How I became Muslim

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Sure, Not all bible is filled with smut.
But it doesn't nullify my argument that christians believe God has written eortic stories to express His disgusts.

If you christians do not think huge penises, fondling breasts, incestuous sex, etc are too explicit, not even too explicit for children, then christians certainly have pretty loose attitude when it comes to erotic stories.
Do you believe that your won scripture is intended for everyone or not?
Is that why catholics are not allowed by vatican to read bible on their own?


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]I still think that you are making too big a deal out of this.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Surah4:56 says:[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Thosewho reject our Signs, We shall soon cast into the Fire: as often astheir skins are roasted through, We shall change them for freshskins, that they may taste the penalty: for Allah is Exalted inPower, Wise. [/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]AndSurah 44:47-48 says:[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Avoice will cry: "Seize ye him and drag him into the midst of theBlazing Fire! "Then pour over his head the Penalty of BoilingWater”.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Aboutthree quarters of the surahs in the Qur'an make mention or referenceto hell or hellfire. There are passages like those quoted above thatlinger over graphic details of the most fiendish tortures imaginable.[/FONT]


[FONT=Arial, sans-serif]Thisto me is far more obscene and disturbing than the mention of ahorse's genitals in a verse in Ezekiel. [/FONT]
 
I think you missed this question:

Did Jesus (pbuh) refer to any writing in the verse?


I believe that he did. Earlier verses in Jesus' recorded prayer give more information.

John 17:6 "they (Jesus' disciples) have observed your word"
John 17:8 "the sayings that you gave me I have given them"
John 17:14 "I have given your word to them"

Jesus many times quoted the Hebrew scriptures to his disciples. And in addition he told them new things from God that are recorded in the Gospels.
 
I still think that you are making too big a deal out of this. Surah4:56 says: Thosewho reject our Signs, We shall soon cast into the Fire: as often astheir skins are roasted through, We shall change them for freshskins, that they may taste the penalty: for Allah is Exalted inPower, Wise. AndSurah 44:47-48 says: Avoice will cry: "Seize ye him and drag him into the midst of theBlazing Fire! "Then pour over his head the Penalty of BoilingWater”. Aboutthree quarters of the surahs in the Qur'an make mention or referenceto hell or hellfire. There are passages like those quoted above thatlinger over graphic details of the most fiendish tortures imaginable. Thisto me is far more obscene and disturbing than the mention of ahorse's genitals in a verse in Ezekiel.

Seriously, Hiroshi?
You can't defend how bible contains smut and pornography materials so explicit that if it weren't a scripture it would have been banned for general consumption in all countries including the most liberal ones, and now you want to take a shot at the Qur'an?
You actually believe that pornography is better than promise of punishments of hell for those who deserve it?

You actually think that when bible talks about fondling virgin breasts, a man enjoy his lover's vaginal juice, ejaculation like horses, a sister gets naked and raunchy with her own brother and every single earthly desires is much better than description of punishment in the hereafter, as a warning for those who are against the command of God?
Or do you want me to quotes more smut passages from bible? What other purposes did it really serve, apart from verbalizing the fantasies of rabbis and scribes who attributed them to God?
In my opinion, those who object to the idea description of the punishments of hell only show that the person realizes that they may go there, and hence their objection.

let me get you straight:
You believe when god in the bible talks about mans penises as big as donkeys, he only wants to shame the israelites?
So bible is actually intended for less than 1% of human being?
Why don't you follow the Qur'an of which God (SWT) directly and plainly claims it is His own WORD, unchanged and preserved, guidelines for ALL mankind?

 
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I believe that he did. Earlier verses in Jesus' recorded prayer give more information. John 17:6 "they (Jesus' disciples) have observed your word" John 17:8 "the sayings that you gave me I have given them" John 17:14 "I have given your word to them" Jesus many times quoted the Hebrew scriptures to his disciples. And in addition he told them new things from God that are recorded in the Gospels.

Again, Hiroshi, you need to be honest with yourself:

Not Only you love to pick and twist Qur'an verses out of context, you actually also do that with your own scripture.

In those verses, it is clear that Jesus (pbuh) taught his disciples the word of God. I never disputed that, but did he ask them to put them in writing? NO.
Was there any evidence even from the bible that the disciples recorded everything Jesus say and did in writing? No
They never did.
The loudest evidence is clearly presented in the bible itself, where the NT only contains no more than 18% of jesus sayings.

Also, Hiroshi, you claimed that bible = word of god.

Does this mean Jesus (pbuh) read from the bible and taught them to his disciples?
Which bible version that Jesus (pbuh) use? Koine Greek? King James Version? Good News Bible? New World Translation bible maybe?

If only you are honest with yourself, you may find the truth, Hiroshi.
 


Seriously, Hiroshi?
You can't defend how bible contains smut and pornography materials so explicit that if it weren't a scripture it would have been banned for general consumption in all countries including the most liberal ones, and now you want to take a shot at the Qur'an?
You actually believe that pornography is better than promise of punishments of hell for those who deserve it?

You actually think that when bible talks about fondling virgin breasts, a man enjoy his lover's vaginal juice, ejaculation like horses, a sister gets naked and raunchy with her own brother and every single earthly desires is much better than description of punishment in the hereafter, as a warning for those who are against the command of God?
Or do you want me to quotes more smut passages from bible? What other purposes did it really serve, apart from verbalizing the fantasies of rabbis and scribes who attributed them to God?
In my opinion, those who object to the idea description of the punishments of hell only show that the person realizes that they may go there, and hence their objection.

let me get you straight:
You believe when god in the bible talks about mans penises as big as donkeys, he only wants to shame the israelites?
So bible is actually intended for less than 1% of human being?
Why don't you follow the Qur'an of which God (SWT) directly and plainly claims it is His own WORD, unchanged and preserved, guidelines for ALL mankind?


Please understand that I am not seeking to take a shot at the Qur'an (although I cannot myself imagine the God of the Bible speaking in such a way). I just want to get things in perspective. Some people would find Ezekiel objectionable. I believe that some people would find the Quranic verses that I quoted even more shocking.

What keeps being overlooked is an important lesson from the book of Ezekiel. In real terms, chapter 23 is actually speaking about Samaria and Jerusalem forming alliances with Assyria and Babylon. From a human standpoint someone might say: "What is wrong with that?" The Israelites of those cities might not even have been aware of committing any wrongdoing.

But how did God view matters?

The Israelites no longer put their trust in God but were beginning to turn instead to idolatrous nations for security and safety. To God it was as if a wife had left her husband and had gone to commit fornication with others.

With our limited human perception it is not always easy to see things God's way. But the words in Ezekiel make it clear that God was every bit as offended, hurt and disgusted as would be a man whose wife had become a prostitute. Something that may have seemed innocent to the Israelites (although they should have known better) was actually causing God the most monstrous outrage.

So God let them know how he felt in terms that expressed the reality of the situation.

This is not just a lesson for the Israelites but is a lesson for all mankind. James 4:4 warns Christians: "Adulteresses, do you not know that friendship with the world is emnity with God?" Christians back then were in danger of adopting the world's loose morality and bad conduct because of too close association with the world. The scripture says that God would view them as shameful adulteresses in a spiritual sense if they acted that way. This is very similar to the words in Ezekiel.

The Bible does not mention sexual matters in order to appeal to the gratuitously sensational, the lurid or the prurient or with the aim of offending the sensibilities of anyone. But the Bible is very open and specific where necessary. As I have explained, there are important lessons to be learned that God is helping us to see.
 
Please understand that I am not seeking to take a shot at the Qur'an (although I cannot myself imagine the God of the Bible speaking in such a way.I just want to get things in perspective. Some people would find Ezekiel objectionable. I believe that some people would find the Quranic verses that I quoted even more shocking

You cannot imagine God of the bible give mankind warnings of eternal punishment?
I don't know if you believe in the existence of hell or not, but I thought that all christians do believe in hell.

Would it be fair and just if God never give any warnings of the torments of hell for those who deserve to be sent there and then He send them there?
Why is the description of hell shocking? Muslims understand that hell will even be more terrible than what is explicitly described.
And even with the promise of the torments of hell, still, many people, including muslims, not living life according to what has been provided by Allah SWT.
You think hell is shocking? Well, THAT is the idea. To make people come back to reality that this world is only temporary.

Now what purpose is there for God of the bible to write pornographic materials in the scripture?
Is it to be made as a warning not to be a prostitute or as written manual to be a prostitute?
What is the wsidom in that?

First you said it was only for israelites, and now you are saying it's for mankind, which one is that?
Do children of today really need to learn that prostitute only desire lovers whose penises as big as donkey penises and can ejaculate as bug amoung as horses and who fondle their breasts and enjoy their vaginal juices?
Do your children need that?
Maybe christians children do?
But why then the kid in that article I posted previously was almost kicked out of his christian school by his practicing christian teacher only for copying the smut material from bible?

Here's more pornographic materials (and I actually invite you to write more Qur'an verses here, especially about hell, so to shock all of us that the punishment for our disobedience will be severe):

"If only you were my brother, who was nursed at my mother's breasts! Then, if I found you outside, I would kiss you, and no one would despise me. I would lead you and bring you to my mother's house-- she who has taught me. I would give you spiced wine to drink [i.e., her vagina's semen!], the nectar of my pomegranates [vagina]. His left arm is under my head and his right arm embraces me."
Song of Songs 8:1-3

"Dear brothers, I'm a walled-in virgin still, but my breasts are full— And when my lover sees me, he knows he'll soon be satisfied."
Song of Songs 8:10

Incestuous thoughts and extramarital sex in just few verses ?
God of the bible is trying to teach the readers on the joy of unbounded sex?
 
I'm still waiting for you to answer this:

Which bible version that Jesus (pbuh) use? Koine Greek? King James Version? Good News Bible? New World Translation bible maybe?

Remember, you claimed bible = word of God
So, when jesus (pbuh) said word of God, which bible version did he refer to?
 


You cannot imagine God of the bible give mankind warnings of eternal punishment?
I don't know if you believe in the existence of hell or not, but I thought that all christians do believe in hell.



The Hebrew word "Sheol" and the Greek word "Hades" both mean the grave. Another Greek word "Gehenna" means a rubbish dump (Gehenna or Hebrew "Geh Hinnom" is where the Arabic word for hell "Jahannam" comes from). Various different translations of the Bible render Sheol, Hades and Gehenna as "hell" but none of these words mean a place of eternal conscious fiery torment.




Here's more pornographic materials (and I actually invite you to write more Qur'an verses here, especially about hell, so to shock all of us that the punishment for our disobedience will be severe):

"If only you were my brother, who was nursed at my mother's breasts! Then, if I found you outside, I would kiss you, and no one would despise me. I would lead you and bring you to my mother's house-- she who has taught me. I would give you spiced wine to drink [i.e., her vagina's semen!], the nectar of my pomegranates [vagina]. His left arm is under my head and his right arm embraces me."
Song of Songs 8:1-3

"Dear brothers, I'm a walled-in virgin still, but my breasts are full— And when my lover sees me, he knows he'll soon be satisfied."
Song of Songs 8:10

Incestuous thoughts and extramarital sex in just few verses ?
God of the bible is trying to teach the readers on the joy of unbounded sex?

I don't know where you get these ideas from. Song of Songs 8:2 only speaks of wine and pomegranates. Where does it mention the woman's vagina?

And Song of Songs 8:10 just says: "I am a wall, and my breasts are like towers. In this case I have become in his eyes like her that is finding peace."

Perhaps you have a translation there that is too liberal with paraphrase.
 


Also, Hiroshi, you claimed that bible = word of god.

Does this mean Jesus (pbuh) read from the bible and taught them to his disciples?
Which bible version that Jesus (pbuh) use? Koine Greek? King James Version? Good News Bible? New World Translation bible maybe?

If only you are honest with yourself, you may find the truth, Hiroshi.

Jesus was familiar with the writings in the scriptures and often quoted them when necessary. The King James, Good News Bible and New World Translation were not published in the first century. But Koine Greek from the Septuagint was available.
 

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