Australian PM: 'Disarm Hezbollah'

[Geronimo]

^Howard is a bum. Today he was trying to pass a bill for all immigrants to be deported offshore and have their future decided there instead of them coming here directly.

Sounds like sound policy to me. If we could do that with Mexico I'd be all for it

 

[azim]

Azim, I can’t tell if you meant for your posts to be taken seriously or not, sorry.

Thanks
Nimrod

Joke about loose cannon = not seriously.

The rest of the post continuing from "more seriously though" = serious.

 

[wilberhum]

My best guess is that Hezbollah will not unarm and in the near future things will be just like they were last week. I hope I’m wrong, but only time will tell.

 

[nimrod]

Azim, “Remove the source of the problem and the problem goes away”.

What exactly does “Remove the source of the problem” mean?

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[Obi-Wan]

Hezbollah should become part of the official Lebanese army. They should take no action without approval from the Lebanese government.

They most certainly should not disarm. That would leave Lebanon with no capable fighting force. And no useful weapons.

When Armerica gives the Cedar Revolution anti-aircraft missiles, then we'll know that the US supports democracy in the Mid-East.

 

[SirZubair]

Many Australians say he is not credible

TOO MANY australians say he is not credible.

..and New Zealanders too. :Evil:

 

[Zulkiflim]

Zulkifilm, I assume that when you say Israel is a terrorist state, you are not referring to the current conflict between Hezbollah and Israel.

I offer up the fact that Hezbollah isn’t a state, and as such, it enjoys none of the rights given to a state.

Hezbollah is banditry.

You can’t make a silk purse out of a sow’s ear.

Thanks
Nimrod

Salaam,
when did i say Hezbollah is a state?

Pls re read my word carefully...

[PIE]So Israel must be disarmed so that the majority of Palestine and Lebansese can live in peace..[/PIE]

And Inshallah,those that aid and supposrt Israel to murder Lebanese and Palesitnain will be dealth with..

 

[azim]

I said: -

There will be no lasting peace until Israel stops occupying land and acting aggressively. Remove the source of the problem and the problem goes away. It's simple as long as you keep in mind the history of events since Israel's conception.

Azim, “Remove the source of the problem and the problem goes away”.

What exactly does “Remove the source of the problem” mean?

Thanks
Nimrod

The problem = Israel occupying land and acting aggressively.

It's all pretty obvious, including whether my post was serious or not.

 

[wilberhum]

The problem = Israel occupying land and acting aggressively.

By occupying land I assume you mean "Any Land". They should commit mass suicide and eliminate the problem.

 

[azim]

By occupying land I assume you mean "Any Land". They should commit mass suicide and eliminate the problem.

You know in the 1930s Germany, one of the things that the goverment did to demonise Jews is to always take a double-meaning of what was said. A scholar called Tariq Ramadan mentioned this in a lecture once - its something thats happening today to Muslims and that you did just now.

I'm talking about the real issues and real solutions while you (and others) twist and turn whats being said for pointless reasons and do nothing but aggrivate the situation.

Israel currently occupies land in many countries it shares borders with - for example, Lebanon.

It also occupies current terroritory recognised as being Palestinian, and is currently building a 'security-fence' (i.e. neo-Berlin wall) and taking more land with it. The Palestinians live in the most densely populated area on the face of this Earth. Israel is in control of more land then it needs, I'm talking about this land. Since it has never declared its borders then the difference between occupied land and otherwise isn't clear - thats not really my problem.

You're assumption that I'm even hinting that every Jew be killed is not only disgusting, its baseless. Find something better to do with your time.

 

[Keltoi]

You know in the 1930s Germany, one of the things that the goverment did to demonise Jews is to always take a double-meaning of what was said. A scholar called Tariq Ramadan mentioned this in a lecture once - its something thats happening today to Muslims and that you did just now.

I'm talking about the real issues and real solutions while you (and others) twist and turn whats being said for pointless reasons and do nothing but aggrivate the situation.

Israel currently occupies land in many countries it shares borders with - for example, Lebanon.

It also occupies current terroritory recognised as being Palestinian, and is currently building a 'security-fence' (i.e. neo-Berlin wall) and taking more land with it. The Palestinians live in the most densely populated area on the face of this Earth. Israel is in control of more land then it needs, I'm talking about this land. Since it has never declared its borders then the difference between occupied land and otherwise isn't clear - thats not really my problem.

You're assumption that I'm even hinting that every Jew be killed is not only disgusting, its baseless. Find something better to do with your time.

I find the comparison to an Israeli security wall to the Berlin Wall as being exactly what you are lecturing against.

 

[nimrod]

Zulkifilm “So Israel must be disarmed so that the majority of [] Lebanese can live in peace”. [My edit]


Can you explain that?

Azim “The problem = Israel occupying land and acting aggressively”.

I thought Israel had with drawn from Lebanon several years ago?

How EXACTLY was Israel acting “aggressively” towards Hezbollah or Lebanon, before the Israeli soldiers were murdered and kidnapped?

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[nimrod]

Azim, your post makes it sound like the wall being built by Israel, has been done outside of any other events.

I do not want to sound uppity, but your post is an example of why the wall is being built.

Israel is NOT all wrong, and Palestine is not ALL right.

You sound like you are beating Hamas and Hezbollah’s drum.

You may not have intended to come across that way, but you have.

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[wilberhum]

I'm talking about the real issues and real solutions while you (and others) twist and turn whats being said for pointless reasons and do nothing but aggrivate the situation.

Israel currently occupies land in many countries it shares borders with - for example, Lebanon.

It also occupies current terroritory recognised as being Palestinian.

All of these occupations are a result of war. Wars Israel did not start. On both sides of Israel the stated objective is to distroy them. I have total discust for Israel, but I don't see any options for them as long as there distruction is an objective.
Given that objective, what is your solution?

 

[Obi-Wan]

I thought Israel had with drawn from Lebanon several years ago?

How EXACTLY was Israel acting “aggressively” towards Hezbollah or Lebanon, before the Israeli soldiers were murdered and kidnapped?

Israeli war planes overflew Lebanon on a regular basis since they were forced out of Lebanon. (It wasn't simply a withdrawal).

Here's an article:

Lebanon's Army captures Israeli Mossad 'Terrorist Ring'

Last Saturday, the army said it had arrested Mahmoud Rafeh, a 59-year-old Lebanese citizen and retired police officer, for a May 26 car bombing that killed Mahmoud Majzoub, a senior Islamic Jihad official, and his brother in front of their home in the southern city of Sidon. Rafeh "had links to Israeli intelligence," a statement said.

On Tuesday, the army said that Rafeh ( L) had confessed to his role in killing the Majzoub brothers, and to other operations ... including bombings that killed two Hezbollah officials;[...]

Investigators found Israeli computers, cameras, ammunition, military uniforms and forged identity cards in ring members' hideouts ( shown below), it added.

The ring smuggled the booby-trapped door of the Mercedes car that killed the Majzoub brothers from Israel, the army said.

[...] An Nahar newspaper reported that Rafeh had been working for the Mossad since 1994. It said the army found in his house forged Lebanese papers that female Mossad agents used to enter the country as the alleged wives of the ring members.

Israeli intelligence agents stayed at the flat Rafeh had rented in Sidon near the residence of the Majzoub brothers to monitor their movements, the paper said.

Israel also holds many Lebanese and Palestinians prisoner, many of them without trial.

 

[therebbe]

Israel also holds many Lebanese and Palestinians prisoner, many of them without trial.

Oh? Can you provide the transcripts of the trials for the two Israeli soldiers captrued by Hezbollah and the 1 soldier captured by Hamas. I'd like to see how there trials ended up.

Could you also provide the verdict of the West Bank settler that was executed by Hamas. I would like to see where the jury decided to give the settler the death penalty.

 

[nimrod]

Obi-Wan, would you have not done the same thing, had it been your job to protect Israel?

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[Muezzin]

Oh? Can you provide the transcripts of the trials for the two Israeli soldiers captrued by Hezbollah and the 1 soldier captured by Hamas. I'd like to see how there trials ended up.

Could you also provide the verdict of the West Bank settler that was executed by Hamas. I would like to see where the jury decided to give the settler the death penalty.

So are you saying, because Hamas and Hezbollah commit such injustices, it's okay for the Israeli authorities to stoop to their level?

 

[Obi-Wan]

Obi-Wan, would you have not done the same thing, had it been your job to protect Israel?

Thanks
Nimrod

The same as who?
Would I have planted car bombs to protect Israel? No, I wouldn't. Because I know that will only create more hatred of isreal.

Would I have hung on to the Shebaa farms -- which are pretty much useless? No I wouldn't. Because that just gives Hezbollah an angle to legitimise their use of arms.

Would I have refused to help clear Isreali minefields, planted in Lebanon? No. Because these fields will harm Lebanese children farm more than they will harm or obstruct Hezbollah. Thereby creating hate.

Would I have sidelined the Cedar Revolution? No. Because that weakens moderates -- and puts Israel more at risk.

Would I have bombed every part of Lebanon? With the stated intention of punishing innocent people so that they will rise up and do the job Israel cannot do -- IE: disarm Hezbollah. Would I engage in collective punishment of a whole population? You've got to be kidding!

Israel has lost so much because of its recent actions. Do you really think this has made Israel safer? America was even calling on Israel to attack Syria. Thankfully, the Israeli leaders had enough sense of self-preservation to resist this American request. Israel's war with Lebanon was America's signal to Iran. It was for America's benefit -- not Israel's.

What would I have done?
I would have negotiated my way out of Gaza. Strengthening Abbas, instead of sidelining him.

I would negotiated the release of prisoners. I would given the Cedar Revolution victory over Hezbollah instead of making every pro-American politician in the Arab world a pariah in his own state.

I hope Israel has learnt that the use of arms will achieve nothing. But, given what is still happening in Gaza, I have little to justify that hope.