Abdul-Raouf
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only christians please........
Only For Christians....
- Thread starter Abdul-Raouf
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Abdul-Raouf
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know what they truely think...........
Abdul-Raouf
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What else option u want .......... reply soon
bint_muhammed
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how can someone be god and human?
Abdul-Raouf
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i think Christians themselves are confused....... not able to choose any option.....
So duski u guys say the father and son are same........ then why u didnt choose "Yahweh and Jesus both are same"
So duski u guys say the father and son are same........ then why u didnt choose "Yahweh and Jesus both are same"
glo
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LOL
Whatever do you mean, Muzammil?
First you put up a poll with some (for Christians) very bizarre answers to choose from ... and then, when nobody replies, you accuse Christians of 'being confused'???! :? :rollseyes ;D
Your poll demonstrates how very little you know about Christianity.
I suggest you do some reading on that subject first.
Or, alternatively, post a question in the 'Questions for Christians' thread. I think you will get a clearer answer there ...
Peace.
Whatever do you mean, Muzammil?
First you put up a poll with some (for Christians) very bizarre answers to choose from ... and then, when nobody replies, you accuse Christians of 'being confused'???! :? :rollseyes ;D
Your poll demonstrates how very little you know about Christianity.
I suggest you do some reading on that subject first.
Or, alternatively, post a question in the 'Questions for Christians' thread. I think you will get a clearer answer there ...
Peace.
Fishman
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Please can you add something to your sig to show that you aren't actually Islamgal, otherwise people will get confused and think she's left Islam or something? I'm not mad, I just think some people will be confused.
Abdul-Raouf
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Friends Im Sorry if i had hurt any of ur feelings............
I read the below article from --- http://godandson.reslight.net/
So i was in doubt who is Yahweh...... is He the ultimate God???
Scriptures That Show That Jesus (Yahshua) Is Not Yahweh (Jehovah)
___________________________________________________________
It is not our object in this study to refute all the arguments used by many who try to prove that Jesus is Yahweh. We simply present some of the scriptures that most definitely show that the Father is Yahweh and that Jesus is not Yahweh [his Father]:
The holy spirit of God has revealed his truth through the apostles. The holy spirit especially led the apostles into all the truths concerning Christ and what he said. (John 14:26; 16:4-13; Galatians 1:12; Ephesians 3:5; 2 Timothy 2:2) The truths revealed to the apostles and made available to us are recorded in the Bible itself. (Ephesians 3:3-12; Colossians 1:25,26; 1 John 4:6) Of course, without the holy spirit, these things that are recorded will still be a mystery to us. -- Mark 4:11; 1 Corinthians 2:7-10.
Part of the truth revealed by means of the holy spirit was that there was to be an apostasy, a "falling away" from the truth of God's Word, with strong delusions. (Matthew 13:24-30; Acts 20:29,30; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12; 1 Timothy 4:1-3; 2 Timothy 4:3,4) This falling away had already begun in the first century, with some receiving a different spirit and preaching "another Jesus"; the apostasy was restrained for only a short while. (2 Thessalonians 2:7; 1 John 2:18,19; 2 Corinthians 11:4) The apostasy spread rapidly after the death the apostles and developed into the great "Man of Sin", or more correctly "Lawless Man", or "Illegal Man", a great religious system, which claimed to have the authority to add to God's Word since their revelation was allegedly of God's Spirit. The central doctrine became the false teaching that Jesus had to be God Almighty in order to provide atonement for sins. With this spirit of error in mind, the writings of the apostles were totally reinterpreted to accommodate the error, and many of the Hellenic Jewish philosophies were adapted and added to and blended in with the New Testament, even as the Jews had done with the Old Testament.
Isaiah, in prophesying concerning the stone of stumbling (Isaiah 8:14; Romans 9:23) to both the houses of Israel (Romans 9:6,31; 11:7; 1 Corinthians 10:18; Galatians 6:16), warns us: "To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them." (Isaiah 8:20, New King James Version) The law, of course, is what we call the Old Testament; the testimony of this prophecy is the testimony of the apostles, as given in the New Testament. This the way to test the spirits. (1 John 4:1) It is to these and through these scriptures that the holy spirit today gives true direction, and anything not in agreement with these scriptures is not of the light of the day. (John 11:9; 1 Thessalonians 5:5) The rejection of the true Jesus -- who while on earth before his death was only human, a little lower than the angels, who gave his flesh for the life of the world -- is one of the greatest stumblingblocks to understanding the true Gospel revealed in scripture. Thus Jesus becomes a stumbling stone, not only to the house according the flesh which was corrupted from true doctrine, but also the spiritual house which was also corrupted from true doctrine.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Yahweh (Jehovah) is the only true God, the God and Father of the Lord Jesus. Yahweh (Jehovah) is the God and Father of the Lord Jesus. Jesus has one who is the Supreme Being over him; Jesus is not his Supreme Being whom he worships, prays to, and who sent him, and whose will he carried out in willful obedience. -- Deuteronomy 18:15-19; Matthew 4:4 (Deuteronomy 8:3; Luke 4:4); Matthew 4:7 (Deuteronomy 6:16); Matthew 4:10 (Exodus 20:3-5; 34:14; Deuteronomy 6:13,14; 10:20; Luke 4:8); Matthew 22:29-40; Matthew 26:42; Matthew 27:46; Mark 10:6 (Genesis 1:27; Genesis 2:7,20-23); Mark 14:36; 15:34; Luke 22:42; John 4:3; 5:30; 6:38; 17:1,3; 20:17; Romans 15:6; 2 Corinthians 1:3; 11:31; Ephesians 1:3,17; Hebrews 1:9; 10:7; 1 Peter 1:3; Revelation 2:7; 3:2,12.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus is the firstborn creature, existing with his God and Father before the world began. -- John 1:1; 6:62; 17:5; Colossians 1:15; Revelaton 3:14.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus was sent by Yahweh, speaks for Yahweh, represents Yahweh. Jesus is not Yahweh whom he represents and speaks for. -- Deuteronomy 18:15-19; Matthew 23:39; Mark 11:9,10; Luke 13:35; John 3:2,17,32-35; 4:34; 5:19,30,36,43; 6:57; 7:16,28; 8:26,28,38; 10:25; 12:49,50; 14:10; 15:15; 17:8,26; 20:17; Acts 2:22,34-36; Romans 15:6; 2 Corinthians 1:3; 8:6; 11:31; Colossians 1:3,15; 2:9-12; Hebrews 1:1-3; Revelation 1:1.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus receives his inheritance and dominion (power) from Yahweh. His power and authority is given to him by his God, his Supreme Being. Jesus is not Yahweh [his God and Father] who gives him this dominion, all authority and power (with the evident exception of God himself -- 1 Corinthians 15:27), yet the exercise of this power and authority by Jesus is all to the praise of Yahweh, the God and Father of the Lord Jesus. The Bible writers never claimed that Jesus is the ultimate "source" of his own power. -- Psalm 2:6-8; 45:7; 110:1,2; Isaiah 9:6,7; 11:2; 42:1; 61:1-3; Jeremiah 23:5; Daniel 7:13,14; Matthew 12:28; 28:28; Luke 1:32; 4:14,18; 5:17; John 3:34; 5:19,27,30; 10:18,36-38; Acts 2:22; 10:38; Romans 1:1-4; 1 Corinthians 15:27; 2 Corinthians 13:4; Colossians 1:15,16; 2:10; Ephesians 1:17-22; Philippians 2:9-11; Hebrews 1:2,4,6,9; 1 Peter 3:22.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus is anointed [made christ, the anointed one] by Yahweh. He is not Yahweh who thus anoints him. -- Psalm 2:2; 45:7; Isaiah 61:1; Acts 2:36; 4:27; 10:38.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus is son of the only Most High, Yahweh. He is not the only Most High Yahweh of whom he is the son. -- Genesis 14:22; Psalm 7:17; 83:18; 92:1; Luke 1:32; John 13:16.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus is given the power of life in himself from Yahweh. Jesus is not Yahweh who gives him this power. -- 1 Samuel 2:6; Psalm 36:9; John 5:21,25-29.
The holy spirit though the scriptures reveals that Jesus is the servant of Yahweh; he is not Yahweh whom he serves. -- Isaiah 42:1; 53:11; Matthew 12:18; John 3:16,17; 5:30,36; 6:38,44; 8:29,38,42; 10:36; 13:16; 17:3; Acts 4:27,30; Galatians 4:4; Hebrews 10:5; 1 John 4:9,10.
The fact is, however, that there is not any proof at all in the scriptures of a God existing as three co-equal, co-eternal, co-substantial persons. You will not find one scripture about such a God. The idea has to added to and read into all the scriptures that are given to support such an idea. The conclusion is that the holy spirit reveals that Jesus is not Yahweh who has made Jesus to sit at the right hand of Yahweh. -- Psalm 110:1; Matthew 22:41-46; Mark 12:35-40; Luke 20:39-47; Acts 2:34; Ephesians 1:20-22; Hebrews 1:3,13; 10:12,13; 12:2; 1 Peter 3:22.
The scriptual conclusion is that the holy spirit is telling us that Jesus is not Yahweh whom he worships (serves as a servant, prays to) as his God. -- Deuteronomy 6:13; Deuteronomy 10:20; Isaiah 42:1; 53:11; Matthew 4:10; 12:18; 27:46; Mark 15:34; Luke 4:8; John 13:16; 17:1,3; 20:27; Acts 4:27,30; Hebrews 1:9; Revelaton 2:7; 3:12.
Jesus is never described as the father of Jesus, and Yahweh is never described as the son of Yahweh. The term "everlasting father" refers to Jesus' role toward mankind that he purchased, and of whom he has become father as the second or "last Adam." (Romans 5:15-19; 1 Corinthians 15:21,22,45,47; Psalm 45:16) Jesus came in the name of Yahweh his Father. (Deuteronomy 18:15,18; Matthew 23:39; Mark 11:9,10; Luke 13:35; John 3:2,17; 5:19,43; 6:57; 7:16,28; 8:26,28,38; 10:25; 12:49,50; 14:10; 15:15; 17:8,26; Hebrews 1:1,2; Revelation 1:1) Yahweh never came in the name of any other than himself; thus, since there is none higher, he swore by himself. -- Hebrews 6:13
Jesus' role as Mighty EL refers to the power and authority given to him by the Mighty EL that is mightier than he, the only true Supreme Being, Yahweh. -- Psalm 2:2,7,8; 110:1,2; Isaiah 9:6,7; 61:1; Luke 1:32; Jeremiah 23:5; Daniel 7:13,14; John 17:1,3; Acts 2:36; Hebrews 1:2,6.
No scripture says that Jesus was God Almighty in the flesh, although possessing the mighty power of Yahweh as did Moses, he could be referred to as God (ELOHIM, THEOS) in a manner similar to Moses. (Exodus 7:1; Deuteronomy 18:15,18; Acts 3:18-22) Neither in the case of Moses nor Jesus does this make either of them into God Almighty who gives them their power and authority.
There is nothing lucid at all in the added-on reasoning that since both Jesus and the Father are called THEOS or ELOHIM that these two must be one God. The Holy Spirit is not directly called "God" in the scriptures, although some can read that thought into Acts 3:17,18 and 2 Corinthians 3:17,18. However, in principle, the Holy Spirit, being the personal power of God which extends from God, is essentially God, but nothing in this would mean that the Holy Spirit is a supposed "person" of God. Additionally since there are many others who are also legitimately referred to as "gods" in the scripture (they are not "false" gods, as are the idols of the heathen), logically in order to keep these all as one God, we would have to add many more the who make up that one God, including Moses (Exodus 7:1); the sons of God to whom the Word of God came (John 10:34,35; Psalm 82:1,6); all the angels (Psalm 8:5; 86:6-8; 95:3; 50:1; Hebrews 2:7,9); the judges of Israel who performed as a body by the power given to by Yahweh. (Exodus 21:6; 22:8,9,28 [See Acts 23:5]); rulers.
As to the God innate, that is, the Power, Might, Innate, there is only one God, who is the God and Father of the Lord Jesus who sent Jesus. -- John 17:1,3
All others who are legitimately called "gods" in the Bible are not the one true God, including Jesus, because these all receive their power and authority from the one true God. Thus they are called EL, ELOHIM, THEOS, (the Hebrew and Greek words for "god", "mighty, might", etc.), in a different manner than of innate Godship, which only belongs the God and Father of the Lord Jesus. If one honestly studies the usage of the words for God in the Hebrew and Greek, it becomes solidly plain that this is so, for like many other words, there is an exclusive usage that is applied to Yahweh, and relative usages that are applied to others, including Jesus.
========
See our study on "Hebraic Usages of the Titles of God"
http://godandson.reslight.net/hebraictitles.html
We realize, however, that trinitarians will add to, redefine common terminology, and distort all of the above scriptures presented to make them appear to fit the extra-Biblical trinitarian fable of three persons in one God. Then they seem to think that one should simply accept their added-on reasoning as proof that the trinity is true; indeed, many claim that their acceptance of the trinity is evidence that they have God's spirit, and will often claim that one cannot have God's spirit who doesn't accept their added-on philosophy. (Some, oddly, also claim that one cannot have God's spirit unless he accepts the trinity, and then claim that one cannot understand the trinity except that one has God's Spirit. Yet, we also know of many trinitarians who staunchly defend the trinity doctrine, yet who say they do not understand it, and that it is not to be understood, only accepted.) Christians have no reason, however, to add this story about three persons in one God to the Bible, since the Bible is totally complete and harmonious without the trinitarian philosophy, or adding to the scriptures the "three persons in one God" fable. It is better to simply take the scriptures in the usage of its own terms rather than to resort to such a drastic change as demanded by the trinitarian formula.
To worship in spirit and truth has nothing to do with accepting a later formulated dogma of men; however, since there is not one scripture anywhere at all that says one word about three persons in one God, then Christians desiring to worship in spirit and truth are correct in rejecting the trinity fable that has to be added to the scriptures.
Permission is given to duplicate this document in its entirety, including this statement, for not-for-profit usage in Bible studies and general distribution.
Last update: March 19, 2005
Source : http://godandson.reslight.net/
I read the below article from --- http://godandson.reslight.net/
So i was in doubt who is Yahweh...... is He the ultimate God???
Scriptures That Show That Jesus (Yahshua) Is Not Yahweh (Jehovah)
___________________________________________________________
It is not our object in this study to refute all the arguments used by many who try to prove that Jesus is Yahweh. We simply present some of the scriptures that most definitely show that the Father is Yahweh and that Jesus is not Yahweh [his Father]:
The holy spirit of God has revealed his truth through the apostles. The holy spirit especially led the apostles into all the truths concerning Christ and what he said. (John 14:26; 16:4-13; Galatians 1:12; Ephesians 3:5; 2 Timothy 2:2) The truths revealed to the apostles and made available to us are recorded in the Bible itself. (Ephesians 3:3-12; Colossians 1:25,26; 1 John 4:6) Of course, without the holy spirit, these things that are recorded will still be a mystery to us. -- Mark 4:11; 1 Corinthians 2:7-10.
Part of the truth revealed by means of the holy spirit was that there was to be an apostasy, a "falling away" from the truth of God's Word, with strong delusions. (Matthew 13:24-30; Acts 20:29,30; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12; 1 Timothy 4:1-3; 2 Timothy 4:3,4) This falling away had already begun in the first century, with some receiving a different spirit and preaching "another Jesus"; the apostasy was restrained for only a short while. (2 Thessalonians 2:7; 1 John 2:18,19; 2 Corinthians 11:4) The apostasy spread rapidly after the death the apostles and developed into the great "Man of Sin", or more correctly "Lawless Man", or "Illegal Man", a great religious system, which claimed to have the authority to add to God's Word since their revelation was allegedly of God's Spirit. The central doctrine became the false teaching that Jesus had to be God Almighty in order to provide atonement for sins. With this spirit of error in mind, the writings of the apostles were totally reinterpreted to accommodate the error, and many of the Hellenic Jewish philosophies were adapted and added to and blended in with the New Testament, even as the Jews had done with the Old Testament.
Isaiah, in prophesying concerning the stone of stumbling (Isaiah 8:14; Romans 9:23) to both the houses of Israel (Romans 9:6,31; 11:7; 1 Corinthians 10:18; Galatians 6:16), warns us: "To the law and to the testimony! If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them." (Isaiah 8:20, New King James Version) The law, of course, is what we call the Old Testament; the testimony of this prophecy is the testimony of the apostles, as given in the New Testament. This the way to test the spirits. (1 John 4:1) It is to these and through these scriptures that the holy spirit today gives true direction, and anything not in agreement with these scriptures is not of the light of the day. (John 11:9; 1 Thessalonians 5:5) The rejection of the true Jesus -- who while on earth before his death was only human, a little lower than the angels, who gave his flesh for the life of the world -- is one of the greatest stumblingblocks to understanding the true Gospel revealed in scripture. Thus Jesus becomes a stumbling stone, not only to the house according the flesh which was corrupted from true doctrine, but also the spiritual house which was also corrupted from true doctrine.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Yahweh (Jehovah) is the only true God, the God and Father of the Lord Jesus. Yahweh (Jehovah) is the God and Father of the Lord Jesus. Jesus has one who is the Supreme Being over him; Jesus is not his Supreme Being whom he worships, prays to, and who sent him, and whose will he carried out in willful obedience. -- Deuteronomy 18:15-19; Matthew 4:4 (Deuteronomy 8:3; Luke 4:4); Matthew 4:7 (Deuteronomy 6:16); Matthew 4:10 (Exodus 20:3-5; 34:14; Deuteronomy 6:13,14; 10:20; Luke 4:8); Matthew 22:29-40; Matthew 26:42; Matthew 27:46; Mark 10:6 (Genesis 1:27; Genesis 2:7,20-23); Mark 14:36; 15:34; Luke 22:42; John 4:3; 5:30; 6:38; 17:1,3; 20:17; Romans 15:6; 2 Corinthians 1:3; 11:31; Ephesians 1:3,17; Hebrews 1:9; 10:7; 1 Peter 1:3; Revelation 2:7; 3:2,12.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus is the firstborn creature, existing with his God and Father before the world began. -- John 1:1; 6:62; 17:5; Colossians 1:15; Revelaton 3:14.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus was sent by Yahweh, speaks for Yahweh, represents Yahweh. Jesus is not Yahweh whom he represents and speaks for. -- Deuteronomy 18:15-19; Matthew 23:39; Mark 11:9,10; Luke 13:35; John 3:2,17,32-35; 4:34; 5:19,30,36,43; 6:57; 7:16,28; 8:26,28,38; 10:25; 12:49,50; 14:10; 15:15; 17:8,26; 20:17; Acts 2:22,34-36; Romans 15:6; 2 Corinthians 1:3; 8:6; 11:31; Colossians 1:3,15; 2:9-12; Hebrews 1:1-3; Revelation 1:1.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus receives his inheritance and dominion (power) from Yahweh. His power and authority is given to him by his God, his Supreme Being. Jesus is not Yahweh [his God and Father] who gives him this dominion, all authority and power (with the evident exception of God himself -- 1 Corinthians 15:27), yet the exercise of this power and authority by Jesus is all to the praise of Yahweh, the God and Father of the Lord Jesus. The Bible writers never claimed that Jesus is the ultimate "source" of his own power. -- Psalm 2:6-8; 45:7; 110:1,2; Isaiah 9:6,7; 11:2; 42:1; 61:1-3; Jeremiah 23:5; Daniel 7:13,14; Matthew 12:28; 28:28; Luke 1:32; 4:14,18; 5:17; John 3:34; 5:19,27,30; 10:18,36-38; Acts 2:22; 10:38; Romans 1:1-4; 1 Corinthians 15:27; 2 Corinthians 13:4; Colossians 1:15,16; 2:10; Ephesians 1:17-22; Philippians 2:9-11; Hebrews 1:2,4,6,9; 1 Peter 3:22.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus is anointed [made christ, the anointed one] by Yahweh. He is not Yahweh who thus anoints him. -- Psalm 2:2; 45:7; Isaiah 61:1; Acts 2:36; 4:27; 10:38.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus is son of the only Most High, Yahweh. He is not the only Most High Yahweh of whom he is the son. -- Genesis 14:22; Psalm 7:17; 83:18; 92:1; Luke 1:32; John 13:16.
The holy spirit reveals through the scriptures that Jesus is given the power of life in himself from Yahweh. Jesus is not Yahweh who gives him this power. -- 1 Samuel 2:6; Psalm 36:9; John 5:21,25-29.
The holy spirit though the scriptures reveals that Jesus is the servant of Yahweh; he is not Yahweh whom he serves. -- Isaiah 42:1; 53:11; Matthew 12:18; John 3:16,17; 5:30,36; 6:38,44; 8:29,38,42; 10:36; 13:16; 17:3; Acts 4:27,30; Galatians 4:4; Hebrews 10:5; 1 John 4:9,10.
The fact is, however, that there is not any proof at all in the scriptures of a God existing as three co-equal, co-eternal, co-substantial persons. You will not find one scripture about such a God. The idea has to added to and read into all the scriptures that are given to support such an idea. The conclusion is that the holy spirit reveals that Jesus is not Yahweh who has made Jesus to sit at the right hand of Yahweh. -- Psalm 110:1; Matthew 22:41-46; Mark 12:35-40; Luke 20:39-47; Acts 2:34; Ephesians 1:20-22; Hebrews 1:3,13; 10:12,13; 12:2; 1 Peter 3:22.
The scriptual conclusion is that the holy spirit is telling us that Jesus is not Yahweh whom he worships (serves as a servant, prays to) as his God. -- Deuteronomy 6:13; Deuteronomy 10:20; Isaiah 42:1; 53:11; Matthew 4:10; 12:18; 27:46; Mark 15:34; Luke 4:8; John 13:16; 17:1,3; 20:27; Acts 4:27,30; Hebrews 1:9; Revelaton 2:7; 3:12.
Jesus is never described as the father of Jesus, and Yahweh is never described as the son of Yahweh. The term "everlasting father" refers to Jesus' role toward mankind that he purchased, and of whom he has become father as the second or "last Adam." (Romans 5:15-19; 1 Corinthians 15:21,22,45,47; Psalm 45:16) Jesus came in the name of Yahweh his Father. (Deuteronomy 18:15,18; Matthew 23:39; Mark 11:9,10; Luke 13:35; John 3:2,17; 5:19,43; 6:57; 7:16,28; 8:26,28,38; 10:25; 12:49,50; 14:10; 15:15; 17:8,26; Hebrews 1:1,2; Revelation 1:1) Yahweh never came in the name of any other than himself; thus, since there is none higher, he swore by himself. -- Hebrews 6:13
Jesus' role as Mighty EL refers to the power and authority given to him by the Mighty EL that is mightier than he, the only true Supreme Being, Yahweh. -- Psalm 2:2,7,8; 110:1,2; Isaiah 9:6,7; 61:1; Luke 1:32; Jeremiah 23:5; Daniel 7:13,14; John 17:1,3; Acts 2:36; Hebrews 1:2,6.
No scripture says that Jesus was God Almighty in the flesh, although possessing the mighty power of Yahweh as did Moses, he could be referred to as God (ELOHIM, THEOS) in a manner similar to Moses. (Exodus 7:1; Deuteronomy 18:15,18; Acts 3:18-22) Neither in the case of Moses nor Jesus does this make either of them into God Almighty who gives them their power and authority.
There is nothing lucid at all in the added-on reasoning that since both Jesus and the Father are called THEOS or ELOHIM that these two must be one God. The Holy Spirit is not directly called "God" in the scriptures, although some can read that thought into Acts 3:17,18 and 2 Corinthians 3:17,18. However, in principle, the Holy Spirit, being the personal power of God which extends from God, is essentially God, but nothing in this would mean that the Holy Spirit is a supposed "person" of God. Additionally since there are many others who are also legitimately referred to as "gods" in the scripture (they are not "false" gods, as are the idols of the heathen), logically in order to keep these all as one God, we would have to add many more the who make up that one God, including Moses (Exodus 7:1); the sons of God to whom the Word of God came (John 10:34,35; Psalm 82:1,6); all the angels (Psalm 8:5; 86:6-8; 95:3; 50:1; Hebrews 2:7,9); the judges of Israel who performed as a body by the power given to by Yahweh. (Exodus 21:6; 22:8,9,28 [See Acts 23:5]); rulers.
As to the God innate, that is, the Power, Might, Innate, there is only one God, who is the God and Father of the Lord Jesus who sent Jesus. -- John 17:1,3
All others who are legitimately called "gods" in the Bible are not the one true God, including Jesus, because these all receive their power and authority from the one true God. Thus they are called EL, ELOHIM, THEOS, (the Hebrew and Greek words for "god", "mighty, might", etc.), in a different manner than of innate Godship, which only belongs the God and Father of the Lord Jesus. If one honestly studies the usage of the words for God in the Hebrew and Greek, it becomes solidly plain that this is so, for like many other words, there is an exclusive usage that is applied to Yahweh, and relative usages that are applied to others, including Jesus.
========
See our study on "Hebraic Usages of the Titles of God"
http://godandson.reslight.net/hebraictitles.html
We realize, however, that trinitarians will add to, redefine common terminology, and distort all of the above scriptures presented to make them appear to fit the extra-Biblical trinitarian fable of three persons in one God. Then they seem to think that one should simply accept their added-on reasoning as proof that the trinity is true; indeed, many claim that their acceptance of the trinity is evidence that they have God's spirit, and will often claim that one cannot have God's spirit who doesn't accept their added-on philosophy. (Some, oddly, also claim that one cannot have God's spirit unless he accepts the trinity, and then claim that one cannot understand the trinity except that one has God's Spirit. Yet, we also know of many trinitarians who staunchly defend the trinity doctrine, yet who say they do not understand it, and that it is not to be understood, only accepted.) Christians have no reason, however, to add this story about three persons in one God to the Bible, since the Bible is totally complete and harmonious without the trinitarian philosophy, or adding to the scriptures the "three persons in one God" fable. It is better to simply take the scriptures in the usage of its own terms rather than to resort to such a drastic change as demanded by the trinitarian formula.
To worship in spirit and truth has nothing to do with accepting a later formulated dogma of men; however, since there is not one scripture anywhere at all that says one word about three persons in one God, then Christians desiring to worship in spirit and truth are correct in rejecting the trinity fable that has to be added to the scriptures.
Permission is given to duplicate this document in its entirety, including this statement, for not-for-profit usage in Bible studies and general distribution.
Last update: March 19, 2005
Source : http://godandson.reslight.net/
Abdul-Raouf
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Christians Unaware
The Christian does not know that the true spirit of charity which the Muslim displays, always, towards Jesus and his mother Mary spring from the fountainhead of his faith - the Holy Qur’ân. He does not know that the Muslim does not take the holy name of Jesus, in his own language, without saying Eesa, alaihi assalam ("Jesus, peace be upon him")
The Christian does not know that in the Holy Qur’ân Jesus is mentioned twenty five times. For example:
"We gave Jesus, the son of Mary, clear signs and strengthened him with the Holy Spirit" (The Holy Qur’ân 2:87)
"O Mary! God giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary..." (3:45)
"...Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of god..." (4:171)
"...And in their foot steps we sent Jesus the son of Mary..." (5:46)
"And Zakariya and John, and Jesus and Elias: all in the ranks of the righteous." (6:85)
Jesus - His Titles
Though Jesus is mentioned by name in twenty-five places in the Holy Qur’ân, he is also addressed with respect as: Ibn Maryam, meaning "The son of Mary"; and as the Maseeh (in Hebrew it is the Messiah), which is translated as "Christ". He is also known as Abdullah, "The servant of Allah"; and as Rasul u Allah, the messenger of Allah.
He is spoken of as "The Word of God", as "The Spirit of God", as a "Sign of God", and numerous other epithets of honor spread over fifteen different chapters. The Holy Quran honors this mighty messenger of God, and the Muslims have not fallen short over the past fourteen hundred years in doing the same.
I Just wanna say this.........
In The final scripture, the Qur’aan, clarifies the issue of worshipping or not worshipping Jesus, by quoting a conversation which will take place between Jesus and God on the Day of Judgement. Allaah states in Chapter al-Maa’idah, (5):116-7:
“When Allaah will say: ‘O Jesus, son of Mary, did you tell people: “Worship me and my mother as two gods instead of Allaah?” ’...[Jesus will say]: ‘I only told them what You commanded me to say: “Worship Allaah, my Lord and your Lord ...” ”
Im not bothered .... Whether u believe the above Quranic verses or not ........ But never forget the above Quranic verse in ur life
The Christian does not know that the true spirit of charity which the Muslim displays, always, towards Jesus and his mother Mary spring from the fountainhead of his faith - the Holy Qur’ân. He does not know that the Muslim does not take the holy name of Jesus, in his own language, without saying Eesa, alaihi assalam ("Jesus, peace be upon him")
The Christian does not know that in the Holy Qur’ân Jesus is mentioned twenty five times. For example:
"We gave Jesus, the son of Mary, clear signs and strengthened him with the Holy Spirit" (The Holy Qur’ân 2:87)
"O Mary! God giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary..." (3:45)
"...Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of god..." (4:171)
"...And in their foot steps we sent Jesus the son of Mary..." (5:46)
"And Zakariya and John, and Jesus and Elias: all in the ranks of the righteous." (6:85)
Jesus - His Titles
Though Jesus is mentioned by name in twenty-five places in the Holy Qur’ân, he is also addressed with respect as: Ibn Maryam, meaning "The son of Mary"; and as the Maseeh (in Hebrew it is the Messiah), which is translated as "Christ". He is also known as Abdullah, "The servant of Allah"; and as Rasul u Allah, the messenger of Allah.
He is spoken of as "The Word of God", as "The Spirit of God", as a "Sign of God", and numerous other epithets of honor spread over fifteen different chapters. The Holy Quran honors this mighty messenger of God, and the Muslims have not fallen short over the past fourteen hundred years in doing the same.
I Just wanna say this.........
In The final scripture, the Qur’aan, clarifies the issue of worshipping or not worshipping Jesus, by quoting a conversation which will take place between Jesus and God on the Day of Judgement. Allaah states in Chapter al-Maa’idah, (5):116-7:
“When Allaah will say: ‘O Jesus, son of Mary, did you tell people: “Worship me and my mother as two gods instead of Allaah?” ’...[Jesus will say]: ‘I only told them what You commanded me to say: “Worship Allaah, my Lord and your Lord ...” ”
Im not bothered .... Whether u believe the above Quranic verses or not ........ But never forget the above Quranic verse in ur life
glo
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I thought you were interested in learning how Christian's view Jesus ...?
Now I am starting to think you are more interested in sharing what the Qur'an tells you to believe about him ... :?
I would love to explain how I see Jesus, but I am afraid I might be seen to "add to, redefine common terminology, and distort all of the above scriptures presented to make them appear to fit the extra-Biblical trinitarian fable of three persons in one God. " I would also hate to give the impression that I "seem to think that one should simply accept [my] added-on reasoning as proof that the trinity is true"; or, like "many" to "claim that [my] acceptance of the trinity is evidence that they have God's spirit, and will often claim that one cannot have God's spirit who doesn't accept their added-on philosophy." :-\
I am not here to force my beliefs and views onto other people.
I would love to tell people what I believe, and why ... but in return I expect my views to be accepted and tolerated as my own.
Peace.
Now I am starting to think you are more interested in sharing what the Qur'an tells you to believe about him ... :?
I would love to explain how I see Jesus, but I am afraid I might be seen to "add to, redefine common terminology, and distort all of the above scriptures presented to make them appear to fit the extra-Biblical trinitarian fable of three persons in one God. " I would also hate to give the impression that I "seem to think that one should simply accept [my] added-on reasoning as proof that the trinity is true"; or, like "many" to "claim that [my] acceptance of the trinity is evidence that they have God's spirit, and will often claim that one cannot have God's spirit who doesn't accept their added-on philosophy." :-\
I am not here to force my beliefs and views onto other people.
I would love to tell people what I believe, and why ... but in return I expect my views to be accepted and tolerated as my own.
Peace.
Abdul-Raouf
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Abdul-Raouf
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i know about him very well....... the thing is we muslims consider him as a messenger........ but u all consider him as God....
With all due respect, in this and other situations, the Quran directly contradicts the Bible. You say the Quran is "The final scripture," but it cannot contradict previous Words of God if IT is also from God. God is not confused. If the Bible is the Word of God and says God was made flesh and dwelt among us in the Person of Jesus Christ, no later "Word of God" can correctly say otherwise, by, for example, saying God did NOT become flesh. I know you may try to justify the later contradiction by saying the Bible is corrupt or whatever, but you can't prove that. You can't prove that all the many, many verses that teach the Deity of Christ, that refer to Jesus as the Son of God, that show Jesus was worshipped without any rebuke by Him, etc., etc. are not exactly as they were in the original manuscripts. It is undisputable, however, that the Quran came into being hundreds of years AFTER the Bible manuscripts (letters to churches, gospels, etc.) were written by the New Testament writers (Paul, Peter, John, Matthew, James, etc.). That being the case, it would seem that YOU have the burden of proof that (1) what the Bible says is not in the original manuscripts and therefore corrupt or otherwise not to be believed, AND that (2) the Quran is the Word of God and can be trusted and believed. I say "AND" because BOTH must be proven. Only proving (1) does not establish your "final scripture" is true; they could BOTH be wrong. And only proving (2) would simply be proving two contradictory scriptures from God.
Your final scripture cannot "clarify" something by directly denying it. Jesus was worshipped again and again without His rebuking anyone. Compare that to when Cornelius, upon meeting Peter, "fell down at his feet and worshipped him" (Acts 10:25). Peter quickly corrected Cornelius in the very next verse: "But Peter took him up, saying, Stand up; I myself also am a man" (v. 26).
The same sort of thing occurred with the Apostle John and an angel in Revelation 22:8-9:
8. Now I, John, saw and heard these things. And when I heard and saw, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel who showed me these things.
9. Then he said to me, "See that you do not do that. For I am your fellow servant, and of your brethren the prophets, and of those who keep the words of this book. Worship God.''
It is clear that we are to worship no one but GOD. But all the verses that show Jesus was worshipped are totally consistent with all the verses that show Jesus is God. Even the FATHER commanded that all the angels worship the Son (Heb. 1:6). And the Father addressed the Son as "God"! (Heb. 1:8) How much more do we need to show that Jesus is God and can be worshipped and prayed to as God?
Peace
bint_muhammed
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no offence to the christians out there but i get the feeling that the new bible has just been fiddled or altered by humans to suit themselves. i dont get where paul etc. come in to it, surely the bible should be right and kept the same way as God has sent
peace ( i am not trying t9o be funny honest, just wanna know how you clear this)
peace ( i am not trying t9o be funny honest, just wanna know how you clear this)
What "new bible"? In what way has it been "fiddled or altered by humans to suit themselves"? Please excuse my ignorance, but I don't understand your post.
Peace
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