Who does one support in Syria?

[Supernova]

Asalaamualaykum:

I sincerely make dua for all the oppressed & effected in all manifestations in that country. I even make dua for those muslims who oppress also, that Allah guide them and have mercy on them. We are all insaan and we all make mistakes.

Having said that - the problem today is that out attention has become one of globalism rather localism. Leading on from there - not only has our attention become misplaced but our sympathy and empathy been misplaced too.

Whilst Syria fall to ruins - the very moral fibre of Islamic societies, Towns, Villages, Suburbs and metropolitans have degenerated all around the world in every country.

Whilst our attention is on Syria - in our own 5/10/15 mile radius of towns we have:
- Muslims who aren't praying
- Muslims who cannot recite Al Quran
- Muslims who aren't fasting
- Muslims who drink alcohol
- Muslims who eat pork
- Muslims who live in disunity
- Talaaq is on the rise
- Boasting and flamboyance is second nature today
- We know more Hollywood and Bollywood celebs than the Prophets/Sahaba/ Sahabiath
- Istighfaraa has become as foreign as a double edged razor
- There is no modesty in anything (be it dressing/walking/talking etc)

Whilst we concern and pay attention to Syria - we ourselves have become lost in our own deen. We will meet one another for hours at end talking about Syria/ the Refugee Crisis etc but we wont even ask the person we talking to "Is your life ok?" "How are you?" "Do you need any help?"

Our personification of Islam has become the global knowledge of Syria Etc.

What is the greater tragedy ...Syria falling apart or your own locality falling apart ?

What is the greater tragedy...Syria falling apart or thousands and thousands of little Islamic localities falling apart by loosing their moral fibre in deen ?

Syria might have bombs falling on them now - but I assure you, The greatest tragedy is Shaytaan has dropped a million more bombs on the hearts & Nafs of Muslims worldwide, derailing the very muslims in our locality from Allah SWT. Whos crying when those bombs are falling ????

Wasalaam.

 

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you aaj;

The command to wage jihad for the sake of Allaah, and the warning against neglecting jihad, appear in many verses of the Qur’aan and ahaadeeth.

Over three hundred thousand people have died, about fifty thousand of them were children. Does fighting mean another three hundred thousand have to die; in order for justice to happen? If you take your gun and just shoot someone, how will you know if you have killed an innocent person, or a murderer?

True justice can never happen, because true justice would mean that those three hundred thousand, should never have been killed in the first place. If you shoot one more person, will you just add one more death, to the injustice that has already happened?

Hence neglecting jihad is a major sin.

Is shooting an innocent person a major sin too, how can you be sure that the person you point the gun at, will be the person Allah wants you to kill?

The ummah is in the state it is because Muslims want to pass around candles and roses, while muslimahs are being brutally gang raped and men and boys tortured and chopped to pieces.

Muslims fight against Muslims in Syria, so whose side do you take>

Remember, you are not a true believer until you love for your brother/sister what you love for yourself.

The same God hears our prayers, despite our differences.

In the spirit of praying to a just and merciful God.

Eric

 

[piXie]

We should find alternative ways to solve the conflicts, not throw the fuel to the flames.

It started as a peaceful demonstration and Assad turned it into bloodshed. What alternatives ways do u suggest? Peace talks with Assad?

If I have to choose - I will choose the candles and roses.

If you choose to stand with roses and candles when there r bullets n bombs falling in your direction - you may as well dig your own grave n lie in it.

By the way, I don´t think the pacifists are cowards. They might be much braver persons than those whose carry weapons.

If they r not cowards then they have certainly lost their senses of reason and justice.

But I do not stand with candles and roses. I have given my candles for people who suffer from cold in the dark. I have given my roses for children who lost their parents to make them understand that they should not lose their hopes because there are always people who love them.

That is very thoughtful but how will that stop Assad?

I have held a weapon for over 23 years and have seen the worst of what war is. Holding a weapon and the ugly injustice of war is 80% of what lead me to Islam. As I stated before, the common people that want to live in peace are the ones I will support.

The USA does not care about peace.

Assad does not care about peace.

Russia does not care about peace.

The Zionists do not care about peace.

ISIS does not care about peace.

Exactly right. Then how will this peace be achieved when these people do not care about peace?

 

[sister herb]

I believe that military option causes only more victims. These are those wars nobody can win. Compare it to the civil war in Lebanon. It took 14 years and who won? Or Somalia - who won? Of course every war is unique but you can find many similarities.

Yep, negotiations is the only solution to end suffering and prevent the country to slipping to the endless post-war chaos what usually causes even more victims than the war itself.

I advice you trying to find solution by your way, I use mine.

 

[Serinity]

How to bring peace? Kill Assad? How? Shoot him blank range. Assad is supported by Russia, and USA keeps bombing Syria. I can assure you, if USA WANTED ISIS out of Syria, they'd have done it already.

Vietnam war ENDED ONLY because the PEOPLE / Populace DEMONSTRATED against it. So how do you believe that USA will stop, except by demonstration?

Allahu alam.

 

[aaj]

Greetings and peace be with you aaj;


Over three hundred thousand people have died, about fifty thousand of them were children. Does fighting mean another three hundred thousand have to die; in order for justice to happen? If you take your gun and just shoot someone, how will you know if you have killed an innocent person, or a murderer?

True justice can never happen, because true justice would mean that those three hundred thousand, should never have been killed in the first place. If you shoot one more person, will you just add one more death, to the injustice that has already happened?


Is shooting an innocent person a major sin too, how can you be sure that the person you point the gun at, will be the person Allah wants you to kill?

Eric

By your logic, we should have stayed home and let hitler do what he wanted to do and finish his work.
By your logic, we should let the blood thirsty dicators and oppressors, warlordds and militia do whatever they want.
By your logic, Burma Muslims are in the state they are because no one is fighting back.

Talking is cheap, especially for pacifistic sitting comfortably at home behind their monitors and never bother to see what's going on in the world.

A picture is worth a thousand words, so here's burma for those who want to throw rose petals

https://islampeace1.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/395991_10151133625884276_1389690274_n.jpg

and this is syria

 

[sister herb]

And by your logic, wars will never end. As majority of the humankind still follows your logic, why we have new wars all the time? Why violence hasn´t ended the violence but increases it?

 

[piXie]

And by your logic, wars will never end. As majority of the humankind still follows your logic, why we have new wars all the time? Why violence hasn´t ended the violence but increases it?

So they defeated them by permission of Allah , and David killed Goliath, and Allah gave him the kingship and prophethood and taught him from that which He willed. And if it were not for Allah checking [some] people by means of others, the earth would have been corrupted, but Allah is full of bounty to the worlds. (2:251)

Sister, the Muslim world is in the situation they r because the majority of them have abandoned Jihad. While negotiations have a place u also need to realise that some criminals will not be controlled via negotiations alone. And neither will candles or roses mean anything to them.

 

[sister herb]

I think that many people nowadays violates the term "jihad" and justify their actions with it. That´s much bigger problem than abandoning jihad as you claim. I don´t even believe that majority has done so. That´s more danger than pacifism.


This kind of discussion leads us nowhere - as usually. We don´t even speak about same matters. Back to topic, which one of war parties Muslims should then support? Is some of the parties in this war right and others wrong? If yes, which one and why? I don´t think anyone has gave an answer to this question.

 

[Simple_Person]

What i find with the group that is so actively wanting to start this "jihad". You have no idea what is going on it almost seems. You see it as if it is like a walk in to the park.

Let me untangle things a bit more.

Within political strategies going on even before this all happened was that Saudi and Gulf states were planning or wanting to have oil pipelines through the Middle East (Syria-Turkey) to Europe. However Assad was in power and he off course is and has been an ally to Iran. Iran has have had their own political strategy of Iran-Iraq-Syria- Mediterranean Sea. And thus have their oil very easily and cheaply go to Europe.

US off course supporting Saudi and the Gulf states like Turkey. WHY do you think Erdogan from the start has been such a FIERCE opponent of Assad? He doesn't care about human lives as we already have seen this just greedy for power and control.

I would not be shocked if many would not even know this, because no media is bringing this up. So what is Russia doing there? Why has NATO befriended Turkey from the start? (February-1952). NATO was created in April-1949. So about 3 years later Turkey joining in. Why was NATO in the first place created? To create a force against USSR (which has fallen in 1991). Going back to Turkey. Turkey was allowed to NATO because of the having control over the bosphorus (search google maps) in Constantinople (modern day Istanbul). Why? Russia has a LARGE fleet at Crimea (Black Sea Fleet). (TADUM..you hear things clicking in your head if they haven't yet when hearing Crimea?)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_Fleet

Russia has also a naval base at Tartus in Syria.

https://www.google.nl/maps/place/Tartous,+Syri%C3%AB/@34.885821,35.8489483,13z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m5!3m4!1s0x15217e77890fb9a3:0xa072a491096e24b!8m2!3d34.8959276!4d35.8866517

(Zoom out with Google maps to see things better)

IF Turkey falls, which means Bosphurus control is OUT OF THE HANDS OF NATO!!!!!!..Let me repeat it again. IF Turkey falls, which means Bosphurus control is OUT OF THE HANDS OF NATO!!!!!! Why do you think they accept all this **** from Erdogan? Erdogan KNOWS this also..but no media is speaking out in the open.

So what gives? one might say. Look at google maps. For Russia to be able to freely go everywhere on earth..this Black sea fleet is CRUCIAL place. Why? It gives the ability to go to the Mediterranean sea (Italy, Spain, France, Greece, Libia, Egypt, Israel, Algeria, Tunisia, Morocco, Croatia..etc. If they have NOT this ability to reach Italy from that strategy place they have to go all the way around northern sea, past UK and through Strait of Gibraltar (Spain-Morocco).

Why do you think Russia has slowly having creating good ties with Egypt and Saudi? ( Suez Canal)..and thus reach red sea and thus reach easily Arabic Sea and thus Indian Ocean. ..or ELSE they have to go ALL the way around Japanese sea.

So why does Russia help Assad so much? If they lose Latakia (Syria) naval base, they will be restricted and this is exactly what NATO wants. And one could even say that Arab spring was artificially made to make this happen just like Ukranian "Revolution" in 2014 because the president wanted to have good ties with Russia..which NATO did NOT want off course. That is why whole issue with Crimea, because NATO was planning to further weaken Russia by getting rid of that Black Sea fleet. Who belonged Crimea in the first place?

Crimea has always belonged to Russia but in 1954 it was given to Ukraine..why? Nobody knows and no logical or rational reason why you just give away some very valuable STRATEGIC Island to somebody else. Which confirms that people were working for NATO in secret (as NATO was already active for like 5 years).

So you people..yes YOU people..have it looks like very shallow understanding what Syria is about. You think this is about Assad. These liars (Mass media) will NEVER tell you the truth. If it was up to Assad..he would have fallen as easily like all those other dictators in other countries. Why do you think Muammar Gaddafi fell? Because he was a dictator? Pff..no..because he was a dictator that didn't like to take orders from NATO..which would almost give Russia another place to settle.

".....But they plan, and Allah plans. And Allah is the best of planners." Qur'an 8:30

 

[sister herb]

It seems that there is no one party we should support as the war is only made because of means of greed and lust of prophit. All because of political power and money. Everyone wants their own slice from the cake.

And war is a good business for the arms dealers and arms industry.

 

[piXie]

I think that many people nowadays violates the term "jihad" and justify their actions with it. That´s much bigger problem than abandoning jihad as you claim. I don´t even believe that majority has done so. That´s more danger than pacifism.


This kind of discussion leads us nowhere - as usually. We don´t even speak about same matters. Back to topic, which one of war parties Muslims should then support? Is some of the parties in this war right and others wrong? If yes, which one and why? I don´t think anyone has gave an answer to this question.

My dear sister, how can we discuss which group is right or wrong when we cannot even agree upon a basic human right of self defence without calling it violence or "retaliation in anger" as brother Eric said.

The majority of members who have liked and commented here on this thread have shown their disapproval towards the Syrian people for picking up arms to even defend themselves. They have stated clearly that they will not stand with anyone who holds a weapon - despite the fact that these people have been left with little choice - if some of you want to stand with candles n roses then do so. Stand to the side and comfort the people with whatever little that you have been resorted to. But atleast - do not come on here n make sick pacifist statements to belittle the syrians who r standing up to this oppressive regime and fulfilling an obligation of Islam - the Syrians who r defending their lands, women, children n religion. You want them to be like pacifist sheep and give up their right to self defence but they will never be like pacifist sheep.

This pacifist brainwashed colonised mentality needs to be fixed first before anyone can understand or see any solution and reason.

 

[Serinity]

When it comes to politics and geography, I learn best with ilustrations and world maps.

So why is Turkey with NATO? Why does NATO want bhosphorous?? (Control over the Black sea?) Why is it that RUSSIA does not attack countries not in NATO??

Why is it that if ONE does not Obey NATO, that Russia would want to go there then? Does Russia fear NATO?

I don't get it, why would Russia fear NATO? And why would a country obey NATO? And what would happen if one disobeys? And why does Russia not attack countries that has NATO? (Because of USA?)

IF Russia AND USA were enemies of each others, why doesn't USA take Russia out? Why is it that USA and Russia both act like friends when attacking Syria? If they are FRIENDS, why would Russia fear USA in invading NATO??

 

[Mustafa16]

Are you trying to say jihad is not part of Islam? That's the only way to save Muslims these days, look at burma, kashmir, falestine, syria, etc.. Do you think throwing rose petals at the butchers will save humanity?


I agree with the said statement, look who is financing them and you will know who you can root for.

all the "jihad" groups fighting against Assad and ISIS have committed numerous atrocities. Even the Free Syrian Army has committed ethnic cleansing and butchering of CIVILIAN Christians, Alawites, druze, etc. as well as indiscriminate shelling and killing of civilians. The war is no longer a jihad against tyranny. It has become a sectarian war of jihadi sunnis vs assad-supporting sunnis and every other religious sect, where all sides are horrible monsters.

 

[sister herb]

the Syrians who r defending their lands, women, children n religion.

This whole war isn´t between Syrian people and Assad regime. War didn´t start because of peaceful demonstrations. If you read the post of Simple Person (I think it was the best description of the reasons of this war I have ever read in this forum), you might understand how little part there acts the idea of jihad. Religion hasn´t much to do in this war - maybe nothing. Keeping this kind of idea in mind and spreading it, those whose are behind of the war, just keep people busy to bark the wrong tree, cause more chaos and more casualties. Those military groups in the area are only little pieces of the big game and real players move them when it suits to them or destroy them if it´s good for the bigger goals.

Only way to stop this war are negotiations. The main parties on the table will be the Russia and the USA. That´s reality, just same if you like it or not. Those big boys could end this war today if it suits to them. No it seems it doesn´t.

By the way, I am a pacifist and I am not a sheep. Stop insulting pacifists.

If you still want to see this war so simple fight between good and bad, then what party in there defends Syrian people´s rights?

 

[Simple_Person]

When it comes to politics and geography, I learn best with ilustrations and world maps.

So why is Turkey with NATO? Why does NATO want bhosphorous?? (Control over the Black sea?) Why is it that RUSSIA does not attack countries not in NATO??

Why is it that if ONE does not Obey NATO, that Russia would want to go there then? Does Russia fear NATO?

I don't get it, why would Russia fear NATO? And why would a country obey NATO? And what would happen if one disobeys? And why does Russia not attack countries that has NATO? (Because of USA?)

IF Russia AND USA were enemies of each others, why doesn't USA take Russia out? Why is it that USA and Russia both act like friends when attacking Syria? If they are FRIENDS, why would Russia fear USA in invading NATO??

Open up Google maps and read my comment.

There is a small path from the Mediterranean sea to the Black Sea. This is the Bosphorus located in Constantinople (modern day Istanbul). If this path is closed, Russia cannot get their fleet anymore to the rest of the world, as that is the ONLY way out. To win something, you play step by step. Just like chess you sacrifice pawns to get what you want. But a pawn has also the ability to kill even the king. So their target is to get rid of Russia once again as USSR has collapsed in 1991. They want to do the same with modern day Russia as it has became to powerful. Just in 26 years it has already become a superpower again, while it had collapsed back then.

NATO want control over things. That which they cannot control, must be destroyed. (Such as Saddam Hussain and Ghaddaffi as two examples). Where they dictators? Yes they were. Was i fan of either one of them? Nope i wasn't. So it wasn't because they were dictators but they wanted to act against NATO by not being controlled by NATO. If you are not controlled by NATO..you will mostly join the other side (Russia, China etc.) NATO doesn't "want" control over black sea..they want to collapse Russia once again and as i have said in my other comment, Russian Black Sea fleet is located on the Crimean Island. They want to dismantle it completely.

A country not in NATO must give Russia a reason to attack. I mean why would i not want to invade your home? If there is no reason for me to..why should i? As far as i have seen by their actions, they do not seek control, they seek partnership. Have partnership that gives mutual benefit. Look up (BRICS). NATO on the other hand, they want control.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVlgtcVg034

If a country does not obey NATO, they know one way or the other they will be "brought democracy"..(war) to topple the people in power in that country and replace with one who does listen to NATO.

As i said in my previous comment, the SOUL purpose of NATO was to create a alliance against USSR because it had become too powerful. USSR had their vision of conquering, but modern day Russia doesn't as far as i have seen by action. I do not listen to words, but look at actions. NATO does not want Russia to be powerful or mess with what they want things to go. For example, if you say we must do X and say we must do Y. If you are stronger than me, you just get rid of me and do X. But if i am stronger than you ..you will not able to do X.

Disobeying..well NATO will "bring freedom and democracy" to your country as they have done in many countries .

NATO has certain rules. If one country is attacked, all the countries unite and attack the aggressor.

US cannot take Russia out, because when somebody has certain arsenal of nuclear weapons.. it will not go very easy. If you are about to die because of your enemy, wouldn't you use ALL YOUR MEANS? Why don't you think North Korea hasn't been invaded yet? Because North Korea also has the A-Bomb. Messing with a country that has the A-BOMB is NOT a good idea.

They are not friends and were never friends. USA is mostly in charge of NATO. Israel is again in charge of USA. I SUSPECT that much has to do with the end times and destruction of Israel. That is why Bolshevik Revolution in replacing Christian Orthodox Russia with Communist anti-religion USSR applied by majority Zionist Jews.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6p1zxKnDeM

 

[M.I.A.]

i think that most people support the humanitarian effort that goes on in syria..

i would hope that it is fairly used.. helps towards rebuilding the faith of the people and towards helping them live with thereselves.

honestly i have not yet seen how any war is won against the will of allah swt..

if one person lives under oppression and tyranny it is different to when a population does so.

i would believe there are other ways of introducing change..

although they also need people who have been given authority.

and those are not easy to come by.. apparently.

the peacemakers.
..
...
...because the war makers are easy to find.

tough it out, change will come..

if they planned it on the land or the people.. i do not know.

if we are true to ourselves we know, we cant ever pretend to be a thing..

the world would not allow it..

but most people wrong themselves.. and will bear witness against each other.

lol learned to box.. found myself doing a two step to get out of the way..felt stupid.

it seems syria was not united in anger.

..they would not have wanted to be united in poverty..

so maybe they will once again be united in rebuilding.

...or not.

 

[Serinity]

Open up Google maps and read my comment.

There is a small path from the Mediterranean sea to the Black Sea. This is the Bosphorus located in Constantinople (modern day Istanbul). If this path is closed, Russia cannot get their fleet anymore to the rest of the world, as that is the ONLY way out. To win something, you play step by step. Just like chess you sacrifice pawns to get what you want. But a pawn has also the ability to kill even the king. So their target is to get rid of Russia once again as USSR has collapsed in 1991. They want to do the same with modern day Russia as it has became to powerful. Just in 26 years it has already become a superpower again, while it had collapsed back then.

NATO want control over things. That which they cannot control, must be destroyed. (Such as Saddam Hussain and Ghaddaffi as two examples). Where they dictators? Yes they were. Was i fan of either one of them? Nope i wasn't. So it wasn't because they were dictators but they wanted to act against NATO by not being controlled by NATO. If you are not controlled by NATO..you will mostly join the other side (Russia, China etc.) NATO doesn't "want" control over black sea..they want to collapse Russia once again and as i have said in my other comment, Russian Black Sea fleet is located on the Crimean Island. They want to dismantle it completely.

A country not in NATO must give Russia a reason to attack. I mean why would i not want to invade your home? If there is no reason for me to..why should i? As far as i have seen by their actions, they do not seek control, they seek partnership. Have partnership that gives mutual benefit. Look up (BRICS). NATO on the other hand, they want control.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cVlgtcVg034

If a country does not obey NATO, they know one way or the other they will be "brought democracy"..(war) to topple the people in power in that country and replace with one who does listen to NATO.

As i said in my previous comment, the SOUL purpose of NATO was to create a alliance against USSR because it had become too powerful. USSR had their vision of conquering, but modern day Russia doesn't as far as i have seen by action. I do not listen to words, but look at actions. NATO does not want Russia to be powerful or mess with what they want things to go. For example, if you say we must do X and say we must do Y. If you are stronger than me, you just get rid of me and do X. But if i am stronger than you ..you will not able to do X.

Disobeying..well NATO will "bring freedom and democracy" to your country as they have done in many countries .

NATO has certain rules. If one country is attacked, all the countries unite and attack the aggressor.

US cannot take Russia out, because when somebody has certain arsenal of nuclear weapons.. it will not go very easy. If you are about to die because of your enemy, wouldn't you use ALL YOUR MEANS? Why don't you think North Korea hasn't been invaded yet? Because North Korea also has the A-Bomb. Messing with a country that has the A-BOMB is NOT a good idea.

They are not friends and were never friends. USA is mostly in charge of NATO. Israel is again in charge of USA. I SUSPECT that much has to do with the end times and destruction of Israel. That is why Bolshevik Revolution in replacing Christian Orthodox Russia with Communist anti-religion Russia applied by majority Zionist Jews.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6p1zxKnDeM

So basically, if I wanted to establish a country based solely on Shariah, nothing else. Not allying myself with any country, Not with NATO, not with Russia, and not with USA and Israel. I'd be invaded.

North Korea only has small A-bombs. Not like they can hit USA from a long distance. But China would probably enter then.

Russia already has access to Latkia, according to you, in Syria, so why would Russia care about Bhosphorous?? If they can just set off from Latkia?? Unless they can't.

 

[Blueflame]

I believe many should stay silent incase they slander the mujahideen. Many of us have no true way of verifying what is going on. Make dua that Allah perishes the falsehood and grants victory to the mujahideen wherever they may be

And remember
Prophet (saw) said:


“Jihad will continue from the day I was sent by Allah till the last people of my nation fight against the Antichrist (Dajjal), it will neither be stopped by oppression nor abstention”.-

Abu Dawud

 

[Blueflame]

The Prophet (ﷺ) said: A section of my community will continue to fight for the right and overcome their opponents till the last of them fights with the Antichrist

*** sorry this was the hadith it's from kitabu-jihad in abu dawud