The Faqeeh Thief!

**Ibn Abi Ahmed** · 12-07-2007

Translated and posted by a brother on a different forum.

Imam ibn alJawzi narrated with his Isnaad to Ahmad bin alMu’addil alBasri who said:

I was sitting in a gathering when a person came and said:

I was heading to the woods where I own a garden. When I got far from the community houses I was approached by a thief.

He said: Give me your clothes.

I said (trying to be defiant): Why would I give you my clothes?

He said: I am more deserving of your clothes than you.

I said: Why?

He said: Because I am your brother. You are clothed and I am not.

I said: Let me express to you how sorry I am for your situation.

He said: No. I want to wear your clothes, just as you wore them.

I said: So you want to make me naked and expose my Awrah?!

He said: There is nothing wrong with this. Imam Malik narrated that it was OK for a man to perform Ghusul naked.

I said: But people will see me naked.

He said: If there were people on this road I would not have approached you on it.

I said: You seem to be intelligent. Let me go to my garden and I will take off my clothes and give them to you.

He said: No. You want to have your servants grab me and take me to the Sultan who will imprison me, rip my skin, and put chains around my feet.

I said: No, I swear to you that I will fulfill my promise to you, and will do you no harm.

He said: No. Imam Malik narrated that oaths given to thieves do not have to be fulfilled.

I said: I swear that I will not use my swearing to con you.

He said: Same thing, this is a compounded oath given to a thief.

I said: Let us stop debating, I promise to give you these clothes out of my good will with no hard feelings.

So the thief thought for a moment and said: Do you know what I am thinking?

I said: No.

He said: I went over the cases of thieves since the time of the Prophet ASWS until today. I do not recall a thief who stole something this way (by leaving a time gap between his attack and receiving stolen goods). I hate to innovate something into Islam which was not from it. I will bare the sin of it and every one who goes by it to the day of judgment … Give me your clothes.

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Note: This shows the extent of fear and hatred people had against bid'ah at that time; that even the sinners would regard it as such a great evil - greater than the major sins such as stealing.

**------** · 12-11-2007

I didn't get it.

**IbnAbdulHakim** · 12-11-2007

its kind of funny, a thief is about to steal and his bringing up islamic teaching.

SubhanAllaah.

It was interesting bro, Assalamu Alaikum wa Rahmatullaah

lol it wouldnt have been a bid'a btw, it doesnt fit into the category. But it most certainly was a funny read

**crayon** · 12-11-2007

I didn't get it at first, but then I reread it and understood.

As for bid'ah, I've actually heard of some scholars arguing that there is a difference between a "good" bida'ah and a "bad" bid'ah. What on earth...? :S

**IbnAbdulHakim** · 12-11-2007

Originally Posted by crayon

I didn't get it at first, but then I reread it and understood.

As for bid'ah, I've actually heard of some scholars arguing that there is a difference between a "good" bida'ah and a "bad" bid'ah. What on earth...? :S

good bid'a = teapot, kettle etc lol

bad bid'a = anything done to please Allaah which has no relation to sharee'ah or sunnah

hope that makes sense

Assalamu Alaikum wa Rahmatullaah

**crayon** · 12-11-2007

No, I mean he was talking about good bida'ahs in religion, like saying a certain duaa a certain number of times, at certain times during the day for a specific purpose. Or extra acts of prayer, that the prophet never used to pray. Basically, acts that weren't in the sunnah, but are supposedly "good", such as extra duaa/tasbeeh/salah, etc.

Salam.

**~Taalibah~** · 12-11-2007

It funny, lol!

But no bid'ah as far as i know.

**IbnAbdulHakim** · 12-11-2007

Originally Posted by crayon

No, I mean he was talking about good bida'ahs in religion, like saying a certain duaa a certain number of times, at certain times during the day for a specific purpose. Or extra acts of prayer, that the prophet never used to pray. Basically, acts that weren't in the sunnah, but are supposedly "good", such as extra duaa/tasbeeh/salah, etc.

Salam.

i prefer to stay away from anything which cant be verified as an act encouraged by the sahabi's/salaf. So if they say saying these are ok, then they need to give a like example at least so we feel secure and can perform the act with yaqeen.

hope that makes sense...

Assalamu Alaikum

**crayon** · 12-11-2007

It does make sense, I agree.
Of course with proof and evidence it's all good.

**Ibn Abi Ahmed** · 12-11-2007

I found it pretty funny cause he was a Maliki thief...he knew the Fiqh of Imam Malik so much so that the narrator of the story couldn't get around him..

And it wouldn't have been a bida', I agree, but the funny/amazing thing was that, even in (while) committing a major sin, he was afraid to innovate; which shows that they considered even the smallest Bida' as destruction upon themselves; a destruction greater than the destruction that comes from a major sin like stealing. Its like Ibn Taymiyyah said, Imam Malik's methodology had such a profound effect on Madinah that it made it Bida' free for 6 centuries..thats why you'll find Maliki scholars having severe animosity against bid'ah in their writings. May Allaah have mercy on Imam Malik, and may he protect us from every and any kind of Bida'. Ameen.

**IbnAbdulHakim** · 12-11-2007

Ameen, mashaAllaah

i cant stop wondering what it must have been like during those times.

You know the extent of fabrication during the times of imaam abu hanifa, he hated bid'a so much that he was afraid to use weak ahadeeth, may Allaah have mercy on him.

Assalamu Alaikum wa Rahmatullaah