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Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

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    Question Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

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    As Salaam Alaikum my question is is Arab Nationalisam Haram ? Was Pan Arabism/Arab Nationalism founded by Arab Christians ? Is Arab Nationalism Racist and Secular ?

    A Criticism of the Idea of
    Arab Nationalism



    The First Contradiction:

    The Arab nationalist message seems simple and consistent. The Arabs from the
    Gulf to the Atlantic are one people united by the ties of blood, history,
    language, and interests. They ought to be united in one political entity which
    is socially and culturally modern and progressive. This programme can be
    achieved by the Arab nationalists in the face of various imperialist and
    "reactionary' forces of whom the Islamic movement is the most prominent.

    Now, the appeal to ties of blood or the argument from ethnography and race
    has been rather eclipsed by scientific discussions and has largely fallen into
    disrepute after Hitler. Still it is not quite clear how one can speak of a pure
    Arab race after the long process of mingling between the original Arabs of the
    Peninsula and such peoples as the Egyptians, Mesopotamians, Berbers, or Negroes.
    The Arabic phrase 'ties of blood' comes in conveniently to cover the weakness of
    the nationalist views on this matter by its double reference to both race and
    kinship. The latter is usually the meaning which is immediately suggested by
    normal usage and saves the nationalists from getting involved in a losing
    ethnographic debate.

    The invocation of geographic facts is not of much help in advancing the
    nationalist argument. The Gulf-Atlantic axis is a rather arbitrary projection
    which overlooks other areas to which the original Arabs ventured. Moreover, it
    is the 'imperialist' view of the Arab-land which the nationalists now come to
    adopt, rather uncritically in the light of their high-flown anti-imperialist
    slogans. The crucial fact in this regard is that it was Islam that created this
    'grand Arab homeland', as it is called, and which impelled the original Arabs to
    conquer that area and much more besides it to spread its teachings.

    The Arab nationalists perform a sleight of hand in that they arbitrarily
    carve out of the grand Islamic homeland, which was made possible by the Arabs'
    spread of their own religion, a small area--the 'Arab homeland' -- which is then
    separated from the larger body and made to stand against or to take priority of
    allegiance' vis-a-vis it. If we adopt the same secularist stance, for the sake
    of argument, which the nationalists adhere to, we can say that Islam is an
    Arabic cultural and social phenomenon which has been propagated by the Arabs
    throughout a large part of the known world at the time. In this sense, the
    Muslims of the world can be said to have been 'Arabized' by the mere fact of
    embracing Islam.

    The Arab nationalists play the trick of separating a section of the
    'Arabized' (the Muslims) which happens to possess one added feature of
    'Arabism', the language, and place it as an independent entity and identity
    against the rest of Muslims (the 'Arabized' in our sense). It is to be noted
    that they do not include in their nationalism some Arabic-speaking minorities
    while they ignore the vital role that Arabic -- with its script -- plays in the
    languages and culture of the other Muslims.

    The nationalists are indicted of contradiction according to their own secular
    view of Islam as a social growth. For, if it is the 'religion of the Arabs',
    their prize acquisition as well as the main motive for issuing out of their
    limited homeland in Arabia, this religion should be the defining feature of Arab
    nationalism. It is Islam, and not those cultural factors transformed by it
    beyond recognition, such as language or history, that should be set up as the
    emblem and sine qua non of Arab nationalism. Yet, the nationalists are out and
    out secularists who exclude Islam altogether or assign it a servile existence
    within their creed as a vaguely defined 'spiritual factor', a thing which
    negates Islam's own claims.

    This same criticism applies to the nationalists' call about joint interests
    -- presumably economic -- as a unifying factor of the 'Arabs' so ambiguously
    defined. It is to be asked, why shouldn't common interests, of whatever sort,
    exist among the Muslims, as they have always done? Once again we meet with the
    same trick. An arbitrary carving out of a certain section within the general
    Islamic context and its setting up as an independent entity. The keyword here is
    'arbitrary', which strips nationalism from any rational claims and exposes its
    bare ideological bias, which it tries to mask under pretexts of modernity or by
    appeal to similar specious terms.

    The major contradiction in Arab nationalist thinking is seen in its most
    flagrant form in the adoption of certain cultural elements as language, common
    history and heritage, and tradition as defining features of that nationalism,
    while ignoring Islam out of a deep-seated secularist bias.

    Before Islam, the Arabs were living in what may be called their pre-history.
    A warring collection of tribes with various dialects and with none or very
    little of cultural life, especially on the intellectual plane.Islam introduced
    such an unimaginable qualitative change into the life of the Arabs that it would
    hardly be an exaggeration to say that it ' created ' the Arab identity anew.

    The Qurayshi dialect was turned into the richest language in the world and
    one of the most wide-spread. Islam won for that tongue adherents that came from
    non-Arab cultures and it was responsible for turning it into a tool of thought
    and expression in many fields of science and scholarship. It spread it far
    beyond its original home and speakers.

    Similarly, the Arab society was totally transformed in its structures,
    customs, aims, and outlooks by Islam. This religion is a constitutive principle
    of Arab social and intellectual life for the past fourteen centuries, and the
    attempt to posit an 'Arab nationalism' without Islam or in confrontation with it
    is inconceivable if not utterly absurd. At the same time, an Arab nationalism
    that tries to take account of Islam will find itself in an impossible position;
    for the universal claims of Islam and its insistence on full allegiance to its
    tenets, as well as its priority over other attachments, ensure that it rejects
    nationalism as a modern form of ancient tribalism or hamiyyat al-jahiliyyah (the
    fanatical clinging to pre-Islamic loyalties).

    The Arabic language and culture have been made by and contained within Islam
    and not the reverse. Islam has not been a passing and limited stage occurring to
    an otherwise independent and developed history or tradition of Arab culture and
    society that had their own line of growth. The same view applies to Arab
    history, which is Islamic history along with the history of the many peoples
    that accepted Islam.In fact, Islam is the common denominator that ties the life
    and history of a great mass of humanity together. As a total religion, Islam has
    shaped all the aspects of the societies that embraced it and linked them
    together in a vast entity which often found a political expression in the
    caliphate system. A non-clerical creed, Islam does not have a separate, isolated
    history within a church, for instance.

    The strategy adopted by the propagandists of Arab nationalism in view of the
    above state of affairs is as follows: They take certain cultural, social, and
    historical facts or elements and cite them both as factors of 'Arab nationalism'
    and as reasons or arguments supporting that idea. They, however, ignore the
    decisive role played by Islam not only in shaping these elements but in bringing
    them into existence as well, as with regard to culture and history.

    Islam is forgotten and deliberately banished from the consideration of the
    Arab nationalists. It is excluded according to the principle of secularism,
    which is, indeed, the real defining feature of that nationalism. Nevertheless,
    the cultural, social, and historical facts forged by Islam are wrested from it
    and made to stand as supports and features of an Arab nationalism. Moreover, the
    same facts that can in all validity and legitimacy be adduced to substantiate
    the idea of Islamic 'nationalism', unity, or identity are arbitrarily 'stolen'
    from the Islamic framework and forced to become constituents of a secular idea
    that sets aside one group of Muslims----the so-called Arabs---and puts them in
    confrontation with or, at least, in contradiction with the rest of the Muslims
    who, still, share with this separated group the same cultural, social, and
    historical unifying elements.

    This may well be described as an exercise in deception and it continues the
    same misleading attitude noticed earlier of artificially defining and extracting
    an 'Arab' identity from within the Islamic matrix. If a separate Arab identity
    existed, there would not be any problem. But to take the unification and
    identification features forged by Islam and designed for all Muslims and then to
    separate them from Islam, their forming principle, and confine their
    applicability to an ambiguously and arbitrarily defined group of Muslims -- this
    can rightly be called intellectual dishonesty.
    In their much-vaunted slogans about the unity of culture, heritage, customs,
    feeling, outlooks, and hopes, the Arab nationalists use fruits from the tree of
    Islam while disowning the tree. This position, paradoxically enough, is their
    only logical move. For, to recognize the claims and priority of Islam is to
    negate their own existence, their own attempt at breaking Muslim ranks and at
    setting up a higher authority than religion. The Arab nationalists have to deny
    Islam even at the cost of devastating logical inconsistencies. Accepting Islam
    demolishes their own raison d detre. Islam would not allow a higher, or even
    another, locus of allegiance, of authority, or of guidance. It would not
    tolerate a breach of unity among the believers or a limitation of its universal
    message and validity. Hence, it rejects nationalism and is in turn rejected by
    it.


    http://www.**************/al-tawhid/arabnationalism.htm

    Prophet Muhammad's
    Last Sermon
    Date delivered
    : 632 A.C., 9th day of Dhul al
    Hijjah, 10 A.H. in the 'Uranah valley of Mount Arafat.


    All mankind is from Adam and Eve, an Arab
    has no superiority over a non-Arab nor a non-Arab has any superiority over an
    Arab; also a white has no superiority over a black nor a black has any
    superiority over white except by piety and good action.
    Learn that every
    Muslim is a brother to every Muslim and that the Muslims constitute one
    brotherhood. Nothing shall be legitimate to a Muslim which belongs to a fellow
    Muslim unless it was given freely and willingly. Do not, therefore, do injustice
    to yourselves.


    http://www.themodernreligion.com/pro...lastsermon.htm

    (1) Narrated AbuHurayrah: The Prophet
    (peace_be_upon_him) said: Allah, Most High, has removed from you the pride of
    the pre-Islamic period and its boasting in Ancestors. One is only a pious believer or a miserable
    sinner. You are sons of Adam, and Adam came from Dust.
    Let the people cease to boast about their Ancestors. They are merely fuel in Jahannam; or they
    will certainly be of less account with Allah than the beetle which rolls dung
    with its nose. (Book #41,
    Hadith #5097)

    http://www.searchtruth.com/searchHad...earch_word=all
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Are the Palestinians Nationalists because they want the Jews out? Are the Jews Nationalists because they want the Palestinians out? Anti Nationalism is a Zionist ploy to weaken people of the world for the conquest by the most racist ones of all.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Haraam is a dangerous word to use in a situation like this. It implies to we can speak for our Maker. I prefer to say that all nationalism, by its very nature, is unethical.
    Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Peace be to any prophets I may have mentioned above. Praised and exalted be my Maker, if I have mentioned Him. (Come to think of it praise Him anyway.)
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Nationalism is a very bad thing.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Does it do any good? It only separate us as muslims. We dont need that.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    Are the Palestinians Nationalists because they want the Jews out? Are the Jews Nationalists because they want the Palestinians out? Anti Nationalism is a Zionist ploy to weaken people of the world for the conquest by the most racist ones of all.
    If we oppose Zionism, does that not make us anti-nationalists?
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa View Post
    If we oppose Zionism, does that not make us anti-nationalists?
    No that would make you "anti semitic" a "racist" from the Zionists point of view. Zionists are internationalists outside of Israel and nationalists within. They have their finger in every pie in the world but Israel is their sacred land for Jews. Arab Muslim nationalists are the Zionists' worst enemy.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Nobody gives a **** what we'd be from the Zionists' point of view, so care to actually answer the question?

    If we oppose Zionism, does that not make us anti-nationalists?
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    If we oppose Zionism, does that not make us anti-nationalists?

    No, it doesn't. It just makes us against one particular type of nationalism. That doesn't automatically entail rejecting every other type as well.
    Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Peace be to any prophets I may have mentioned above. Praised and exalted be my Maker, if I have mentioned Him. (Come to think of it praise Him anyway.)
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    So nationalism is good when we do it, and evil when they do it?
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa View Post
    Nobody gives a **** what we'd be from the Zionists' point of view, so care to actually answer the question?

    If we oppose Zionism, does that not make us anti-nationalists?
    First rule in the art of war is to know your enemy... tactics, point of view, mindset, weapons etc. The Zionists policy now is "to win the hearts and minds" in real terms to infiltrate, collect intel, terminate resistance, bribe, corrupt and brainwash the simple.

    "No, it doesn't. It just makes us against one particular type of nationalism. That doesn't automatically entail rejecting every other type as well". Good answer I couldn't say it any better.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa View Post
    So nationalism is good when we do it, and evil when they do it?
    Yes good for Arabs in Arab lands but they cannot let pride overtake their reason they must remember that they are small fish in a big pond.
    The USA is internationalist with it's globalization, multi nationalism world police stance but nationalist in that all of it's policies are for "American interests" so doing good or evil does not matter as long as America does well by it.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    For heaven's sake, Karl, I was talking about the terms! What was that, some kind of ridiculous set-up?

    Rejecting Zionism = rejecting one kind of nationalism. This is true.
    That this fact justifies the embracing of any other kind of nationalism = not true.

    Surely you weren't implying such a thing??

    Nationalism is a kinder way of saying "jingoism". It is the philosophy of a man who cares too much about his place in the dunya.
    Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Peace be to any prophets I may have mentioned above. Praised and exalted be my Maker, if I have mentioned Him. (Come to think of it praise Him anyway.)
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    format_quote Originally Posted by IAmZamzam View Post
    For heaven's sake, Karl, I was talking about the terms! What was that, some kind of ridiculous set-up?

    Rejecting Zionism = rejecting one kind of nationalism. This is true.
    That this fact justifies the embracing of any other kind of nationalism = not true.

    Surely you weren't implying such a thing??

    Nationalism is a kinder way of saying "jingoism". It is the philosophy of a man who cares too much about his place in the dunya.
    I think you are thinking of ultra nationalism. The Marxists like to put an evil spin on nationalism because it believes in private enterprize, private property and unity of a nation. It dosesn't have to get ugly but it dosen't matter what system people choose it always does.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    No, I am thinking of nationalism as in...nationalism. No one has gotten to me, brother. In fact the very day I learned the words "nationalism" and "jingoism" for the first time in the fifth grade I was already confused about what the difference between them was, because it seemed to me right then and there that it must be pretty artificial. Nothing that I've seen in the nearly two decades since has ever overturned that verdict; rather, everything has only reinforced it more and more. Actually the same goes for patriotism to a lesser degree. It only makes people think too much of how their countries allegedly stand for universal values, instead of just throwing away this extraneous detail and focusing on those values themselves (remember, they're supposed to be universal. And even if you can somehow avoid falling into the trap of arrogance--which, by the way, is a lot harder than it would seem--you'll still never avoid the fact that what you're doing is growing too attached to something that will not last past Judgment Day. You're getting blinded by the dunya. Your kingdom in heaven is the only land that really matters. (Does that sound to you like something Karl Marx would have taught?)
    Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Peace be to any prophets I may have mentioned above. Praised and exalted be my Maker, if I have mentioned Him. (Come to think of it praise Him anyway.)
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    Yes good for Arabs in Arab lands
    Is, then, Jewish nationalism good for Jews in Jewish lands as well?
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    format_quote Originally Posted by IAmZamzam View Post
    No, I am thinking of nationalism as in...nationalism. No one has gotten to me, brother. In fact the very day I learned the words "nationalism" and "jingoism" for the first time in the fifth grade I was already confused about what the difference between them was, because it seemed to me right then and there that it must be pretty artificial. Nothing that I've seen in the nearly two decades since has ever overturned that verdict; rather, everything has only reinforced it more and more. Actually the same goes for patriotism to a lesser degree. It only makes people think too much of how their countries allegedly stand for universal values, instead of just throwing away this extraneous detail and focusing on those values themselves (remember, they're supposed to be universal. And even if you can somehow avoid falling into the trap of arrogance--which, by the way, is a lot harder than it would seem--you'll still never avoid the fact that what you're doing is growing too attached to something that will not last past Judgment Day. You're getting blinded by the dunya. Your kingdom in heaven is the only land that really matters. (Does that sound to you like something Karl Marx would have taught?)
    I suppose all nations are artificial. Just like a dog urinates to mark his territory, humans do it with the pen and their war machines. Everyone has a nationalist mindset it is the nature of animals, territory and having pride in it and wanting to defend it.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa View Post
    Is, then, Jewish nationalism good for Jews in Jewish lands as well?
    I suppose the problem here is that there are so many tribes and races that call themselves Jews so it gets very complicated as well as different sects of Judaism. The original name for the Jews came from the city of Judah. Jewish ultra nationalism (as they believe all the Gentiles are born to be their slaves) holds their little Israel together at a very high cost internationally, but I think it is doomed to fail. If they had listened to Jesus (PBUH) maybe their destiny would have been better.
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    I suppose all nations are artificial. Just like a dog urinates to mark his territory, humans do it with the pen and their war machines. Everyone has a nationalist mindset it is the nature of animals, territory and having pride in it and wanting to defend it.

    I did not expect you and me to be of one mind on that, Karl. That is a pleasant surprise.
    Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    Peace be to any prophets I may have mentioned above. Praised and exalted be my Maker, if I have mentioned Him. (Come to think of it praise Him anyway.)
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    Amat Allah's Avatar Full Member
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    Re: Is Arab Nationalisam Haram ?

    May Allah unite us all Ameeen arabs or non; still we are one Ummah.
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