We Muslims believe that to build one's faith on other than the One God is a foundation of sand. Jesus (pbuh) will disavow the worship of him on Judgement Day.
Clearly you are wrong on this as there are many errors in the Bible.
Are we gods?
- Thread starter Redeemed
- Start date
- Replies 298
- Views 47K
British Wholesales - Certified Wholesale Linen & Towels | Halal Food Gastronomy | vBulletin 4 php 8.0 patch
Instead of what you are implying, I personally believe that Paul was a type of anti-Christ who misled people to worship Jesus (pbuh) instead of teaching people to follow what Jesus (pbuh) taught from the Injil. But then again how in the world would Paul even know WHAT Jesus (pbuh) said because he was never one of his followers while he lived on earth. I believe this was an example of bait-and-switch that has misled worshippers of Jesus (pbuh).
Although I agree with your point in the similarity of Jesus and Moses (pbut), I strongly oppose the word "god" applied to them.Yes, I do agree with you; There is no one who can compare to God. However,
I don't know if you got this, but I'll send it again: I will explain again why I post this title for this thread. Jesus said, "Is it not written in your law ye are gods?" This remark came after the Jews wanted to stone Jesus for saying "He and His Father are one" As Gleason L. Archer Jr. puts it, "Jesus' audience rightly understood Him asserting His deity..." Moreover, Jesus wanted to counter their hostility with that verse found in Ps. 82:6. That verse didn't apply to all men, but only to those prophets and the ones who bore God's word. They were given that title. God even told Moses you will be a god and Aaron will be your spokesman. There were those in positions of authority that carried Gods word but abused their power by favoring rulers and for other corrupt reasons. That is why the verse continues to say, but ye shall die like men even though you are gods. Notice that is a god with a small g Peace
Merriam-Webster Dictionary
Main Entry: 1god
Pronunciation: \ˈgäd also ˈgȯd\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English; akin to Old High German got god
Date: before 12th century
1capitalized : the supreme or ultimate reality: as a: the Being perfect in power, wisdom, and goodness who is worshipped as creator and ruler of the universe bChristian Science : the incorporeal divine Principle ruling over all as eternal Spirit : infinite Mind
2: a being or object believed to have more than natural attributes and powers and to require human worship; specifically : one controlling a particular aspect or part of reality
3: a person or thing of supreme value
4: a powerful ruler
The first definition capitalized refers to the Creator, but even the 2nd definition states "require human worship". The only one worthy of worship is the One God!
/Peace To AllYou cannot apply verses from the Bible to Muslims. Therefore, it is not "shirk" for us.
The Bible is outdaed, and has been corrupted by human beings. Verses have been litterally dropped/altered from that book by the Church
Human beings are not gods. We are far from it.
There is only ONE God (SWT). And He is most definitely not begotten. Nor did He beget any children.
You should view the debate regarding this and other topics between Sheikh Ahmad Deedat & the Televangelist, Jimmy Saggert. Ahmad Deedat refuted Swaggerts claims, one-by-one. It is very enlightening...
Redeemed
Account Disabled
- Messages
- 753
- Reaction score
- 12
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Christianity
Iam interested in hearing this debate
You cannot apply verses from the Bible to Muslims. Therefore, it is not "shirk" for us.
The Bible is outdaed, and has been corrupted by human beings. Verses have been litterally dropped/altered from that book by the Church
Human beings are not gods. We are far from it.
There is only ONE God (SWT). And He is most definitely not begotten. Nor did He beget any children.
You should view the debate regarding this and other topics between Sheikh Ahmad Deedat & the Televangelist, Jimmy Saggert. Ahmad Deedat refuted Swaggerts claims, one-by-one. It is very enlightening...
the thing about men being gods is not my idea it is in Pslams and there is no mistake about the meaningIt has already been accepted by you that you do not speak Hebrew nor can you read or write it. The Psalms that are kept by Jews are not same as the concocted copies held by Trinitarians.Iam interested in hearing this debate
You have been told the true meaning of the Psalm in question, recently by Br. Snakelegs and before that by myself and a Jewish Brother on this forum.
Only a liar or a seriously misguided person would insist on there being no mistake in translation from The Jewish kept Psalms.
It is a differrent thing if you are talking about the fake versions from Greek to English to Hebrew, then back to English. In that case all I can say is that you are a victim of deception.
Redeemed
Account Disabled
- Messages
- 753
- Reaction score
- 12
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Christianity
I don't have to know Hebrew to look up the word, and its translation in the dictionary. So which one am I to you the liar or the seriously misguided one? Let me say something here. If I am the liar, then why do you respond to my thread? If am the seriously misguided one; then, you are certainly not reaching me. Your example drives me further from Islam, and convinces me that I have something spiritually good that you don't, cause you give the impression you don't care if I go to hell; better yet, you would be happy to see me there. God is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to the knowledge of the truth. Those who refuse the love of the truth, God sends them a strong delusion that they may believe a lie. God knows how to keep the righteous and preserve the unjust for the Day of Judgment. Vengeance is mine says the Lord. I will repay! Let God deal with liars our job is to think the best of each other and as greater than ourselves. Do not return evil for evil and bless those that curse you. I pray that God blesses you with the knowledge to see this situation as He does and not as a man sees, because God looks at the heart, but man looks at outward appearance.
:rollseyes
depends on what you are translating from! If you use words from written Tanakh, then I Have no problem with that but If you are using the so called old testament, the fakery made up by man or the oral Torah then I do have problem for they are from men who had their own agenda.
Well if you refuse to use The Written Torah (the one kept by Jews) and insist upon the "old testament", then I, certainly, can't call you misguided.
Redeemed
Account Disabled
- Messages
- 753
- Reaction score
- 12
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Christianity
I don't know of any Christian who will deny that God is One!!!:statisfie
I have no problem looking it up in the Torah.
Woodrow
May Allah have mercy on him رحمة الله عليه
- Messages
- 17,217
- Reaction score
- 4,224
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Islam
I do not know of any Christian that does not believe he is worshiping only one God(swt) Those that come to the realization that they are not worshiping one God(swt) leave Christianity.
Redeemed
Account Disabled
- Messages
- 753
- Reaction score
- 12
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Christianity
I understand where you are coming from. you think I serve more than one God or that I am worshiping the wrong person (Jesus) right? Let me clearify something here. You honor a different Jesus than me. The Jesus I honor is the Word of God not a spokesman THE WORD. And all things are held together by the word of His (God Almighty) power. You were directed you said in your testimony by the Holy Spirit to Islam. Who is the Holy Spirit to you? You did run well who has bewitched you that you should turn from the truth??????????? :?
I believe that God is a Spirit; in fact, the Bible says that He is and that those who worship Him must do it in spirit and in truth. I, however, have no problem believing that God can inhabit a human person or be in more that more place at a single moment in time. We do not limit what God can do. We do not look at God as if He is limited to the confines of time and space, as we know it. I have no problem believing that God's word could be made flesh, nor to I have a problem seeing God as all wise, merciful and Holy. Since He is Holy and a Spirit, I have no problem as seeing Him as the Holy Spirit and yet the same one true God. To try to understand the essence of God in terms of human dimensions only leads to horrible heresies of which Muslims think us guilty of. I look at Jesus who was the only prophet (Son of Man) to be sinless and conceived of a virgin (Son of Mary). That alone should be a sign and I hint as to the true nature of Jesus Christ. Since He did not have an earthly father, it only confirms that through the prophets and even Jesus Himself the Bible speaks absolute truth has His Father being God. It is written in the Scriptures, "He that has the Son has life; he that has not the Son, as not life, but the wrath of God abides on him." I do not want the wrath of God abiding on me. I would have to be spiritually dead to believe that He is not who He says. The Bible is the inerrant word of God to the true believers and follows of Christ there are no mistakes in it pertaining to who Jesus really is. I know I wrote this before, but it doesn't hurt to be reminded.
Last edited:
So you claim the Bible has no errors or mistakes or suppositions. Will you then explain Luke 3:23 When he began His ministry, Jesus Himself was about thirty years of age, being, as was supposed, the son of Joseph, the son of Eli... and Matthew 1:16 Jacob was the father of Joseph the husband of Mary, by whom Jesus was born, who is called the Messiah.
Now if Jesus was born to a virgin, as both Christians and Muslims believe, why is his geneology traced through Joseph? Who was the father of Joseph - Jacob or Eli?
Redeemed
Account Disabled
- Messages
- 753
- Reaction score
- 12
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Christianity
This is where the bloodline of Joseph and Mary converge. This is not an error. Nevertheless, I never said that the Bible doesn't have translation, typos and interpretive errors. My point was that it doesn't have a spirit of error. Every part of the Bible points to Jesus as the total spiritual sum of all things. Does He say the "Father is greater than me (He)?" Yes, but the whole Bible is about God preparing the way for the Messiah. God glorifies Jesus and the Son glorifies the Father. Jesus said "No one comes to His Father except through me." And, no one can come to Christ unless the Father draws him. There is no mistake there or exceptions. It is repeated many times and in many different ways.
Peace
If, as Christians and Muslims believe, Jesus (pbuh) was not conceived by the natural method, but instead was born to Mary, a virgin (had not yet had sexual intercourse), then it is ludicrous to trace his genealogy through Joseph. The Bible clearly states "being, as was supposed, the son of Joseph" that Jesus was thought to be the son of Joseph. Now, if you want to be so blind as to believe this is not an error - then so be it! :blind: When was the last time that God did not know the Truth about anything and resorted to supposition? Now, how would God suppose that Jesus was the "son of Joseph" if He was in fact Jesus' Father?
If there is even one documented error in the Bible that clearly cannot be the Word of God, then how can ANY of the Bible be believed and accepted as the "inerrant Word of God"?
Redeemed
Account Disabled
- Messages
- 753
- Reaction score
- 12
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Christianity
As I mentioned on another thread. I understand what you are trying to say, I think; however, this is where the Bible and the Koran clash. The Bible says that all things were made by Him and for Him (Jesus). I don't believe the Bible is as corrupt as Muslims say; moreover, I do understand why they say that. It is because they can't except the Bible is true and remain Muslim. I can't prove that the Bible is God's word, but I believe it by faith. Can you prove the Koran is the word of God? All the titles that were given to Allah Jesus had claimed for himself; in fact, others (prophets and Apostles) have declared it so as well. Yes, I know that He also took the humble position too. That was because He was also a man (flesh and blood), but the spirit part of Him is God in the flesh. . How do you know that it's true that God is not a begetter nor is He begotten? Do you think that it is impossible for God who created life not to be a begetter even if He wants to beget Himself in human flesh? Think about it. Ask God to show this doctrine through His eyes. Have you done that?
peace
Last edited:
Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
Tu kaun hai paiiii?
- Messages
- 7,218
- Reaction score
- 920
- Gender
- Female
- Religion
- Islam
Who else could have sent down the Qur'an since we know Muhammad(pbuh) was not literate but was the first to verbally teach others what he was taught by Allah through Gabriel? What other way could u possibly think of?
"What" prophets claimed Jesus was god? Can you support your claim, as I'm interested to know. Thanks.
Peace
"What" prophets claimed Jesus was god? Can you support your claim, as I'm interested to know. Thanks.
Peace
Main Entry: be·get
Pronunciation: bi-'get, bE-
Function: transitive verb
Inflected Form(s): be·got /-'gät /; also be·gat /-'gat/; be·got·ten /-'gä-t&n /; or -got; -get·ting
Etymology: Middle English begeten, alteration of beyeten, from Old English bigietan -- more at GET
1 : to procreate as the father : SIRE
2 : to produce especially as an effect or outgrowth
Main Entry: 1sire
Pronunciation: 'sI(-&)r
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Anglo-French, lord, feudal superior, from Vulgar Latin *seior, alteration of Latin senior older -- more at SENIOR
1 a : FATHER b archaic : male ancestor : FOREFATHER c : AUTHOR, ORIGINATOR
2 a archaic : a man of rank or authority; especially : LORD -- used formerly as a form of address and as a title b obsolete : an elderly man : SENIOR
3 : the male parent of an animal and especially of a domestic animal
There is a difference between creating and begetting or siring an offspring. Begetting/siring is an animalistic process requiring sexual intercourse or artifical insemination of a female using collected sperm. It is beneath the dignity of Allah to even consider applying this process to Him. However, it is a simple enough thing that Allah could say, "Be" and Jesus could be created in the womb of Mary.
aadil77
Glory Be To Allah
- Messages
- 5,007
- Reaction score
- 978
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Islam
How many versions of the bible are there? 100+
How many versions of the Quran are there? 1 and no more. If there are any others the changes would be obvious.
The truth that was once in the bible doesn't exist anymore, Accept it.
On the day of judgement the truth will be obvious.
btw can't believe this thread is still running.
Redeemed
Account Disabled
- Messages
- 753
- Reaction score
- 12
- Gender
- Male
- Religion
- Christianity
I am interested in the word you used "However" and the part where you said God said, "be" and it happened. That is how Mary conceived. If Jesus wasn't begotten, than how did He become? And if He is begotten, who is the begetter? The Bible says, "For God so loved the world that HE gave His only begotten Son that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. (Jn. 3:16) You are surely going through a lot of trouble to try to explain away this truth even something that makes more sense than what you say. I went to the Franklin Graham festival at the Scope in Norfolk (it is still going on) and there were thousands of Christians and people of other religions there. I heard beautiful testimonies of how people gave their lives to Christ and their lives were changed forever. They said they were convinced even as I am that Jesus is the solid Rock on which they stand and all other ground is sinking sand. Jesus said He is the Way, and that way is narrow (Few find it), but the way to destruction is wide and many go that way. There is coming a time that every knee will bow to Jesus to confess that he is Lord only for some people that will do them no good for salvation purposes because they will be thrown into the lake of fire. Jesus said He is the only WAY. I’d be lost forever to neglect so great a salvation. We will die soon and then comes the judgment. You cannot say I didn’t try to warn you.
Last edited:
Back at ya - neither can you deny the Message of Islam being presented to you. Peace.