Are we gods?

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NoName55 said:
why do you keep repeating same old lying rubbish time and again? I asked you before to show me how you came up with this mistranslation and you ignored me. I ask again show me"

ו אֲנִי-אָמַרְתִּי, אֱלֹהִים אַתֶּם; וּבְנֵי עֶלְיוֹן כֻּלְּכֶם
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I got it from the gospel of John chapter 10:36
 
alapiana1 said:
What blatant evidence are you referring to? "Angelic creatures" is only one ways to look at it - not every way. It also means godly, godlike, like God and goddess and mighty to that above angels +, which we will one day be. Jesus said, we will "judge angels." In the context it makes no sense to translate that as you are an angel like creatures and will die as men. Besides, angels were referred to as son of God to.
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Shalom,

Can you read Hebrew?
 
alapiana1 said:
Originally Posted by NoName55
why do you keep repeating same old lying rubbish time and again? I asked you before to show me how you came up with this mistranslation and you ignored me. I ask again show me"

ו אֲנִי-אָמַרְתִּי, אֱלֹהִים אַתֶּם; וּבְנֵי עֶלְיוֹן כֻּלְּכֶם
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I got it from the gospel of John chapter 10:36
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how does 10:36 say to to mistranslate The psalms?
10:36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
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NoName55 said:
how does 10:36 say to to mistranslate The psalms?
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Thank you that helps make my case. Who is it that was set apart and who is ti that claims to be the Son of God Jesus. By the way, I just got my Koran today. Can I find the Injil in there?
 
NoName55 said:
how does 10:36 say to to mistranslate The psalms?
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You left out the part where He said, "Didn't I say in your law ye are gods?" There is no mistranslation there. I believe the mistake is to say that it is a mistranslation, because that goes along with many things that show all power and authority were given to Jesus as comes out of His own mouth! He mentions this of Himself. Why would anyone go through the trouble to make a deity out of Jesus? Man could never manipulate all that history and prophecy to make it fit Jesus as prefectly as it does. Read The Old Testament Isaiah 53 it speaks of all that Jesus did for us. That is whay I believe, if I neglect so great a salvation, how would I be able to escape the judgment of God?
 
alapiana1 said:
That is true god is a Spirit and He is Holy; therefore to me, He is the Holy Spirit. Do you believe that God can do anything He wills? If not, I understand where you are coming from. If yes, do you think he can turn His word into flesh and blood? I do!!
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Yes he can do everything. But in our scriptures we are told, God is free from the cirlce of life and death. So, that would mean he would not take the form of a human, as humans (we all know) die. So this would be of no sue if God can die, what hope is there for us! - Jesus is/was a Messenger of his Father but was not God. Say what you will, it's utter nonsense. If he was God, he'd never look up at the sky (or in many verses say God is my father) and say ''WHy do you forsake me''
 
alapiana1 said:
Thank you that helps make my case. Who is it that was set apart and who is ti that claims to be the Son of God Jesus. By the way, I just got my Koran today. Can I find the Injil in there?
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No the Injil was lost and the people Substituted the Gospel of today for it. The Injil was the Word of God(swt) revealed to Isa(as) The Gospel of today is the writings of men some using their memory to relate what Isa(as) said God(swt) revealed to him. But, the Gospel, was not the direct word of God(swt) and it became corrupted.

If you read any mythology you may see very strong Greek influence as to what was taken from the Greeks and proclaimed to be the word of God(swt). Only the early writings that supported the myths of the old Greek Gods were preserved, attributed to Isa(as) and passed on as being Christianity. Sadly it caught a large audience and today 2 billion people have been lead astray.

I'm pleased to see you got Your Qur'an. Just out of curiosity which one did you get? They all have good points and limitations. If we know which one you are using, we will be in better shape to answer any questions.
 
AvarAllahNoor said:
Yes he can do everything. But in our scriptures we are told, God is free from the cirlce of life and death. So, that would mean he would not take the form of a human, as humans (we all know) die. So this would be of no sue if God can die, what hope is there for us! - Jesus is/was a Messenger of his Father but was not God. Say what you will, it's utter nonsense. If he was God, he'd never look up at the sky (or in many verses say God is my father) and say ''WHy do you forsake me''
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I understand what you are saying, but you error not knowing the Scriptures. IN the beginning was the word, and the word was with God and the word was God and became flesh - that is Jesus. You cannot understand this with your carnal mind it is spiritually discerned. It is no more difficult to believe that than to believe Allah always was and always will be makes all knowing and powerful. Your question to me is like someone saying to me “That makes no sense; how can someone always be?"
 
alapiana1 said:
You left out the part where He said, "Didn't I say in your law ye are gods?" There is no mistranslation there. I believe the mistake is to say that it is a mistranslation, because that goes along with many things that show all power and authority were given to Jesus as comes out of His own mouth! He mentions this of Himself. Why would anyone go through the trouble to make a deity out of Jesus? Man could never manipulate all that history and prophecy to make it fit Jesus as prefectly as it does. Read The Old Testament Isaiah 53 it speaks of all that Jesus did for us. That is whay I believe, if I neglect so great a salvation, how would I be able to escape the judgment of God?
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Actually at the time of Isa(as) there where many people who appeared to meet the conditions of the old Testament. These were the so called rivals of Isas(as)

Many historians state that during the time of Isa(as) alleged messiahs were a dime a dozen. Many came out of Greece or Rome.

1. Judas, son of Hezekiah (4 BCE)
2. Simon of Peraea (4 BCE)
3. Athronges, the shepherd (4 BCE)
4. Judas, the Galilean (6 CE)
5. John the Baptist (c.28 CE)
6. Jesus of Nazareth (c.30 CE)
7. The Samaritan prophet (36 CE)
8. King Herod Agrippa (44 CE)
9. Theudas (45 CE)
10. The Egyptian prophet (52-58 CE)
11. An anonymous prophet (59 CE)
12. Menahem, the son of Judas the Galilean (66 CE)
13. John of Gischala (67-70 CE)
14. Vespasian (67 CE)
15. Simon bar Giora (69-70 CE)
16. Jonathan, the weaver (73 CE)
17. Lukuas (115 CE)
18. Simon ben Kosiba (132-135)
19. Moses of Crete (448)

This is a poor site, but it is one of the few that names many of them.

LINK:http://www.livius.org/men-mh/messiah/messiah00.html


At least we can agree that Isa(as) was the true one although we will differ about his nature.

Believe it or not there were several people crucified that people claim arose from the dead, with stories very similar to what is related in todays Gospels. They had claimed to be the Son of God(swt)
 
Woodrow said:
Actually at the time of Isa(as) there where many people who appeared to meet the conditions of the old Testament. These were the so called rivals of Isas(as)

Many historians state that during the time of Isa(as) alleged messiahs were a dime a dozen. Many came out of Greece or Rome.

1. Judas, son of Hezekiah (4 BCE)
2. Simon of Peraea (4 BCE)
3. Athronges, the shepherd (4 BCE)
4. Judas, the Galilean (6 CE)
5. John the Baptist (c.28 CE)
6. Jesus of Nazareth (c.30 CE)
7. The Samaritan prophet (36 CE)
8. King Herod Agrippa (44 CE)
9. Theudas (45 CE)
10. The Egyptian prophet (52-58 CE)
11. An anonymous prophet (59 CE)
12. Menahem, the son of Judas the Galilean (66 CE)
13. John of Gischala (67-70 CE)
14. Vespasian (67 CE)
15. Simon bar Giora (69-70 CE)
16. Jonathan, the weaver (73 CE)
17. Lukuas (115 CE)
18. Simon ben Kosiba (132-135)
19. Moses of Crete (448)

This is a poor site, but it is one of the few that names many of them.

LINK:http://www.livius.org/men-mh/messiah/messiah00.html


At least we can agree that Isa(as) was the true one although we will differ about his nature.

Believe it or not there were several people crucified that people claim arose from the dead, with stories very similar to what is related in todays Gospels. They had claimed to be the Son of God(swt)
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Yes, but out of Jesus' own mouth He is more that the true prophet He said, "I am the truth." There is a difference between being a true prophet and being the Truth and the Way and the Life as He claims of himself. Well, you say the Bible is not valid. I beg to differ. I believe those are His words, and that is how I hope to be judged.
 
The operative word here is "You believe" I am sure you are a credible person but that won't cut mustard when we are all responsible for our own actions. I find just the title of your thread offensive... I hope after this 5 page catharsis someone would be kind enough to close this thread.

peace
:w:
 
alapiana1 said:
Yes, but out of Jesus' own mouth He is more that the true prophet He said, "I am the truth." There is a difference between being a true prophet and being the Truth and the Way and the Life as He claims of himself. Well, you say the Bible is not valid. I beg to differ. I believe those are His words, and that is how I hope to be judged.
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What about the others before him who had said the same thing?

Have you ever read the story of Attis? This comes directly from Greek Mythology.

ttis of Phrygia offers very little grist for the pagan copycat theorists; indeed, even Acharya S offers less than a dozen points of correspondence, and Freke and Gandy barely find Attis worth a mention. Therefore our item this time will be fairly short.

Acharya's items listed are as follows [107-8]:

1. Attis was born on December 25th of the Virgin Nana.
2. He was considered the savior who was slain for the salvation of mankind.
3. His body as bread was eaten by his worshippers.
4. His priests were "eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven."
5. He was both the Divine Son and the Father.
6. On "Black Friday," he was crucified on a tree, from which his holy blood ran down to redeem the earth.
7. He descended into the underworld.
8. After three days, Attis was resurrected on March 25th (as tradition held of Jesus) as the "Most High God."
9. Doane is recorded as saying that Attis was represented as a "a man tied to a tree, at the foot of which was a lamb, and, without doubt also as a man nailed to a tree..."
10. Jackson is reported as saying that on March 22nd, a pine tree was felled and "an effigy of the god was affixed to it, thus being slain and hung on a tree..." Later the priests are supposed to have found Attis' grave empty.

Source: http://www.tektonics.org/copycat/attis.html

you may want to do some google searches and find out more about Attis and Cybele

Remember this was all recorded in Greece before Christ(as) was born. Just one of the reasons I feel Paul added some Greek Mythology to Christianity.
 
Early Christians were aware of the Myths of Attis:


It was long years afterwards, when Augustine had become a very solemn and very sour and very puritanical bishop, that he described these things. I need not reproduce his comments. But he hints that at the time the religious life he saw in Rome made him lean to the Academic philosophy (an early type of Agnosticism). His mother Monica was a Christian, and she sought the conversion of her son with all the fire with which she had once sought a lover. But Augustine smiled disdainfully at the Christian Church in Rome.

Although he does not say so explicitly, one reason for his aversion must have been the sight of these two Holy Weeks. In the same month as the pagans the Christians opened a Holy Week with a palm-bearing procession, and five days later they mourned before the figure of a pale young god nailed to a "tree" (as they chanted), and two days later again they went into a frenzy of rejoicing because he had risen from the dead. The one Holy Week was a frank drama of the death and resurrection of love:

the other was, at least in theory, a spiritual and ascetic drama. But Augustine would look from the pale young Attis on his tree to the pale young Christ on his cross, from resurrection to resurrection, and wonder . . . Cybele and Attis were ages older than Jesus.
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Source: http://altreligion.about.com/library/texts/bl_resurrectionmyth.htm
 
PurestAmbrosia said:
The operative word here is "You believe" I am sure you are a credible person but that won't cut mustard when we are all responsible for our own actions. I find just the title of your thread offensive... I hope after this 5 page catharsis someone would be kind enough to close this thread.

peace
:w:
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There is something significantly different about the way God is working in your life and mine. You, however, might choose to say He is not working in my life; nevertheless, I can't help notice that you get easily offended with my spiritual comments; and yet, there is nothing you can say in your theology that would offend me even though my views about the nature of God are on the other side of the spectrum if you will. I can love you in Christ, but you can't love me. The irony here is that we both have the same creator. There is not doubt about that. Finally, there is no reason to close this thread. If you don't like it, you don't have to read it or post on it.
It is written, "Great peace have they which love thy law and nothing shall offend them."
 
I have a thing against idle speech, idle thought and offensive threads.. I feel it is my right to voice my opinion. I try to read what most people have to say to learn from them, but I can't get past your repetitive rhetoric-- I have no feelings toward you, short of those I feel for humanity in general... You can be anybody.. I don't go around hating or rather as you said (not loving) a random anybody.
Do you feel like you are reaching people here? Even your fellow Christians?

peace!
 
Woodrow said:
Remember this was all recorded in Greece before Christ(as) was born. Just one of the reasons I feel Paul added some Greek Mythology to Christianity.
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The author of your source didn't! After providing that list Holding then proceeds to completely dismantle it before ending with;

In conclusion -- the evidence is very clear that the Phrygian Phreakazoid (Attis) had nothing to do with the institution of the Christian faith. As usual, Acharya S and her cohorts are blowing bubbles.
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