Every night I hear the depressing news of suicide bombers murdering innocent civilians. I thought that the following could stop this practise.
A well publicised and televised debate on one question: Do suicide bombers qualify for martyrdom.
The preservation of life is a strong emotional drive. However, it can be over ridden by a higher goal: martyrdom. I thought that the defence of one's family may override this emotional drive, but it does not, for even when trying to protect your family, you still want to live.
I believe that there will be a shortage of candidates for suicide missions if the candidates themselves did not believe that they would be martyrs.
You are probably correct, but who is going to convince them? The average everday Muslim cleric will denounce suicide terrorism as un-Islamic, but the people who are carrying out these attacks aren't listening to those guys. They are brainwashed by the extremist element.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
That is why there needs to be a well publicised debate between some who disagree that they qualify for martyrdom and many of the respected teachers who do believe that they do qualify. The problem is the will do organise such a debate. Who will do it? I am certainly willing to assist.
Excuse my pessimistic thinking (which I am renowned for), but I don't think it can be stopped.
That doesn't, of course, mean that we don't try. What is important is that we make sure that everybody understands that Islam prohibits suicide. And prove it using the verse from the Qur'an. After that, if a person still goes on to do these suicide bombings (often sugarcoated with the term 'martyrom operation'), then that is their prerogative. Our duty, however, will have been done. I would like to quote a friend of mine on this notion:
Always think, i am the horse that carries the rider. It is the rider who will do the presentation, i merely carry him along. That rider is the Message of Islam.
Education, in a nutshell.
Regards
Last edited by Uthman; 04-27-2007 at 06:01 PM.
"I spent thirty years learning manners, and I spent twenty years learning knowledge."
"O you who believe! Eat not up your property among yourselves in vanities: But let there be among you Traffic and Trade by mutual goodwill: Nor kill (or destroy) yourselves: For verily The God has been to most Merciful."
Al Qur'an Sura 4 Nisaa Ayat 93:
"If a man kills a believer intentionally, his recompense is Hell, to abide their in (forever): and the wrath and the curse of The God are upon him, and a dreadful penalty is prepared for him."
Did I say these things? No, The Book of The God did.
If I strap on an Bomb and Blow-up (Destroy) myself. I have Violated that Command not to do so.
If (as is usually the case) I Blow-up (Destroy) myself AND others who are Muslim, MY destination is not "The Garden as a Martyr." The God said it is HELL that is me destination( khaalideena feeha) Forever in it.
I know that some of my Brothers and Sisters would rather listen to their Sheiks, Scholars, Imams, Muftis, Etc. But something has to be realized here:
Many (NOT All- Let me make that clear) of them are the ones who would have me Violate The Order that has been by The God not to Kill Myself and Other Muslims- and then LIE to me about "72 Virgins waiting" for me.
I do not need 72 Virgins in Hell. I need to stay out of Hell. That is part of the purpose of this Test of life on this world.
My "Hadith" is a little shabby, but I know that there is one that basically tells you that however you killed yourself, is how you will do so in Hell. If you drank poison, you will drink poison, if you stabbed yourself you will stab yourself.
Blow-Up Forever (Khaalideen)?
That is what must be drilled into Muslims. Follow Allah, and not Mankind. Post those Ayat everywhere! Until it starts to sink in.
A way to limit suicide bombings is for it to not be rewarded by a "positive" response. Al Quada killed a few hundred people in Spain and the Spanish people voted in a knocked kneed government who capitulated to the death squads.
As long as Suicide bombing is glorified as martyerdom and veiwed as Jihad, it's not only going to be seen as acceptable, but as obligatory. This is how it's presented.
The Arab Dictators actually Pay the familys of suicide bombers more than they would earn in several lifetimes. But they beleive their real reward is from Allah.
Occupation: The term of control of a territory by foreign military forces: Iraq 2003-2005 Liberation:when something or someone is freed: Operation Telic 2003
^Not all suicide bombers think like that. There are actually a few other reasons one chooses to become a suicide bomber, but they're not really thought of.
Al Qur'an Sura 4 Nisaa Ayat 29:
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A rafidah inspired child or youth in Palestine/Israel who is brainwashed/coerced in to blowing up him/herself is going to hell?
why not the terror masters who hide in sewers when israel comes for vengence?
A badly armed soldeir who dives under the enemy tank with a hand grenade is hellbound?
We should be clear about going to hell and martyrdom. A martyr goes to heaven via persecution unto death for their belief.
A suicide bomber may go to heaven as a soldier, but I do not believe that they can qualify as martyrs. I am not talking about suicide bombers who kill innocent people who are not fighting them - that is simply murder.
It would appear that these suicide bombers are being deceived by their teachers, and I am convinced that the most effective way of ending this deception is with an honest debate with these teachers and broadcast to their students. Again, the question is who is willing to debate them.
I wrote a published article on this here if you are interested:
Somehow, the notion of causing oneself to explode into a fiery ball of bone shards, shrapnel, and soft tissue for ones deity is utterly foreign to me.
Do you think they are really doing it for God? Granted, there are some "true" believers out there that actually think they are, but this is all wrapped up in politics. If the leaders of these terrorist organizations actually believed that blowing yourself up was the way to Heaven, they would have done it themselves. The key is to brainwash the young, outcasts, homeless, etc, into accepting this absurd notion of martrydom by suicide. That is how these organizations, who mainly have political objectives, use religion for their own means.
"Imagination was given to man to compensate him for what he is not, and a sense of humor was provided to console him for what he is."
That is why there needs to be a well publicised debate between some who disagree that they qualify for martyrdom and many of the respected teachers who do believe that they do qualify. The problem is the will do organise such a debate. Who will do it? I am certainly willing to assist.
Regards,
Grenville
I wanted this also - the reformation of the Council of Princes and Elders, but there is one problem. The scholars who need to attend this debate on behalf of the support for martyrdom missions (among a thousand other worthy issues), would be arrested the moment they entered the venue. So I asked for a general amnesty to allow them to Assemble, but... it's like talking to a brick wall.
The Ninth Scribe
Last edited by Ninth_Scribe; 04-28-2007 at 08:51 PM.
I really fail to see how certain people think that deliberately killing oneself and civilians will grant them a place in Paradise...
Suicide and killing civilians are both expressly forbidden in Islamic teachings.
Then pehaps you should have a talk with baby killers like Messrs. bush blair types, who create environments where sadrs and moqtadas of this world thrive.
How difficult do you think it is to convince a 16 year old who has nothing/no-one left, to "volunteer"?
Then pehaps you should have a talk with baby killers like Messrs. bush blair types,
Tony Blair hasnt strapped a nail bomb to his chest and blown the snot out of a school. Or indeed a Nursery. Quite simply, he hasnt killed any babys.
I dont have to remind anyone here that the Suicide bombers although following a political agenda do not blow themselves to bits because it's an effective way of killing people.A truck bomb will kill just one person less if the suicidal driver isnt inside, and he can wander off back home and get another truck for tommorows attack.
They do it as a offering of their devotion to Allah.(weather he actually accepts it or not is irrelevant, they beleive he does and the Islamic Terrorists can read for hour after hour scripture which they say supports this.)
The only way for Islam to truely be veiwed as a "religion of peace" is for ordinary Muslims to take their religion back and to move it forward.
Occupation: The term of control of a territory by foreign military forces: Iraq 2003-2005 Liberation:when something or someone is freed: Operation Telic 2003
Your first sentence is a fair one and I can only offer my opinion based upon what we read and witness as to the motivations expressed by these killers. I think you need to examine the motivations of those who explode car bombs in the midst of crowded markets and those who behead their fellow humans to the droning intonation of “Allahu Akbar”.
I would say ideologically, at the root of the conflict and hatreds that cause people to commit these atrocities are the religious perspectives pulsing away. There are many on this board who will seek to define who is, and who is not a “real” Moslem and what “real” Islam is.
I would propose to you, for example, that the 19 highjackers who flew commercial airliners into mega buildings were in fact Moslems and were acting on behalf of an Islamic belief which was to exact retribution on the evil “Great Satan” and was an ideologically sanctioned act of Jihad. I believe that a very large percentage of the Moslem populations’ perception of the West is couched in religious terms and that is, in part, made manifest in our support of Israel. The Moslems hate them and therefore hate us by proxy. This hatred is founded in a religious blood feud dating back centuries.
I'm going to go backwards and try to answer a few.
I would propose to you, for example, that the 19 highjackers who flew commercial airliners into mega buildings were in fact Moslems and were acting on behalf of an Islamic belief which was to exact retribution on the evil “Great Satan” and was an ideologically sanctioned act of Jihad. I believe that a very large percentage of the Moslem populations’ perception of the West is couched in religious terms and that is, in part, made manifest in our support of Israel. The Moslems hate them and therefore hate us by proxy. This hatred is founded in a religious blood feud dating back centuries.
As they had identified themselves as Muslim and there are no witnesses to say that they had committed the sin of shirk, I have to accept them as being Muslim
However, their actions are contradictory to the teachings of Islam.
This next one I have trouble in agreeing with.
a very large percentage of the Moslem populations’ perception of the West is couched in religious terms and that is, in part,
I tend to think you are not aware as to where the majority of the world's Muslim population is. Very few Muslims are anti American, although many are anti American policies. Very many of the world's Muslims are living in Western countries or countries closely aligned with the West. Any perceptions are not the result of any religious teachings for most Muslims.
I would say ideologically, at the root of the conflict and hatreds that cause people to commit these atrocities are the religious perspectives pulsing away. There are many on this board who will seek to define who is, and who is not a “real” Moslem and what “real” Islam is.
As a Muslim I find it very difficult to explain what a Muslim is to a non-Muslim. At the Very minimal a Muslim is any Person who has said the Shahadah or was born of Muslim Parents. A Muslim is simply a person who has chosen to serve the one Monotheistic God(swt) who was revealed through all of the Prophets(PBUT)
Islam is the act of Surrendering to the Will of God(swt) All Islamic teaching is directed with a single goal and that is to live our lives so that all we do, think or say is an act of surrendering to God(swt)
If a person is not acting in a manner that is a an act of servitude to God(swt) they are being unIslamic.
Your first sentence is a fair one and I can only offer my opinion based upon what we read and witness as to the motivations expressed by these killers. I think you need to examine the motivations of those who explode car bombs in the midst of crowded markets and those who behead their fellow humans to the droning intonation of “Allahu Akbar”.
Perhaps the motivation is more related to living in countries that have not seen peace for many decades and the people of those countries have been over run consistantly by foreigners. Areas where all strangers have shown themselves to have come with destructive intent.
Perhaps the motivations are more in terms of wanting freedom. Not much different then our attitudes towards the British in the 18th century.
Someone said to the Prophet, "Pray to God against the idolaters and curse them." The Prophet replied, "I have been sent to show mercy and have not been sent to curse." (Muslim)
Islam is the act of Surrendering to the Will of God(swt) All Islamic teaching is directed with a single goal and that is to live our lives so that all we do, think or say is an act of surrendering to God(swt)
If a person is not acting in a manner that is a an act of servitude to God(swt) they are being unIslamic.
Can one be both a Muslim and unIslamic at the same time?
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