How do Atheists view the Prophets (messengers of Allah)?

[NYCmuslim]

Peace.

I believe my question was pretty self-explanatory. How do atheists view Abraham, Noah, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad, and the other prophets (peace upon them all)? Do you think they were actual people that walked this earth or are they just myths? Do you believe in the stories that surround them? Do you think that they were sent down for a message and purpose? Im just curious about the subject and would like to know.

Many thanks

[czgibson]

Greetings,

Good question. My thoughts on this might well differ from the thoughts of other atheists.

Did the prophets exist? In my view, there is solid evidence for the existence of Jesus and Muhammad (pbuh), but the others are more questionable, so the answer would have to be 'I don't know'. I suspect it is likely that they did exist, but the evidence seems to be contradictory.

Do I believe the stories about them? Some of them. I believe Jesus was crucified. I believe Muhammad (pbuh) conquered Mecca. I don't believe Noah lived to be 950 years old. I don't believe any of the miracles that the prophets are said to have performed, because I agree with Cicero (I'm quoting from memory here):

Whatever couldn't happen, didn't happen.
Whatever could happen is not a miracle.
Therefore there are no miracles.

I don't believe they were sent for a purpose by god, and I don't believe that they talked with god, for obvious reasons.

I hope that answers your questions.

Peace

[Gator]

Hello, As with what CZ said, you'll find that atheists are all over the map so I'll put my usual caveat that this is just my opinion.

I haven't really researched any of the other prophets besides Jesus. I disagree with CZ that there is firm evidence for Jesus, but my thinking is that a Jesus did exist (you find some atheists who say he didn't). Muhammad is pretty well documented so yeah, he existed. The old testament ones are tough, if they were real, they have been relagated to myth so it doesn't really matter if they were real or a conglomeration of many leader with a bit of storytelling thrown in.

I don't believe the supernatural parts of the stories. The other parts, who knows.

Since there's no god in my opinion, they were not sent down for a reason.

Good question! those are my initial thoughts. Would like to see how the atheist responses differ or are alike to see if anything surprising comes out.

thanks.

[root]

Peace.

I believe my question was pretty self-explanatory. How do atheists view Abraham, Noah, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad, and the other prophets (peace upon them all)? Do you think they were actual people that walked this earth or are they just myths? Do you believe in the stories that surround them?

I think some of them did walk the earth, and others did not. Some stories might be true others are not.

Do you think that they were sent down for a message and purpose?

I believe that they firmly believed that?

[czgibson]

Greetings,

For the record, here is a summary of the literature on the historicity of Jesus. It's possible to draw a number of conclusions from it; in this case I'm with the majority view.

Peace

[Gator]

I disagree with your interpretation of this article. Well off topic so let's drop it.

Thanks.

[czgibson]

Greetings,

I disagree with your interpretation of this article. Well off topic so let's drop it.

Thanks.

Absolutely - I didn't want to start an argument with you. It's just there for people who might be interested to see what the sources are. It might be worth doing the same for the other prophets in the OP.

Peace

[Gator]

True discuss another time and it was a good article.

[Isambard]

I'd Muhammed existed. Jesus is harder because looking at the material of the time, he seems to be a grab-bag of different people/legends mixed into a very common name.

The other ones? Probably, but as metioned, they have been told so many times that its really more myth at this point.

[Trumble]

How do atheists view Abraham, Noah, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad, and the other prophets (peace upon them all)? Do you think they were actual people that walked this earth or are they just myths? Do you believe in the stories that surround them? Do you think that they were sent down for a message and purpose?

Mohammed is the only one who is a definite historical figure. I suspect the others were all real as well (certainly Moses and Jesus if not Abraham and Noah), but how much resemblance the men had to the myths and stories that grew up around them after their deaths - sometimes a very long time after - is probably unknowable now. Maybe they were all spiritual 'seekers' or adepts of some description, maybe political leaders, or most likely a combination of the two.

I personally believe Jesus was an incarnation of a great bodhisattva, destined for Buddhahood, but that incarnation would be the result of karmic cause and effect and even choice rather than being 'sent', there being no entity to do the 'sending'.

[جوري]

I personally believe Jesus was an incarnation of a great bodhisattva, destined for Buddhahood, but that incarnation would be the result of karmic cause and effect and even choice rather than being 'sent', there being no entity to do the 'sending'.

are there enough living bodies for all those 'reincarnates'? Do souls hang around hospitals and grab on to the first baby and enter its body with no prior recollection of past lives but enough ambition to continue on with life? or are they suspended in a different dimension until chance permits for a body to be available at hand? Who chooses the bodies for those to be reincarnated souls? Do they go as they please or is there some 'guiding force' to funnel them to the correct body?

cheers

[ranma1/2]

Peace.

I believe my question was pretty self-explanatory. How do atheists view Abraham, Noah, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad, and the other prophets (peace upon them all)? Do you think they were actual people that walked this earth or are they just myths? Do you believe in the stories that surround them? Do you think that they were sent down for a message and purpose? Im just curious about the subject and would like to know.

Many thanks

Well it varies. Many we see as mythological figures. Muhammad has the best evidence for existing. As for the miracles or other special events. I dont think many atheists believe in them. Did a person that jesus was based on exists. Possibly, same with the others. Do i think they were prophets. No.

[Joe98]

Do you think they were actual people that walked this earth....

Yes

Do you believe in the stories that surround them?

Where the act was in the form of a miracle the answer is "no".

It is likely they did something memorable in history and then afterwards the miraculous stories were made up to impress. It worked!
-

[Trumble]

are there enough living bodies for all those 'reincarnates'? Do souls hang around hospitals and grab on to the first baby and enter its body with no prior recollection of past lives but enough ambition to continue on with life? or are they suspended in a different dimension until chance permits for a body to be available at hand? Who chooses the bodies for those to be reincarnated souls? Do they go as they please or is there some 'guiding force' to funnel them to the correct body?

The Buddhist conception of rebirth does not involve 'souls', least of all immutable ones that need suspending anywhere. No such things exist. If you have a genuine interest in the subject, do a little background reading and I'll try and answer any questions you may have by PM or if you start another thread.. it's way off topic in this one. Might be a few days; I'm off for a long weekend vacation :smile:

[جوري]

The Buddhist conception of rebirth does not involve 'souls', least of all immutable ones that need suspending anywhere. No such things exist. If you have a genuine interest in the subject, do a little background reading and I'll try and answer any questions you may have by PM or if you start another thread.. it's way off topic in this one. Might be a few days; I'm off for a long weekend vacation :smile:

Enjoy your vacation..
No --I can't say I have a genuine interest in Buddhism.. will dig out your old thread on Buddhism and see what exactly gets reincarnated in a rebirth... or what causes Jesus to take a detour to the middle east in the far east' stead!...


cheers

[Pygoscelis]

Peace.

I believe my question was pretty self-explanatory. How do atheists view Abraham, Noah, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad, and the other prophets (peace upon them all)? Do you think they were actual people that walked this earth or are they just myths?

I do not know for sure that Abraham, Noah, Moses, or Jesus existed as people. They could be pure myth. I see them the same as I see King Arthur. Somebody probably did exist with their name or a name like theirs, and perhaps they even did something notable. Then a myth grew around them, merged with other stories about other people and became the figures that we know them as today.

Mohammed is a special case, in that we do know that he existed as a person and I do believe that he endorsed the Quran. I am not convinced, though find it possible, that he came up with it totally by himself. I am definitely not convinced that it has any sort of devine inspiration behind it.

Do you believe in the stories that surround them? Do you think that they were sent down for a message and purpose? Im just curious about the subject and would like to know.

Obviously no to all of these, or I'd not be an atheist. There is nowhere for them to be sent down from.

Most of the mythology around Noah and Jesus especially can be traced back to earlier mythologies largely derived from egyptian, babylonian, and summerian lore. If you are curious about this look up Mithras, Gilgamesh, Osiris, Nebo, and Amen-Ra to get you started.

[nevesirth]

Yes





Where the act was in the form of a miracle the answer is "no".

It is likely they did something memorable in history and then afterwards the miraculous stories were made up to impress. It worked!
-

you dont believe miracles can happen? do you also believe there are no supernatural occurences in this world? or you believe theres a logical explanation for everything

[Pygoscelis]

The "supernatural" is what we call things when we don't have an explanation for them.

Looking back on history we can see many cases where even the brightest scientific minds declared things "devine" and "supernatural" when they were at the limit of their understanding, only to have those very things later explained by others with the advantage of more advanced technology and science.

[nevesirth]

The "supernatural" is what we call things when we don't have an explanation for them.

Looking back on history we can see many cases where even the brightest scientific minds declared things "devine" and "supernatural" when they were at the limit of their understanding, only to have those very things later explained by others with the advantage of more advanced technology and science.

lets wait till the day these scientists will be able to raise the dead or create a human being

[wilberhum]

Peace.

I believe my question was pretty self-explanatory. How do atheists view Abraham, Noah, Moses, Jesus, Muhammad, and the other prophets (peace upon them all)? Do you think they were actual people that walked this earth or are they just myths? Do you believe in the stories that surround them? Do you think that they were sent down for a message and purpose? Im just curious about the subject and would like to know.

Many thanks

As an Agnostic, not an atheist, I have been slow to post.
But since the thread has degraded to Reanimation, I thought, why not.

It is obvious that an atheist is not going to believe in a messenger of Allah.
And would never believe that "they were sent down for a message and purpose".
I don't believe in prophets either.
It also seams obvious that if you conceder Muhammad a prophet, you would become a Muslim.
I have never heard anyone ever question that Muhammad existed.
I think few doubts that Jesus exited.
I have never questioned the existence of any of the above.
As for all the stories. Ya, I think they are stories.
All have been execrated beyond my ability to believe.
Noah may have built a boat and saved his animals from a flood.
But a world flood that wiped out all life that wasn't on his boat is way not possible.
Just to name a few, where did he get the Polar Bears and penguins?

But there is one thing I believe. I believe you believe, and I try to respect that.