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Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Intercession by Wali ullah (OP)



    format_quote Originally Posted by Musalmaan View Post
    can we discuss intercession through the wali of Allah in some other thread? whether it is permissible or not, is majority of scholars are in the view of its permissibility etc etc?
    Dear Muslamaan! intrecession by whome you re talking about ? By Living Walis or Dead Walis ?
    Please elaborate.
    Thanks
    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

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    format_quote Originally Posted by al-Izaaree View Post
    well i agree with all you brought, Im not against you. but i htink you may have been a little restrictive with regard to wasela

    you see, according to the interpretation of he majoirty of scholars, tawassul meant to "follow the prophet" i.e. the sunnah. I will clarify this inshallah in my next post with other added things to it.


    and lastly, i dont think it is good for yourself to say "best of luck" rather you could say mabrook.

    asalamu alaikum

    I agree with you
    Waseela = Taqarrub Illah = تقرب الى الله
    What can be more effecient mean than following the Holy prophet and that is Ad-Deen (Quran /Sunna)???
    Follow this Ad-Deen and you will get Taqarrub illahi.
    Best of luck (Mabrook)
    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    Ar-Rasa’il Aqeedatu-Ashaabul-Hadeeth fi Tawassul

    Inal-hamdulillah wa salatu wa salamu 'ala ashraafil anbiyaa e wal mursaleen, wa salatu wa salamu ana nabiyeen wa ala aalihi wa sahbihi ajma'een
    Ya ayuu ahlil-ikhwaa wal akhwaat, asalamu alaikum warahmatullahi wa barakatuhu wa maghfirtuhu

    Muqadimah

    Im preparing this risaalah for those wishing to read the creed of the Righteous Imaams of ahlu-sunnati wal-athaar on their positions and statements regarding at-Tawassul.

    In the beginning I have brought the definition of the word "Tawassul" to clarify what is actually being discussed.

    Another point in clarifying the outline of this article is that the requester of this information did not give precedence to the quraanic ayaah and hadeeth on the view of tawassul under the pretext of "throwing our own (the salafee tafseer) opinion into the meaning of tawassul". So in trying to please Allah and appease my brother I have not added the quraanic ayaah or hadeeth in its initial opening like all other books of the Imaams are done, yet I have added them where I have deemed necessary to prove a point

    A. The Discussion on Tawassul

    Of course in this topic one must know the definition of the matter discussed.

    at-Tawassul- this word in the arabic as is referenced repeatedly in the quraan and the hadeeth in the linguistic meaning refers literally to seek the means to draw closer to what one needs and desires.

    Imaam ar-Raazi has stated that "tawassul', as a religious term, entails drawing closer to Allah by performing good deeds" (Mukhtar As-Sihah)

    Haafidh in Katheer said in his tafseer

    "al-Wasilah (root word of tawassul) is the means that one uses to obtain a need. al-Wasilah is also the best grade grade in paradise, the grade of the Messenger of Allah that is his residence in paradise"further stated by Ibn Katheer
    "Oh ye who beleive, do your duty to Allah and fear Him. Seek al-Wasilah to Him"
    Ibn Katheer reported that Ibn abbass had stated that al-Wasilah here means good deeds. This is also the tafseer of the mujtahid Imaams Mujaahid, Abu Wa'il, Hasan al-Basri, Qatadah, as-Suddi, ibn Zayd and others who are all noted Imaams and mufassireen.
    Ibn Katheer added that Qatadah said that the ayaah means "draw closer to Allah by obeying Him and by performing the deeds that please Him", then, Ibn Katheer commented on this that this tafseer by these scholars is unopposed.

    About the Ayah “ Seek Waseelah to Him”, Hanafi scholars said in tafseer "Seek Qurbah of Allah with actions of obedience and leaving sins”

    Abu Layth Samarqandi, one of the big Hanafi scholar said about this Ayah : "Meaning seek Qurbah and Fadeelah with good deeds”

    Imam Abu Su’ood Al ‘Imadi al Hanafi said in his tafseer
    “It is Fa’eelatun with meaning what we do Tawassul with to Allah from actions of obedience and leaving sins”

    Also an-Nassafi mentioned in Madariku Tanzeel that Tawassul as been used to
    “What we do Tawassul with to Allah with actions of good and leaving sins”

    Imam Mahmood Aloosi and his son Nu’man followed him :
    “This is Fa’eelatun with meaning of what one does tawassul with from actions of obedience and leaving sins” and some people took daleel from this ayah to justify istighathah (to call upon others besides Allah) from Saliheen, making them Waeelah between Allah and slaves, and Qasam on Allah for them is to say : “O Allah we do Qasam on you with Fulan that you give us that” and some of them say to the absent or dead from pious slaves of Allah : “ Ya Fulan, invoke Allah that He gives us Rizq this and that”, and they think that it is from chapter of seeking Waseelah, and they tell from the Prophet saw : “ When things are difficult for you, then go to Ahle Quboor or seek help from Ahle Quboor” ( a fabricated narration), and all of this is far from the truth”

    ( Rooh Al Ma’ani v 6 p 124-125, Jala ul Aynayn p 494)

    Imam Haskafi said in Durul Mukhtar, Fasl fil Bay’ :
    “And in Tatar Khaniyah Ma’ziyan lil Muntaqa, from Abu Yussuf from Abu Haneefah : “ One should not invoke Allah except with Himself, and the Du’ah permitted in it and prescribed is what is taken from His Saying : “ And for Allah are beautiful Names, invoke with them” ( A’raf, 180), and this saying is makrooh : : Bi Haqq of Your Prophets or Nabi or Awliyah…”

    Ibn Abideen As Shamee said in explanation of “except with Himself” : “ Meaning with his Dhat, His Sifat and His Names”

    Allamah Rustami Al Hanafi said :
    “Know that in this saying ( of Abu Haneefah) there is restriction to Tawassul of Tawassul Ismi in du’a in Names of Allah and His Sifat. And the condition of these muqalideen is that they leave the saying of their Imam, and follow their desire without knowledge…and our shaykh ( Ar Ribati) Al fadil Al Allamah Al Adeeb, Jami’ Al Ma’qool and Manqool, one of the Afadil Hanafiyah fair refuting Quburiyah, has some Kalam important in istidlal from this saying of Imam Abu Haneefah, and he quoted sayings of Hanafi scholars cutting backs of Quburiyah…” ( Tibyan p 182 of Rustami, see also “Kowakib Ad Duriyah fi tahqeeq Waseelah Shar’iyah” p 125 of Ribati Al Hanafi”

    Mahmood Aloosi Sahib Roohul Ma’ani said about Tawassul of Sahabah :

    “That one seek Du’a, Shafa’ah, so the Tawassul and Tawajuh is in truth with his du’ah and his Shafa’ah, and this is from what is not forbidden, as for what is in language of a lot of people, that meaning is to ask Allah with his dhaat, and do Qasam on him with it, this is subject of dispute, and you have known words on it, and it has been put in Iqsam not legislated the saying of someone : “ O Allah, I ask you with status ( Jahun) of Fulan” because this is not proven from any of the salaf that he invoked like thatAnd Tahqiq of kalam in this topic is that istighathah from creation, and making him a waseelah in meaning of asking for his du’a, there is no doubt for its permissibility, if the one asked is alive, and if the asked is dead or absent, then it is not hidden for the scholar that it is not permissible, and it is from the innovations that none of the Salaf did, and none of the Salaf came with this, while they were most desiring people from creation to do good deeds…and Taj Subki insulted Al Majd ( Ibn Taymiyah), as it is his ‘adat (meaning that it is the usual character of subki to act as a bigot as he is well known for this among the scholars) and said : “ And tawassul is Hassan, and Istighathah with Nabi saw to the Lord, and none from the Salaf or khalaf denied this until Ibn Taymiyah came, and he denied this, and deviated from Sirat Mustaqeem, and innovated…. (Al Aloosi answered ) : “And you know that Du’a Mathoorah from pure Ahle Bayt and others from Aimah, there is not in them Tawassul with his Respected Dhat…the one who claims a text, then he should present it”

    Thus what Mahmud al-aloosi is saying in reply to as-subki is in order for your claim to be repected as "legitimate" then bring forth the claims that allow you to hold such beleifs, otherwise you will forever be rendered in the realm of bida and inacceptence.

    ( Rooh Al Ma’ani v 6 p 126-127 and Jala Ul Aynayn of his son Nu’man Al Aloosi p 497-498)

    And Shukri Aloosi, great son of Mahmood Aloosi said in Ghayatul Amani in refutation of Nabbahani about Tawassul with du’a : “ And this is done with alive, and not dead, and this is tawassul with their du’a and their Shafa’ah, because the alive is sought for that, and for the dead, nothing is sought from him, not du’a nor anything else” ( Ghayatul Amani v 2 p 335)

    For more on Tawassul and other innovations of graves, see the book of Nu’man Al Aloosi Al Hanafi “ Jala ul Aynayn fi Muhakamati baynal Ahmadayn” in which he refutes Ibn Hajar Al Haytami’s attack against ibn Taymiyah, on Tawassul, ibn Arabi, taqleed, Asma wa Sifat, Ismah of Anbiyah and many other attacks of AL Haytami, that Al Aloosi called unjust and leaving ways of scholars by attributing things to ibn Taymiyah he never said.

    Also Ziyaratul Qubur of Al Barkawi Al Hanafi, Majalis ul Abrar of Roomi Al Hanafi, Khazeenatul Asraar translation of Majalis ul Abrar of Subhan Baksh Al Hindi Al Hanafi for refutation of innovated Tawassul that are done on graves of Saliheen, the many books of Shukri Al Aloosi against Yussuf Nabbahani Ash Shazili.


    Now I beleive I shall bring the Indo pak monster on this discussion

    In Faydul Bari, Kitab Jihad, v 3 p 434, al-Alaamah al-Imaam Anwar Shah Kashmiri said

    Chapter : “ One who seeks help with weak and Salihin”
    Know that the tawassul for Salaf was not as it is practiced between us, because when they wanted to do Tawassul with someone, they went to the one they wanted to do tawassul with, also with him, so he makes du’a for them, and they sought help from Allah, making du’a to Him, hoping His answer

    As for the Tawassul with names of Salihin, as it is known in our time, in which the one who is done tawassul with is not aware of our tawassul, rather his being alive is not a condition, and tawassul is only done with mention of their names, thinking they have status in front of Allah, and acceptation, so Allah will not make ( du’a) vain with mention of their names.

    This matter, I do not like to enter it, nor do I claim any prove from Salaf, nor do I make Inkar. Look at Shami for that.

    As for His Saying : “ Seek Waseelah to Him”, this, even if it necessitates seeking of Wasilah, there is no proof for Tawassul with only names, and Ibn Taymiyah went to its forbiddance, and Sahibu Durul Mukhtar enabled it, but he did not give any text from Salaf.: end of Kashmiri’s words

    Anwar Shah Kashmiri also says in Faydul bari, Abwabul Witr v 2 p 379 :

    “Allah we used to do tawassul with our Prophet saw” : There is not in this ( shar’i tawassul mentioned in hadeeth) the Tawassul known, that is done secretly, until he has no perception from basis ( meaning the one who is done tawassul with has no knowledge of that), rather there is in this the Tawassul of Salaf, and it is to come to a man of Satus in front of Allah, and he asks him to invoke Allah…as was done with Abbas, uncle of the Prophet saw, it was Tawassul of mutaakhireen, then why did they need to go to Abbas with them, Tawassul with their Prophet saw after his death was sufficient for them, or with Abbas without his presence, and this kind of things is permissible for mutakhireen, and Hafiz ibn Taymiyah forbade this, and I am doubtful ( mutraddidun) in this, because a text from Imam came in quoting of Qadoori that Iqsam to Allah without His Names is not permissible, and he took from negation of Iqasam negation of Tawassul, and if tawassul is Iqasam, then the case is as said by Ibn Taymiyah, and if it is not Iqsam, it remains permissible.

    As for taking ( daleel) from his saying saw “ You are given Rizq with your weak” then this is not supporting this, because it is not Tawassul, but the meaning is that Allah gives you your rizq with Ri’ayat ( taking care) of weak and Ri’ayah of their being with them, not the Tawassul with toungue : “ Allah give us Rizq with Waseelah of Fulan”…

    End of Kashmiri’s words

    Oh student and seeker of knowledge and truth, how clear it is to understand the truth and from where falsehood departs from it.



    [B]Tawassul as Worship

    The Messenger of Allah (sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam) said:

    “If you ask in prayer then ask only Allah, and if you seek help, seek it only from Allah.” (Reported by Ibnu Abbaas and collected by at-Tirmidhee. See Imam an-Nawawee’s 40 Hadeeth)

    “Du’aa (invoking or calling upon) is worship.” (Sunan Abu Dawood vol.1 p387 no.1474)

    And I (Allah) created not the jinn’s and humans except they should worship Me (Alone). (adh-Dhariyat 51:56)

    Say (O Muhammad sallallaahu alayhi wa sallam): Verily, my Salat (prayer), my sacrifice, my living, and my dying are for Allah, the Lord of the 'Alamin (mankind, jinn’s and all that exists). (al-An'am 6:162)

    Now it must be pointed out for further understanding of the matter that tawassul implies both religious and material. as for the material type, it entails the material means and methods that will help people attain benefit that ALlah has created for them on earth. This type of tawassul is the same for both beleivers and disbeleivers. Example, water is needed to quench thirst, and food is needed to satisfy hunger. So food is the wasilah of hunger and water is the wasilah of thirst.

    As for the religious wasilah, it entails every method that help obtain the religious objectives that ALlah has legislated in His Book or by the tongue of His messenger in the sunnah. This type is exclusive for the beleivers, those who seek to obey Allah's commandments and satisfy the obligations that He has required them to fulfill. This type of wasilah also includes the uttering of the shahadah with sincerity, knowledge, love, and certainty of it (the shahadah). The shahada is a waasilah for the soul to be saved from the hellfire.

    as for the religious wasilah, mankind is by defualt unable and religiously crippled to uncover the knowledge of religious wasilah except throuhg revelation. Hence the Past Imaams of the sunnah have stated that "Everything in the dunya (worldly affairs) is halal (permissible) unless there is a text making it haraam (impermissible), and everything in the ibaadah (Worship) is forbidden unless there is a text allowing it"

    The legal types of tawassul are three

    Tawassul by Allah's names and attributes, tawassul by the righteous and good deeds that one performs, and tawassul by soliciting the du'aa of a righteous, living person.

    Tawassul to Allah by invoking His Most Beutiful of Names and Perfect Attributes is legislated for muslims, according to the Quraan and Sunnah and the consensus of the scholars of Islam throughout the ages.

    The proof for this is that Allah said "And the Most Beautiful Names belong to Allah, so call on Him by them, and leave the company of those who belie or deny His Names"

    As for the legislated tawassul by the righteous, good deeds that one performed, then invoking Allah by the slave's love for the prophet, which is one of the necessary elements of Islam, is included in this type of Wasilah that entails invoking Allah through one's good deeds. Loving and believing in the prophet and following his sunah are the origin of all good deeds.

    Tawassul by asking a righteous living person to perform du'aa on one's behalf is yet another type of tawasul that is allowed. this is among the very known matters like believers asking each other for such an such. There are some hadeeth and actions of the sahaba that prove the validity of this tawassul which ahlu-sunnah is fully in 100 percent agreement with.

    I hope this clarifies the matters

    asalamu alaikum
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah


    Actually asking for Du'aa from the Righteous alive people is not under discussion.That is 100% permissible.
    Many people came to Holy Prophet and asked for "Du'aa".And its permissibility not debatable.Moreover this not "Twassul" is strict sense.
    I am mainly concerned about the sense of Tawassul which is the backbone of "sufism".
    Mabrook.
    (Is this ok ?)
    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    actually it is not "sufism" as you say. it is only practiced by sufis, more particularly, the mystics.

    the backbone of sufism is to purify the heart. it is a science, but in the case of people who call themselves "sufi" they are far removed form the actual science of purifying he heart since the 'sufism' that is known in our times a more of a monoplized sectarian ploys of attaining righteousness.

    tawssaul itself is a fiqhi arguement mentioned in the books of fiqh, that actually reaches the aqeedah of the muslim, hence we have certain imaams making takfeer depending on the persons type of tawassul despite its fiqhi appearence.

    asalamu alaikum
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by al-Izaaree View Post
    actually it is not "sufism" as you say. it is only practiced by sufis, more particularly, the mystics.

    the backbone of sufism is to purify the heart. it is a science, but in the case of people who call themselves "sufi" they are far removed form the actual science of purifying he heart since the 'sufism' that is known in our times a more of a monoplized sectarian ploys of attaining righteousness.

    tawssaul itself is a fiqhi arguement mentioned in the books of fiqh, that actually reaches the aqeedah of the muslim, hence we have certain imaams making takfeer depending on the persons type of tawassul despite its fiqhi appearence.

    asalamu alaikum

    What purifies the Heart is "Al -Islam".Why to give another name ? I cannot understand.Is Sufism more effective than Islam? If both are same then kindly call it as Islam not Sufism.
    Mabrook
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    who is the wali ullah?
    format_quote Originally Posted by MM²™ View Post


    Allah said in His book about the associationist people of Nuh:
    [They said: Do not forsake your gods, do not forsake Wadd, Suwaa', Yaghooth, Ya'ooq, and Nasr.] Qur'an 71/23
    Ibn Abbas and others of the first generations reported about this verse:
    "These "gods" (mentioned in the verse) were a righteous people among the people of Nuh. When they died, the people were devoted to their graves. Later, they made images of them and worshipped them. This was the beginning of idol worship."
    Anas (radiyallaahu ’anhu) related:
    “In times of drought, ’Umar Ibnul-Khattaab (radiyallaahu ’anhu) used to ask ’Abbaas Ibn ’Abdul-Muttalib to pray for rain on their behalf. He himself would say: “O Allaah we used to ask Your Prophet to supplicate on our behalf to You, and You would bless us with rain. Now we ask the uncle of our Prophet to supplicate to You on our behalf, so bless us with rain.” Anas said: So they would be blessed with rain.”
    Related by al-Bukhaaree (no. 1010)

    So why didn’t Umar and the rest of the Companions who were with him, go to the grave of our beloved Prophet (sallallaahu ’alayhi wa sallam); or to the grave of the greatest of the awliyaa Abu Bakr, and make du’aa to them for rain? Why? Because they knew that doing so would constitute Shirk. Why didn't they ask them to make Dua' to Allaah for them, i.e. intercede for them?

    Just thought that was worth pointing out before this topic moves forward.
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by tears4husain View Post
    who is the wali ullah?


    Sorry bro, what do you mean? For example, Abu Bakr is an Awliya of Allaah, no doubt the greatest of them...
    Intercession by Wali ullah

    Do not argue with your Lord on behalf of your soul, rather argue with your soul on behalf of your Lord.” - Dhul-Nun

    "It is the very pursuit of happiness that thwarts happiness." - Victor Frankl
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    bro izaree i thought we was talking about intercession on yawmal qiyamah by the blessed awliyaa of Allah?

    if you need proof for this then i can find it without a doubt?

    but first is this the proof you are asking for or did you think i was talking about intercession whilst on dunya by dead awliyah of Allah?
    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim View Post
    bro izaree i thought we was talking about intercession on yawmal qiyamah by the blessed awliyaa of Allah?

    if you need proof for this then i can find it without a doubt?

    but first is this the proof you are asking for or did you think i was talking about intercession whilst on dunya by dead awliyah of Allah?

    Awlyallah will be intercessors on Yawmul Qiyaamah ( يوم القيامه )???? Really ??
    Mabrook
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by asadxyz View Post

    Awlyallah will be intercessors on Yawmul Qiyaamah ( يوم القيامه )???? Really ??
    Mabrook
    lol yes my brother Alhamdulillah, the pious hafidh of quran will get intercession as will the shuhadaa', Alhamdulillah
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    Thumbs down Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by asadxyz View Post

    What purifies the Heart is "Al -Islam".Why to give another name ? I cannot understand.Is Sufism more effective than Islam? If both are same then kindly call it as Islam not Sufism.
    Mabrook
    No, what purifies the heart is Ihsan. it is just that ihsaan is part of islam. Islam itself does not purify anything. had it been so, there would not have been no such thing as munafiqeen. Yet there were disbeleivers in the guise of islam, thus they are munafiqeen. Islam is the Law required for the beleiver. When i ask you to blend me 20 dollars, islam does not dictate to you that you give it to me, and emaan would make your heart contemplate and only ihsaan would dictate that for you, because on the mere level of islam, then you have the islamic right to say no. And no one could say "your not acting islam' by saying no because you have made no offense against islam. As for thelevel of emaan, then you can have faith by saying no and still have your faith in tact, because saying no, while it is helping your brother, would not remove your emaan, but if you have ihsaan, and then said now, thelevel of your ihsaan is what decreases.

    I said all of that for what to show that
    1. fiqh is what is used for the sciences of the shar'iah
    2. aqeedah is used in the sciences of emaan and
    3. the tazkiyyatu-nafs is what is used for the sciences of ihsaan. This tazkiyaatu-nafs, is (with the same meaning as Ibn taymiyyah, Ibn Abdul-wahhab and others) tassawuf, i.e. sufism. It is not that sufism is one thing and islam is another. if that is thecase then why do we not call fiqh and shariah islam. why call it fiqh, why call it aqeedah.

    Now im in no way defending tassawuf in absolute terms, im just relaying that one must understand from which avenue someone is coming from when they use the word tassawuf or sufism. That is because i come acorss to many who read at one breathe the statement of shaf'i'ee about tassawuf, and then read a monster like Jilaanee or Ibn taymiyyah saying how "tassawuf' is good.


    Ibn Abdul-Haakem said

    bro izaree i thought we was talking about intercession on yawmal qiyamah by the blessed awliyaa of Allah?

    if you need proof for this then i can find it without a doubt?

    but first is this the proof you are asking for or did you think i was talking about intercession whilst on dunya by dead awliyah of Allah?
    You know, now that i think about it, the discussuion deviatd form the topic.

    No, brother, you don't have to worry, shafa'aa is an article of faith, and whoever denies it becomes a heretic just as whoever denies the hawd, the nuzool of isa, the coming of mahdi, the ruyah of he beleivers on allah, etc etc etc.

    Now i didnt think you were talking about that. hoever i do know that the main ingrediant for the issue of tawasssul to the dead is for their desire of shafa'a, so it is very well connected.

    Awlyallah will be intercessors on Yawmul Qiyaamah ( يوم القيامه )???? Really ??
    Mabrook
    yes, by Allah's permission

    asalamu alaikum
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by al-Izaaree View Post
    Originally Posted by asadxyz

    What purifies the Heart is "Al -Islam".Why to give another name ? I cannot understand.Is Sufism more effective than Islam? If both are same then kindly call it as Islam not Sufism
    .

    No, what purifies the heart is Ihsan. it is just that ihsaan is part of islam. Islam itself does not purify anything. had it been so, there would not have been no such thing as munafiqeen. Yet there were disbeleivers in the guise of islam, thus they are munafiqeen.

    On this statement I can only say:

    إِنَّا لِلّهِ وَإِنَّـا إِلَيْهِ رَاجِعونَ
    Islam = اقراربالسان وتصديق بالقلب
    I do not know your definition of "Islam".If you are considering Munafiqeen's apparent "islam" as the real Islam ,then you are highly mistaken.When a muslim talks about Islam ,he is talking about that Islam about which the Holy Quran has said :

    إِنَّ الدِّينَ عِندَ اللّهِ الإِسْلاَمُ

    (3:19) The true religion with Allah is Islam
    الْيَوْمَ أَكْمَلْتُ لَكُمْ دِينَكُمْ وَأَتْمَمْتُ عَلَيْكُمْ نِعْمَتِي وَرَضِيتُ لَكُمُ الإِسْلاَمَ دِينًا

    This day I have perfected for you your religion, and have bestowed upon you My bounty in full measure, and have been pleased to assign for you Islam as your religion. (Follow, then, the lawful and unlawful bounds enjoined upon you.)(5:3)

    وَمَن يَبْتَغِ غَيْرَ الإِسْلاَمِ دِينًا فَلَن يُقْبَلَ مِنْهُ وَهُوَ فِي الآخِرَةِ مِنَ الْخَاسِرِينَ﴿3:85﴾

    (3:85) And whoever seeks a way other than this way a submission (Islam), will find that it will not be accepted from him and in the Life to come he will be among the losers.
    فَمَن يُرِدِ اللّهُ أَن يَهْدِيَهُ يَشْرَحْ صَدْرَهُ لِلإِسْلاَمِ (6:125)
    (6:125) Thus, (it is a fact that) whomsoever Allah wills to guide, He opens his breast for Islam;
    أَفَمَنْ شَرَحَ اللَّهُ صَدْرَهُ لِلْإِسْلَامِ فَهُوَ عَلَى نُورٍ مِنْ رَبِّهِ

    39:22) Now, can the person whose breast Allah has opened for Islam *40 and he is walking in the light shown by his Lord *41 (be like the one who has learnt no lesson from these things)?

    إِذْ قَالَ لَهُ رَبُّهُ أَسْلِمْ قَالَ أَسْلَمْتُ لِرَبِّ الْعَالَمِينَ﴿2:131﴾

    (2:131) When his Lord said to him, "Surrender," *130 he promptly responded, "I have surrendered to the Lord of the Universe (and become a Muslim)
    يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ ادْخُلُواْ فِي السِّلْمِ كَآفَّةً وَلاَ تَتَّبِعُواْ خُطُوَاتِ الشَّيْطَانِ إِنَّهُ لَكُمْ عَدُوٌّ مُّبِينٌ﴿2:208﴾

    (2:208) O Believers, enter completely into Islam *226 and do not follow in" the footsteps of Satan, for he is your avowed enemy

    AN IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT ABOUT YOUR NAME GIVEN BY QURAN (IT IS NEITHER SUFI ,NOT SECT ,X,Y,Z ......) BUT ;
    هُوَ سَمَّاكُمُ الْمُسْلِمينَ

    Allah had called you "Muslims" (22:78)

    I am sure Islam is everyting for a muslim.
    Best of luck
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by al-Izaaree View Post
    No, what purifies the heart is Ihsan. it is just that ihsaan is part of islam. Islam itself does not purify anything. had it been so, there would not have been no such thing as munafiqeen. Yet there were disbeleivers in the guise of islam, thus they are munafiqeen. Islam is the Law required for the beleiver. When i ask you to blend me 20 dollars, islam does not dictate to you that you give it to me, and emaan would make your heart contemplate and only ihsaan would dictate that for you, because on the mere level of islam, then you have the islamic right to say no. And no one could say "your not acting islam' by saying no because you have made no offense against islam. As for thelevel of emaan, then you can have faith by saying no and still have your faith in tact, because saying no, while it is helping your brother, would not remove your emaan, but if you have ihsaan, and then said now, thelevel of your ihsaan is what decreases.

    I said all of that for what to show that
    1. fiqh is what is used for the sciences of the shar'iah
    2. aqeedah is used in the sciences of emaan and
    3. the tazkiyyatu-nafs is what is used for the sciences of ihsaan. This tazkiyaatu-nafs, is (with the same meaning as Ibn taymiyyah, Ibn Abdul-wahhab and others) tassawuf, i.e. sufism. It is not that sufism is one thing and islam is another. if that is thecase then why do we not call fiqh and shariah islam. why call it fiqh, why call it aqeedah.

    Now im in no way defending tassawuf in absolute terms, im just relaying that one must understand from which avenue someone is coming from when they use the word tassawuf or sufism. That is because i come acorss to many who read at one breathe the statement of shaf'i'ee about tassawuf, and then read a monster like Jilaanee or Ibn taymiyyah saying how "tassawuf' is good.


    Ibn Abdul-Haakem said



    You know, now that i think about it, the discussuion deviatd form the topic.

    No, brother, you don't have to worry, shafa'aa is an article of faith, and whoever denies it becomes a heretic just as whoever denies the hawd, the nuzool of isa, the coming of mahdi, the ruyah of he beleivers on allah, etc etc etc.

    Now i didnt think you were talking about that. hoever i do know that the main ingrediant for the issue of tawasssul to the dead is for their desire of shafa'a, so it is very well connected.



    yes, by Allah's permission

    asalamu alaikum
    :bravo:

    quiet surprised. masha'Allaah, very well said, cent% agreed.
    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    The famous hadith found in the widely circulated and read Forty Hadith compiled by Imam Nawawi. It was narrated by 'Umar ibn al-Khattab (radiAllahi anhu), and is found in sahih Muslim;



    "One day we were sitting in the company of the Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, when there appeared before us a man dressed in pure white clothes, his hair extraordinarily black. There were no signs of travel on him. None of us recognized him. He sat with the Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him. Resting his knees against his and the palms of his hands on his thighs,

    he said, 'O Muhammad, tell me about Islam'.

    The Messenger of Allah replied, 'Islam is to testify that there is no god but Allah and that Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah, to establish the prayer, pay the zakat, observe the fast of Ramadan, and perform the pilgrimage to the House if you are able to do so'.


    He said, 'You have spoken the truth,' and we were amazed at him asking and then verifying that he had spoken the truth.

    He then said, 'Inform me about Iman'.

    He replied, 'It is to believe in Allah, His angels, His books, His messengers, the Last Day, and in the divine destiny of both good and evil'.

    He said, 'You have spoken the truth'.

    He then said, 'Tell me about Ihsan'.

    He said, 'It is to worship Allah as if you see Him, for though you do not see Him, surely He sees you'.

    He then said, 'Inform me about the Hour'.

    He replied, 'The one who is asked knows no more than the one who is asking'.
    He said, 'Tell me some of its signs'.

    He said, 'That the slave-girl will give birth to her mistress, and barefoot, destitute shepherds will compete with one another in the building of magnificent buildings'.

    Then he (the questioner) went on his way but I stayed with him (the Prophet) for a long while.

    He said to me, 'Umar, do you know who this questioner was?'

    I replied, 'Allah and His Messenger know best'.

    He said, 'He was Gabriel. He came to instruct you in your religion."

    Intercession by Wali ullah

    Hadith: "The best of my community are my generation, and then those who follow them, and then those who follow them" [related by Imran ibn al-Husayn in Bukhari].

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by asadxyz View Post

    Best of luck
    I hope you read the sahih hadith and don't portray hadith against Qur'an, it reveals yours (series of) ignorance in the matter of tafaqqahu-fid-deen (understanding the deen of Allah). but i hope you'll agree now and wont do jarah(quarrel) with the ppl. of knowledge.
    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by Musalmaan View Post
    I hope you read the sahih hadith and don't portray hadith against Qur'an, it reveals yours (series of) ignorance in the matter of tafaqqahu-fid-deen (understanding the deen of Allah). but i hope you'll agree now and wont do jarah(quarrel) with the ppl. of knowledge.

    Dear why annoyance??

    .Let me know if I have put anything except definition of Islam which the Holy Quran has given.'(None of my own words)
    Can you show my own words which are annoying?

    If you think that Islam does not purify the heart as Izaari has put.I have not objection that is your own faith.
    May God bless all of us.
    Mabrook:
    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by asadxyz View Post

    Dear why annoyance??

    .Let me know if I have put anything except definition of Islam which the Holy Quran has given.'(None of my own words)
    Can you show my own words which are annoying?

    If you think that Islam does not purify the heart as Izaari has put.I have not objection that is your own faith.
    May God bless all of us.
    Mabrook:

    Dear, Quran is Truth but your interpretation is false, and thats the difference you are ignoring with your ignorance. your using the verses of Quran where ever you desire. They Ayah of Quran is Haq but your interpretation and your understanding is false. Those verses is not giving the definition of Islam or is it? ( اقراربالسان وتصديق بالقلب )

    Did you read the Haith-e-Gabriel of Sahih Muslim? now Whose interpretation do we have to accept?

    Do you really know what you're doing? with whom you are coming against?

    Think plz.
    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by Musalmaan View Post
    Dear, Quran is Truth but your interpretation is false, and thats the difference you are ignoring with your ignorance. your using the verses of Quran where ever you desire. They Ayah of Quran is Haq but your interpretation and your understanding is false. Those verses is not giving the definition of Islam or is it? ( اقراربالسان وتصديق بالقلب )

    Think plz.

    Thanks a lot for pointing out that these Quranic ayas are not giving definition of Islam.Then what are those (Quranic Ayas) showing??
    You have not answered this question about what Izaari said :]
    No, what purifies the heart is Ihsan. it is just that ihsaan is part of islam. Islam itself does not purify anything. had it been so, there would not have been no such thing as munafiqeen
    You have also said :
    Did you read the Haith-e-Gabriel of Sahih Muslim? now Whose interpretation do we have to accept?
    My question is how Hadith -e-Gabriel contradict Quran? Where does it say that that "Islam itself does not purify anything".
    Is this not " A big accusation which both of you are putting on the Holy Prophet and Hadith ??

    Al-islam is comprehensive term by itself it encircles all aspects of Aqeeda and actions including all detailed components

    I will appreciate your guidance.
    Thanks
    Last edited by asadxyz; 06-23-2007 at 09:22 AM.
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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    format_quote Originally Posted by asadxyz View Post

    Thanks a lot for pointing out that these Quranic ayas are not giving definition of Islam.Then what are those (Quranic Ayas) showing??
    Thanku also for accepting the truth. For knowing the correct interpretation of those ayah, you can refer to authentic tafsir of Qur'an like Tafsir Ibn Khathir, Ma'ariful Qur'an by Mufti Muhammad Shafi'i r.a. etc.

    format_quote Originally Posted by asadxyz View Post
    You have not answered this question about what Izaari said :]
    I will appreciate your guidance.
    Thanks
    I don't think so izaree had questioned there or that he was replying to ME, but in case, if you want to ask me what Izaari was telling there,
    so i can hardly interpret him that he *meant* to say or what is suppose to know for us is that even munafiqeen say that they are muslim and their religion is islam but they are missing the important aspect of religion Islam know as Iman, which means affirmation and confirmation in the heart. in the heart they still deny the verses of Qur'an or anything which prophet Muhammad sallallahu alihi wa sallam has brought along with him, they deny it, due to this nifaaq in heart they are not muslims. They are known as munafiqeen who even saying that islam their religion they are not beleiving the truth.

    Ihsan is the aspect of Islam which means to strive for excellence in achieving piety. Also known as Tasawwuf/Sufism in the context of various branches of the Islamic sciences that has developed, Tasawwuf is a branch of Islamic knowledge which focuses on the spiritual development of the Muslim. There are verses of Qur'an and Hadith for its importancy, like Hadith-e-Gabriel.

    I hope I answered more now.

    Intercession by Wali ullah

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    Re: Intercession by Wali ullah

    [QUOTE=Musalmaan;775578]

    Ihsan is the aspect of Islam which means to strive for excellence in achieving piety. Also known as Tasawwuf/Sufism in the context of various branches of the Islamic sciences that has developed, Tasawwuf is a branch of Islamic knowledge which focuses on the spiritual development of the Muslim. There are verses of Qur'an and Hadith for its importancy, like Hadith-e-Gabriel.
    Tasawwaf and Sufism are alien terms in Islam.Show me in the Holy Quran or Any Hadith which are narrating these terms.

    No you evaded my question :
    He said :
    B]No, what purifies the heart is Ihsan. it is just that ihsaan is part of islam. Islam itself does not purify anything. had it been so, there would not have been no such thing as munafiqeen [/
    B

    Both of you assumed that Munafqeen's faith is "real Islam".That is not Islam.
    Who told you this? Why do you call their faith as "Islam"?
    Both of you talking about "Islam itself does not purify anything"
    :w
    please be to the point
    Last edited by asadxyz; 06-23-2007 at 09:43 AM.
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