Creation

salam
i have the heirarchy of angels
wasalam

brother

I mean like what was created first etc...

can u post it(or the link) if u know the info..

jzkAllah kheir



Rabi'ya:rose:

salam
not sure about that sis, will have to research inshallah
wasalm

Here's a small link to get you started; I'll write up something a little bit more comprehensive with references Insha-Allah (I'm working on several articles, one of them is based on creation): http://www.tafsir.com/default.asp?sid=7&tid=17982

Tafsir.com is a decent site for Tafsir Ibn Kathir Online.

Ok, jzkAllah kheir for that brother. However Im looking for something a little more indepth. For example, like 1st day Allah created heavens and the earth, 2nd day he creted the mountains land/water - 3rd day moon/stars etc

i dunno the exact order so thats jsut an example of what im looking for.

My first query with the tafsir you have provided is that it is said that created in some for or other for 7 days - which as i understand it is incorrect. Also how can days be established when the ligth and dark was not in place until the ??4th?? day....
Names of days were not created in the beginning and calenders have not been in use since the beginning of time....

Anyway, first if someone can provide a little bit more of a comprehansive list inshAllah it will be helpful.



Rabi'ya:rose:

format_quote Originally Posted by Rabi'ya

Ok, jzkAllah kheir for that brother. However Im looking for something a little more indepth. For example, like 1st day Allah created heavens and the earth, 2nd day he creted the mountains land/water - 3rd day moon/stars etc

i dunno the exact order so thats jsut an example of what im looking for.

My first query with the tafsir you have provided is that it is said that created in some for or other for 7 days - which as i understand it is incorrect. Also how can days be established when the ligth and dark was not in place until the ??4th?? day....
Names of days were not created in the beginning and calenders have not been in use since the beginning of time....

Anyway, first if someone can provide a little bit more of a comprehansive list inshAllah it will be helpful.



Rabi'ya:rose:

A day in the context of creation is not based on the understanding of light and dark; rather these days are very long eons of span in time.

if they are eons of time...how then can we address them as monday, tuesday, wednesday etc....

I feel this is misleading especially for someone trying to understand the concept of creation...which is what i am attempting to do inshAllah

For too long ive had many questions about the topic of creation..so i thought best to try adn clear them up inshAllah

jzkAllah to everyone who is taking the time to read this thread ad help me to understand Islam more efficiently



Rabi'ya:rose:

format_quote Originally Posted by Rabi'ya

if they are eons of time...how then can we address them as monday, tuesday, wednesday etc....

I feel this is misleading especially for someone trying to understand the concept of creation...which is what i am attempting to do inshAllah

For too long ive had many questions about creation..so i thought best to try adn clear them up inshAllah

jzkAllah to everyone who is taking the time to read this thread ad help me to understand Islam more efficiently



Rabi'ya:rose:

Very good question . . . With an obvious answer, as you know very well that in Arabic you count days as numbers (1st Day, 2nd Day and so on). When for example you translate Yawm al-Ahad into English, you write Sunday and NOT "the first Day". All with the exception of Jumu'ah (Friday: literally meaning Gathering). Jumu'ah itself fits perfectly well into the context of both standard day and the day referred to in the Quran (in creation). Simply by its definition, the word Jumu'ah can mean gathering as in finallising or as in mahshoor; the bringing together (in which case, the example of the friday prayer). Feel free to ask any further questions Insha-Allah . . . :thankyou:

jazakAllah kheir brother...i did not know the names of the days in arabic - so thats explains it a little. also i dont think we should use the english day names as these are derived from greek gods anyway.

Its easier to understand if we simply use 1st day, 2nd day etc.

JazakAllah Kheir for clearing that up...



Rabi'ya:rose:

format_quote Originally Posted by Rabi'ya

jazakAllah kheir brother...i did not know the names of the days in arabic - so thats explains it a little. also i dont think we should use the english day names as these are derived from greek gods anyway.

Its easier to understand if we simply use 1st day, 2nd day etc.

JazakAllah Kheir for clearing that up...



Rabi'ya:rose:

The names of the Days are simple:

1. al-Ahad
2. al-Ithnayn
3. ath-Thulaatha
4. al-Arbi'aa
5. al-Khamees
6. al-Jumu'ah
7. as-Sabt

They are numbered according to which days they are.

ok well now we've established that - im just waiting for someone to post the basics of what was created on each day....

inshAllah ill keep searching the net...



Rabi'ya:rose:

Sister,
Please see the following articles:
http://www.load-islam.com/C/rebuttal..._or_the_Earth/
http://www.load-islam.com/C/rebuttal..._the_Universe/

format_quote Originally Posted by Ansar Al-'Adl

Sister,
Please see the following articles:
http://www.load-islam.com/C/rebuttal..._or_the_Earth/
http://www.load-islam.com/C/rebuttal..._the_Universe/

Great articles . . .

brother

jazakAllah kheir for your answer. It was certainly VERY helpful.

Id just like to quote some extracts from the second link you provided.

This hadîth has been related in other sources besides Sahîh Muslim with various conflicting narrations. In some of them the Earth is created on Sunday and Monday while the mountains are created on Tuesday and the trees, rivers, and inhabitants are created on Wednesday, and the Sun, Moon, stars, and angels created on Thursday, and Adam on Friday. These are single-narrator hadîth that conflict with one another and do not provide any practical instruction. We must not rely upon them in determining the order of appearance of created things during those days.

I would just like to clarify, if you dont mind

ok so its established thats its 6 days - which i didnt doubt in the beginning. so if i summarise(please correct me if im wrong.....(thanks)

1st Day & 2nd Day - Earth is created( I take this to mean heaven, earth)
3rd Day - Mountains are created ( I assume this means the land was raised up from the water, separating the land from the sea, therefore creating the continents??)
4th Day - Trees, Rivers and Inhabitants( i guess all plant life, obviously rivers, and animal life?)
5th Day - Sun, Moon, Stars, Angels(so here, i assume, all planets, the angels and does this include jinns?)
6th Day - Adam(as) ( and finally here, mankind was created)

Hope thats is right, if not please correct me, and thanks to Brother Ansar for the answer


The Messenger's Saying (peace be upon him): "And He created light (ar. Noor) on the fourth day"

This is how it has been narrated in Sahih Muslim as noor but in the transmission of Thabit ibn Qaasim it says noon with the letter 'Nûn' at the end. Al-Qaadi said "It refers to the fish

is there any further clarification of this - do we take it to mean "fish" or "light"??


Rabi'ya:rose:

Br. Ahmed Waheed,
JazakumAllahu khayran for your kind words.

Sr. Rabi'ya,

format_quote Originally Posted by Rabi'ya

1st Day & 2nd Day - Earth is created( I take this to mean heaven, earth)
3rd Day - Mountains are created ( I assume this means the land was raised up from the water, separating the land from the sea, therefore creating the continents??)
4th Day - Trees, Rivers and Inhabitants( i guess all plant life, obviously rivers, and animal life?)

Well there's a number of ways to interpret the exact scientific meanings of the Qur'anic descriptions as pointed out in the linked article, I tend to prefer the first explanation which states that the earth was created in the first two periods, and an additional two periods were taken for the formation of major landmasses and the cultivation of the world.

Then the next two periods were taken for the formation of the heavens. These periods do not necessarily include the adornment of the heavens with lamps, even though it is mentioned after, because it can be interpreted as just an additional favor of God mentioned and not part of the sequence.

It seems to me that you are including the hadith in your interpretation, which most scholars regard as unauthentic. That's why I wouldn't necessarily agree with what you've mentioned for the fifth day. The sun was created before the earth as were most stars. And I'm not sure where you got the Angels from. But Adam was likely at the end.

is there any further clarification of this - do we take it to mean "fish" or "light"??

Most scholars view it as unauthentic. It doesn't make sense to interpret it as light, so if you agree with the scholars who do believe it is authentic, then you would most likely interpret it as 'fish'.

thanks brother for posting, but ive just ended up more and more confused now! lol

so the link you provided before, i shouldnt really accept most of it ..or..?

is there nothing which can clearly explain to me the topic of creation from the Quraan if the hadith are not authentic?



Rabi'ya:rose:

format_quote Originally Posted by Rabi'ya

thanks brother for posting, but ive just ended up more and more confused now! lol

so the link you provided before, i shouldnt really accept most of it ..or..?

is there nothing which can clearly explain to me the topic of creation from the Quraan if the hadith are not authentic?



Rabi'ya:rose:

Okay, let me try to explain this more clearly. The linked article is correct, but you'll notice that near the end it discusses a particular hadith, which turns out to be unauthentic. Not all hadith on creation, just that one that is discussed at the end of the article. The hadith are authentic, just that one mentioned at the end of the article is not authentic, acocrding to the majority of scholars.

The order of creation goes like this:

Earth is created in two periods
An additional two periods are taken before the earth develops in terms of land and life.
The heavens are formed in an additional two periods.

I hope that clarifies.

brother

thanks for clarifying..jazakAllah kheir.

InshaAllah i will study a bit more and raise any questions later on...

if you find anything further that may help me to understand more please post it up.



Rabi'y:rose: