[Poll] Vegetarian Muslims

good old meat =

I wouldn't feel human without meat. I love fruit too (especially mangoes).

I've been back and forth with this for a while. I think I'm on the verge of becoming vegetarian. Although it is halal for us, you really don't need it to live. Actually alot of us would be better without nowadays. Besides, the exact same nutrients you obtain from it can be obtained from the same veggie source the animal retrieved it from. Think about it. The same applies about seafood items as well. So cheers! To a meatless option.

I wouldn't feel human without meat. I love fruit too (especially mangoes).

If you know it is halal habibti, no one has the right to forbid what Allah and His messanger, sall-Allahu alayhi wa salm, have permitted. If you do not know that your meat is halal, it is haram to eat it (what I understood from a shaykh).

Anyways, when you fast, do you love Allah more than meat? Of course you love Allah, azz wa jall, more.

Assalamu ALaykum

Salam..The Prophet ate meat and it is Halal and Sunnah. The quran forbides us to make Halal things haram on us.

Salam..The Prophet ate meat and it is Halal and Sunnah. The quran forbides us to make Halal things haram on us.

Wa Alaykum Salam sister

I understand you. However, the hadeeths are vast and we must rely on scholars for understanding of our religion. There is a Sar'i (God's law) way of slaughtering the meat. If it was slaughtered in a wrong way, we are not allowed o eat it. Anyhow, the ruling is not to be generalized on I guess, so I'll paste the fatwa. We are obliged to follow the schoalrs.

an-Nawawi, said :

"The slaughtered meats of the People of the Book are halal whether or not they mention Allah when slaughtering due to the apparent meaning of the verses in the Mighty Qur’an, and this is our madhhab and that of the majority."
- (al-Majmu’’ (9/78))

Sa’id bin Mansur with a good chain from Ibn Mas’ud (may Allah be Pleased with him) that he said: "Do not eat slaughtered meat except from the Muslims and the People of the Book"
- (Tafsir Ibn Kathir’ (2/19))


Qays bin as-Sakan that Ibn Mas’ud said: "You have descended upon a land in which the
Muslims do not hunt, and only has Nabateans and Persians. So, if you buy any meat, ask
them about it. If it was slaughtered by a Jew or Christian, eat it, as their food is permissible for you."
- [ Mussanaf Abdur Razzak 4/487, and the narrators in its chain are those of the two ‘Sahih’s except Qays bin as-Sakan, as he is only up to the conditions of Muslim, and Ibn Hajar said in ‘Taqrib at-Tahdhib’ (2/129): “He is trustworthy.”]

Ibn ‘Abbas said:
"The slaughtered meats of the Jews and Christians are allowed because they believe in the Torah and the Gospel."

- [Majma’ az-Zawa’id 4/36, and al-Haythami said: “This was reported in ‘al-Kabir’ by at-Tabarani, and its chain contains Isma’il bin ‘Umar al-Bajli, who was considered trustworthy by Ibn Hibban and others, and considered weak by ad-Daraqutni.” Also see p. 20 of Ibn Humayd’s ‘Hukm al-Luhum al-Mustawradah.’]

Imam az-Zuhri said: "There is no problem in eating the slaughtered meat of the Arab Christians, and do not eat it if you hear them mentioning the name of other than Allah upon it. If you do not hear them, Allah has made it permissible and Knows their kufr,"
- Fath al-Bari’ (9/636)

an-Nawawi said: "If we find a sheep that is slaughtered without knowing who the
slaughterer was, if it was in a land containing those whose meats we cannot eat, such as the Magians, it is not allowed to eat the meat whether they seclude themselves or mix with the Muslims. This is because of the doubt as to whether the meat was slaughtered properly, and the default is that it is haram. However, it is permissible if the land is free of such people."
- ‘al-Majmu’’ (9/79)

Hashiyat Ibn ‘Abidin’ (6/476): "If one finds a slaughtered sheep in his garden, can he eat it? ash-Sharnablali said that it is not allowed to eat it due to the doubt as to whether the slaughterer of this meat is someone whose meats we are allowed to eat. (Ibn ‘Abidin said) What would’ve been more appropriate to say is that if the location was one in which a Magian lived, it should not be eaten. Otherwise, it can be eaten."

Ibn Rajab said :
"As for what is by default forbidden, such as sexual relations and the meat of animals, these are not permissible unless it is certain that the proper contract and proper slaughter has been performed, respectively."
- ‘Jami’ al-‘Ulum wal-Hikam’ (1/189)

Ibn al-‘Arabi said:
"Our scholars said that the default regarding animals is that they are haram, and they are not permissible to eat except if they are properly slaughtered or hunted. So, if there is any doubt as to the hunter or slaughterer, the meat remains in its default state of being forbidden."
- Ibn al-‘Arabi’s ‘Ahkam al-Qur’an’ (2/546)

Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah said
"Sexual relations and slaughtered meat are not allowed when there is doubt as to their status."
- ‘Majmu’ al-Fatawa’ (21/89, 21/100, & 32/190)

Ibn Qudamah said:"The default is to avoid them, and their permissibility is tied to
a condition, which is that they be slaughtered properly by those who are qualified to
do so."
-‘al-Mughni’ (8/571)



THE FATWA
Eating the Meat of Ahl Al-Kitaab (Jews & Christians)
Imaam Ibn Uthaymeen (Rahimahullaah)

Q. Is it permissible to eat poultry which is sold in the markets on the basis that it is meat of the People of the Book...or is it impermissible on the basis that it is a carcass slaughtered by unknown means i.e. was it done by cutting off the head or electrocution or some such means... and are the Ahl-Kitaab today truly to be considered in this ruling [as those of the past]?

A. Yes, eating the poultry is permissible because that which is slaughtered by the Ahl Al-Kitaab today is just as what was slaughtered by Ahl Al-Kitaab in the time of the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam). The Ahl Al-Kitaab are of the Kuffaar (disbelievers) whether they are in the time of the Prophet (saaws) or now.
Allah says in His Noble Book They have certainly disbelieved who say that Verily Allah is Isa Ibn Maryam and the Messiah said "O Children of Israel worship Allah my Lord and your Lord Verily whosoever commits shirk (associates partners with Allah in any way) Allah has made the Paradise forbidden to him and his end will be the Hellfire and there will be no help to the Dhaalimeen. They have certainly disbelieved who say that Allah is the third of three and there is no deity except the single Deity and if they do not desist from what they are saying We will inflict upon those disbelievers a painful punishment.

Allah also says in the same chapter: "Today I have made permissible for you that which is good and wholesome and the food of those who were sent the Scripture is permissible to you and your food is permissible to them."

As far as the methodology of the slaughtering we do not inquire about the method because if an action has occurred min ahlihi [at the hands of those suited to perform such an act] the conditions surrounding that act are not asked about.

We find in Saheeh Al-Bukhari: "It is related by Aisha (raa) that a group of people said to the Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam) 'Some people came to us with some meat about which we didn't know whether the name of Allah was mentioned over or not' and he replied (saaws) Sammoo [Say the name of Allah] over it yourselves and then eat. She [Aisha - raa] said that these people had just recently been from the Kuffaar [i.e. just became Muslim and the question was not asked as to the method of slaughter].

This rule therefore applies to the Jews and the Christians about whom we don't know whether or not they have mentioned Allah's name or not because their slaughtered meat is halal [permissible] to us.

Q. Please clarify the fatwa - esteemed Sheikh - If a Muslim goes to the markets and eating places in a Christian land and purchases the lamb, beef, of chicken and does not ask about how it was slaughtered?

A. Yes, he does not ask about the method of slaughter.

Q. What if he is informed however that the meat has been stunned by electric shock, or has been choked or shot? What is the ruling for meat slaughtered like this? Is it considered a carcass? [Which is impermissible to eat]

A. It is not permissible if it is known with certainty because it would be considered a carcass.

Q. Can we understand from the hadith of Aisha (raa) which is related in the fatwa that the question which was posed by the people to the Messenger of Allah (saaws) was only in relation to whether Allah's name was mentioned over the animal being slaughtered and it was not about the actual method of slaughter?

A. Yes, they did ask about the mentioning of the name of Allah and not the actual method of slaughtering and it is evident in the hadith that it is not necessary to ask about either.

Q. Is it possible to say that if there are
stores in a city where the Muslim lives and those stores carry meat slaughtered according to the Islamic method - even of it is more expensive - that it is not then permissible to buy the meat of the Christians?

A. No it is not possible to say that because the slaughtered meat of the Christians and the Jews is halal. However whoever leaves it [doesn't eat it] out of a sense of piety [tawar'an], we see no fault upon him. [Tawar'a or wara' is when a person has such piety that they will avoid even that which is permissible to do what is even better from wanting to please Allah and also eliminating any possibility of doing something wrong].

Q. One of the readers asks about a relation from Ali Ibn Abi Talib (raa) in which he reportedly said: "Do not eat the meat slaughtered by Bani Taglab because they adhere to Christianity by drink alcohol." Can this be then used as a proof considering the Christians of today, the majority of who drink alcohol , that it is not permissible to eat their slaughtered meat?

A. I do not know the authenticity of this statement [from the Sahabah] and if it is authentic its meaning would be that they [Banu Taglab] were not actually on the religion of the Christians and therefore they would not fall under the ruling of permissibility of their slaughtered meat.

Q. If it is known that some of the slaughterhouses in this country slaughter sheep and cattle along with swine is it permissible to eat that meat especially when the same instruments are used to slaughter both at the same time?

A. In this case, if we know that the knives are used for both then the meat should be washed and it will be purified through washing.

Q. Is it possible - esteemed Sheikh - for you to address us with a word to the Muslim in the Western countries about the obligation of staying far away from disobedience [to Allah and His Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam)] and haram things and doubtful matters because we are aware of some of them being lax in relation to some major sins such as not praying or illicit sex or drinking alcohol yet he is distressed or makes complicated the eating of meat which is not slaughtered according to Islamic method?

A. My advice to them is to have taqwa and fear Allah's punishment and to remember the Day of Meeting, a day which the excuses of those who wrong themselves will be of no avail. A day when the parent will not afford their offspring anything nor can the offspring do anything for the parent. A day when they will all be raised from their graves barefoot, and naked. We ask
Allah for all guidance and success.

Muhammad Saleh Al-Uthaimeen (rahimahullaah) 2/28/1414


Al-Imaam Ibn Baaz (rahimahullaah) discusses meat imported from the lands of the disbelievers
Question: In reference to the meats that are imported from outside (i.e. outside of the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia), and likewise the frozen chickens, which we do not know about their method of slaughter, since some of the scholars do not support purchasing them?
Answer: If the mentioned meats are imported from the lands of the People of the Book (i.e. Jews and Christians), it is lawful to eat them as long as you do not know something that proves its forbiddance. This is due to the statement of Allaah, far removed is He from imperfections:
"Today the good things have been made lawful for you, and the food (slaughtered meat) of those who have been given the Book (i.e. Jews and Christians) is lawful for you, and your food (slaughtered meat) is lawful for them." [Al-Maa'idah (5):5]
The fact that some of the slaughter houses in some of the lands of the People of the Book slaughter animals in a way that is not legislated, this does not neccessitate the forbiddance of the slaughtered meat that is imported from the lands of the People of the Book, until you know that this specific slaughtered meat (that you have) is from the slaughter house that slaughters in a way that is not legislated. Because the basic principle is that the meat is lawful and safe until something is known that contradicts that.

Ash-Shaikh 'Abdul-'Azeez bin 'Abdullah bin Baaz
Source: Al-Fataawaa min Kitaabid-Da'wah, Vol. 1, pp. 250-251.

Al-Imaam Ibn Baaz (rahimahullaah) discusses meat of the People of the Book vs. the meat of other disbelievers

Question: Verily I am a Somalian student who studies in China and I face many difficulties concerning food in general and meats in specific. The problems are as follows:
1. Verily I heard before coming to China that the animals that the atheists slaughter, or it is more appropriate to say that they kill them, it is not permissible for the Muslim to eat them. We have a small restaurant at the university for the Muslims and in it are meats, but I am not certain that they have been slaughtered in the Islamic manner, and I have doubt about that, even though my friends do not have doubt like me. They eat from that meat. Are they correct or are they eating something Haraam (forbidden)?
2. In reference to the containers for cooking the food, there is no distinguishing between the containers of the Muslims and the cooking containers of people other than them (i.e. disbelievers). What is required of me to do concerning these matters?
Ibraaheem Alif. Baa. (his initials) - Somalian student
Answer: It is not permissible to eat the animals slaughtered by the disbelievers except for the People of the Book, from the Jews and the Christians. It makes no difference whether those other people are Majians, or idol worshippers, or Communists or other than them from the various types of disbelievers. It is also not permissible to eat whatever is mixed with their slaughtered animals, such as the broth (or gravy) and other than it. This is because Allaah, far removed is He from any imperfections, has not permitted for us any of the slaughtered meats of the disbelievers, except the slaughtered meat of the People of the Book. This occurs in His statement, the Mighty and Majestic:
"Today the good things have been made permissible for you and the food (slaughtered meat) of those who have been given the Book is lawful for you and your food (slaughtered meat) is lawful for them."
This is the fifth verse from Surah Al-Maa'idah. And their food is their slaughtered animals, just as Ibn 'Abbaas and others besides him have said. In reference to the fruits and similar foods (i.e. vegetables, fruit, grains, fish, and so forth), then there is no harm in them because they are not included in the prohibited food. In reference to the food of the Muslims, then it is permissible for the Muslims and other than them, if they (those who slaughtered it) are truly Muslims, who do not worship anything other than Allaah, nor do they call upon anyone else besides Him along with Him, such as Prophets, righteous people, people who are deceased in the graves and other than them from that which is worshiped by the disbelievers.

In reference to the cooking containers, then it is obligatory upon the Muslims that they have cooking containers other than the cooking containers of the disbelievers, which they use to cook their food and intoxicants and so forth. If the Muslims cannot find containers (specifically for their use), then it is obligatory upon the Muslims' cook to wash the containers that the disbelievers use, and then put the food of the Muslims in them. This is due to what is confirmed in the two Saheehs (Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim) on the authority of Aboo Tha'labah Al-Khashanee (radhiyallaahu 'anhu) that he asked the Prophet (sallallaahu 'alayhi wa sallam) about eating from the containers of the polytheists. Thus, the Prophet (sallallaahu 'alayhi wa sallam) said to him, "Do not eat from them unless you cannot find anything else, then (if you can't find any other container) wash them (the disbelievers' containers) and eat from them."

Ash-Shaikh 'Abdul-'Azeez bin 'Abdullah bin Baaz
Source: Al-Fataawaa min Kitaabud-Da'wah, Vol. 1, pp.249-250.

Al-Imaam Ibn Baaz (rahimahullaah) discusses meat imported from the lands of the disbelievers

Question: In reference to the meats that are imported from outside (i.e. outside of the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia), and likewise the frozen chickens, which we do not know about their method of slaughter, since some of the scholars do not support purchasing them?

Answer: If the mentioned meats are imported from the lands of the People of the Book (i.e. Jews and Christians), it is lawful to eat them as long as you do not know something that proves its forbiddance. This is due to the statement of Allaah, far removed is He from imperfections:

"Today the good things have been made lawful for you, and the food (slaughtered meat) of those who have been given the Book (i.e. Jews and Christians) is lawful for you, and your food (slaughtered meat) is lawful for them." [Al-Maa'idah (5):5]

The fact that some of the slaughter houses in some of the lands of the People of the Book slaughter animals in a way that is not legislated, this does not neccessitate the forbiddance of the slaughtered meat that is imported from the lands of the People of the Book, until you know that this specific slaughtered meat (that you have) is from the slaughter house that slaughters in a way that is not legislated. Because the basic principle is that the meat is lawful and safe until something is known that contradicts that.

Ash-Shaikh 'Abdul-'Azeez bin 'Abdullah bin Baaz

Source: Al-Fataawaa min Kitaabid-Da'wah, Vol. 1, pp. 250-251.

Sister unknown, no one is saying they love meat more than Allah nor did anyone mention about eating haram..inshaAllah...the thread is about being a vegetarian and that the brothers and sisters like eating meat

JazzakALlahu Khayr

That's not what I ment. It was just proof that you can go without mean (smile).

No need for excuses my beloved sister. I understsad you.

JazzakALlahu Kahyr

Asalaamu Aleikum

My sis/bro, I never forbade anything. I was simply giving my opinion on something I think will be a new approach for myself, but Allah knows best. Everyone is entitled to eat whatever they feel to eat as long as it is halal and hopefully in moderation. When I think of the animal whether it is chicken,beef,lamb,etc I think of it as something that was alive like me, has veins/blood like me,has flesh like me. It kind of bothers me. So it's a personal issue. But since I have options, I think I'll stick with my veggies/fruits which are also halal to us.

Ma Salaama