Paris Attacks

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I really do not understand this guy i mean in most of his posts he addresses us like we have commited a crime or something

Abz do u consider us muslims ? Or have we become "murtadeen" ?
 
I really do not understand this guy i mean in most of his posts he addresses us like we have commited a crime or something

Hopefully you'll take it upon yourself to understand what Allah who is my Master and your Master says, He is not limited by my ineloquence.


84.*To the Madyan People (We sent) Shu'aib, one of their own brethren:
he said: "O my people! worship Allah. Ye have no other god but Him. And give not short measure or weight: I see you in prosperity, but I fear for you the penalty of a day that will compass (you) all round.
85.*"And O my people! give just measure and weight, nor withhold from the people the things that are their due: commit not evil in the land with intent to do mischief.
86.*"That which is left you by Allah is best for you, if ye (but) believed! but I am not set over you to keep watch!"
87.*They said: "O Shu'aib! Does thy (religion of) prayer command thee that we leave off the worship which our fathers practised, or that we leave off doing what we like with our property? truly, thou art the one that forbeareth with faults and is right- minded!"
88.*He said: "O my people! see ye whether I have a Clear (Sign) from my Lord, and He hath given me sustenance (pure and) good as from Himself? I wish not, in opposition to you, to do that which I forbid you to do. I only desire (your) betterment to the best of my power; and my success (in my task) can only come from Allah. In Him I trust, and unto Him I look.
89.*"And O my people! let not my dissent (from you) cause you to sin, lest ye suffer a fate similar to that of the people of Noah or of Hud or of Salih, nor are the people of Lut far off from you!
90.*"But ask forgiveness of your Lord, and turn unto Him (in repentance): For my Lord is indeed full of mercy and loving-kindness."

91.*They said: "O Shu'aib! much of what thou sayest we do not understand!

In fact among us we see that thou hast no strength!

Were it not for thy family, we should certainly have stoned thee! for thou hast among us no great position!"
92.*He said: "O my people! is then my family of more consideration with you than Allah. For ye cast Him away behind your backs (with contempt). But verily my Lord encompasseth on all sides all that ye do!
93.*"And O my people! Do whatever ye can: I will do (my part): Soon will ye know who it is on whom descends the penalty of ignominy; and who is a liar! and watch ye! for I too am watching with you!"
94.*When Our decree issued, We saved Shu'aib and those who believed with him, by (special) mercy from Ourselves: But the (mighty) blast did seize the wrong- doers, and they lay prostrate in their homes by the morning,-
95.*As if they had never dwelt and flourished there! Ah! Behold! How the Madyan were removed (from sight) as were removed the Thamud!


So a pondering person notes that it is an ancient tradition of those who deny truth to resort to casting ambiguous and illusory arguments, then pretending to not understand what is clear and making irrational threats after they have no valid arguments against what is complete and clear - And Allah sees all that we do. ("we" as in everyone in the universe).

Abz do u consider us muslims ? Or have we become "murtadeen" ?


What and/or who do you mean by "we"? Please give clear and wholesome descriptions.
 
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Abz,
Like one can be dragging away by jinns, has to be stick to his own destiny.
 
Hopefully you'll take it upon yourself to understand what Allah who is my Master and your Master says, He is not limited by my ineloquence.


84.*To the Madyan People (We sent) Shu'aib, one of their own brethren:
he said: "O my people! worship Allah. Ye have no other god but Him. And give not short measure or weight: I see you in prosperity, but I fear for you the penalty of a day that will compass (you) all round.
85.*"And O my people! give just measure and weight, nor withhold from the people the things that are their due: commit not evil in the land with intent to do mischief.
86.*"That which is left you by Allah is best for you, if ye (but) believed! but I am not set over you to keep watch!"
87.*They said: "O Shu'aib! Does thy (religion of) prayer command thee that we leave off the worship which our fathers practised, or that we leave off doing what we like with our property? truly, thou art the one that forbeareth with faults and is right- minded!"
88.*He said: "O my people! see ye whether I have a Clear (Sign) from my Lord, and He hath given me sustenance (pure and) good as from Himself? I wish not, in opposition to you, to do that which I forbid you to do. I only desire (your) betterment to the best of my power; and my success (in my task) can only come from Allah. In Him I trust, and unto Him I look.
89.*"And O my people! let not my dissent (from you) cause you to sin, lest ye suffer a fate similar to that of the people of Noah or of Hud or of Salih, nor are the people of Lut far off from you!
90.*"But ask forgiveness of your Lord, and turn unto Him (in repentance): For my Lord is indeed full of mercy and loving-kindness."

91.*They said: "O Shu'aib! much of what thou sayest we do not understand!

In fact among us we see that thou hast no strength!

Were it not for thy family, we should certainly have stoned thee! for thou hast among us no great position!"
92.*He said: "O my people! is then my family of more consideration with you than Allah. For ye cast Him away behind your backs (with contempt). But verily my Lord encompasseth on all sides all that ye do!
93.*"And O my people! Do whatever ye can: I will do (my part): Soon will ye know who it is on whom descends the penalty of ignominy; and who is a liar! and watch ye! for I too am watching with you!"
94.*When Our decree issued, We saved Shu'aib and those who believed with him, by (special) mercy from Ourselves: But the (mighty) blast did seize the wrong- doers, and they lay prostrate in their homes by the morning,-
95.*As if they had never dwelt and flourished there! Ah! Behold! How the Madyan were removed (from sight) as were removed the Thamud!


So a pondering person notes that it is an ancient tradition of those who deny truth to resort to casting ambiguous and illusory arguments, then pretending to not understand what is clear and making irrational threats after they have no valid arguments against what is complete and clear - And Allah sees all that we do. ("we" as in everyone in the universe).




What and/or who do you mean by "we"? Please give clear and wholesome descriptions.
Ppl who oppose bag daddys caliphate (not the true islamic caliphate)
 
Abz,
Like one can be dragging away by jinns, has to be stick to his own destiny.

Lol with human devils of the type that exist, who needs even iblees as a jinn?

I just uploaded a grainy video from a movie demonstrating how low people can go and how hopelessly lost they can become when they fail to judge by what Allah has revealed and have fools ruling over them.
The daughter pulls a short measuring line, the mother is tricked into going even shorter, then cancels it all at by validating the action and the deed of the daughter, and the family almost destroys itself.
Almost like the thought robberies in inception.

It's a bit lewd in concept:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkrloSXqdlo
 
How what work ?

You keep telling us what people shouldn't do, and how they're so wrong, however, since you are capable of ample criticism you would do better to tell us how you believe we will all live peacefully and prosperously and manage to make it into paradise at the end, so that we may consider and have the opportunity to walk aright and achieve success.
 
Anyone who supports the so called 'ISIS Caliphate' is severely misguided and clearly doesn't know the basic principles of Islam. Our beloved Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him is our leader, our guide, our role model and nowhere in the history of Islam is this kind of barbarity and indiscriminate killing of innocent human beings condoned or practiced.

There are 1.6 billion + Muslims from all corners of the globe and if such terror ISIS practices were a part of Islam we would all be wiped out. Think rationally, think and reach out to your inner common sense before you sympathise and defend the indefensible. Peace out.
 
Anyone who supports the so called 'ISIS Caliphate' is severely misguided and clearly doesn't know the basic principles of Islam. Our beloved Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him is our leader, our guide, our role model and nowhere in the history of Islam is this kind of barbarity and indiscriminate killing of innocent human beings condoned or practiced. There are 1.6 billion + Muslims from all corners of the globe and if such terror ISIS practices were a part of Islam we would all be wiped out. Think rationally, think and reach out to your inner common sense before you sympathise and defend the indefensible. Peace out.

Omg this is like an ali g moment.
Wot? Is ISIS your new boogemman when it come to explaining the universe?Is it coz they is only three years old when you is over twenty?Is all the answers in you's heart?Question is, which you is you that i can follow it, or is i to follow mine? Anarchy no doubt.



Anyone who's read 1984 should understand the mechanism which is called "two minutes hate":

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Minutes_Hate
 
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15 masjids have been attacked in Paris in the last 48 hours.

And also a sister in Leyton was pushed into the middle of the road today during busy traffic but luckily was uninjured Alhumdulillah

May Allah protect the Muslims. Ameen!
 
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15 masjids have been attacked in Paris in the last 48 hours.

And also a sister in Leyton was pushed into the middle of the road today during busy traffic but luckily was uninjured Alhumdulillah

May Allah protect the Muslims. Ameen!

Indeed. It comes from both "sides"... this attitude that everybody belongs on a "side" and we must be eternally against each other, leading to some senseless acts of violence. That said, I see a lot of decent upstanding Muslims in this thread and that is encouraging. It really does mean a lot. I would far rather hold your hand in unity than engage you in combat. The west, including France, has indeed done some horrific tings, and continues to do some horrific things. The way to stop that is not to egg it on by "justifying" it with events like what happened in Paris or endorse that or justify it after the fact (as unfortunately we also see in this thread). The way forward is to show common empathy and humanity. Only then can the doves overpower the hawks in a democracy.
 
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You make a good point. I don't know if what happened in France was ISIS led or directed. But I agree that this feeds directly into their hands, and I knew they would claim it the moment I heard it happened. Other radical groups will also claim is, though we may not hear about it as loudly. Owning what happened makes them look bigger and scarier, which is what they want.
 
Greetings,

That said, I see a lot of decent upstanding Muslims in this thread and that is encouraging. It really does mean a lot. I would far rather hold your hand in unity than engage you in combat.

This is a good point, and it seems that this point is finally getting through to the wider world. I think it's becoming clearer to society at large that orthodox Islam does not permit actions like those committed by ISIS. The large number of condemnations by Muslim organisations, the hashtags like #TerrorismHasNoReligion and other social media campaigns are really helping non-Muslims to see that Islam has been hijacked by terrorist groups, and that the vast majority of Muslims revile their actions.

Yes, there has been an increase in Islamophobic violent attacks since the events in Paris, as often happens after incidents like this, but for the first time I am cautiously optimistic that a significant change in European public opinion may be occurring.

Peace
 
Indeed. It comes from both "sides"... this attitude that everybody belongs on a "side" and we must be eternally against each other, leading to some senseless acts of violence. That said, I see a lot of decent upstanding Muslims in this thread and that is encouraging. It really does mean a lot. I would far rather hold your hand in unity than engage you in combat. The west, including France, has indeed done some horrific tings, and continues to do some horrific things. The way to stop that is not to egg it on by "justifying" it with events like what happened in Paris or endorse that or justify it after the fact (as unfortunately we also see in this thread). The way forward is to show common empathy and humanity. Only then can the doves overpower the hawks in a democracy.

What was your reaction and how much ink (electronic or physical) did you spend discussing it?
And what have you done to prevent the unlawful actions of the French government during the instigations in Libya and Syria and before September and after the bombing of Syrian Muslims since Sebtember.

Be sure that it is perfectly lawful to retaliate up to the extent of the injustice done by an aggressor and unless the people of France , U.S. U.K and their other criminal allies are retaliated against according to the number of Muslims they have murdered in the past 10 years and 10 months, or they sincerely repent, establish regular prayer, give regular zakah and rule by the laws of God as enshrined in the Quran and Sunnah, there is no way for the Muslims to condemn those who rectify the tally, one other possibility may be a truce whereby we go our separate ways and allow the people who will live according to the rule of God to come out of their lives as servitude as despised minorities and move to the majority Muslim lands, and for the kuffar who pretend that there is no God or assume that Muhammad pbuh was a liar to leave the countries in which they are a minority, and move to the lands of gog and magog where they can live their debauched lifestyles and let God be the judge between all of us with no hostilities on the part of any side - however, that would be a compromise and matter of council.
There is no "pyar kiya to ni bhana" in such an abusive relationship.
There can only be peace if there's "na mein tumhe satao, na tu mujhe satae".





55.*Those who reject Faith will not cease to be in doubt concerning (Revelation) until the Hour (of Judgment) comes suddenly upon them, or there comes to them the Penalty of a Day of Disaster.
56.*On that Day of Dominion will be that of Allah. He will judge between them: so those who believe and work righteous deeds will be in Gardens of Delight.
57.*And for those who reject Faith and deny our Signs, there will be a humiliating Punishment.
58.*Those who leave their homes in the cause of Allah, and are then slain or die,- On them will Allah bestow verily a goodly Provision: Truly Allah is He Who bestows the best provision.
59.*Verily He will admit them to a place with which they shall be well pleased: for Allah is All-Knowing, Most Forbearing.

60.*That (is so). And if one has retaliated to no greater extent than the injury he received, and is again set upon inordinately, Allah will help him: for Allah is One that blots out (sins) and forgives (again and again).

61.*That is because Allah merges night into day, and He merges day into night, and verily it is Allah Who hears and sees (all things).
62.*That is because Allah - He is the Reality; and those besides Him whom they invoke,- they are but vain Falsehood: verily Allah is He, Most High, Most Great.
63.*Seest thou not that Allah sends down rain from the sky, and forthwith the earth becomes clothed with green? for Allah is He Who understands the finest mysteries, and is well-acquainted (with them).
64.*To Him belongs all that is in the heavens and on earth: for verily Allah,- He is free of all wants, Worthy of all Praise.
65.*Seest thou not that Allah has made subject to you (men) all that is on the earth, and the ships that sail through the sea by His Command? He withholds the sky (rain) from failing on the earth except by His leave: for Allah is Most Kind and Most Merciful to man.
66.*It is He Who gave you life, will cause you to die, and will again give you life: Truly man is a most ungrateful creature!


 
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What was your reaction and how much ink (electronic or physical) did you spend discussing it?
And what have you done to prevent the unlawful actions of the French government during the instigations in Libya and Syria and before September and after the bombing of Syrian Muslims since Sebtember.

I am not French. I have no control over what France does. I can tell you that I voted in the recent Canadian election that ousted Stephen Harper, who was a hawk and who pushed for Canadian troops in Syria. The new Prime Minister, Justin Trudeau had vowed to remove and keep Canada out of these international conflicts. I am proud to have helped him into power. That said, I do not know what he will do now that the Paris attack happened. He may now see the need to get involved. I also took part in the protests against Bush's wars, and helped push Canada of that conflict , though Canada was engaged in Kandahar.

Of course none of that matters to you does it? Because I am Canadian you hold me responsible for everything the Canadian government has ever done and will ever do, just as responsible as those making the decisions or voting in the hawks. You work on a group tribal level, yes? If I were French and did everything I could to stop French involvement in Syria, you'd cheer for my death... simply because I was French, yes? That is as irrational as it is barbaric.

I do not scorn you because you are Muslim. I do not judge you based on that and that alone. If you are supporting Isis and wish to harm me however, then for that reason and that alone I would fight you. Other Muslims in this thread I would side with against you, and against any of my fellow Canadians who would think along the same lines as you and seek to harm them. That is what rational people with a sense of empathy and morality do.

or they sincerely repent, establish regular prayer, give regular zakah and rule by the laws of God as enshrined in the Quran and Sunnah, there is no way for the Muslims to condemn those who rectify the tally

This is doubly irrational. Do you realize that not only are not all French people supportive of the actions of the French government that you scorn, but many French people ARE Muslim, do regular prayer, etc? Do they also deserve to be killed because of where they live? In your warped number system, where you demand equal numbers to die on both "sides"... how do you count these French Muslims? Do you count them in the "us" column or the "them" column?

one other possibility may be a truce whereby we go our separate ways and allow the people who will live according to the rule of God to come out of their lives as servitude as despised minorities and move to the majority Muslim lands, and for the kuffar who pretend that there is no God or assume that Muhammad pbuh was a liar to leave the countries in which they are a minority, and move to the lands of gog and magog where they can live their debauched lifestyles and let God be the judge between all of us with no hostilities on the part of any side - however, that would be a compromise and matter of council.

The last I checked, non-muslims were not moving in droves to muslim majority lands. From what I have seen it tends to be the other way around. Are you proposing to stop such Muslims, such as the Syrian refugees, from leaving Muslim lands? Do you propose to build a giant wall to keep them in? I think you could get a lot of western people to support you in your mission to keep Muslims out of the west, especially after attacks like the one in Paris. Do you see the western islamophobes as natural allies?

Finally, why do you post a video of Malcolm X? Wasn't he American? Doesn't that mean you would like to see him dead? Your position seems to contradict itself in many ways.
 
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I want to ask a question regarding the Sura 5:32 quote at the begining of the post....My question is the meaning of the word "corruption"...Does it means that killing is ok when "corruption" is found in the "land"? Becouse if thats that case, then, to what standart "corruption" judge upon? The Koran? The Hadith? If thats that case.....all non-Muslams should die rigth....they are all corrupted in the light of the Hadith and the Koran? Can some one adress my question please? Thank you! Shalon!
 
:bism::sl: at Bro Abz, various posts:

I hope you realize that the seerah (biography) is meant to be taken as a complete comprehensive guide of Prophet Muhammad's sallalahu alayhi wasallam (peace and blessings be upon him) life. Whereas you have given isolated incidents as example in your various posts without context to justify your position, Islamic scholars (ulema), people who have dedicated their life to studying Islam academically, have unequivocally come to the conclusion that you and others who have taken your position are completely mistaken. Islamic scholars, again I repeat, by consensus have said that the modern approach to warfare that terrorists and extremists have taken is completely wrong, misguided, and not based on the principles of Islam.

Also, I hope you know that the specific incidents in the seerah to which you'd referred are not comparable to the time we're living in right now because Prophet sallalalhu alayhi wasallam (peace and blessings be upon him) had wahi (divine revelation) to guide him; scholars even go so far as to say that even when Prophet sallalalhu alayhi wasallam (peace and blessings be upon him) sneezed, that was part of wahi. However, today, we do not have wahi as the time of wahi finished with the death of Prophet sallalalhu alayhi wasallam (peace and blessings be upon him).

Moreover, you have quoted various ayats (verses) of Quran to again justify your position without referring to exegesis of Quran, which is what scholars for centuries have done since the advent of Islam.

Also, in your various posts, you have given an erroneous interpretation of qisas; qisas is not meant to be interpreted in the way you have interpreted it.

Additionally, I hope you realize scholars have said that if any group takes minority opinions or picks self-pleasing opinions over sincere guidance over majority scholarly academic opinions or follows literally the Quran without guidance of teachers, then the result will be a twisted and perverted version of "Islam" that is no longer Islam. That is what Daesh (or insert any other terrorist group) follows; they have sacrificed following Islam for following their nafs (ego). Also, I have no doubt that Daesh and their likes will soon be annihilated because they are oppressors under the guise of fighting oppression.

Also, Daesh and people like them have forgotten the stern warning of Prophet Muhammad's sallalahu alayhi wasallam (peace and blessings be upon him): "Whoever exposes himself to these afflictions, will be destroyed by them. So whoever can find a place of protection or refuge from them, should take shelter in it." Scholars explain that what this means: In the days of tribulation and widespread chaos, when one is powerless against the tribulations that afflicting the world and Muslims, Muslims should avoid being a part of interfering in global politics and fighting and cut instead their anger and take to patience and breaks their egos on the stones of hardship. However, what Daesh and their likes are doing is exactly what was warned against; they believe they have to wreck vengeance on behalf of Allah SWT, which is completely antithetical to Islam.

You know, the knowledge of religion is extremely important; early Muslims used to warn people with the words to the effect, "This knowledge is a matter of deen (religion/way of life), so be careful who you take your deen (religion/way of life) from." Honestly, I find it extremely dangerous that you seem to be taking your knowledge from people who themselves have either little knowledge or too much hatred to be objective about what Islam really says.

Finally, as to the suffering of Muslims all over the world, yes, that is a fact. However, you're also forgetting that Allah SWT is allowing this to happen. Do you then also hate the Will of Allah SWT? I assume you don't.

If you believe Islam is a divine religion *and I assume you do), then you have to understand that Allah SWT will give happiness and victory to believers in the way that Allah SWT deems fit and when Allah SWT deems fit, not a moment before. If you look to ahadith, it is extremely clear believers will not have happiness and victory until the time of Mahdi alayhis salaam (peace be upon him) and return of Prophet Isa (Jesus) alayhis salaam (peace be upon him).
 
or they sincerely repent, establish regular prayer, give regular zakah and rule by the laws of God as enshrined in the Quran and Sunnah,
Many Muslims are still do not perform regular salah, still do not fasting in Ramadan, still do not pay zakat, still live not under values of Islam. If you want to do da'wah, do your da'wah toward Muslims like this.

There's no compulsion to accept Islam. If you want to tell the messages to non-Muslims, do it in good manner. Let them decide. If they decide to accept Islam, guide them. If they decide to not accept Islam, still respect them. The only thing that make someone accept Islam is hidayah that given by Allah, not given by you.

Now is the time for us, Muslims, to introspect ourselves. What make Muslims be hated?
 
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