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For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

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    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

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    A certain post on this forum prompted this question in mind.

    If you were traveling and you came upon what you knew to be a small pagan shrine made of sticks and stones, assuming noone is around, would you destroy it?

    My thoughts are that if there are many of it's followers around, destroying it outright may make them distance themselves from Islam in anger. So, with the mission of spreading Islam in mind, I would not destroy it.


    Yet if noone was around, I would certainly destroy it. It's presence serves as a misguidance to the people around it. Indeed, non-muslims may gnash their teeth at such an act but I act according to the commands of Allah and not them.

    Of course people would say "what if I did the same to your shrines?" Well, Allah would destroy you in this life or the next, so I wouldnt worry. The little stick and stone idol on the otherhand is powerless.





    What are your thoughts? Muslim brothers and sisters?
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Even Satan believes in Allah.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?




    Surah Anbiya';
    51. And indeed We bestowed aforetime on Ibrâhim (Abraham) his (portion of) guidance, and We were Well-Acquainted with him (as to his Belief in the Oneness of Allâh, etc.).
    52. When he said to his father and his people: "What are these images, to which you are devoted?"
    53. They said:"We found our fathers worshipping them."
    54. He said: "Indeed you and your fathers have been in manifest error."
    55. They said: "Have you brought us the truth, or are you one of those who play about?"
    56. He said: "Nay, your Lord is the Lord of the heavens and the earth, Who created them and of that I am one of the witnesses.
    57. "And by Allâh, I shall plot a plan (to destroy) your idols after you have gone away and turned your backs."
    58. So he broke them to pieces, (all) except the biggest of them, that they might turn to it.
    59. They said: "Who has done this to our âliha (gods)? He must indeed be one of the wrong-doers."
    60. They said: "We heard a young man talking (against) them who is called Ibrâhim (Abraham)."
    61. They said: "Then bring him before the eyes of the people, that they may testify."
    62. They said: "Are you the one who has done this to our gods, O Ibrâhim (Abraham)?"
    63. [Ibrâhim (Abraham)] said: "Nay, this one, the biggest of them (idols) did it. Ask them, if they can speak!"[]
    64. So they turned to themselves and said: "Verily, you are the Zâlimûn (polytheists and wrong-doers)."
    65. Then they turned to themselves (their first thought and said): "Indeed you [Ibrâhim (Abraham)] know well that these (idols) speak not!"
    66. [Ibrâhim (Abraham)] said: "Do you then worship besides Allâh, things that can neither profit you, nor harm you?
    67. "Fie upon you, and upon that which you worship besides Allâh! Have you then no sense?"
    68. They said: "Burn him and help your âliha (gods), if you will be doing."
    69. We (Allâh) said: "O fire! Be you coolness and safety for Ibrâhim (Abraham)!"
    70. And they wanted to harm him, but We made them the worst losers.




    Its funny lol, Ibrahim peace be upon him broke all the idols except the biggest one and placed the axe in his hand. When the people came back, they said 'who broke them?' and he said 'ask the biggest one'.



    lol, then they realised he couldn't talk or see, which disproved their claim of their idols really being gods. But even then they disbelieved.




    But yeah, he was wise.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Islam not only says there is only one God, it also says there is only one way of worship. No wonder ideas like destroying others' places of worship crop up in the Muslim mind.
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    "If you have two loaves of bread, sell one to buy hyacinths, for they will feed your soul." Mohammad

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    I can not reconcile the destroying of another person's property as being justified. My solution would be to buy such a shrine and once it is legally my property, do with it as I find best.
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Herman 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this?


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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    I wouldn't destroy it, assuming no one is around, I don't really know what purpose the shrine has. Don't think me going loco and destroying it would do much good, as I am not informed what is happening there. I'd make a dua for those who are strayed away and ask Allah to take away the ignorace.
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    If only I had checked myself
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    True leaders don't create followers...
    .... They create new leaders.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Woodrow View Post
    I can not reconcile the destroying of another person's property as being justified. My solution would be to buy such a shrine and once it is legally my property, do with it as I find best.
    Same here.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?
    No, unless off course I want to start a war
    format_quote Originally Posted by K.Venugopal View Post
    Islam not only says there is only one God, it also says there is only one way of worship. No wonder ideas like destroying others' places of worship crop up in the Muslim mind.
    Islam and antikarate kid are not synonyms, furthermore, unlike in your country where security forces guard over and escort thugs to destroy other religions places of worship, in Pakistan on the other hand we actually protect Non-Muslim places of worship and have lost many soldiers to death and/or injuries at the hands of terrorists while doing that job

    Protection of Non-Muslims' Places of Worship

    First of all, we would like to make it clear that Islam’s teachings as regard non-Muslims and its keenness on granting them full protection is not confined to the sphere of worship. Rather, Islam’s mercy and great concern for non-Muslims cover all aspects of life. But here we will tackle only the point referred to in your question, revealing the shinning history of Islam with non-Muslims, and how their places of worship are given full protection.

    In this regard, we would like to cite for you the following fatwa issued by the well-known erudite scholar Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi in which he states the following:
    Islam establishes a relationship with the people of different faiths on the basis of tolerance, justice, benevolence, and mercy. The basis of this relationship is Allah’s saying in the Qur’an: [Allah forbids you not, with regard to those who fight you not for (your) Faith nor drive you out of your homes, from dealing kindly and justly with them: for Allah loveth those who are just. Allah only forbids you, with regard to those who fight you for (your) Faith, and drive you out of your homes, and support (others) in driving you out, from turning to them (for friendship and protection). It is such as turn to them (in these circumstances), that do wrong.] (Al-Mumtahinah 60: 8- 9)

    According to the Qur’an, Muslims are required to deal with all people kindly and justly as long as they do not oppose or oppress Muslims or place obstacles in the way of spreading Islam.

    Of non-Muslims, Islam gives special consideration for the People of the Book, that is, Jews and Christians, whether they reside in a Muslim society or not.

    Being a divine religion revealed to guide all mankind, Islam tackles all aspects of man's life, regardless of whether he believes in it or not. That is why we see it granting many rights and privileges to non-Muslim citizens of the Islamic state. Muslims are ordered to show full consideration to this injunction and give due respect to non-Muslims' places of worship, which are part and parcel of their property enjoying full protection in Islam.

    Protection of property:

    The Islamic government is bound to protect the properties of non-Muslims. In his book Al-Kharaj, Abu Yusuf sheds light on the Prophet’s contract with the people of Najran: “Najran and its neighboring area are in the security of Allah, the Almighty, and His Messenger. The property, religions and churches of the inhabitants, as well as properties, whether much or little, are under the protection of the Prophet.”

    `Umar ibn Al-Khattab, in his letter to Abu `Ubaydah ibn Al-Jarrah (may Allah be pleased with them both) wrote: “Prevent Muslims from wronging or causing harm to them (non-Muslims) or taking their property illegally.”

    Freedom of worship:

    This means the freedom to practice any religion or ideology and not to be forced to adopt a certain faith or compelled to convert to Islam. This is based on the verse:

    [Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.] (Al-Baqarah 2: 256)

    Commenting on the verse, the famous exegete Ibn Katheer states: “Don’t force anyone to embrace Islam as it is clear and self-evident in its proofs and realities and does not need to exert force to be accepted.”

    Islam protects the places of worship of non-Muslims, and allows them to observe their religious ceremonies. Allah says:

    [To those against whom war is made, permission is given (to fight), because they are wronged;- and verily, Allah is most powerful for their aid;- (They are) those who have been expelled from their homes in defiance of right,- (for no cause) except that they say, "our Lord is Allah". Did not Allah check one set of people by means of another, there would surely have been pulled down monasteries, churches, synagogues, and mosques, in which the name of Allah is commemorated in abundant measure. Allah will certainly aid those who aid his (cause);- for verily Allah is full of Strength, Exalted in Might, (able to enforce His Will).] (Al-Hajj 22: 39-40)

    In the reign of `Umar ibn Al-Khattab, the religious freedom of the citizens of Ilya (Jerusalem) and the sanctity of their synagogues and places of worship were confirmed: “This is the protection which the slave-servant of Allah, `Umar, the Commander of the Believers, extends to the people of Ilya: The safeguarding of their lives, properties, churches, crosses, and of their entire community. Their churches cannot be occupied, demolished, or damaged, nor are their crosses or anything belonging to them to be touched. They will never be forced to abandon their religion, nor will they be oppressed. None of the Jews will live with them in Ilya….” (At-Tabari, Tarikh, Vol III, p. 609, ed. Dar Al-Ma`arif, Egypt.)

    Khalid Ibn Al-Waleed, in his covenant with the People of `Anat, wrote: “They are allowed to ring the bells at any time of the day or night, except in the time of the Islamic prayer times. They are allowed to bear their crosses in their festivals.” (Abu Yusuf, Al-Kharaj, p. 146)

    Muslims not only allowed non-Muslims to enjoy the freedom of their faith, but also let them follow their way even though some of their practices might conflict with the religion of the majority. Actually, this is the highest degree of tolerance. Muslims tolerated the religious practices of their minorities by not prohibiting even those practices which were contrary to the state ideology.

    History bears witness to the fact that Muslims accepted and applied the Islamic laws to an extent that has no parallel in the history of mankind. The fair and tolerant approach they show to other faiths are no secret.

    Asserting the tolerance of Muslims, Tritton says:

    “Muslim rulers frequently went beyond what was required of them in their relations with non-Muslims. The best example of this is the presence of churches and other (non-Muslim) places of worship in purely Arab (Muslim) cities. Government departments always had Christians and Jewish officials who were sometimes given very sensitive and influential posts. Some non-Muslims thus acquired great wealth. In addition, Muslims were accustomed to sharing with Christian their festivals.” (Khartubali, Hasan Ali, Islam and Ahl Adh-Dhimmah, p. 256)
    Based on Al-Qaradawi’s book Ghayr Al-Muslimeen fil Mujtama` Al-Islami (Non-Muslims in the Islamic Society). trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this? trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this?
    Related Questions
    trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this? trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this? trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this? trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this? trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this? trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this?


    trick 1 - For Muslims: Would you destroy this?
    Allah Almighty knows best.
    Last edited by doorster; 03-06-2009 at 12:52 PM.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Personal thoughts, no.
    'To you your religion, to me mine.'
    We could always try Da'wah you know. Hmmm.
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    I Loves chocolate I does..

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    What will one gain by destroying it?
    Surely waiting for the people who worship it to appear, and educating them about what they're doing, is better than just destroying something they could rebuild right away?
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    alhamdullilah.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by doorster View Post
    No, unless off course I want to start a war
    Islam and antikarate kid are not synonyms
    This coming from a person who insults prospective converts and who cant continue a debate without name calling?



    THis is a hypothetical situation so lets not start ganging up on me. Notice I didnt cite any backup for my opinion meaning these are just musings.
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Even Satan believes in Allah.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by crayon View Post
    What will one gain by destroying it?
    Surely waiting for the people who worship it to appear, and educating them about what they're doing, is better than just destroying something they could rebuild right away?
    Technically you could do both. I would rather see them destroy it with their own hands though.
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Even Satan believes in Allah.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Woodrow View Post
    I can not reconcile the destroying of another person's property as being justified. My solution would be to buy such a shrine and once it is legally my property, do with it as I find best.
    THough we are not Prophets obviously, Prophet Ibrahim pbuh didnt think this way. Arent we supposed to be following their example?
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Even Satan believes in Allah.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Ooo dunno if I could resist getting rid of that filth. Maybe I would knock it down like a snowman or leave it be depends on my mood

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by AntiKarateKid View Post
    THough we are not Prophets obviously, Prophet Ibrahim pbuh didnt think this way. Arent we supposed to be following their example?
    yes thats why Allah(God) sents prophets to earth!

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    honestly speaking


    depends completely on my mood

    i would probably incline towards destroying it


    theres this huge statue on battersea which ive felt liek destroying sooo many times :|
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by AntiKarateKid View Post
    A certain post on this forum prompted this question in mind.

    If you were traveling and you came upon what you knew to be a small pagan shrine made of sticks and stones, assuming noone is around, would you destroy it?

    My thoughts are that if there are many of it's followers around, destroying it outright may make them distance themselves from Islam in anger. So, with the mission of spreading Islam in mind, I would not destroy it.


    Yet if noone was around, I would certainly destroy it. It's presence serves as a misguidance to the people around it. Indeed, non-muslims may gnash their teeth at such an act but I act according to the commands of Allah and not them.

    Of course people would say "what if I did the same to your shrines?" Well, Allah would destroy you in this life or the next, so I wouldnt worry. The little stick and stone idol on the otherhand is powerless.

    What are your thoughts? Muslim brothers and sisters?

    Well it comes to mind that now you would be a criminal act for destroying some one elses property and if discovererd you are considered a criminal and could go to jail.,,, in additon if the person owning the idol could put in a cival claim against you that you caused him loss of property and perhaps sue you for a large sum of money in that you caused him mental suffering and anguish.

    Of course if he was not a muslim he might retaliate against muslims or mosques.....

    I personally belive that one persons religon stops at the point other peoples religon begins and if we dont respect other peoples religon, we should not espect them to respect ours....

    There are small shrines all over south america and if some one did catch you destroying one it would be very unhealthy...

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by AntiKarateKid View Post
    Technically you could do both. I would rather see them destroy it with their own hands though.
    You couldn't really, no.

    I don't think destroying their object of worship is getting off on the right foot with them. You mess with their shrine, they're going to be enraged and get defensive and not even listen to what you have to say.
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    alhamdullilah.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?



    The obligation to remove idols;

    http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/20894/idols



    I don't know whether it applies to when the place has Islamic rule over it, or a general command. Allah knows best.

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by AntiKarateKid View Post
    A certain post on this forum prompted this question in mind.

    If you were traveling and you came upon what you knew to be a small pagan shrine made of sticks and stones, assuming noone is around, would you destroy it?

    My thoughts are that if there are many of it's followers around, destroying it outright may make them distance themselves from Islam in anger. So, with the mission of spreading Islam in mind, I would not destroy it.


    Yet if noone was around, I would certainly destroy it. It's presence serves as a misguidance to the people around it. Indeed, non-muslims may gnash their teeth at such an act but I act according to the commands of Allah and not them.

    Of course people would say "what if I did the same to your shrines?" Well, Allah would destroy you in this life or the next, so I wouldnt worry. The little stick and stone idol on the otherhand is powerless.





    What are your thoughts? Muslim brothers and sisters?


    its the sunnah of the prophets and practice of the sahabah, i would destroy it either way, if they were there i would explain why i was doing it.

    that their idols cannot help themselves, its just clay or wood.
    For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    Abu Abdillah

    Submitting to none but Allah

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    Re: For Muslims: Would you destroy this?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Dawud_uk View Post


    its the sunnah of the prophets and practice of the sahabah, i would destroy it either way, if they were there i would explain why i was doing it.

    that their idols cannot help themselves, its just clay or wood.
    there are many Churches and temples in UK with Icons and Idols housed within them. how many of them have you destroyed thus far?


    Stop it before some moron takes your misguidance as sound Islamic advice and acts upon it
    Last edited by doorster; 03-05-2009 at 10:59 PM.


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