introductions

**jamal10** · 09-28-2012

Hello All,
I am Jamal and I am trying to learn more about Islam, its historical manifestations, its law and its future.
I believe that Islam is the one true religion of Oneness. It must therefore be the vehicle for a sane just human future.
I am learning about Islamic law and I would like to speak with people about the situations of muslims living in Arab countries.
I am living in North America, and I expect that the considerations of muslims living in Arab lands are very different from the normal person in the west.
I fully expect that my opinions will not be shared by most muslims as I believe that Islam must be a strictly voluntary religion. I think that no person should be forced into Islam and no one should ever be "converted at sword point". Islam must be a voluntary religion and its adherents must have voluntarily chosen its set of beliefs and precepts.
Also I believe that no child should ever be forced into Islam, I believe that to join Islam should be a decision of legal persons and there must be another kind of Islamic community to raise children and have community affairs for families, towards a point where the children when they are of legal age can make the decision to join Islam when they know fully what that means and what that implies. Also, I believe we must have strong secularist states that will not force Islamic law upon a people, but there must be islamic cities everywhere in the world that are allowed to live with their own law and their own communities free from the interference of corrupt western forms of language game. Furthermore, secular states will actually help Islam because they will create the framework for people to better see exactly what Islam is and again, it must not be forced upon anyone. These considerations, I think, will help both Islam and the self of every member of Islam.

**جوري** · 09-28-2012

aboard.. nice set of beliefs you've. Don't expect that others should share in those beliefs though!

best,

**Scimitar** · 09-28-2012

Originally Posted by jamal10

I fully expect that my opinions will not be shared by most muslims as I believe that Islam must be a strictly voluntary religion. I think that no person should be forced into Islam and no one should ever be "converted at sword point". Islam must be a voluntary religion and its adherents must have voluntarily chosen its set of beliefs and precepts.
Also I believe that no child should ever be forced into Islam, I believe that to join Islam should be a decision of legal persons and there must be another kind of Islamic community to raise children and have community affairs for families, towards a point where the children when they are of legal age can make the decision to join Islam when they know fully what that means and what that implies. Also, I believe we must have strong secularist states that will not force Islamic law upon a people, but there must be islamic cities everywhere in the world that are allowed to live with their own law and their own communities free from the interference of corrupt western forms of language game. Furthermore, secular states will actually help Islam because they will create the framework for people to better see exactly what Islam is and again, it must not be forced upon anyone. These considerations, I think, will help both Islam and the self of every member of Islam.

Assalaam alaikum bro

1) no one here would disagree with this: I fully expect that my opinions will not be shared by most muslims as I believe that Islam must be a strictly voluntary religion. I think that no person should be forced into Islam and no one should ever be "converted at sword point". Islam must be a voluntary religion and its adherents must have voluntarily chosen its set of beliefs and precepts.

2) Also I believe that no child should ever be forced into Islam, I believe that to join Islam should be a decision of legal persons and there must be another kind of Islamic community to raise children and have community affairs for families, towards a point where the children when they are of legal age can make the decision to join Islam when they know fully what that means and what that implies.

this makes no sense to me. What do you mean by "legal persons"? Lawyers? As for children. You claim you are a student of Islamic law, correct? Maybe before you study the higher up subjects, you should study the basics first. Every child is born a Muslim - it is the parents that give it another religion.

The Prophet (PBUH) reported that Allah said, "I created my servants in the right religion but devils made them go astray". The Prophet (PBUH) also said, "Each child is born in a state of "Fitrah", then his parents make him a Jew, Christian or a Zoroastrian, the way an animal gives birth to a normal offspring. Have you noticed any that were born mutilated?" (Collected by Al-Bukhaaree and Muslim).

and this from the Quran:

When your Lord drew forth from the loins of the children of Aadam their descendants and made them testify concerning themselves. Saying: Am I not your Lord? They said: “Yes, we testify to it.” (This) in case you say on the Day of Judgement, “We were unaware of this.” Or in case you say: It was our ancestors who made partners (with Allah) and we are only their descendants…[Surah Al-A’raaf 7:172-173]

3) you also wrote: Also, I believe we must have strong secularist states that will not force Islamic law upon a people, but there must be islamic cities everywhere in the world that are allowed to live with their own law and their own communities free from the interference of corrupt western forms of language game. Furthermore, secular states will actually help Islam because they will create the framework for people to better see exactly what Islam is and again, it must not be forced upon anyone. These considerations, I think, will help both Islam and the self of every member of Islam.

Islam has never been a secular religion, it is a religion which allows anyone to enter it, regardless of colour, creed, tribal affiliation etc, so no. You are wrong. Your western education has pretty much dictated your opinion, and it is flawed. Sorry to say it.

Welcome to the forum.

Scimi