How well do you know the Anbiyaa (alayhim assalaam)?

[OmAbdullah]

Thanks. It still seems that the difference is the desire of the beings. The angels desire what God desires wholly under God's direction. The jinn seem to have gone against the direction of God. I understand the reason for the separation of the two. Just not sure that they came at different times or from different force. I was under the impression that all angels were of the fire of God which is somewhat synonymous with the light of God. One third of them strayed from God's path in pursuit of their own selfish desires. This clarification is very welcome. Again, please take no offence to my input. I am learning and comparing notes basically.

Only for your information:

Satan's name was Azaazeel and not Iblees. Iblees means extremely hopless person. As Satan became jealous to Adam alaihi salaam, and disobeyed Allah's Command to prostrate to Adam, Allah cursed him and he became extremely hopeless from any mercy of Allah. Therefore, his name became Iblees.

Regarding God's Unity and Uniqueness, we must be very careful to abstain from associating any partner to Allah in any sense. This is a very delicate matter because a mushrik (the one who associates a partner with Allah in any sense) shall never enter Paradise.

So we can say that God created angels from light but we should not say that angels are a part of the light of Allah. Allah is a very Unique Being separate from HIS creation.

 

[OmAbdullah]

Not sure what's going on in this thread.

Well, the fact about history is, many of us believe "what we want to believe". So if there's some information that doesn't go down our throat, we say "it is wrong". That's mostly because we were brought up with one type of knowledge and we tend to follow only that, any new information that we didn't knew in the first place, makes us think it's wrong.

As far as the history of Prophets and Messengers is concerned, We only know about 25 of them as the Quran and Hadith mentions.

But our Prophet also said there were 120,000 Prophets and Messengers sent to the face of the Earth.
By name only 25 are mentioned.

So as for the rest, we can only know and learn, but surely not verify.

We as Muslims, whatever is available in the Quran and Hadith, everything in History that matches it, we agree that it's true. Anything that goes against it, we say it's wrong.
Now as far as stuff which isn't available in our texts, and neither agrees to, nor disagrees with the Quran, we say they are ambiguous. May be right, may be wrong. Because it doesn't go against the Quran, you cannot say it's wrong. And because Quran speaks nothing about it, you can't say it's 100% right.

Hence yah, to those of you who want to have certain PROOF, am sorry to say, this thread might disappoint you. Because a lot of the stories are taken from Bible too, the Old Testament and stuff, and it doesn't go against Quran, nor does it agree with, so it's ambiguous, may be right, may be wrong.
If you are the one who believes something about history with certain PROOF, then like I said, you may be disappointed with this thread.
However if you're someone who is okay with ambiguous stuff and can agree that these knowledges have no certain backed up PROOF, but may be right, may be wrong, it's something that we want to know more about, whether it is from History, from Bible, from Veda, whatever. As long as it doesn't contradict, it should be fine to many and I believe this thread is more for those type of people.

Am sorry if I have hurt anyone's feelings, but I was disappointed to see this thread turn in to a "give me proof" thread, that also of stuff which has no certain proof.

Either way, good day and I hope the OP continues his questions and gives his answers and opinions, referred from wherever he learnt them from. Whether you want to agree or not is your wish, but how about we continue this thread like usual? God bless.

Excuse me, any statement about the Prophets alaihi salaam must be true. We are all accountable and any Muslim who realizes this fact i.e. he/she has strong belief in the Accounting in the Court of Allah in the life after death, shall be careful in this thread. If the thread was about some worldly matter, then any statement taken from history books could be accepted.

 

[OmAbdullah]

RE: Book of Enoch (Idris AS)

The book of enoch is supposed to be an ancient religious work ascribed by tradition to Enoch, the great grandfather of Noah (Alaihis salaam).

The problem here is that the Jews were not even an idea let alone a race when Enoch lived.

And when Noah's ark settled the earth, there were no humans left except for Noah, his wife, his three sons and their wives... Where is the book of Noah?

How did a book of a pre-flood prophet survive and yet, Noah's own revelations not survive?

It wasn't until approx 2900 year later (according to biblical timelines) between Enoch and David (father of Jews) - and there was a world flood between then too.

Moses was before David - yet Moses never spoke of any book of Enoch.

the israelites at the time of their slavery in Egypt, had all but lost their religion, and had started to worship Egyptian deities.

SO I ask - what nonsense is this regarding the Book of Enoch? its a LIE.

Scimi

The Holy Qur'aan is the witness that the Ark of Nuh alaihi salaam had his family + more Muslims other than his family. Allah said that they were the nations of the future. Insha Allah, I will post the verses and the surah's name.

 

[OmAbdullah]

I don't believe that the flood covered the whole earth, it has covered only Arabia.

The flood covered the whole earth, the Ark of Nuh alaihi salaam stopped it the top of Judi mountain and Allah made it a sign for the future races. That ark is seen by the people of our time. Judi mountain is in Turkey, not in Arabia.

 

[Khalid Saifullah]

Day Seven: Sayyadina Adam (عليه السلام‎):

7. What creation did Allah decide to create, giving them an intellect and shaping them “in the best of forms” so that they could take up the vicegerency of Allah on earth, after the Jinn?

Human Beings, the first of whom was Sayyadina Adam (عليه السلام‎), known as Abul Bashr (Father of Mankind). (Qur’an 2:31-37)

 

[Khalid Saifullah]

Day Eight: Sayyadina Adam (عليه السلام‎):

8. Mankind is also generally rebellious. If Allah destroys us, will He create another creation to inhabit the earth in order to continue with His vicegerency?

 

[Celebrimbor]

Day Eight: Sayyadina Adam (عليه السلام‎):

8. Mankind is also generally rebellious. If Allah destroys us, will He create another creation to inhabit the earth in order to continue with His vicegerency?

Ermmm Yes and No

Yes because I remember an ayah when Allah states that if we are evil, He would destroy us and replace us with better people ? (Something along those lines)

No because mankind is the last of creation before the judgement day ? Donno what happens after that though lol

 

[BlueOwl358]

Same answer, kinda in a mixed bag. We do know Humans are the best form of creation and we will remain until the end. If He wanted to, yes, He could replace us, but I don't think humans will get replaced. Individual nations maybe, but not the entirety of mankind. And the previous stated hadith helps with that (which actually states what would happen if we did not sin).

"Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) having said: By Him in Whose Hand is my life, if you were not to commit sin, Allah would sweep you out of existence and He would replace (you by) those people who would commit sin and seek forgiveness from Allah, and He would have pardoned them." (Sahih Muslim 2749)

So we won't get destroyed and get replaced because we are rebellious. We would either continue somehow, or face Judgement day, because humans do commit sin. We know that we will survive until Judgement Day. And I know that there won't be any creations after that, at least that is what I think.

So, humans won't get replaced because we are rebellious, we would get replaced if we were sinless, which isn't the case. We will be ended eventually, but not replaced, because we are final sentient species. But, if Allah wanted to, all things are under His command.

 

[Abz2000]

)I have quoted only that part of the hadeeth which is objectionable. Full hadeeth can be read in the post 58.)

It appears that among the narraters, starting from the beginning until now, there is a person who is very rude as well as fearless. He/she doesn't fear Allah and so has attributed false words to the action of the Prophet Muhammad salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam. We cannot believe that the Prophet Muhammad salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam slept deeply in "lay down position" and then led the Muslims in fajar prayer without ablution. The Prophets of Allah never acted against their teaching. They were the first to act upon what they taught their Ummahs.

We must remember that the Prophet salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam informed us that anyone who willfully attributes false words to the Prophet salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam, he makes for himself place in Hell. The arrogant person has attributed wrong action to the Prophet salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam thus trying to mislead many Muslims. So he/she made for him/herself a place in the Hell-Fire. He/she is also very rude saying that the Prophet salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam snored and that he had the habit of snoring. I have read so many ahaadeeth, uloom-ul hadeeth and commentaries of the Holy Qur'aan but I never read such rude words about him. Also every one must know that these rude words are not part of the hadeeth therefore, their mentioning is quite useless and is for the purpose of rudeness for which the sinner shall suffer in Hell.

a little late in replying - many diversions meet me on my path so i have to do some kung fu and struggle back to the straight and narrow,
JazakaAllahu khayran for pointing that out sis, i didn't even notice that part as i skimmed through though i remember stopping and turning it over my mind for ages a few years back, we know that the prophet pbuh would usually take a nap after tahajjud, even if it was short, there is no reason to believe that the prophet pbuh didn't snore, it is recorded that he (pbuh) would snore loudly when he would go into the trance of receiving revelation, the reading prayer after sleeping without ablution part, i can only perceive three possibilities, it wasn't true (there are flaws in some ahadith which have made it into the sahihain), it was true however the practice of performing ablution after nodding off wasn't yet established at the time of incidence, or that he pbuh wasn't aware that he had fallen asleep and the companions were too shy to tell him as they were uncertain of questioning him when he pbuh prayed two rakah instead of four, though he pbuh had to push them to inform him.
and Allah knows best.

 

[Scimitar]

If we keep suspecting everything, then that's going to be difficult eh... xD.

No. Its more orderly when I know what texts are unreliable, so I don't have to consider them

I follow "method"... I don't know what you follow. But whatever bro If you prefer chinese whispers then - that's your delusion, not mine

Scimi

 

[Abz2000]

there's forcefully pushing a dubious hadith and then there's preserving it for future consideration, for instance, we see that some ahadith pertaining to the age we live in and references to others are found scattered in books from hundreds but not a thousand years ago, and some of these are totally accurate and without miss, such as the believer seeing his brother from east to west and west to east, the ability to globally communicate sound and vision without a postman involved etc, these prophecies didn't make it into the sahih for whatever reason but were preserved up until a certain time, we know it isn't sinful to keep them and we know that some have however been discarded in the memory hole out of doubt, fear of keeping apocraphy, deatroyed by the mongols or americans in baghdad.
sometimes i so wish saddam had hired a bunch of typists to make them electronic so that we could at least sift through them and try to make more sense of what is happening.
but as Allah says, sanuqri-uka falaa tansaa illa maashaaAllah.

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/scrolls_deadsea/deadsea_scrollsdeception/scrollsdeception17.htm

 

[OmAbdullah]

Allah created the Jinn to take over the duty of worshiping Allah and to be His vicegerent on earth. In order to achieve this, He sent an army of Jinn to subdue these other beings, which they successfully did. They were then assigned to dwell on earth and to worship Allah. For their guidance, 800 prophets were sent, but they slew them all and caused much corruption on earth. In order to restore order, Allah sent an army of angels, led by Azazil, the Jinn, to subdue them and confine them to remote islands and high mountains. Only the pious jinn were left alone. This brought an end to the rule of the Jinn on earth, but there was one pious Jinn named Azazil, who was but a child at that stage, who was uplifted to the skies. (Hidayat ke Chiragh of Maulana M. Abdur Rahman Mazhari, vol. 1, page 57)

For Muslims there are only 2 sources of the knowledge of Truth and they are more than sufficient, these are the Holy Qur'aan and the Sunnah. From these 2 sources, we know that Jinns lived on this earth before mankind and that Allah created them to worship Allah. But from where comes this long story? What is the source of knowledge with M.Abdur Rahman Mazhari?

 

[OmAbdullah]

Okay, but i didn't get why God can destroy the other nations in the world just because of the sins of the tribe of Nuh (as)

Allah had given the Prophet Nuh alaihi salaam very long life and he had tried to guide his nation for 950 years. But only a small number of people had accepted the guidance. From his own family 2 persons i.e. his wife and a son also were among the rejecters of Islam, so they were also drowned in the flood. His son was drowned in front of his eyes. See this story in surah Hud verses 25--48. Note how was his kafir son drowned in front of his eyes. Also read the commentary of verse 48. It is very deep. Allah said in verse 40 that very few people had accepted the faith (of Islam) with him while in the verse 48 Allah said salaam and blessings on Nuh alaihi salaam and on the nations that were with him, along with that Allah also mentioned the kafir nations and warning of the painful punishment for them. This was at the time when the wrath of Allah stopped and Nuh alaihi salam was advised to leave the Ark on the Judi mountain. Please read this beautiful commentary which is so deep and full of wisdom.

 

[Abz2000]

For Muslims there are only 2 sources of the knowledge of Truth and they are more than sufficient, these are the Holy Qur'aan and the Sunnah. From these 2 sources, we know that Jinns lived on this earth before mankind and that Allah created them to worship Allah. But from where comes this long story? What is the source of knowledge with M.Abdur Rahman Mazhari?

sister i totally agree with you on your position on baseless conjecture, there have been incidences in the past too that some scholars have fallen into that trap, we must however know that Allah Himself tell us in the Quran to seek truth, use our intellects and adopt it as the way, the Quran doesn't need to tell you that tony blair exists, you find that out from your intellect, i bet you've never seen him face to face though

we use the Quran and sunnah as a guiding principle in our lives and even with some of the sahih graded hadith there are fabrications which must be looked at and weighed based upon gained knowledge and intellect, the prophet pbuh was never shy to adopt a good practice even if it was entrusted in the hands of people who opposed him, we can see this from the fast of ashura, the fact that he pbuh adopted the stoning for adultery rule from the torah, and many other practices.
Allah has given you an intellect, people who limit themselves to only what knowledge they perceive as their owndeprive themselves of moving forward because All knowledge is from Allah, we should seek the truth and accept it.
again, regarding some of the conjecture concerning the origin and time of earthly rule of jinn, personally i agree that it appears baseless but it's not haram to preserve such information. i would not throw it in the bin in case it can be used to understand future findings but i definitely would neither confirm nor deny it unless more solid evidence was available to support or contradict it.
the knowledge either came from a source and the origins are lost, or it's fabricated, Allah knows best.
the Quran and Sunnah however are the begining of knowledge, and a person's knowledge cannot be even fractionally completed on the day they die, though the reading of the Quran and hadith can.
the reason why we accept the Quran as truth is because our knowledge and intelligence compel us to, otherwise we'd be following anything we found our parents upon.
the way i see it, the more people do halal (not nazi mk ultra style) research and make new findings, the more they'll come to the truth, and if i was afraid of them coming to the truth, it would mean that i am not upon the truth.
below is the story of a man who came to the conclusion that Jesus Christ was neither killed nor crucified, he explains the delving he did and the ancient documents he found, then analysed, the obstacles which confronted him, and the controversy he caused, however, being an open minded scholar, he couldn't accept standing upon falsehood just because everyone else around him thought it was unfashionable to think critically and speak the truth:
the screenshots uploaded in an incorrect order but the page numbers are at the tops of the pages, they are regarding documents, most likely prophecies abot the second coming:

http://s248.photobucket.com/user/abz2000123/library/the jesus papers - intro

 

[shafat10]

No. Its more orderly when I know what texts are unreliable, so I don't have to consider them

I follow "method"... I don't know what you follow. But whatever bro If you prefer chinese whispers then - that's your delusion, not mine

Scimi

I can't go back in time to prove that the stories about them 120,000 Prophets are real as we are hearing them xD but as long as it doesn't contradict the Quran and Hadith, there's no problem in knowing them too , because we don't have that information, it can only be taken from previous religious scriptures or what history says. And because you can't go back in time to prove them, you either have to agree, disagree, or just let it stay ambiguous. I prefer it to remain ambiguous :v, but learning something ambiguous isn't wrong either eh xD.

 

[shafat10]

The flood covered the whole earth, the Ark of Nuh alaihi salaam stopped it the top of Judi mountain and Allah made it a sign for the future races. That ark is seen by the people of our time. Judi mountain is in Turkey, not in Arabia.

Sorry sister but archaeological evidences disagree with it.
Even the Quran doesn't say that the whole Earth was submerged.
The Quran says that the Tribe of Nuh PBUH was submerged, if you read in context, it doesn't speak about the whole world, but just he and his people.
Secondly, the Quran doesn't give a time frame of when it happened.
Archaeological evidences say it took place around 21st to 22nd century BC.
Scientists tell us that the 3rd Dynasty of Babylon and 11th Dynasty of Egypt was uninterrupted during the 21st and 22nd century BC.
So scientifically it's not possible that Nuh PBUH's flood occurred in the whole world, neither does the Quran speak about a worldly flood. Reading in context makes this point clear.

 

[shafat10]

Excuse me, any statement about the Prophets alaihi salaam must be true. We are all accountable and any Muslim who realizes this fact i.e. he/she has strong belief in the Accounting in the Court of Allah in the life after death, shall be careful in this thread. If the thread was about some worldly matter, then any statement taken from history books could be accepted.

As far as the 120,000 Prophets and Messengers are concerned. You have no information regarding them in Quran and Hadith.
If something disagrees with Quran, we say it's wrong. If something agrees, we say it's right.
If something neither agrees nor disagrees, we say it's ambiguous, neither right, neither wrong.
As far as the remaining Prophets are concerned, we say it's ambiguous, so we are not saying it's true, neither are we saying it's false. It's something we are just knowing and tagging as "ambiguous".
Hope this helps .

 

[Abz2000]

no wonder we fell behind after the iniitial caliphates, the cia seems to be doing the research and gaining the advantage on the material sphere by connecting dots and understanding the psyche and struggles of past peoples including the history of Islam, more detailed than many of us have the ability to acquire, and the events in the future, then hiding it from the masses who appear bored of scripture and content with fox news. does anyone think that the final messenger was the only one receiving details of the end times? if not, do they think details of future events were revealed only for the people of the ancient times, or for us living in this time too?





i almost fell of my bed laughing at the following article from an anarchist site, God knows the intelligence and background knowledge of his target audience which appears to be atheist anarchist people who have very distant Christian roots:
it just shows how far people can go when they lose track.

So after manufacturing the bible, God, the Devil, murdering Jesus and his followers, the romans and jews funded the king Muhammad, who just like King James translated the Torah into his own language. They called it the Koran.
The CIA and British Secret Service fund Al Qaeda today, not only to murder christians and atheists, but also to control those regions for their valuable resources. The Torah being a sort of Manifest Destiny ideology sold to dictators, to “conquer” (control) “their” people (as traitors), just as the Book of the Dead, 10 commandments, Bible, Coran, Capitalist Constitutions pretending to be democratic and Communist Manifesto did. Then the romans and jews created the Imperial Roman Catholic Church and Vatican. The Vatican was built on top of a hill full of human bones, where millions of anarchists like Jesus, had been crucified in order to perpetuate hierarchism and the current dominant form of Hierarchism, being Roman Imperialism.

 

[popsthebuilder]

Only for your information:

Satan's name was Azaazeel and not Iblees. Iblees means extremely hopless person. As Satan became jealous to Adam alaihi salaam, and disobeyed Allah's Command to prostrate to Adam, Allah cursed him and he became extremely hopeless from any mercy of Allah. Therefore, his name became Iblees.

Regarding God's Unity and Uniqueness, we must be very careful to abstain from associating any partner to Allah in any sense. This is a very delicate matter because a mushrik (the one who associates a partner with Allah in any sense) shall never enter Paradise.

So we can say that God created angels from light but we should not say that angels are a part of the light of Allah. Allah is a very Unique Being separate from HIS creation.

I understand that we are not to associate partners or equals to God. That isn't logical anyway. God has many names, as does satan. I can see why one would say that evil and it's forms are not of God. But I feel that angels, and pretty much all existence is made by God, and as such, is connected to it in some way. This in no way assumes partners with GOD, as all things are subsidiary to, and under GOD.

Names seem to be divisive.

Peace.

 

[Khalid Saifullah]

Day Eight: Sayyadina Adam (عليه السلام‎):

8. Mankind is also generally rebellious. If Allah destroys us, will He create another creation to inhabit the earth in order to continue with His vicegerency?

No. The coming of the Last Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم‎) heralds the end of time. After all the major portents of the Last Day will come to pass, this entire universe will be destroyed and be substituted for another. This world is for doing deeds, and the other world will be to reap the reward or the punishment thereof. (Qur’an 21:104)