israel is attacking a whole city for one zionist criminal soldier!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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muslim_friend said:
Yes, Please. That was an innocent woman, and this is some criminal soldier. I also think it's wrong of you to make immediate assumptions.
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How do you know that was an innocent woman? Criminal soldier? He was in Israel proper, not Gaza. He was doing his national service. He wasn't killing anyone. I admit he was a soldier. But even so, he was hardly a criminal. How does it differ?

Explain to me what assumptions you think I have made?
 
HeiGou said:
How do you know that was an innocent woman? Criminal soldier? He was in Israel proper, not Gaza. He was doing his national service. He wasn't killing anyone. I admit he was a soldier. But even so, he was hardly a criminal. How does it differ?
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Right, i simply assumed that the man was a criminal, he might have been peace loving. But more than who the captive is, the real issue is the seriousness of these raids. Israel is killing innocent people because of one person.. and that is clearly wrong.why should other people die, for what someone else has done?

I don't know if the woman in the incident you mentioned, was innocent. It would be good, if you furnish details about this event.

Explain to me what assumptions you think I have made?
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Did i in any way sound offensive?.. i was referring to the event involving the woman. In your previous post, you mention 'massacre' and 'enslavement' with regard to it. Clarify me, if i have misunderstood.
 
Musli friend how many people have died from these raids so far... just curious. And could Hamas have prevented it by not kidnapping the soldier who was not in Gaza, but was in real Israel not occupied areas?
 
ganeshsikkim said:
More prayers for death. There is a lot of that here. I don't know many religions pray for the death of others.
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yh so what you gonna do about it? theres nothing wrong with saying *may Allah Subahana wa Ta'ala destroy the black hearted zionists.*
and i didnt pray for death. they, like i am, gonna die anyway :rollseyes i prayed for a bunch of criminal black hearted opressive people to be destroyed.
 
ManchesterFolk said:
Musli friend how many people have died from these raids so far... just curious.
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I think there have been a few casulaties. but the exact number, i don't know. But do numbers matter? Even if it's one innocent person, it doesn't make a difference.
And could Hamas have prevented it by not kidnapping the soldier who was not in Gaza, but was in real Israel not occupied areas?
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Does the kidnapping involve civilians in any way? no.
 
I think there have been a few casulaties. but the exact number, i don't know. But do numbers matter? Even if it's one innocent person, it doesn't make a difference.
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I didn't say it as a wise crack comment. I was just curious because I never heard on the news about a death yet, but you said innocent people were dieing. Just curiousity.
 
The Muslims invaded Byzantium over one woman. Find me a Muslim who thinks that was a little extreme. What's your problem here? I mean, really?
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I've have problem if they knocked down the whole city in smoke killing innocent civilians, elderly, women, and children like Israeli military is doing.
 
Muezzin said:
Good God, people! You'd think that after I locked this thread once, you'd learn your lesson and get back on topic. Now, seriously, if you cannot discuss this topic without name-calling, mudslinging, or being otherwise unpleasant while posting off-topic messages, I'll lock the thread, delete the offending posts, and hand out some hefty warnings for multiple off-topic posts.

You have been warned.
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Wow! My apologies for hitting so many nerves, but it's the only way I can get all this out in the open where I can see it better, in all it's detail.

Hmm... so it's true then? This all started over name-calling? This one is an infidel. That one is a Kafir. The wound really is that small, once you wash off all the blood. But every family has the one -sshole and everyone has been at different times, in different circumstances. I confess to having an evil temper myself, but I've learned to pick and choose my battles carefully because I know how much energy my rage will cost me. I let a lot of things slide with my family because I'm stuck with them for the ride here. That's just the way it is. Likewise, I'm stuck with people... can't go off too much with them because, well, there's a lot of pots calling the kettles black. All this business of one side accusing the other of the killing of innocent women and children ~ spare me! There isn't a single army, from ANY side that isn't guilty.

I don't care what's been done anymore and, judging from what messages I hear, these wars have gone well beyond the point of reason, all because certain family members disrespected others who were not consulted on matters they felt strongly about. Those family might have otherwise come to an agreement if they were at least heard, but that's not what happened here. Only a handful decided on an issue, and they felt they had the right to speak for everyone. Giggles, that's probably how some women feel when their marriage is arranged by others. No voice.

Well, knowing how silence poisons the soul, I'd rather have to hear the all the ranting and raving it takes to get all the different points and pieces back on the table. It's exhausting, but every mother on this forum knows that when her children fight, she has to hear every child's side of the story.... and the truth is never found in one, it's always somewhere in between them all.

So cough up the pieces, lol. Let's hear every angle of this until we're exhausted and can't think anymore.

First Question: Can you all agree that you are the children of Abraham?

Ninth Scribe
 
ManchesterFolk said:
Ok, great awnser. Are you going to back up your claim of 'innocent people dead' because of this invasion. I would like to know how many have died.
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??? ..that was in reference to your first statement. from what i have read on yahoo.. "it's few casualties".. if i knew the number, i would have told you wouldn't I?
 
ManchesterFolk said:
Musli friend how many people have died from these raids so far... just curious.
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Don't know but here is something from fair.org. It is an 2002 article in the style of NYT reporting on Palestinian casualties, but I don't know if current crises has same pattern news reporting.
The main headline on the front page of the New York Times' April 10 final edition was "At Least 8 Killed In Suicide Bombing On A Bus In Israel." The late edition, which is available to more readers, had "13 Israeli Troops Killed in Ambush; Bus Bomb Kills 10," in the 36-point headline size that the paper reserves for what it considers major events.

Six paragraphs into the story, the paper provided this additional information: "More than 100 Palestinians have been killed in Jenin, the Palestinian town that has brought the stiffest resistance to the broad Israeli sweep through the West Bank. Many of the Palestinian dead still lie where they fell."

By its headline choice, the Times suggested that the deaths of 23 Israelis (or eight, in the final edition) are more important than the deaths of 100 Palestinians.

But even those ratios may understate the greater weight that the editors place on Israeli casualties. Beneath the main headline in the late edition were two subheads: "Worst Army Toll" and "A 14th Soldier Is Killed in Separate Attack at a Refugee Camp." The Times might have used one of the subheads to acknowledge the deaths of more than a hundred Palestinians, but evidently noting the death of a single additional Israeli soldier was considered more newsworthy.

Link: http://www.fair.org/activism/nyt-israel-headlines.html
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ManchesterFolk said:
And could Hamas have prevented it by not kidnapping the soldier who was not in Gaza, but was in real Israel not occupied areas?
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Other side can argue that Israel's govt. could have prevented it by not shelling and killing civilians on beach. Then one side will say they started the killing first and the other would say no they started it first... he said she said thing is not the solution or not the right thing at all. Targeted assassinations, suicide bombings among other forms of violence, and intentionally imposed economic hardships and other practices that make everyday life for any people difficult, even unbearable... all should be equally condemned and stopped.
 
Ninth_Scribe said:
Wow! My apologies for hitting so many nerves, but it's the only way I can get all this out in the open where I can see it better, in all it's detail.
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Let me preface this by saying my message was not in reference to any particular member, only to the fact that the messages on this thread seem to have heavilly deviated from the original topic.

You in particular didn't hit any of my nerves with what you said. I was just very miffed at the fact that a lot of your posts on this particular thread do not have much to do with the topic at hand. Others reacted by insulting you, which also has nothing to do with the topic at hand. I am tired of deleting tangenital posts. My apologies if I caused any upset.
 
Chuck said:
Other side can argue that Israel's govt. could have prevented it by not shelling and killing civilians on beach.
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True, but Hamas could have prevented it by not shooting Kassam Rockets at Sderot Israel. We can play this game of going back and forth forever, but that won't stop the violence now, will it?
 
ManchesterFolk said:
True, but Hamas could have prevented it by not shooting Kassam Rockets at Sderot Israel. We can play this game of going back and forth forever, but that won't stop the violence now, will it?
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Yup that's way I said: "he said she said thing is not the solution or the right thing. Targeted assassinations, suicide bombings among other forms of violence, and intentionally imposed economic hardships and other practices that make everyday life for any people difficult, even unbearable... all should be equally condemned and stopped."
 
as usual, more chaos by the zionist israeli military, they have destroyed Al-Arkam SCHOOL that was built by Hamas for the CHILDREN...

what the school has to do with the zionist soldier who was arrested?!?! did the students arrested him by any chance!? do they have bombs in the school or something?!?! why did they destroy the school?!?! what kind of war is this...

that is so unacceptable and israel will be responsible for the crap that they are doing to the Palestinians children...

that is a place to learn and it's all what is left for them.. and look what the zionist terrorists are doing.. having a cold war even with kids...
 
Muezzin said:
You in particular didn't hit any of my nerves with what you said. I was just very miffed at the fact that a lot of your posts on this particular thread do not have much to do with the topic at hand. Others reacted by insulting you, which also has nothing to do with the topic at hand. I am tired of deleting tangenital posts. My apologies if I caused any upset.
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Understood and my apologies, but I couldn't help but notice that these isolated incidents are deeply rooted in others, so I didn't really consider them unrelated. Every time I try to learn something on this forum, I have to play chase with all the others issues that are tied up in this one or that... and the name-calling that follows. I don't mind that so much because I have to admit, I'm a stranger here and equally... strange. Will can the discussion and go over what came out of the pages of this thread.

Ninth Scribe
 
Lamaggad said:
as usual, more chaos by the zionist israeli military, they have destroyed Al-Arkam SCHOOL that was built by Hamas for the CHILDREN...

what the school has to do with the zionist soldier who was arrested?!?! did the students arrested him by any chance!? do they have bombs in the school or something?!?! why did they destroy the school?!?! what kind of war is this...
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First of all, no Israeli soldier has been arrested. He has been kidnapped. He was kidnapped in Israel and taken to Gaza to be exact. Second, the school was built by Hamas. Isn't it obvious that is the connection? Hamas kidnaps a soldier, Israel attacks Hamas-related targets.

that is so unacceptable and israel will be responsible for the crap that they are doing to the Palestinians children...

that is a place to learn and it's all what is left for them.. and look what the zionist terrorists are doing.. having a cold war even with kids...
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This is unacceptable? What are they doing to Palestinian children? I assume that none were killed or you would have complained about it. They destroyed some buildings. It does not look too cold t ome, it looks like a real war, but where were you when Hamas started attacking children? If you condemn the IDF for destroying a school, where were you when Hamas murdered children? This is a list of those killed in the June 1 Dolphinarium suicide bombing by a Hamas terrorist,

* Maria Tagiltseva, 14
* Yevgeniya Dorfman, 15
* Raisa Nemirovskaya, 15
* Yulia Sklyanik, 15
* Ana Kazachkova, 15
* Katherine Kastinyada, 15
* Irina Nepomnyashaya, 16
* Mariana Medvedenko, 16
* Yulia Nalimova, 16
* Liana Saakyan, 16
* Marina Berkovskaya, 17
* Simona Rudina, 17
* Alexei Lupalo, 17
* Yelena Nalimova, 18
* Irina Osadchaya, 18
* Ilya Gutman, 19
* Sergei Panchenko, 20
* Roman Dzhanashvili, 21
* Diaz Nurmanov, 21
* Jan Bloom, 25
* Uri Shachar, 32

Are these children somehow less child-like than the ones that were not killed in Gaza? And it is not just a Hamas thing, Here are the names of 21 students who were killed at the Ma'alot High School massacre: Ilana Turgeman, Rachel Aputa, Yocheved Mazoz, Sarah Ben-Shim'on, Yona Sabag, Yafa Cohen, Shoshana Cohen, Michal Sitrok, Malka Amrosy, Aviva Saada, Yocheved Diyi, Yaakov Levi, Yaakov Kabla, Rina Cohen, Ilana Ne'eman, Sarah Madar, Tamar Dahan, Sarah Sofer, Lili Morad, David Madar, Yehudit Madar. Care to condemn that attack too?

No one is innocent in this. Both sides kill civilians. The only real distinction here is that Israel rarely does and does not usually intend to.
 
There has been too much killing on both sides. The solution is complex in its simplicity. Both, sides just need to stop killing.

The problem is neither side wants to be the first to stop killing, out of fear it will seen as surrendering.

What concessions can or should be made to preserve the life of one child. Which side will be brave enough and big enough to stop the killing today?
 

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