beneath the Throne? Allaah knows best how this prostration happens. The apparent meaning of the hadeeth proves that what this prostration means is not simply submission to the command of Allaah and obedience to Him. Indeed, it is submission, humility and surrender by prostrating in a real sense, but we do not understand how it happens. Similarly it is said that the moon, the trees, the animals and all other entities prostrate in a manner that suits them. What the believer should do is not to let the fact that he does not know how some entities prostrate prevent him from believing in this prostration, rather he must believe in what Allaah has told him about other entities prostrating to Him.

And Allaah knows best.

 

[freezium]

salaam
can u please tell me who gave this answer???this one cleared all the ambiguities ov my mind at once..want to knw the person who is been rewarded with such a blessing........

The sun prostrates however it is not like the prostration of a human, the prostration of the sun could be a number things. I found the below answer, someone was asking how do all things prostrate to Allah (swt)

salaam
can u please tell me who gave this answer???this one cleared all the ambiguities ov my mind at once..want to knw the person who is been rewarded with such a blessing........

 

[Salahudeen]

salaam
can u please tell me who gave this answer???this one cleared all the ambiguities ov my mind at once..want to knw the person who is been rewarded with such a blessing........

salaam
can u please tell me who gave this answer???this one cleared all the ambiguities ov my mind at once..want to knw the person who is been rewarded with such a blessing........

Sheikh Yasir Qadhi, he went into even more detail but unfortunately I can not remember the rest of the lecture I tried to find it on youtube however I had no success. But all creatures worship Allah in their own way and we may not actually realize they are worshipping Allah. An example of this would be the croaking of a frog. You see when a frog croaks it's making dhikr of Allah, that's it's tasbih. It's glorifying Allah, but to us this does not seem like an act of worship however it is an act of worship for the frog.

In As-Sunan it is reported that he (peace and blessings be upon him) was asked about frogs which were used for medicinal purposes. He forbade killing them, and said, “Their croaking is tasbih (glorification of Allah).”

See how the frog glorifies Allah, in this instance the prophet (saw) told us how the frog worships Allah. But we don't know how the sun worships Allah.

 

[freezium]

Sheikh Yasir Qadhi, he went into even more detail but unfortunately I can not remember the rest of the lecture I tried to find it on youtube however I had no success. But all creatures worship Allah in their own way and we may not actually realize they are worshipping Allah. An example of this would be the croaking of a frog. You see when a frog croaks it's making dhikr of Allah, that's it's tasbih. It's glorifying Allah, but to us this does not seem like an act of worship however it is an act of worship for the frog.

In As-Sunan it is reported that he (peace and blessings be upon him) was asked about frogs which were used for medicinal purposes. He forbade killing them, and said, “Their croaking is tasbih (glorification of Allah).”

See how the frog glorifies Allah, in this instance the prophet (saw) told us how the frog worships Allah. But we don't know how the sun worships Allah.

yes!!! absloutly ryte

Islam says that the Qur'an is the Speech of Allah, preserved perfectly by Allah, and that there are only different readings [Qira'at] with only minor differences in pronunciation... However, Sahih Al-Bukhari volume 6, book 60, no. 468, reports that the Sahabi Abdullah Ibn Mas'ud read Surah Al-Layl slightly differently.. he read ayah 3 as "By the male and the female" instead of "By Him who created male and female" [which is the reading of Zaid Ibn Thabit and the version Khalifa Uthman ordered to be standardized].. that means that several words were different between the version of Ibn Mas'ud and the standard version, which is a problem considering the Qur'an claims to be the completely preserved Speech of Allah... In fact, according to Ibn Sa'd, Tabaqat Al-Kabir volume 2, p.444, Ibn Mas'ud strongly disagreed with the standard Qur'an version [of Zaid Ibn Thabit] and even said that "the people have been decieved.".... More problems on this issue can be found in the book Al-Itqan Fii Ulum Al-Qur'an, p. 152-153 by Imam Suyuti, who reports that the Sahabi Ubayy Ibn Ka'b included 2 extra surahs [Al-Hafd and Al-Khali', that were short ayahs used for du'a in qunut] in his collection [mushaf].. if this is true, then there is a big problem with the Islamic claim that the Qur'an has been completely preserved as the Speech of Allah....

all other ambiguities cleared..but really i couldn't find answer of this one...

3] Islam says that the Qur'an is the Speech of Allah, preserved perfectly by Allah, and that there are only different readings [Qira'at] with only minor differences in pronunciation... However, Sahih Al-Bukhari volume 6, book 60, no. 468, reports that the Sahabi Abdullah Ibn Mas'ud read Surah Al-Layl slightly differently.. he read ayah 3 as "By the male and the female" instead of "By Him who created male and female" [which is the reading of Zaid Ibn Thabit and the version Khalifa Uthman ordered to be standardized].. that means that several words were different between the version of Ibn Mas'ud and the standard version, which is a problem considering the Qur'an claims to be the completely preserved Speech of Allah... In fact, according to Ibn Sa'd, Tabaqat Al-Kabir volume 2, p.444, Ibn Mas'ud strongly disagreed with the standard Qur'an version [of Zaid Ibn Thabit] and even said that "the people have been decieved.".... More problems on this issue can be found in the book Al-Itqan Fii Ulum Al-Qur'an, p. 152-153 by Imam Suyuti, who reports that the Sahabi Ubayy Ibn Ka'b included 2 extra surahs [Al-Hafd and Al-Khali', that were short ayahs used for du'a in qunut] in his collection [mushaf].. if this is true, then there is a big problem with the Islamic claim that the Qur'an has been completely preserved as the Speech of Allah....

can i have some references about this one???
Jazak Allah.....

 

[freezium]

Salaam!!

its freezium here...

I recieved an email yesterday from friend who's friend(reverted to islam)asked these question as they were confusing him...To be honest wen i read these questions i got confusins too....Please help me by answering these questions with proper refferences...

i posted the same questions on another site....and for my surprise one of members there ,said that he has dealt these questions years back.....
and wat i heard about the revert ix that "he reverted months back perhaps...."
The Brother said that these questions seems dodgy..cox the same question is spreading among common masses of Muslim Population ,who have not enuf knowledge to answer...and it is creating great confusions and sense of uncertainty about the authenticity of Deen.(Na'auz u billah).
It seems that these questions are generated for that specific purpose.....

i am double minded here......