Islam and Apostasy

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Hello Snakelegs,
snakelegs said:
i readily admit i am ignorant about shariah. my point was not about the shariah but about how these laws get implemented in the real world.
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Right.
i'm not sure if i understand your point about preferring the term "abadoned" instead of "abused".
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You said that the laws were easily abused which implies that they can be misused or they provide loopholes, etc. Either way it indicates some flaw with the statement of the law. My position was that the law simply is not being followed correctly, it is being abandoned. This does not reflect negatively on the law at all.
i get the impression that you use the word "hearsay" to discount any opinion expressed by either muslims or non-muslim that doesn't conform to your views.
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I think that's an unfair generalization. I use the word 'hearsay' to encourage muslims and non-muslims to move beyond the steretypes they recieve in the media and actively seek to promote understanding in the diverse world in which we live.

Regards
 
Syed Nizam said:
Sis Noora,

Correct me if i'm wrong. I taught that there is no such terms such as "modern muslim" or "conservative muslim". There are but only one muslim.. & that means the submission to Allah. We might not shared the same view on some issues but i'm certained that our beliefs & our convictions nevertheless are just the same.

May Allah blessed us in this life & the hereafter. Ameeen.
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Bro Nizam,

Salam

I think u did notice that I said (so called) n put modern muslims between ""..I personally dont belive that there r such, there is only One Quranand One prophet. I said that sarcasticly, some ppl like to claim themselves as "modern muslims" n attack Islam.

I know this is off topic, sorry.

Wassalam
 
Ansar Al-'Adl said:
Hello Snakelegs,

Right.

You said that the laws were easily abused which implies that they can be misused or they provide loopholes, etc. Either way it indicates some flaw with the statement of the law. My position was that the law simply is not being followed correctly, it is being abandoned. This does not reflect negatively on the law at all.

i'm not sure we disagree but are using different words. when i say that a certain law is easily abused i agree this does not mean that the law itself is flawed (that's above my head) - just that it is often abused in practice, as is the case with the blasphemy laws in pakistan. i wasn't implying anything about shariah one way or the other - i don't even know the wording or the context in the shariah. i'm sure i would disagree with many aspects of the shariah, but after all, i am not a muslim. a law could be 100% just but people can find ways to misuse it or abuse it.

I think that's an unfair generalization. I use the word 'hearsay' to encourage muslims and non-muslims to move beyond the steretypes they recieve in the media and actively seek to promote understanding in the diverse world in which we live.

Regards
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ok.
 
Ansar Al-‘Adl, I have waited several days to reply to this because I know my reply is off topic to a degree. I didn’t want to chance sidetracking the thread.

You stated “I think we need to combat these stereotypes and help westerners understand that the problem is with some Muslims, not with Islam, and then we can all take steps towards eradicating the problems in the Muslim world”.

I have to say that I think you, along with a large portion of the Islamic world, are trying to put the cart before the horse.

Wouldn’t it be great if the common news item contained reports of actions taken by, the common, Muslims against those who abuse Islamic teachings (Such as Bin Ladin)?

If Islam spent more time on the underlined, there would be much less of the other. One of these days a smart Muslim will realize that the Western world doesn’t hate Islam (As long as you keep it on your own shores); it hates what those who abuse Islamic teachings do. Then we will have a common enemy.

Thanks
Nimrod
 
BTW, I do have a problem with any religion that allows one faith to be more promoted than another by the state and then teaches that anyone who converts away from the state promoted religion/faith is to be put to death.

Thanks
Nimrod
 
nimrod said:
BTW, I do have a problem with any religion that allows one faith to be more promoted than another by the state and then teaches that anyone who converts away from the state promoted religion/faith is to be put to death.

Thanks
Nimrod
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hey!-in the west you are put to death if you 'apostate' from the army!
you have to fulfill ur contract-well i think the 'contract' you make with God is much more important than in an army...
 
Salam
I dont think that rally in London was such a good idea. As the sister said, there were other things we could have done (du'a, sabr). If anything, the rally caused chaos for commuters that day and this will give a more negative view of islam and muslims in the UK.
Why should we demand an apology from the danes? we know they don't like us. We are muslims. They will never like us untill we accept their way of life.
May Allah guide us all
Wassalam
 
Peace
I've never heard of it myself, but maybe s/he was talking about the times during WW1 and WW2. Cowardice was punishable by death
 
Assalamu alaikumwa rahmatullahi wa barakaatu

Yeah and not just the West loads of other places. Russia definitely and Marge1 can give you a nice list since the question was addressed to her. Hee hee.
 
Yep. In WW1 British soldiers were shot because they had breakdowns due to the fear of the war. They didn't run away and scream they started to shiver and cry and if killing them isn't inhuman then what is?
 
Ayesha Rana said:
Yep. In WW1 British soldiers were shot because they had breakdowns due to the fear of the war. They didn't run away and scream they started to shiver and cry and if killing them isn't inhuman then what is?
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Yes, in a war situation these things happen. I guess it's the only way to keep a losing army from disbanding.
Not that I agree with it!
In times of war the whole world goes mad! :-\

Peace.
 
Assalamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakaatu

Their mental state is now referred to as shell-shock.
In Russia in 1918 the following orders were given to the Red Army by Trotsky:
Every scoundrel who incites anyone to retreat, to desert, or not to fulfil a military order, will be shot.
Every soldier of the Red Army who voluntarily deserts his post will be shot.
Every soldier who throws away his rifal will be shot.

Harsh way of putting it don't you agree?
 
Ayesha Rana said:
Assalamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakaatu

Their mental state is now referred to as shell-shock.
In Russia in 1918 the following orders were given to the Red Army by Trotsky:
Every scoundrel who incites anyone to retreat, to desert, or not to fulfil a military order, will be shot.
Every soldier of the Red Army who voluntarily deserts his post will be shot.
Every soldier who throws away his rifal will be shot.

Harsh way of putting it don't you agree?
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Yes. :-\
 
Greetings,
Ayesha Rana said:
Yep. In WW1 British soldiers were shot because they had breakdowns due to the fear of the war. They didn't run away and scream they started to shiver and cry and if killing them isn't inhuman then what is?
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I'm not sure about this. I know soldiers could be shot for desertion, but for shell shock? Many soldiers suffering from shell shock (or neurasthenia as it was known to doctors) got taken to Craiglockhart Military Hospital in Edinburgh for treatment.

Peace
 
no sectarian articles - please refer to the first post for the correct understanding of this issue.
 
Imam Abu Haneefah on Apostasy

:sl:

Why did he think that females are to be spared? Female adulterers and murderers should be put to death in an Islamic State right?
 
Re: Imam Abu Haneefah on Apostasy

Hijrah said:
:sl:

Why did [Imam Abu Hanifa] think that females are to be spared? Female adulterers and murderers should be put to death in an Islamic State right?
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It stems from the understanding that this punishment is in reality a punishment for the protection and preservation of society. The Islamic state takes action against those who pose a threat to the security of the state, and Imam Abu Hanifah held that a woman was unlikely to pose such a threat. As such, he compared the apostate woman to the originally disbelieving woman. (Ibn Rushd, Bidayatul Mujtahid [Eng. Trans.], vol 2. p. 552)
a female apostate is not liable to the death penalty since she is not in any position to fight against Islam (Sarakhsi, Masbut vol. 10, pp. 108-110)
​
Whatever the case, others have stated otherwise. Please refer to the following to articles for a better understanding of this issue:
Narration 7
Apostasy and Islam
 
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