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21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

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    21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry... (OP)


    Salaam brothers and sisters of Islam,

    I am 21 years old, British, born catholic (although parents not strict) and living in London. I am recently converted to Islam and this is my first ramadan as a muslim, i'm finding fasting fairly tough but i am enjoying it Mashallah

    I do have a slight problem though and i'm not sure if i'm posting it in the right section? This is not a joke:

    Before i converted i used to drink like normal white people do, hit on girls, look at porn, without a care in the world. Now i am alcohol free, Insha'Allah, i have a steady muslim girlfriend who i adore and hope to continue to date Insha'Allah (we are halal, before you ask.) And i don't look at other women or desire them Insha'Allah.

    I try to avoid all things haram, however i have a love for masturbation, and sometimes porn along with it. In my eyes it makes me feel good and stops me from committing a bigger sin in illegal sexual relations with my private parts. At the moment it is ramadan and i have been resisting with every fibre in my body.. but once fasting hours are over, i find myself wanting to look at it once, and pleasure myself.

    When ramadan is over, i'd want to do it maybe once a week.

    How bad of a sin is this? I know it is wrong, but Insha'Allah it is the only temptation i have, and one i feel i need in my life. Are there any muslims out there, male or female who do masturbate?

    What if i can try to not look at porn (will be very hard) and think of my girlfriend when masturbating, i also sometimes do this.

    I read somewhere, that while unmarried it is acceptable?

    I appreciate your replies in advance.

    Haider Ali

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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

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    Salaam

    format_quote Originally Posted by Haider_Ali View Post
    Why does the Quran state that a man may beat his wife?



    .
    there is a thread on it . A Christian sis asked this question and she ended up by embracing Islam

    Alhamdulillah.
    21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Christ will never be proud to reject to be a slave to God .....holy Quran, chapter Women , 4: 172

    recitation:http://quran.jalisi.com
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...



    format_quote Originally Posted by Muslim Woman View Post
    Salaam



    there is a thread on it . A Christian sis asked this question and she ended up by embracing Islam

    Alhamdulillah.


    If possible, please post a link.

    جزاك الله خيراً

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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Salaam

    format_quote Originally Posted by Ahmed Waheed View Post






    If possible, please post a link.

    جزاك الله خيراً


    her name was Chris. It's about 2 yrs back. After that , several changes took place in the forum and forum has lost many posts including threads . So , I have to see if that thread is still here .
    21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Christ will never be proud to reject to be a slave to God .....holy Quran, chapter Women , 4: 172

    recitation:http://quran.jalisi.com
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...



    format_quote Originally Posted by Muslim Woman View Post
    Salaam




    her name was Chris. It's about 2 yrs back. After that , several changes took place in the forum and forum has lost many posts including threads . So , I have to see if that thread is still here .
    That probably explains why my search didn't find it. I've been away for a few years, so I have missed out on "a few" discussions.

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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    as-salaam alaykum

    Bismillah

    @syed_z

    It's month of ramadan and I hate to do this. Please my brother be careful about taking information from anyone. Such understanding regarding salves is corrupt modernist understanding who are ashamed of their religion; hence, in order to appease the kuffaar they twist the meaning and wordings to push forward their agenda. We don't learn our deen from heretic Assad. May Allah protect us all from these dajjal within our ummah and may Allah destroy the enemies of Islam, ameen

    @Haider_Ali

    Welcome to Islam my brother *smile, it's sunnah*. May Allah keep you steadfast and make everything easier for you, ameen. My 2 cents:

    1 - Do lots of good deeds & make lots of dua'a
    2 - Keep yourself busy with other halal things; when you feel the urge, recite the Qur'an or read a book or something like that (something which will fill your hear with imaan). Or memorize an ayaah which strikes your heart and keep repeating it while pondering over its meaning.
    3 - As the Salaf used to say, don't look at the significance of the sin but the significance of the One you're disobeying.
    4 - Imagine what will happen if you die in that state or die before repenting.

    Read this, this and this insha'Allah

    As far your question about slavery, once we have established belief in Allah, worshipping him only and understand the meaning of being a Muslim, then the secondary issues and questions like "why" do not matter. Because we believe that Allah is most just and most wise; hence, there's no room for questioning why He has made something halal while others haraam. He is our Lord and this is the world He created; He does whatever He pleases. On topic, slaves in Islam are prisoners of war (POW), which is permissible in Islam regardless of time period. Islam provided a practice solution for POW instead of throwing them into prison dungeons. Islam allows a Muslim male to have physical relationship with his female slave. You could also go through threads on slavery here and insha'Allah they will be helpful.

    and Allah knows best
    21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Fi Amanillah
    Wa As-Salāmu 'Alaykum
    Islamic-Life
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    عن تميم بن أوس الداري أن النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم: قال الدين النصيحة ثلاثا قلنا لمن يا رسول الله قال لله ولكتابه ولرسوله ولأئمة المسلمين وعامتهم - رواه مسلم
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    heretic Assad
    He quotes Tabari, Razi and Great Imam Shafi ... and you call him Heretic ? What proof do you have that after embracing Islam and writing Great commentary of Quran which was made easy for many to understand Islam better and accept Islam, that you call him Heretic ?

    Im sorry to say brother, but you remind me of those ignorant Muslims who called Dr Zakir Naik a "Kafir" when he called Yazeed ibn Muawiya "may Allah be pleased with him"... since then he is being maligned every where.

    Whoa may We seek refuge in Allah from saying such about Great Scholars of Islam. Reminds me of this Verse brother for you to recite...and think

    (49:6) Believers, when an ungodly person brings to you a piece of news, carefully ascertain its truth, lest you should hurt a people unwittingly and thereafter repent at what you did.

    If you called him an agent of Dajjals System (I.e New World Order) then please go ahead and prove that he is a "heretic" and an Agent ? If you have no proof, would you beleive that what you said was a very big word for a Muslim , whom you declared to be a non Muslim based on suspicion ?

    (49:12) Believers, avoid being excessively suspicious, for some suspicion is a sin.


    Now i would actually like you to prove it to me that he was an agent and/or heretic ? And how was he heretic ?

    (49:11) Believers, let not a group (of men) scoff at another group, it may well be that the latter (at whom they scoff) are better than they...



    Please do provide proof that he was an agent of the Western, Dajjal system ?

    May Allah guide us all in the month of Ramadaan.
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Salaam Alaykum;

    pl. my respected Muslim brothers , don't start any debate in the forum in this holy month . Postponed it till Eid. Also , these are off topic here.
    21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Christ will never be proud to reject to be a slave to God .....holy Quran, chapter Women , 4: 172

    recitation:http://quran.jalisi.com
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...



    format_quote Originally Posted by syed_z View Post
    He quotes Tabari, Razi and Great Imam Shafi ... and you call him Heretic ? What proof do you have that after embracing Islam and writing Great commentary of Quran which was made easy for many to understand Islam better and accept Islam, that you call him Heretic ?

    Im sorry to say brother, but you remind me of those ignorant Muslims who called Dr Zakir Naik a "Kafir" when he called Yazeed ibn Muawiya "may Allah be pleased with him"... since then he is being maligned every where.

    Whoa may We seek refuge in Allah from saying such about Great Scholars of Islam. Reminds me of this Verse brother for you to recite...and think

    (49:6) Believers, when an ungodly person brings to you a piece of news, carefully ascertain its truth, lest you should hurt a people unwittingly and thereafter repent at what you did.

    If you called him an agent of Dajjals System (I.e New World Order) then please go ahead and prove that he is a "heretic" and an Agent ? If you have no proof, would you beleive that what you said was a very big word for a Muslim , whom you declared to be a non Muslim based on suspicion ?

    (49:12) Believers, avoid being excessively suspicious, for some suspicion is a sin.


    Now i would actually like you to prove it to me that he was an agent and/or heretic ? And how was he heretic ?

    (49:11) Believers, let not a group (of men) scoff at another group, it may well be that the latter (at whom they scoff) are better than they...



    Please do provide proof that he was an agent of the Western, Dajjal system ?

    May Allah guide us all in the month of Ramadaan.
    Do not reply to any post, which is aimed at arguing. Your earlier post was very useful as an answer to Brother Haider's question; don't let anyone turn this thread into a cyber-battlefield. Remember one thing, there are always people who look for even the smallest bit of negativity in others, so that they may emphasise it. Brother islamiclife made a list of useful points in his post; it would avoid arguments to reply to the good points in his post, rather than replying to an argument. This isn't a debating thread, we must try to keep ourselves aware of this

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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    I am sorry and i apologize... i do not aim and my intention is not to start any debates... Allah (swt) is my witness. However i just saw a Muslim being called heretic and wanted the brother to know and understand , what are the dangers of calling other Muslims heretic, while we don't even have any evidence and specially when he had served the Ummah.

    Just wanted to remind of What Allah (swt) has said , if we suspect or blame or say anything wrong about Muslim brothers/sisters.

    This is one of the diseases which have plagued the Ummah today is, we have no tolerance and we are quick to blame each other disbelievers.

    If i have broken any rules, i apologize again. May Allah for give me.

    Salaam..


    P:S Not till eid either... my intention is not to debate with any Muslim Brother/sister..however i think it is also a duty of each muslim Muslimah to point out and correct the one who is making a serious mistake, which can affect our Iman and Islam.
    Last edited by syed_z; 08-21-2010 at 05:38 PM.
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    as-salaam alaykum

    subhaanAllah *big smile* I clearly mentioned that I'm hating to say what I said regarding that, which is an indication that I do not want to argue or to drag it on during this month or hijack this thread. It was nothing more than a sincere naseeha to my brother. It's an obligation upon us to do whatever we can to best of our abilities to stop the munkar. This is our deen, not a child's play. We can't let anybody hijack it under the disguise of Muslim names.

    brother syed, it seems you don't know who this man is and his hidden agenda. We can discuss it in length after the month of Ramadan, insha'Allah

    May Allah guide us all, keep us on haqq and let us die as Muslims, ameen
    21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Fi Amanillah
    Wa As-Salāmu 'Alaykum
    Islamic-Life
    Bringing Da'wah back..to life!

    عن تميم بن أوس الداري أن النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم: قال الدين النصيحة ثلاثا قلنا لمن يا رسول الله قال لله ولكتابه ولرسوله ولأئمة المسلمين وعامتهم - رواه مسلم
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    this is what you were probably looking for sis?

    Wife beating?

    icon1 1 - 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry... Wife beating

    IslamTomorrow smJPG 1 - 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    | Home Page | Email | LIVE Broadcasts | Order Tapes, Videos & CDs | EZ-Islam |
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    Author:
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    RasulAllah P.B.U.H. Said:
    "Never beat God's handmaidens."
    "Could any of you beat your wife as he would a slave, and then lie with her in the evening?"

    Question:
    Could you please tell me why the Quran tells men to "beat them" meaning their wives? (chapter 4, verse 34)

    Answer:
    Thank you for asking about Islam. It is our committment to try our best to provide answers to questions to the best of our ability. However, sometimes we come across questions for which we do not have answers. In this case we will refer you to others who may be able to provide you with proper answers.

    Please be aware that we as Muslims, must never lie about anything, especially our religion.

    Secondly, we do have the original text of the Quran and the preserved teachings of Muhammad, peace be upon him. This enables us to verify exactly what was said, intended and taught by Muhammad, peace be upon him, as being the religion of Islam.

    Third, I would like to remind myself and all who read this in the future that not all questions are purely questions. Some contain statements and implications, that may or may not be true.

    Finally, it is important to keep in mind anytime we discover something in the answers to actually be better than what we already have, we should be committed to change our position and accept that which is true over that which is false and take that which is better for that which is inferior.

    After taking all of the above into consideration, if we find that the answer to this question provides us with a better approach to understanding what Almighty God has provided us with as a way of life on this earth and in the Next Life, we should then make the logical decsion to begin to worship Him on His terms.

    Having said that, let us now look to the particular verse in question in the original text (Arabic), followed by the phonetic sounds in Latin letters and then finally, followed by a translation of the meaning to the English language by experts in both Arabic and in Quranic meanings.

    4 34 1 - 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Transliteration
    Alrrijalu qawwamoona AAala alnnisa-i bima faddala Allahu baAAdahum AAala baAAdin wabima anfaqoo min amwalihim faalssalihatu qanitatun hafithatun lilghaybi bima hafitha Allahu waallatee takhafoona nushoozahunna faAAithoohunna waohjuroohunna fee almadajiAAi waidriboohunna fa-in ataAAnakum fala tabghoo AAalayhinna sabeelan inna Allaha kana AAaliyyan kabeeran

    Explanation (tafsir) of Sura 4:34
    Here is the translation of meaning of the verse as best can be defined according to the rules of understanding Quran with the explanations following this translation:
    “Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). Regarding the woman who is guilty of lewd, or indecent behavior, admonish her (if she continues in this indecency then), stop sharing her bed (if she still continues doing this lewd behavior, then), [set forth for her the clear meaning of either straighten up or else we are finished and when she returns to proper behavior take up sharing the bed with her again], but if she returns in obedience (to proper behavior and conduct) then seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.”

    Meaning of the Words
    For the three words fa'izu, wahjaru, and wadribu in the original, translated here ‘speak to them in a persuasive manner’, ‘leave them alone (in bed - fi'l-madage'),’ and ‘have intercourse’, respectively, see Raghib Lisan al-'Arab and Zamakhsari. Raghib in his Al-Mufridat fi Gharib al-Qur'an gives the meanings of these words with special reference to this verse. Fa-'izu, he says, means to 'to talk to them so persuasively as to melt their hearts.'
    (See also v.63 of this Surah where it has been used in a similar sense.)
    Hajara - Wahjaru (do not touch or moleste them)
    Hajara, he says, means to separate body from body, and points out that the expression wahjaru hunna metaphorically means to refrain from touching or molesting them. Zamakhshari is more explicit in his Kshshaf when he says, 'do not get inside their blankets.'
    Here is the translation of meaning of the verse as best can be defined according to the rules of understanding Quran with the explanations following this translation:
    “Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). Regarding women guilty of lewd, or indecent behavior, admonish her (if she continues in this indecency then), stop sharing her bed (if she still continues doing this lewd behavior, then), [set forth for her the clear meaning of either straighten up or else we are finished and when she returns to proper behavior take up sharing the bed with her again], but if she returns in obedience (to proper behavior and conduct) then seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.”

    Let me begin by explaining the English language is not powerful enough when it comes to translating the meanings of the Arabic of the Quran. Nor for that matter, is any other language on earth. So, all we have is translations of meanings according to the best understanding of the translators.

    The operative word in this verse in Arabic is "daraba." While there are literally hundreds of uses for this word varying from "tap" to "walk in stride" to "strike at something" to "set a clear example", the only meaning that can be assigned to something in the Quran must be according to the rules of Quran. And Allah has used the same word a number of times with a consistent meaning. Let us examine them.

    Here is what we find from the scholars of the Arabic language:
    Daraba (to have intercourse, not to beat)

    Raghib points out that daraba metaphorically means to have intercourse, and quotes the expression darab al-fahl an-naqah, 'the stud camel covered the she-camel,' which is also quoted by Lisan al-'Arab. It cannot be taken here to mean 'to strike them (women).' This view is strengthened by the Prophet's authentic hadith found in a number of authorities, including Bukhari and Muslim: "Could any of you beat your wife as he would a slave, and then lie with her in the evening?" There are other traditions in Abu Da'ud, Nasa'i, Ibn Majah, Ahmad bin Hanbal and others, to the effect that he forbade the beating of any woman, saying: "Never beat God's handmaidens."

    Source: al-Qur'an: a contemporary translation by Ahmed Ali, Princeton University Press, 1988; pp78-79

    Daraba (to set forth, to make a clear statement or proclamation)
    One of the key rules of understanding words of the Quran is to go to other places in the Quran to investigate the usage in other places. This word is used by Allah in other places in the Quran to mean "set forth" or "sets up for you" or "makes known to you" - as is demonstrated in the following verses:
    Surah Ar-Ra'd (13:17) yadribu Allahu al-amthala “Thus Allah sets forth a parable”
    [here the word "yadirbu" is from the exact same root da-ra-ba]
    Surah Ibrahim (14:24): Alam tara kayfa daraba Allahu mathalan .. “Don’t you see how Allah sets forth a parable?..”
    And again in the next verse: Surah Ibrahim (14:25) wa yadribu Allahu al-amthala li-naasi
    “..and Allah sets forth parables for mankind..”
    [again the word yadirbu is from da-ra-ba]
    Surah An-Nur (24:35) wa yadribu Allahu al0amthala lin-naasi
    “And Allah sets forth parables for mankind..”
    Surah Ar-Rum (30:28) Daraba lakum mathalan min anfusikum
    “He sets forth for you a parable from yourselves..”
    Surah At-Tahreem (66:10) Daraba Allahu mathalan lillatheena kafaroo..
    “Allah sets forth an example for those disbelievers..”
    In fact, the word daraba has not been translated to mean (beat) or (hit) or (strike) in any other verse of the Quran except this one.
    The words for (beat) as in [to hit] found in Surah Baqarah 2:275 ... kama yaqoomu allathee yatakhabbatuhu ash-shaytanu mina almassi..
    "..like the standing of someone beaten by the devil (Satan) leading him to insanity."

    And in Surah Ta Ha 20:18 Allah Says, “Qala hiya Aasaya atawakkao Aalayha waahushshu biha Aala ghanamee waliya feeha maaribu okhra.”
    "This is my stick, whereon I lean, and wherewith I beat down branches for my sheep and wherein I find other uses."

    As you can see, these are not even related to the word (daraba).
    Verses 34 and 35 in Surah An-Nisaa' need to be read together to understand this is the proper relationship between men and women in general and husband and wife specifically.

    Islam seeks to hold the family together and to make peace and reconciliation between spouses. The next verse makes it clear what to do in the case where it seems that divorce may be the result of the uncorrected bad behavior. It stresses appointing arbitrators from both sides and seeks reconciliation.

    The first part of 34 deals with all men taking care of all women. Then goes on to explain the wife's proper obedience to Allah because He is the One Who has ordained this relationship of provision and protection for her and to be appreciative and respectful of her husband, guarding herself and his property in his absence. The man is told the proper way to behave when he finds his wife not complying with decency and proper behavior of a Muslim wife. He has a direct order to begin with admonishing her and then if there is compliance to leave her be and don't give her a hard time about it.

    However, if this continues, he should not have sex with her and this makes it clear to her that he is most serious and this not a joke. Again, if she comes around then he is to let it go and not bother her about it. Finally, if she still insists on such lewdness and bad conduct, he is to make it clear to her in no uncertain terms that they are going to be heading for separation or even divorce unless she comes back to proper behavior. Again, if she complies, then he should not bring it up and return to the bed with her.
    And of course, this is all in an effort to translate one short but powerful phrase from Arabic to English. The sources are quoted herein and there may be other interpretations but the only acceptable ones are those based on the teachings of the Quran and the prophet, peace be upon him.
    And as always, Allahu 'Alim (Allah is the Knower)

    Source: al-Qur'an: a contemporary translation by Ahmed Ali, Princeton University Press, 1988; pp78-79

    In the past, some translators of this verse have mistakeningly used the word "beat" or "hit" or even "scourge" (as in the case of an old translation) to represent the word "daraba" in Arabic. This is not the opinion of all scholars especially Raghib and Zamakhshari as mentioned above and those who are well grounded in both Islam understanding and the English language.
    34.
    Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allâh has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allâh and to their husbands), and guard in the husband's absence what Allâh orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). As to those women on whose part you see ill*conduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to share their beds, (and last) beat them (lightly, if it is useful), but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allâh is Ever Most High, Most Great.
    The understanding now is that some of the translations are not properly representing the spirit of the meaning. Therefore, they cannot be considered to be the representation of what has been intended by Almighty God.

    Now we can properly understand that Almighty God has commanded the men to provide for the women and allow them to keep all of their wealth, inheritance and income without demanding anything from them for support and maintenance. Additionally, if she should be guilty of lewd or indecent conduct, the husband is told to first, admonish her and then if she would cease this lewdness. If she should continue in this indecency, then he should no longer share the bed with her, and this would continue for a period of time. Finally, if she would repent then he would take up sharing the bed with her again.

    And Allah is All Knowing of the meanings.

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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    this is what you were probably looking for sis?

    Wife beating?

    icon1 1 - 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry... Wife beating
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    RasulAllah P.B.U.H. Said:
    "Never beat God's handmaidens."
    "Could any of you beat your wife as he would a slave, and then lie with her in the evening?"

    Question:
    Could you please tell me why the Quran tells men to "beat them" meaning their wives? (chapter 4, verse 34)

    Answer:
    Thank you for asking about Islam. It is our committment to try our best to provide answers to questions to the best of our ability. However, sometimes we come across questions for which we do not have answers. In this case we will refer you to others who may be able to provide you with proper answers.

    Please be aware that we as Muslims, must never lie about anything, especially our religion.

    Secondly, we do have the original text of the Quran and the preserved teachings of Muhammad, peace be upon him. This enables us to verify exactly what was said, intended and taught by Muhammad, peace be upon him, as being the religion of Islam.

    Third, I would like to remind myself and all who read this in the future that not all questions are purely questions. Some contain statements and implications, that may or may not be true.

    Finally, it is important to keep in mind anytime we discover something in the answers to actually be better than what we already have, we should be committed to change our position and accept that which is true over that which is false and take that which is better for that which is inferior.

    After taking all of the above into consideration, if we find that the answer to this question provides us with a better approach to understanding what Almighty God has provided us with as a way of life on this earth and in the Next Life, we should then make the logical decsion to begin to worship Him on His terms.

    Having said that, let us now look to the particular verse in question in the original text (Arabic), followed by the phonetic sounds in Latin letters and then finally, followed by a translation of the meaning to the English language by experts in both Arabic and in Quranic meanings.

    4 34 1 - 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Transliteration
    Alrrijalu qawwamoona AAala alnnisa-i bima faddala Allahu baAAdahum AAala baAAdin wabima anfaqoo min amwalihim faalssalihatu qanitatun hafithatun lilghaybi bima hafitha Allahu waallatee takhafoona nushoozahunna faAAithoohunna waohjuroohunna fee almadajiAAi waidriboohunna fa-in ataAAnakum fala tabghoo AAalayhinna sabeelan inna Allaha kana AAaliyyan kabeeran

    Explanation (tafsir) of Sura 4:34
    Here is the translation of meaning of the verse as best can be defined according to the rules of understanding Quran with the explanations following this translation:
    “Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). Regarding the woman who is guilty of lewd, or indecent behavior, admonish her (if she continues in this indecency then), stop sharing her bed (if she still continues doing this lewd behavior, then), [set forth for her the clear meaning of either straighten up or else we are finished and when she returns to proper behavior take up sharing the bed with her again], but if she returns in obedience (to proper behavior and conduct) then seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.”

    Meaning of the Words
    For the three words fa'izu, wahjaru, and wadribu in the original, translated here ‘speak to them in a persuasive manner’, ‘leave them alone (in bed - fi'l-madage'),’ and ‘have intercourse’, respectively, see Raghib Lisan al-'Arab and Zamakhsari. Raghib in his Al-Mufridat fi Gharib al-Qur'an gives the meanings of these words with special reference to this verse. Fa-'izu, he says, means to 'to talk to them so persuasively as to melt their hearts.'
    (See also v.63 of this Surah where it has been used in a similar sense.)
    Hajara - Wahjaru (do not touch or moleste them)
    Hajara, he says, means to separate body from body, and points out that the expression wahjaru hunna metaphorically means to refrain from touching or molesting them. Zamakhshari is more explicit in his Kshshaf when he says, 'do not get inside their blankets.'
    Here is the translation of meaning of the verse as best can be defined according to the rules of understanding Quran with the explanations following this translation:
    “Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allah), and guard in the husband's absence what Allah orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). Regarding women guilty of lewd, or indecent behavior, admonish her (if she continues in this indecency then), stop sharing her bed (if she still continues doing this lewd behavior, then), [set forth for her the clear meaning of either straighten up or else we are finished and when she returns to proper behavior take up sharing the bed with her again], but if she returns in obedience (to proper behavior and conduct) then seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allah is Ever Most High, Most Great.”

    Let me begin by explaining the English language is not powerful enough when it comes to translating the meanings of the Arabic of the Quran. Nor for that matter, is any other language on earth. So, all we have is translations of meanings according to the best understanding of the translators.

    The operative word in this verse in Arabic is "daraba." While there are literally hundreds of uses for this word varying from "tap" to "walk in stride" to "strike at something" to "set a clear example", the only meaning that can be assigned to something in the Quran must be according to the rules of Quran. And Allah has used the same word a number of times with a consistent meaning. Let us examine them.

    Here is what we find from the scholars of the Arabic language:
    Daraba (to have intercourse, not to beat)

    Raghib points out that daraba metaphorically means to have intercourse, and quotes the expression darab al-fahl an-naqah, 'the stud camel covered the she-camel,' which is also quoted by Lisan al-'Arab. It cannot be taken here to mean 'to strike them (women).' This view is strengthened by the Prophet's authentic hadith found in a number of authorities, including Bukhari and Muslim: "Could any of you beat your wife as he would a slave, and then lie with her in the evening?" There are other traditions in Abu Da'ud, Nasa'i, Ibn Majah, Ahmad bin Hanbal and others, to the effect that he forbade the beating of any woman, saying: "Never beat God's handmaidens."

    Source: al-Qur'an: a contemporary translation by Ahmed Ali, Princeton University Press, 1988; pp78-79

    Daraba (to set forth, to make a clear statement or proclamation)
    One of the key rules of understanding words of the Quran is to go to other places in the Quran to investigate the usage in other places. This word is used by Allah in other places in the Quran to mean "set forth" or "sets up for you" or "makes known to you" - as is demonstrated in the following verses:
    Surah Ar-Ra'd (13:17) yadribu Allahu al-amthala “Thus Allah sets forth a parable”
    [here the word "yadirbu" is from the exact same root da-ra-ba]
    Surah Ibrahim (14:24): Alam tara kayfa daraba Allahu mathalan .. “Don’t you see how Allah sets forth a parable?..”
    And again in the next verse: Surah Ibrahim (14:25) wa yadribu Allahu al-amthala li-naasi
    “..and Allah sets forth parables for mankind..”
    [again the word yadirbu is from da-ra-ba]
    Surah An-Nur (24:35) wa yadribu Allahu al0amthala lin-naasi
    “And Allah sets forth parables for mankind..”
    Surah Ar-Rum (30:28) Daraba lakum mathalan min anfusikum
    “He sets forth for you a parable from yourselves..”
    Surah At-Tahreem (66:10) Daraba Allahu mathalan lillatheena kafaroo..
    “Allah sets forth an example for those disbelievers..”
    In fact, the word daraba has not been translated to mean (beat) or (hit) or (strike) in any other verse of the Quran except this one.
    The words for (beat) as in [to hit] found in Surah Baqarah 2:275 ... kama yaqoomu allathee yatakhabbatuhu ash-shaytanu mina almassi..
    "..like the standing of someone beaten by the devil (Satan) leading him to insanity."

    And in Surah Ta Ha 20:18 Allah Says, “Qala hiya Aasaya atawakkao Aalayha waahushshu biha Aala ghanamee waliya feeha maaribu okhra.”
    "This is my stick, whereon I lean, and wherewith I beat down branches for my sheep and wherein I find other uses."

    As you can see, these are not even related to the word (daraba).
    Verses 34 and 35 in Surah An-Nisaa' need to be read together to understand this is the proper relationship between men and women in general and husband and wife specifically.

    Islam seeks to hold the family together and to make peace and reconciliation between spouses. The next verse makes it clear what to do in the case where it seems that divorce may be the result of the uncorrected bad behavior. It stresses appointing arbitrators from both sides and seeks reconciliation.

    The first part of 34 deals with all men taking care of all women. Then goes on to explain the wife's proper obedience to Allah because He is the One Who has ordained this relationship of provision and protection for her and to be appreciative and respectful of her husband, guarding herself and his property in his absence. The man is told the proper way to behave when he finds his wife not complying with decency and proper behavior of a Muslim wife. He has a direct order to begin with admonishing her and then if there is compliance to leave her be and don't give her a hard time about it.

    However, if this continues, he should not have sex with her and this makes it clear to her that he is most serious and this not a joke. Again, if she comes around then he is to let it go and not bother her about it. Finally, if she still insists on such lewdness and bad conduct, he is to make it clear to her in no uncertain terms that they are going to be heading for separation or even divorce unless she comes back to proper behavior. Again, if she complies, then he should not bring it up and return to the bed with her.
    And of course, this is all in an effort to translate one short but powerful phrase from Arabic to English. The sources are quoted herein and there may be other interpretations but the only acceptable ones are those based on the teachings of the Quran and the prophet, peace be upon him.
    And as always, Allahu 'Alim (Allah is the Knower)

    Source: al-Qur'an: a contemporary translation by Ahmed Ali, Princeton University Press, 1988; pp78-79

    In the past, some translators of this verse have mistakeningly used the word "beat" or "hit" or even "scourge" (as in the case of an old translation) to represent the word "daraba" in Arabic. This is not the opinion of all scholars especially Raghib and Zamakhshari as mentioned above and those who are well grounded in both Islam understanding and the English language.
    34.
    Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allâh has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend (to support them) from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient (to Allâh and to their husbands), and guard in the husband's absence what Allâh orders them to guard (e.g. their chastity, their husband's property, etc.). As to those women on whose part you see ill*conduct, admonish them (first), (next), refuse to share their beds, (and last) beat them (lightly, if it is useful), but if they return to obedience, seek not against them means (of annoyance). Surely, Allâh is Ever Most High, Most Great.
    The understanding now is that some of the translations are not properly representing the spirit of the meaning. Therefore, they cannot be considered to be the representation of what has been intended by Almighty God.

    Now we can properly understand that Almighty God has commanded the men to provide for the women and allow them to keep all of their wealth, inheritance and income without demanding anything from them for support and maintenance. Additionally, if she should be guilty of lewd or indecent conduct, the husband is told to first, admonish her and then if she would cease this lewdness. If she should continue in this indecency, then he should no longer share the bed with her, and this would continue for a period of time. Finally, if she would repent then he would take up sharing the bed with her again.

    And Allah is All Knowing of the meanings.

    21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Regarding slavery, i myself am considering converting, but i also know that may muslims believe there is a holy war going on right now, which means if they feel my conversion if more of a surrender, i would be open to being enslaved. It is not my right to choose how muslims may view my conversion One thing i have always read is that slaves are treated really well.
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    Where did you come up with you being enslaved? and who has a right to judge your intentions or heart if you are a Muslim?
    21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    i am not a muslim, i am considering converting, all i was stating is if muslims saw my conversion as a form of surrender i would understand the need for a form of punishement
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    format_quote Originally Posted by hopeful19 View Post
    i am not a muslim, i am considering converting, all i was stating is if muslims saw my conversion as a form of surrender i would understand the need for a form of punishement
    and what I am saying is, no Muslim has a right to judge your conversion.. I mean unless you are actively committing treacherous acts while feigning being a Muslim.
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    i understand, thats sort of what i am saying as well, in my quest for conversion, i would simply tell me story to a muslim preacher and let him judge my conversion since i don;t understand what may or may not constitute feigning
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    format_quote Originally Posted by hopeful19 View Post
    i understand, thats sort of what i am saying as well, in my quest for conversion, i would simply tell me story to a muslim preacher and let him judge my conversion since i don;t understand what may or may not constitute feigning
    Dear member I am telling you that no one (not even a preacher) has a right to judge your conversion, that is between you and God.
    Someone who feigns, is someone actively allaying with the enemy to kill Muslims, or causing 'fitna' tribulations, that is in fact considered worse than war.. what that constitutes is for instance, going to an Islamic region, setting a bomb, and then pinning it on another Muslim group to cause dissent and not because of fact, in that case the truth must be verified by knowledgeable people .. surely you must know instinctively what it means to be a traitor by the virtue of the definition. undermining those of whom you are a part of by deceit and none other!

    peace
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    format_quote Originally Posted by hopeful19 View Post
    i am not a muslim, i am considering converting, all i was stating is if muslims saw my conversion as a form of surrender i would understand the need for a form of punishement
    Quite a few of us on this forum are reverts, some fairly recent. We are as much Muslim as those who have lived their entire life as Muslims and a person who reverts this very second or any time in the future is as much Muslim as every Muslim living today, yesterday or tomorrow. Being Muslim has no concept of when one became Muslim, that is of no importance. A person is either Muslim or not Muslim. No other distinction is needed.
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    Re: 21 year old Converted muslim.. facing a worry...

    dear brother,
    i clearly understand what you are going through as i have gone through the same and have AlhamdulliALAH conqured this habit to 99 percent by Grace of Almighty.I face many difficulties and am still in constant battle with nafs and shaitan but i have few tips that will really help you.
    1.Always remain in wuzu never let wuzu break.
    2.Always recite small salawat.at all times such as Sallah Allah hu alay wa Alahi wasallam.trust me it has helped many a person leave this habit.as you recite salawat then the mercy of Allah descends on you to extinguish the fires of nafs and those of satanic nature as the rehmat of Allah descends on person reciting salawat.make it a habit..its easier then you know...very easy once it becomes a habit.
    3.Please please foresake all frnds...groups ..gatherings that take you to this habit..i know you will become isolated........but its the way its is...i have also had to go through this.find gud muslim frnds or social cirlce around you.
    4.Reduce time spend on internet..go to mosque instead....make plans some halal food place go with brothers...start new sport...pick some tough sport...rugby..football...boxing...this really helps...as when you are looking forward to some match..tournament...you will focus your energy there.
    5.TV is the most useless creation..no doubt the root of many evils...no good use watching it..
    6.Start visiting places of natural beauty..mountains..lakes...gardens...appreciate the beauty of His creations....spend atleast an hour there...
    7.5 times prayers in mosque....quran recitation time fixed everyday...

    well.....this all has really helped me...but its a challenge...i treat it like a battle..between forces of truth and falsehood
    i pray you succeed in this test,Ameen.
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