what do christians & jews believe in?

Naidamar:
You and your trickery attempt at forcing us to accept the divinity of Jesus.

and...

YO, why don't you just accept the fact the muslims and jews will NEVER accept that Jesus is God, or that Jesus is part of God, or that Jesus is divine.
It's not in jewish scriptures, and not in the Qur'an, and till the end of the day no true jews or muslims will ever believe that Jesus was God, or very god (in your own word).

Bro. I don't know what your deal is...but none of the questions (or Boaz's responses) have ANYTHING AT ALL to do with any claim of divinity for Jesus. Just look at the sentences again. My whole aim was to note the similarities between Judaism and Christianity and to explain how some Christians can use the term "Judeo-Christian" meaningfully. This was specifically about THAT...and nothing else!

Are you serious? Is something wrong with you, bro? ^o)
 
Boaz said:
What propaganda are you basing this racial thing on?
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This racials thing stems from your own holy book the Talmud

Some Teachings of the Jewish Talmud

.
Hitting a Jew is the same as hitting God

Sanhedrin 58b. If a heathen (gentile) hits a Jew, the gentile must be killed.

O.K. to Cheat Non-Jews

Sanhedrin 57a . A Jew need not pay a gentile ("Cuthean") the wages owed him for work.

Jews Have Superior Legal Status

Baba Kamma 37b. "If an ox of an Israelite gores an ox of a Canaanite there is no liability; but if an ox of a Canaanite gores an ox of an Israelite...the payment is to be in full."

Jews May Steal from Non-Jews

Baba Mezia 24a . If a Jew finds an object lost by a gentile ("heathen") it does not have to be returned. (Affirmed also in Baba Kamma 113b). Sanhedrin 76a. God will not spare a Jew who "marries his daughter to an old man or takes a wife for his infant son or returns a lost article to a Cuthean..."

Jews May Rob and Kill Non-Jews

Sanhedrin 57a . When a Jew murders a gentile ("Cuthean"), there will be no death penalty. What a Jew steals from a gentile he may keep.

Baba Kamma 37b. The gentiles are outside the protection of the law and God has "exposed their money to Israel."

Jews May Lie to Non-Jews

Baba Kamma 113a. Jews may use lies ("subterfuges") to circumvent a Gentile.

Non-Jewish Children are Sub-Human

Yebamoth 98a. All gentile children are animals.

Abodah Zarah 36b. Gentile girls are in a state of niddah (filth) from birth.

Abodah Zarah 22a-22b . Gentiles prefer sex with cows.

Where a Jew Should Do Evil

Moed Kattan 17a: If a Jew is tempted to do evil he should go to a city where he is not known and do the evil there.

Penalty for Disobeying Rabbis

Erubin 21b. Whosoever disobeys the rabbis deserves death and will be punished by being boiled in hot excrement in hell
 
YieldedOne said:
Bro. I don't know what your deal is...but none of the questions (or Boaz's responses) have ANYTHING AT ALL to do with any claim of divinity for Jesus. Just look at the sentences again. My whole aim was to note the similarities between Judaism and Christianity and to explain how some Christians can use the term "Judeo-Christian" meaningfully. This was specifically about THAT...and nothing else!
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This is why I called you out on your trickery, as it has been proven in the other threads.

Now please answer me honestly: Is Jesus very god from very god or not?
 
To Siam (112)

Stoning , executions, 'eye for an eye; teeth for theth', polygamy, conception of God by what He does (Judge, Lording over, Master), not yet according to what He is. Tendency to see God as violent...
 
To Naidama (114)

I had read that but thanks again. First, I have to point out that the Judaism we are talking about today is not the one practice by Mary and Jesus, if it were, these Jews would be Christians. They certainly got somethings wrong about the Faith of their ancestors. You will notice that they don't even recognize Jesus in any capacity, while at least Muslim recognize him as Prophet. For some precision, I will use key descriptive words about how each realition see God and his relation to us:

Judaism: Lord/servants also Father/Son(God-> man;Israel)
Islam: Master/slaves
Christianity: Lord/servants also Father/Son(God->God/Man;Jesus => Church)

No as we all know, Jews don't see the fatherhood of God as something real, but more poetical. At least the more they have this view, the more they approch Islam. Islam view God as absolute Master.
About bloody sacrifices, and sin; of course, where else did Christianity inherit terms like 'lamb'; as I said, modern Judaism is just different from the ancient one. John the Baptist would not have used the term 'lamb' to describe Jesus if he did not know what it meant for Jews.
 
Amigo said:
First, I have to point out that the Judaism we are talking about today is not the one practice by Mary and Jesus,
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Mary and Jesus (pbut) followed all the jewish scriptures, and in fact, Jesus was a rabbinic jew, he was a teacher.
Mary and Jesus did not follow the NT.
Today's jews follow all jewish scriptures, today's jews do not follow the NT.
In fact, Jesus said he was sent to the lost sheep of Israel only and that he didn't come to abolish the (mosaic) law, but to fulfill them. So clearly Jesus didn't intend to create christianity.

In addition, the most important one: Mary and Jesus worshiped the one true God, and they were strictly monotheistic.
Compared that to todays christianity.

Amigo said:
if it were, these Jews would be Christians.
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what are you talking about? of course the jews would not be christians, hell, even jesus wouldn't be christian.

Amigo said:
They certainly got somethings wrong about the Faith of their ancestors. You will notice that they don't even recognize Jesus in any capacity, while at least Muslim recognize him as Prophet.
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I WILL notice??
Did you even read my post?? apparently you did not, despite you lying about it.
In my post, I said the jews didnt recognize the prophethood of Jesus (p), but muslims do.
Stop the christians word twisting habit!

Which is a greater deviation: not recognizing man as prophet, or making man as God?

The jews went to one extreme while christians went to the other farthest extreme. Islam give recognition to Jesus as a special prophet and NOT making him as God.
 
Special for Amigo and others who are interested,

so, Jesus (pbuh) spoke aramaic, right?
Then go to this english-aramaic translator, and see what Jesus actually said when he prayed to God, just type "god" in the box.

http://www.pe****ta.org/

Just replace the stars with the letters "s" "h" "i" and "t"

it gets auto-censored.
 
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Hi Naidamar, I went to that site and did what you asked me. I am not sure what you wanted me to notice, can you be more detailed? thanks.

About noticing what jews believe about Jesus vs what Muslims believe about him, I knew that you know that ...seriously. Have a sense of humour:)... communication is more than letters sometimes:).

Well, about Jesus and the NT, He is the NT. And the OT is revealed in the new while the NT is hiden in the old. I am not talking about book(s) here. I am not talking about letters here, I am talking about the living Word of God. And yes, Mary was/is strictly monotheistic; and she is my Mother teaching me strict, pure, and full monotheism.
 
Amigo said:
Well, about Jesus and the NT, He is the NT.
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Umm...have you ACTUALLY opened your bible? Do you actually know what is in the NT?

Jesus (pbuh) is certainly not the NT.
The NT does not even contain "the gospel of Jesus".
The NT contains the gospels of john, matthew, mark, luke, the acts, pauline epistles, catholic epistles, revelation, pastoral epitsles. And some other church such as the Ethiopian orthodox add some other books as well.
None of it is "the gospel of Jesus"
Not only that, the development and canonization of the NT went for centuries, long after jesus. No need also to mention that the four gospels were written by anonymous people, long after jesus departure, AND in totally different language than the language spoken by Jesus (p).

I understand that in order to have belief in catholicism, you must have suppress your ear, eye, and mind over any facts and evidence and just ahve blind faith over what your popes and priests tell you.
The way you believe things in christianity and catholicism is no different than how children believe that santa clause really exist.

Amigo said:
And the OT is revealed in the new while the NT is hidden in the old.
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What does this even mean? Is there any christian who speaks in simple english, instead of speaking in tongue all the time?
Please try to make sense for once, guys.

Amigo said:
And yes, Mary was/is strictly monotheistic; and she is my Mother teaching me strict, pure, and full monotheism.
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So Mary is your mother (really? LOL) who teaches you strict, pure, and full monotheism, and in return you worship God the father, jesus, and the wandering ghosts?

And you repay your mother by worshiping her..ooopss not even her, but her statues! :

idolatrymary_worship-1.jpg


mary_worship_is_crazy-486x326.jpg



Either christians have totally new meanings for every single english words, or that christians do not act the words they speak, and do not mean the words they speak. If not, then why is it that your words are almost always contradictory to your acts and to the reality/facts/evidence?

 
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Following the last post, here's another difference between the belief of jews and christianity: The jews still keep the commandments given to Moses (the commandements that Jesus also kept and followed), while christians do not believe in the most important of the commandments:

you shall have no other gods before me.

You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and fourth generation of those who reject me,
 
We are also aware of those verse. We have them in our Catechism.
We don't make idols, we make statues
We don't bow down before idols.
We bow down before statues of the people in our hearts who are in heaven, recalling/acknowledging/celebrating their presence/love for us, we bow down to receive their blessings and prayers for us.
Everyone who loves can understand these things.
 
Amigo said:
We are also aware of those verse. We have them in our Catechism. We don't make idols, we make statues We don't bow down before idols. We bow down before statues of the people in our hearts who are in heaven, recalling/acknowledging/celebrating their presence/love for us, we bow down to receive their blessings and prayers for us. Everyone who loves can understand these things.
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This is yet another example of what I wrote earlier:

- christians devise new meanings of the words
- christians words contradict their actions

Amigo said:
We don't make idols, we make statues
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ok. whatever. other people can see what you do. Just because you claim you don't does not mean you don't.

Amigo said:
We don't bow down before idols.
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People are able to see the two images I have shown in my previous post, and from direct experience they have with christians or catholics.

Amigo said:
We bow down before statues of the people in our hearts who are in heaven, recalling/acknowledging/celebrating their presence/love for us, we bow down to receive their blessings and prayers for us.
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Ok. your statues give you blessings. I get that.
My question: why need the statues? They are so random and don't look like mary, jesus, etc anyway.
you receive blessings from mary? So apart god, how many other people and angels and saints and what have you that can give you blessings?

Amigo said:
Everyone who loves can understand these things.
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Everyone who loves to deceive themselves and to follow their whims and desires, as opposed to following God.
 
"I don't worship idols, I only bow my head and prostrate in front of statues to receive blessings"

"I am a strict monotheist, but I worship a supreme God, a hybrid God-human and a ghost"

"I didn't steal, I only borrowed without the knowledge of the owner"


see the similarities?
 

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