Deploy troops in Iran...!

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Barney shame on you, I wasn't being sarcastic (I'm very good at that you'll know it when I am :D ). I was genuinely interested. To me 2003 is recent and as I haven't been there since the first gulf war I really wanted to know if you could enlighten me on the situation there, how did this mess get so far? Thats why I said send me an email so we don't bore other people to death. I too would love to understand what leads people to extremism. If you email I can share what I found out since moving to the middle east.


I'm So sorry. i have become quite a cynic :cry:

I will PM you after i've had some sleep, it's getting late now. but I'd just like to publicly apologise for accusing you of sarcasm.:)
 
I'm So sorry. i have become quite a cynic :cry:

I will PM you after i've had some sleep, it's getting late now. but I'd just like to publicly apologise for accusing you of sarcasm.:)

Thank you Barney. Sleep well. I will try to hone my sarcasm for tomorrow :D
 
You wouldn't be wrong to wonder if Iran hasn't lost its mind seizing the 15 British marines and sailors, and in so doing, handing Bush a casus belli even he couldn't have imagined.
Related
What Iran Wants with the Sailors

Feeling cornered in its nuclear confrontation, Tehran is trying to take the offensive against Britain. Will it backfire?

But then again you'd be missing the grim fatalism that has settled over Iran of late, the resigned belief that a war with the U.S. is all but inevitable. This week Iranian diplomats are telling interlocutors that, yes, they realize seizing the Brits could lead to a hot war. But, they point out, it wasn't Iran that started taking hostages — it was the U.S., when it arrested five members of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps in Erbil in Northern Iraq on January 11. They are diplomats, the Iranians insist. They were in Erbil with the approval of the Kurds and therefore, they argue, are under the protection of the Vienna Convention.

Iranian grievances, real and perceived, don't stop there. Tehran is convinced the U.S. or one of its allies was behind the March 2006 separatist violence in Iranian Baluchistan, which ended up with 20 people killed, including an IRGC member executed. And the Iranians believe there is more to come, accusing the U.S. of training and arming Iranian Kurds and Azeris to go back home and cause problems. Needless to say the Iranians are not happy there are American soldiers on two of its borders, as well as two carriers and a dozen warships in the Gulf. You call this paranoia? they ask.

The Bush Administration is doing nothing to allay Tehran's paranoia. With the largest buildup in the Gulf since the start of this Iraq war, it's actually fanning it. You have to wonder if Bush is counting on the Iranians' overreacting the way they did when they seized our embassy in 1979. And lest we forget, this was driven by paranoia that we were plotting to destroy the revolution.

Add this to the rest of the bad news coming out of the Gulf, and things look pretty grim. The "surge," despite what some claim, has barely made a dent in the violence in Iraq. Our Arab allies are jumping ship, apparently as fast as they can. At the opening of the Arab summit on Wednesday, Saudi King Abdallah accused the U.S of illegally occupying Iraq. The day before, the leader of the United Arab Emirates sent his foreign minister to Tehran to tell the Iranians he would not allow the U.S. to use UAE soil to attack Iran. That leaves us with Kuwait and Iraqi Prime Minister Maliki to face Iran.

I called up an Arab Gulf security official and asked him what he thought about it all. He said the view from his side of the Gulf is that if Iran does not soon release the Brits, a war between the U.S. and Iran is in the cards. "I for one am taking all the cash I can out of my ATM," he said before hanging up.


this is from TIMES



IRAN proving POWER

these are random quotes


"You can start a war but it won't be you who finishes it," said Gen. Yahya Rahim Safavi, the head of the Revolutionary Guards and among the regime's most powerful figures
.
"The Americans know better than anyone that their troops in the region and in Iraq are vulnerable. I would advise them not to commit such a strategic error," he told reporters on the sidelines of a conference in Tehran.

"I would advise them to first get out of their quagmire in Iraq before getting into an even bigger one," Gen. Safavi said with a grin.

"We have American forces in the region under total surveillance. For the past two years, we have been ready for any scenario, whether sanctions or an attack."
 
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good post akhi, but wait till u get the responses. Boy sum of these guys will still find justificationz 4 u.s action. But still i think iran is playin a dangerous game. Either they know wat their doing, or they r jus crazy
 
good post akhi, but wait till u get the responses. Boy sum of these guys will still find justificationz 4 u.s action. But still i think iran is playin a dangerous game. Either they know wat their doing, or they r jus crazy

Start a poll - do Iran know what they are doing or are they just nuts? :D
 
Yeah sis i shud. Mods sort it out. Anyways every time i c Ahmedinijad i jus start laughing coz he is so defiant. The man is a funny dude.:D
 
Yeah sis i shud. Mods sort it out. Anyways every time i c Ahmedinijad i jus start laughing coz he is so defiant. The man is a funny dude.:D

Can I vote now? He has a screw loose somewhere.

Just watching a documentary called Once Upon a Time in Iran - rather interesting. Anyone in UK turn to channel 4 to watch.
 
its no suprise that the documentries r comming out now. They r prepering the people, getting them 2 think 'yes iran is a problem' and they need 2 do sumting about it.
 
its no suprise that the documentries r comming out now. They r prepering the people, getting them 2 think 'yes iran is a problem' and they need 2 do sumting about it.

Like the people need documentaries to figure out Ahmadenijad has a couple of screws loose.
 
its no suprise that the documentries r comming out now. They r prepering the people, getting them 2 think 'yes iran is a problem' and they need 2 do sumting about it.

Excuse me did you switch it on? They are actually being surprisingly unbiased and telling the history of the troubles going right back to Hussain.
 
This was an outrageous and grievous act by the Iranians. If it's not an act of war, I don't know what is.
 
^who can tell truly?and the maritime borders concerned doesn't seem to be demarcated properly.Blair pissed,Iran ignoring him and all ,a reminder they can boss around countries like Bangladesh but not Iran,no longer a superpower,haha.England here seems pissed off too.too bad isn't it?
a war between the Forces of Good and the Evil forces of the bad bad bad Iranians would be nice.atleast the Brits won't meddling in Bangladesh elections.
 
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Excuse me did you switch it on? They are actually being surprisingly unbiased and telling the history of the troubles going right back to Hussain.

Sorry sis i didnt watch it. BuT if was about a shia pilgrimiage 2 karballah and the killin of hussain, then yes i did watch it b4. Anyways all iam saying is that they r building up intrest in that region. Bad or good.
 
I've let this thread go on for 30 pages withot stepping in. I finally feel an urge to do so :D
Well thank God you did, I dont know what I would have done had you not! :D


That's a good point. And it should be looked at from both sides. Americans are constantly criticizing Iran for possibly trying to influence things in Iraq. But the US itself has invaded and is occupying Iraq! Iran is Iraq's neighbour. The US is half way around the world. Talk about hipocracy.
First off, I must say, I dont think the word hypocrisy(check that spelling) really applies in this situation, it is very much overused on this forum.

hypocrisy
noun
1. an expression of agreement that is not supported by real conviction
2. insincerity by virtue of pretending to have qualities or beliefs that you do not really have

Now let me explain, the US is in Iraq not to occupy but to liberate these people. Do you think the Iraqis want the Iranians on their land blowing things up, killing civilians, etc? Do you think the Iranians are in Iraq to help all of the people of Iraq or just the Shia? This is the difference, all that aside the original comment was about the Iranians trying to pose a "resistance" to the Iraqis and the Americans, the Americans are not resisting anyone, they are trying to establish peace so that these people can take care of themselves, whereas the Iranians are there for a completely self serving purpose.

They will likely have nukes, and that has come out of the US and UK lately, including the actions regarding Iraq and North Korea has only given them more and more perfectly legitimate reasons to want and build nukes. Can you say you wouldn't want nukes if you were Iran? Given the way Iraq and North Korea were respectively treated?

Right lets talk about Irans actions lately, that would give a legitimate reason to stop the building of the nukes at all cost. 1) Most recently holding British Navy for no good reason other than to frustrate 2) Calls for Israel to be wiped off the map 3) Contributing to the destruction of Iraq 4) Meetings and information exchanges with NK 5) Holding holocaust conventions 6) Constantly rallying where people say Death to America. What do they need nukes for anyways? No one has threatened to nuke them? Do you think they will behave the same way if they obtain nukes? Not only that but judging by their actions in Iraq (being there but not claiming to be there) they could easily turn a nuke over to a third party allow it to go off somewhere and take no responsibility for it, and this would more than likely be the way it would happen. Iran will be obliterated before they obtain a nuclear weapon, you can hope for it but all you are hoping for is the destruction of a nation.

Even if Iran somehow does fail to build nukes, somebody else the US doesn't like WILL do so. It is only a matter of time. The US should be preparing home defences and more importantly, diplomacy. US diplomacy sounds like a conflict in terms now doesn't it?

Really who else is trying to produce them that you know of? Building a nuclear bomb isnt something you can do in a shed outside of your home, if someone attempts to do this, the world will know and stop it
 
Yes, we should have expected it. In fact, many of us did expect it. Sadam kept these people oppressed and in line, with an Iron fist. It is only natural that once he was removed and a power vacuum was created, these old rivals would rise up and compete to fill it.
Right, so please tell me where in history that there has been another situation like this that the US could have seen this happening. Also when the war first started not even the Iraqis opposed it, not until outside forces (other than the US) arrived and started creating instability. It is easy for you to say this in hindsight.

Add an invasion by the USA, a hated foreign "Great Satan" (etc) and you've got a recipe for disaster. Did anybody seriously believe that American soldiers would be welcomed with open arms? I doubt even Bush actually believed that propaganda.
Actually take a look back and you will see, many were very happy to see the US forces come to remove Saddam from power, and believe it or not the ones who are not planting bombs in markets and blowing up children in car bombs are still happy we are there and want us to stay until there is stability.

Whether the US leaves now or later, there is nothing to suggest that the same bloodshed won't follow. By remaining what is being accomplished other than delaying it? Is it even being delayed? Seems to be taking place even with the US there.
I agree, I am sick of the US being made out to be the bad guy and I say lets leave. Let the blood flow, then whose fault is it? Iran? Saudi Arabia? Al - Qaeda or the various other factions? Where will it then stop? Will in stop inside Iraq or will it spill over the borders? Maybe they will set up a state and a military and we could have a visible enemy to destroy

Wasn't the stated goal of attacking Iran to depose of its socalled WMD? I don't recall plans about an occupation being drawn up prior to attacking Iraq. In fact, there appears to have been no strategy at all to follow the "Mission Accomplished" photo opp on that aircraft carrier.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/iraq/iraq_strategy_nov2005.html

I suggest you take a look at that site, the objective all along was to overthrow Saddam, set up a good government and establish security. There have been many accomplishments in Iraq, the news just doesnt always report it. Again I will say though a war with Iran would include a clearly defined enemy, military bases, government institutions and any other unmentioned resistance :skeleton:
 
Iran airs second sailor 'apology'

The crewman says he has been well treated by the Iranians.
A second member of the Royal Navy crew captured in the Gulf has apologised for "trespassing" in Iranian waters, in a broadcast on Iranian television.
The crewman, who introduces himself as Nathan Thomas Summers, says: "I would like to apologise for entering your waters without permission."


I must say making them apologise like this is not right
 
Iran airs second sailor 'apology'

The crewman says he has been well treated by the Iranians.
A second member of the Royal Navy crew captured in the Gulf has apologised for "trespassing" in Iranian waters, in a broadcast on Iranian television.
The crewman, who introduces himself as Nathan Thomas Summers, says: "I would like to apologise for entering your waters without permission."


I must say making them apologise like this is not right

It is actually pretty funny what they are doing. By presenting these servicemen in the manner that they are is only further discrediting their claims. If they were in fact in Iranian waters the Iranians would have already started prosecuting and would have said to Britain that they couldnt have them back. They are only making trouble for themselves, especially since the letters and speeches are obviously not in these peoples own words. Iran will feel the reprecussions of these juvenile acts
 
http://www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/ir...y_nov2005.html

I suggest you take a look at that site, the objective all along was to overthrow Saddam, set up a good government and establish security. There have been many accomplishments in Iraq, the news just doesnt always report it. Again I will say though a war with Iran would include a clearly defined enemy, military bases, government institutions and any other unmentioned resistance

It can always be the other way around too. (Keep in mind, I'm not taking anyones side here) All I'm saying is that when a government wants to take an action that is illegal, and they want to justify it, what better way to do it than to get the people on your side.

(Keep in mind, this is just an assumption, because I have no way of knowing what actually goes on at the battlegrounds) [this may be true or may not be] By constantly displaying of the Terrorist activity and the Suicide bombers in the news, they play themselves out to be the Heroes; when you have no way of knowing what actually goes on in those grounds. You pretty much eat what you are fed. [No offense to anyone] But ofcourse it can be the other way around too.

What I'm trying to prove is that each government tries to justify its actions by getting the public on their side.

(A similar thing happened when bush got into power. Through media, bush brought fear into the hearts of US citizens by claiming Iraq had WMD, this way, get the public ready for your actions and the rest will follow)
 
I must say making them apologise like this is not right

I've gone from being angry to just plain baffled, now. What on earth do the Iranians think they are achieving?

I understand that they might originally have wanted to flex their muscles and try and 'humiliate' and embarrass the British (as proxies for the Americans) but all they are doing now is making themselves look like bullies. Even if the Brits had been in Iranian waters they would not be making voluntary 'apologies' or writing strange letters to Tony Blair about why he should withdraw the troops from Iraq. As it is so obvious this is happening under duress, what is the point? Add to that the fact that the best answer Iran had to British photographic and GPS evidence was some bloke pointing a stick at a map and they are beginning to look very foolish indeed. I just hope they don't do anything stupid as that fact finally starts to sink in.
 
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