Lack of diplomacy from america a big part of ME crisis

[جوري]

difficult to distinguish a supremecists from the next.......everyone has a superiority complex.... neo-nazi... neo-Israeli neo-zionist... same mentality different groups of people.......(arynas)/ (god's chosen) we have played this card often enough it has lost all meaning......

 

[searchingsoul]

how is the u.s. to blame?
they refuse to demand a cease fire as lebanon is being systematically destroyed.
they arm israel and early on in the israeli attack on lebanon, it was announced that the u.s. is shipping some kind of more bombs to israel.
as i said elsewhere there are so good guys here.
israel's purpose - to turn the lebanese people against hezbollah is a dismal failure. this invasion has so far increased the support for hezbollah among the lebanese, not decreased it.
both sides made serious mistakes in judgement. the lebanese are paying.

Why is it the place of the US government to demand a cease fire? That would be Western intervention.

Is Western intervention acceptable when your getting your butts kicked?

 

[Keltoi]

how is the u.s. to blame?
they refuse to demand a cease fire as lebanon is being systematically destroyed.
they arm israel and early on in the israeli attack on lebanon, it was announced that the u.s. is shipping some kind of more bombs to israel.
as i said elsewhere there are so good guys here.
israel's purpose - to turn the lebanese people against hezbollah is a dismal failure. this invasion has so far increased the support for hezbollah among the lebanese, not decreased it.
both sides made serious mistakes in judgement. the lebanese are paying.

Ordinarily I believe the U.S. would have demanded a cease-fire. The problem is the act that triggered this conflict, namely Hezbollah killing 8 soldiers and kidnapping 2 of them. As for the "bunker buster" bombs being sent to Israel, they are designed for exactly this kind of warfare, with tunnels and underground bunkers. Hezbollah is also an enemy of the United States, let us not forget that fact.
It is obvious that civilians are suffering the most, and that Israel has been less than precise with its air campaign, and that Hezbollah has been less than concerned about the people they hide among. I know it makes sense to call for an immediate cease-fire when you take into account the loss of innocent life in this war. The problem is the future. Hezbollah cannot be destroyed entirely, that would be like canceling Star Trek...the body may be gone but a new generation of nerds will never let it die...okay, bad analogy. However, Israel has put itself between a rock and a hard place. If they stop the offensive and return to Israel, then Hezbollah will declare victory and use the "tail between the legs". That isn't going to end the conflict, only ensure that it will start all over again. Only option now is an international peace-keeping force, with no Americans, that will actively disrupt Hezbollah's hold on southern Lebanon. No good answers.

 

[snakelegs]

Why is it the place of the US government to demand a cease fire? That would be Western intervention.

Is Western intervention acceptable when your getting your butts kicked?

u.s. has already intervened by arming israel and refusing to apply pressure.

 

[snakelegs]

i don't blame the US for backing the jews they own most of americas top businesses

[MOUSE]bigot alert![/MOUSE]

 

[snakelegs]

Ordinarily I believe the U.S. would have demanded a cease-fire. The problem is the act that triggered this conflict, namely Hezbollah killing 8 soldiers and kidnapping 2 of them. As for the "bunker buster" bombs being sent to Israel, they are designed for exactly this kind of warfare, with tunnels and underground bunkers. Hezbollah is also an enemy of the United States, let us not forget that fact.
It is obvious that civilians are suffering the most, and that Israel has been less than precise with its air campaign, and that Hezbollah has been less than concerned about the people they hide among. I know it makes sense to call for an immediate cease-fire when you take into account the loss of innocent life in this war. The problem is the future. Hezbollah cannot be destroyed entirely, that would be like canceling Star Trek...the body may be gone but a new generation of nerds will never let it die...okay, bad analogy. However, Israel has put itself between a rock and a hard place. If they stop the offensive and return to Israel, then Hezbollah will declare victory and use the "tail between the legs". That isn't going to end the conflict, only ensure that it will start all over again. Only option now is an international peace-keeping force, with no Americans, that will actively disrupt Hezbollah's hold on southern Lebanon. No good answers.

i disagree - the israelis are being quite precise. they are destroying the country quite systematically.
there are reports that israel is using depleted uranium, cluster bombs and white phosphorous.
as far as the future, this invasion and the u.s. support for it, have boosted sympathy for hezbollah tremendously, as well as increased hatred for the u.s.
i agree completely with your last point! that given, why isn't the u.s. demanding this (immediate cease fire and international peace keeping force)?
yes, there are no good answers or simple right and wrong in this issue.
and it is a very emotional issue for most of us.

 

[nimrod]

I am just not understanding the logic behind this “Their "fanaticism"...so it is fanatical to respond to an enemy who raids across the border and kills and kidnaps soldiers?

Pure Ambrosia responded “yup”.

How does that make sense in anyone’s mind?????

Snake Legs, you are very wrong in your stance on this issue.

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[snakelegs]

Snake Legs, you are very wrong in your stance on this issue.
Thanks
Nimrod

i accept that. i am wrong about a lot of things - (it happens every so often) and i feel much ambiguity on this subject in particular.
i hope you didn't think that because i am critical of the u.s. and israel about this, that that means i think hezbollah is right. i most certainly do not!

 

[جوري]

I am just not understanding the logic behind this “Their "fanaticism"...so it is fanatical to respond to an enemy who raids across the border and kills and kidnaps soldiers?

Pure Ambrosia responded “yup”.

How does that make sense in anyone’s mind?????

Snake Legs, you are very wrong in your stance on this issue.

Thanks
Nimrod

It is simple Israel is suffering from Munchausen syndrome with a little bit of malingering.... to the naked eye seems believable but on closer examination it all becomes clear... want a good view take a few weeks sabbatical and live in a Palestinian refugee camp... and let us know how well you handle it when people come knocking on your door shooting your wife and smashing your property.... I am sure you will be all forgiving like....

 

[nimrod]

Snake Legs, I in no way believe that you are defending Hezbollah, or its actions, I hope I didn’t leave you with that impression.

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[searchingsoul]

Snake Legs, I in no way believe that you are defending Hezbollah, or its actions, I hope I didn’t leave you with that impression.

Thanks
Nimrod

Of course she is! "You're either with us, or against us."

I think the same statement would apply to this conflict since Israel is supported by the United States.

Snakelegs, you are against us.

 

[snakelegs]

Of course she is! "You're either with us, or against us."

I think the same statement would apply to this conflict since Israel is supported by the United States.

Snakelegs, you are against us.

who is "us"? sometimes i am not even sure about this! lol.

 

[nimrod]

Purest Ambrosia, you speak as though everything that has happened, has happened in some sort of vacuum.

Israel has, the same as every other nation, acted and reacted to events concerning them, just the same as Palestine.

Surely you don’t believe Palestine has made no mistakes in any of its actions toward Israel.

Maybe, just maybe, if someone is shooting rockets at your wife and kids, you might do some of the things that have been done to Palestine.

I refuse to enjoin a tit-for-tat debate all the way back to the 1940’s, it is pointless.

It is time that Palestine understood one fact, Israel is not going away.

Find a way to live peacefully or suffer.

Be it right or wrong, Israel isn’t going to cease to be a nation.

Deal with that or suffer for not understanding things as they are.


On a more logical plane, answer me this;

What advantage does Israel gain from a cease fire and status quo?

If you were advising the Israelis on their best course of action, what advise would you give them that would better their position?

If a cease fire would better Israel’s position with Hezbollah, please explain how.

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[nimrod]

Searching Soul, I assume your post was made in jest.

Thanks
Nimrod

No supporter of GWB

 

[searchingsoul]

Searching Soul, I assume your post was made in jest.

Thanks
Nimrod

No supporter of GWB

Of course.

 

[جوري]

Purest Ambrosia, you speak as though everything that has happened, has happened in some sort of vacuum
Israel has, the same as every other nation, acted and reacted to events concerning them, just the same as Palestine..

ha?

Surely you don’t believe Palestine has made no mistakes in any of its actions toward Israel...

Sure I believe...

Maybe, just maybe, if someone is shooting rockets at your wife and kids, you might do some of the things that have been done to Palestine....

Again I am not sure what that means!!

I refuse to enjoin a tit-for-tat debate all the way back to the 1940’s, it is pointless.

then don't...

It is time that Palestine understood one fact, Israel is not going away..

oh in time there will be a day of reckoning....

Find a way to live peacefully or suffer.

I guess the choice is made then

Be it right or wrong, Israel isn’t going to cease to be a nation.

again I believe that there will be a day of reckoning

Deal with that or suffer for not understanding things as they are.

I don't like simplistic comments from which I am to draw some sort of closure

On a more logical plane, answer me this;

What advantage does Israel gain from a cease fire and status quo?.

they get their two thugs back

If you were advising the Israelis on their best course of action, what advise would you give them that would better their position?]?.

To wander in nations until driven back the promised land by the awaited one not to impose a secular state under the guise of a religious one if that doesn't spell nazism I don't know what does.

[If a cease fire would better Israel’s position with Hezbollah, please explain how.

I don't care what their postition is as far as hezballah... "they want" they should give it is that simple...

Thanks
Nimrod

you are quite welcome
pureamb

 

[nimrod]

Pure Ambrosia “I don't care what their [Israel’s] position is as far as Hezbollah...”.

That is what I don't understand.

My, posts to you, are worded/written to trigger your giving some sort of consideration toward what is happening in the real world.

Surely Israel’s position/stance toward Hezbollah is of some importance?

Why don’t you care?

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[جوري]

Pure Ambrosia “I don't care what their [Israel’s] position is as far as Hezbollah...”.

That is what I don't understand.

My, posts to you, are worded/written to trigger your giving some sort of consideration toward what is happening in the real world.

Surely Israel’s position/stance toward Hezbollah is of some importance?

Why don’t you care?

Thanks
Nimrod

if IDF has a total blatant disregard to human life....as we have seen ONLY a small excerpt while the rest is swept under the rug... Any sympathy for Israel can only be met with apathy on my behalf and many others....surely the mind has formed and expression and we have a long laundry list of disdain to lean back on ... the same way we are yearly reminded of the holocaust yet with nothing but insolence deny the state of Palestine also on the same Oscars... forgive that I am not very pro-Israel .... glad to see that you are so forgiving though would love to know how you fare if you were lost amidst a tribe of cannibals and how "accepting' of defeat...
you tend to be polite in your responses and I don't wish to lose my manners around you ... this is the general view through muslim/arab eyes... Israel is the offender ........

 

[snakelegs]

Snake Legs, I in no way believe that you are defending Hezbollah, or its actions, I hope I didn’t leave you with that impression.

Thanks
Nimrod

ok. thanks for the clarification.

 

[snakelegs]

Purest Ambrosia, you speak as though everything that has happened, has happened in some sort of vacuum.

Israel has, the same as every other nation, acted and reacted to events concerning them, just the same as Palestine.

Surely you don’t believe Palestine has made no mistakes in any of its actions toward Israel.

Thanks
Nimrod

this wasn't addressed to me but i just wanted to point out that it isn't the palestinians who are paying the price - it is the lebanese people, muslims, christians, sunnis, shi'as. - the entire country.
israel's reaction is, if anything, helping the palestinians. it has certainly won a lot of new fans for hezbollah.