Are we designed to believe in God?

  • Thread starter Thread starter glo
  • Start date Start date
  • Replies Replies 35
  • Views Views 7K
For one; all we ever see is them asking question like are we designed to believe in God.
You make several gross generalisations about westerners.

The lady who asked the question - Glo - is herself very much a believer so I very much doubt she is trying to undermine religion in any way.

She also invited us to 'play nice' in this thread which doesn't seem to be working out, so I think I'll leave it at that.
 
I'm making no generalisations but it's true. The whole society looks down on those whom are religious as backwardly or uncivilised and you see these examples everyday. Where else but the west would a women feel ashamed to admit that she's a virgin? and where else but the west do people feel pressured into mocking religion because it's 'irrational' and 'dangerous'. Only God knows about what's inside everyone's heart I don't see how other people's input can be of any benefit as she previously proclaimed her self to be a christian believer shouldn't she grasy that understanding from the Bible and not from an IslamicBoard. And I'm not mean before you pass a judgement on me and get defensive because I pointed out a few facts you should actual consider their credibility.
 
Sweetie, be careful how you put things. I'm a westerner too. And if anything people here feel pressured not to go against traditional religion (i.e. Christianity)--although it may vary by exact region. People have their problems everywhere. There isn't a single non-godless nation on earth and there never has been. The world is a great big Baskin-Robbins serving thirty-one flavors of sugar-coated distraction from prayer. One kind isn't better or worse than another.

Sigh. I wonder how long it will be before the word "Zionism" finds its way into this somehow....
 
I am not your sweetie!. As a muslim you should use more modest phrases when adressing someone from the opposite gender. I didn't say all westerners are religion haters but I said the vast majority of them do and infact they hate it very much.
 
Forgive me, I sometimes overlook the different connotations or lack of figurative meanings that certain words hold in certain places...

But it's also all too easy for people to forget that saying "the vast majority of this humungous group consisting of hundreds and hundreds of millions of people, of whom I personally know of maybe 0.00001%", does not make what they're doing any less of a stereotype. Human nature is really weird sometimes.

Although accurate statistics are pretty well impossible to keep on matters of what people believe about anything, to the degree that we know what westerners are we know that the vast majority of them are not religion-haters. You can feel free to look that up.
 
Do you always have to do that?. The situation is the same as every where else. You say that I'm making judgements based on my experiences but I'm not. I am pointing out to facts of reality. There is a sense of downgrading religion you can't possibly deny that even if you wanted to. If you want to use political correctness use it on all side and not just one.
 
There's that phrase "politically correct" again.

It's possible that there are a few observations I do make a lot. But that doesn't make me wrong when I make them. Some things need to be said, and often. Now religion (usually just meaning Trinitarian Christianity anyway) does get "downgraded" more than it should in many people's lives over here, that's true, but that isn't the same thing as almost all of them positively hating it.
 
I am not discussing this any further. You can want to believe whatever you want it doesn't concern me at all. You're speaking geographically, I didn't direct this to you personally so why do you have to assign yourself as a lawyer of defence?. I am not participating in this thread any further but I frankly don't understand what any benfit a thread like this could be. If it concerns christianity then maybe these thoughts should be shifted to a Christian forum and not an Islamic one.
 
However, as our understanding of the workings of nature increases, there are fewer events that impress us as significant.
I listened to a radio programme yesterday by Rev David Wilkinson, a Christians minister with a background in astrophysics.

He warned against this 'God of the gap' thinking which reduces the importance and relevance of God every time science makes a new discovery. It can also discourage people from seeking scientific knowledge, because it is seen as a threat to religious belief.

As a scientist his view of God was quite different.
He sees God and his presence in the wonders of the world around us. So asking question about this world and seeking scientific answers to them is not a threat to his faith, but a way of learning more about God's creation and (ultimately) about God himself.
 
Sis Glo that "God of the gaps" thing is so silly and a waste of time IMO as its based on a straw man argument. The atheist assumes that the reason why believers believe is that because they don't understand how nature works. If anything it's the atheists' own "argument of the gaps". They don't understand why people believe so they make up this argument to make sense of it.
 
Nothing happens when I try to click on "add to this user's reputation", Hulk, but just so long as you know that I'm thinking it.
 

I listened to a radio programme yesterday by Rev David Wilkinson, a Christians minister with a background in astrophysics.

He warned against this 'God of the gap' thinking which reduces the importance and relevance of God every time science makes a new discovery. It can also discourage people from seeking scientific knowledge, because it is seen as a threat to religious belief.

As a scientist his view of God was quite different.
He sees God and his presence in the wonders of the world around us. So asking question about this world and seeking scientific answers to them is not a threat to his faith, but a way of learning more about God's creation and (ultimately) about God himself.

That is refreshing and really quite beautiful.
 
If we werent designed to believe, the majority of this world wouldn't have been believers of a Higher power.


:)
 
we were designed to be free, this is the greatest thing God made, free beings, who can refuse Him despite being made in the same time capable of reaching happiness only in faith and love. Without freedom there is no faith, because we would be not the authors of our denial of God.
 
we were designed to be free, this is the greatest thing God made, free beings, who can refuse Him despite being made in the same time capable of reaching happiness only in faith and love. Without freedom there is no faith, because we would be not the authors of our denial of G
Would you mind referencing where in christian religious text is it mentioned that human beings are the greatest creation of God? Would appreciate it.

In Islam the human being is given free will in the sense that he is capable of choosing his choices on his own, however we are supposed to practice ikhtiyar which is to choose the better choice. If we were to choose the bad choice then we are doing injustice to ourselves.

“We have indeed created humankind in the best of molds. Then do We abase him (to be) the lowest of the low,- Except such as believe and do righteous deeds: For they shall have a reward unfailing.”
Quran 95:4-6 (Surat At-Tin, The Fig)

Because of how we were created, we have the capacity to be better than the angels or worse than animals. Angels were created to serve God and are incapable of disobedience. Animals are subjected to their own carnal desires that they are unable to deny themselves from.

We are in between.

God knows best.
 
Last edited:
I have some texts in english from the early christian writings regarding free will, which is what signifies in the christian theology "the image of God"

John of the Ladder
, a sixth century Desert Father, in his spiritual classic The Ladder of Divine Ascent wrote:

Of the rational beings created by Him and honoured with the dignity of free-will, some are His friends, others are His true servants, some are worthless, some are completely estranged from God, and others, though feeble creatures, are His opponents (1991:3).


Justin Martyr and “The Philosopher” wrote:

For the coming into being at first was not in our own power; and in order that we may follow those things which please Him, choosing them by means of the rational faculties He has Himself endowed us with, He both persuades us and leads us to faith (First Apology 10; Ante-Nicene Fathers Vol. I, p. 165).
St. Irenaeus concurs:
This expression of our Lord, "How often would I have gathered thy children together,
and thou wouldest not, (Matthew 23:37) II , set forth the ancient law of human liberty,
because God made man a free agent from the beginning, possessing his own power,
even as he does his own soul, to obey the behests of God voluntarily, and not by
compulsion of God. For there is no coercion with God, but a good will towards us is
present with Him continually. And therefore does He give good counsel to all. In man,
as well as the angels, He has placed the power of choice...so that those who had yielded
obedience might rightly possess the good, given indeed by God, but preserved by
themselves. On, the other hand, they who have not obeyed, shall, with justice, be not
found in possession of the good, and shall receive condign punishment : for God did
kindly bestow on them what was good;... (Against the Heresies, IV, 37, I).


and a fragment from Kallistos Ware, with references to the early texts:

The Creation of Man. "And God said, let us make man according to our image and likeness" (Genesis 1:26). God speaks in the plural: "Let us make man." The creation of man, so the Greek Fathers continually emphasized, was an act of all three persons in the Trinity, and therefore the image and likeness of God must always be thought of as a Trinitarian image and likeness. We shall find that this is a point of vital importance.

Image and Likeness. According to most of the Greek Fathers, the terms image and likeness do not mean exactly the same thing. ‘The expression according to the image,’ wrote John of Damascus, ‘indicates rationality and freedom, while the expression according to the likeness indicates assimilation to God through virtue (On the Orthodox Faith, 2, 12 (P.G. 94, 920B)). The image, or to use the Greek term the icon, of God signifies man’s free will, his reason, his sense of moral responsibility — everything, in short, which marks man out from the animal creation and makes him a person. But the image means more than that. It means that we are God’s ‘offspring’ (Acts 27:28), His kin; it means that between us and Him there is a point of contact, an essential similarity. The gulf between creature and Creator is not impassable, for because we are in God’s image we can know God and have communion with Him. And if a man makes proper use of this faculty for communion with God, then he will become ‘like’ God, he will acquire the divine likeness; in the words of John Damascene, he will be ‘assimilated to God through virtue.’ To acquire the likeness is to be deified, it is to become a ‘second god,’ a ‘god by grace.’ "I said, you are gods, and all of you sons of the Most High" (Psalm 81:6). (In quotations from the Psalms, the numbering of the Septuagint is followed. Some versions of the Bible reckon this Psalm as 82.)


"Man at his first creation was therefore perfect, not so much in an actual as in a potential sense. Endowed with the image from the start, he was called to acquire the likeness by his own efforts (assisted of course by the grace of God). Adam began in a state of innocence and simplicity. ‘He was a child, not yet having his understanding perfected,’ wrote Irenaeus. ‘It was necessary that he should grow and so come to his perfection (Demonstration of the Apostolic Preaching, 12). God set Adam on the right path, but Adam had in front of him a long road to traverse in order to reach his final goal.

This picture of Adam before the fall is somewhat different from that presented by Saint Augustine and generally accepted in the west since his time. According to Augustine, man in Paradise was endowed from the start with all possible wisdom and knowledge: his was a realized, and in no sense potential, perfection. The dynamic conception of Irenaeus clearly fits more easily with modern theories of evolution than does the static conception of Augustine; but both were speaking as theologians, not as scientists, so that in neither case do their views stand or fall with any particular scientific hypothesis.
The west has often associated the image of God with man’s intellect. While many Orthodox have done the same, others would say that since man is a single unified whole, the image of God embraces his entire person, body as well as soul. ‘When God is said to have made man according to His image,’ wrote Gregory Palamas, ‘the word man means neither the soul by itself nor the body by itself, but the two together (P.G. 150, 1361C). The fact that man has a body, so Gregory argued, makes him not lower but higher than the angels. True, the angels are ‘pure’ spirit, whereas man’s nature is ‘mixed’ — material as well as intellectual; but this means that his nature is more complete than the angelic and endowed with richer potentialities. Man is a microcosm, a bridge and point of meeting for the whole of God’s creation."
 

Similar Threads

Back
Top