By what right is this still going on?

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just showing what the bush regime is doing in Iraq, i don't see anyone condemning their war crimes?

Remaining silent to such atrocities is a crime as well, maybe not by human law but by God law it is...

So then what would God think of you remaining silent about the atrocities committed by the self proclaimed Muslims that blow up markets and kill innocent people on a daily basis?

I very strongly condemn any war crime, whether it be by my country or a Muslim or a donkey for that matter
 
:sl:
Hmm ok time out for a while, I have some mess to clean up.

Thread will be locked for about 5 minutes.

Ok all done. Please discuss the issues in a respectable manner. Else I will ban 'all joo noobs'
 
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So then what would God think of you remaining silent about the atrocities committed by the self proclaimed Muslims that blow up markets and kill innocent people on a daily basis?

I very strongly condemn any war crime, whether it be by my country or a Muslim or a donkey for that matter

Apparently you have a very very short memory. I"ve proved to you with testimonies, stories,and even pictures of US agents/soldiers undercover doing all that to make the iraqis fight each other. it's an old colonial tactic of divide and conquer. These losers of the world's mighty and high army are getting their butt kicked bad and so they make the muslims right against each other, this way they pick out the fighters and shoot them as said by one of their commanders. But hey, continue watching that trash on your media.

I am not a Christian and I will tell you again that it would be a lie to say that I am a Kuffar (unless of course a Kuffar is someone who doesnt believe in conspiracy theories or agree all of the time with your garbage)


if your not muslim then your kuffar, it's as simple as that.
 
Apparently you have a very very short memory. I"ve proved to you with testimonies, stories,and even pictures of US agents/soldiers undercover doing all that to make the iraqis fight each other. it's an old colonial tactic of divide and conquer. These losers of the world's mighty and high army are getting their butt kicked bad and so they make the muslims right against each other, this way they pick out the fighters and shoot them as said by one of their commanders. But hey, continue watching that trash on your media.

You provide nothing credible, you act as though the "Al-Qaeda groups" do nothing bad or as though they are innocent in all of this, to be frank with you, you are wrong. As far as you call the US troops losers in all of this, well I can only say that a mere 3500 or so of them have been killed, so what does that tell you? The enemy wishes to kill them day and night and averages only 3 a day at most, now how many combatants die per day? Again I will say you evidence is derived from conspiracy sites, opinion articles or biased left wing extremist sites. It is all based not on fact but on opinion and you accept it as fact because it is what you wish to hear, the information has to have a basis to be credible

if your not muslim then your kuffar, it's as simple as that.
I submit to only one God
 
You provide nothing credible, you act as though the "Al-Qaeda groups" do nothing bad or as though they are innocent in all of this, to be frank with you, you are wrong. As far as you call the US troops losers in all of this, well I can only say that a mere 3500 or so of them have been killed, so what does that tell you? The enemy wishes to kill them day and night and averages only 3 a day at most, now how many combatants die per day? Again I will say you evidence is derived from conspiracy sites, opinion articles or biased left wing extremist sites. It is all based not on fact but on opinion and you accept it as fact because it is what you wish to hear, the information has to have a basis to be credible
so you say...

I submit to only one God
That's good, you got one part of the sahaada, just need the 2nd part though.

La ilaha il Allah,
(
There is no god but Allah,)

Muhammad-ur-Rasool-Allah
( and Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah)​
 
i had no idea this has been re-opened, i'l post in my pm here:

Greetings with peace,

firstly i have read your responce and i'd like to apologise, i had no idea you are really trying to find out the truth about islam.

Well as for the rest, the oppression i see and hear about taking place at iraq, palestine, afghanistan, chechnya etc is always covered up. The crying of our brothers and sisters are always falling on death ears, but the news of a single american or israelli troop when injured or killed is howled across the world.

sorry but the bias/propaganda, injustice is too much, i completely agree with islamarama... i dont see how it is allowed to prevail.


if you call this post a lie, or say i have given into propaganda, or think i am biased, then please leave me be. i have looked at both sides, fox cnn etc, i have analysed... my eyes are open as wide as possible....
 
so you say...

That's good, you got one part of the sahaada, just need the 2nd part though.

La ilaha il Allah,
(
There is no god but Allah,)

Muhammad-ur-Rasool-Allah
( and Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah)​

To me there is no doubt the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was a messenger sent to mankind by God
 
To me there is no doubt the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) was a messenger sent to mankind by God

Alhamdulillah.

:D


may Allah send us all guidance, if only you knew how happy i am.

and btw from your pm, it sounds like you are extremely sincere, yes MTAFFI, the quran and sunnah is what islam is, and those who dont act upon them are not acting upon islam.

your also right, it is not black and white, there is wrong on both sides but the ratio of america doing wrong and the muslims doing wrong is like 999-1 (sry to exagerate lol...)


i hope this reaches you in the best state :)
 
Pentagon survey: US Iraq troops 'condone torture'

Friday, 4 May 2007
By Humphrey Hawksley
BBC News, Baghdad

A US survey of battlefield ethics among troops in Iraq has found widespread tolerance for torture in certain circumstances and problems with morale.

The survey, by an army mental health advisory team, sampled more than 1,700 soldiers and marines between August and October 2006.

It examined their views towards torture and the Iraqi civilian population.

A Pentagon official said the survey had looked under every rock and what was found was not always easy to look at.

The Pentagon survey found that less than half the troops in Iraq thought Iraqi civilians should be treated with dignity and respect.

More than a third believed that torture was acceptable if it helped save the life of a fellow soldier or if it helped get information about the insurgents.

About 10% of those surveyed said they had actually mistreated Iraqi civilians by hitting or kicking them, or had damaged their property when it was not necessary to do so.

Troops suffering from anxiety, depression or stress were more likely to engage in unethical behaviour, together with those who had had a colleague wounded or killed in their unit.

Shorten deployments

A key recommendation to emerge was to shorten the tours of duty.

Those deployed longer than six months, or who had been to Iraq several times, were more likely to suffer from mental health problems.

But presently thousands of extra troops are being sent to Iraq as part of an offensive to try to curb the insurgency by October.

Tours are being extended, and units that do go home are being allowed less time to recover before being sent back.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6627055.stm

1/3 of US troops in Iraq 'condone torture': poll

A US survey of battlefield ethics among troops in Iraq has found widespread tolerance for torture in certain circumstances and problems with morale.

The survey, by an army mental health advisory team, sampled more than 1,700 soldiers and marines between August and October 2006.

It examined their views towards torture and the Iraqi civilian population.

A Pentagon official said the survey had looked under every rock and what was found was not always easy to look at.

The Pentagon survey found that less than half the troops in Iraq thought Iraqi civilians should be treated with dignity and respect.

More than a third believed that torture was acceptable if it helped save the life of a fellow soldier or if it helped get information about the insurgents.

About 10% of those surveyed said they had actually mistreated Iraqi civilians by hitting or kicking them, or had damaged their property when it was not necessary to do so.


Troops suffering from anxiety, depression or stress were more likely to engage in unethical behaviour, together with those who had had a colleague wounded or killed in their unit.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6627055.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6627055.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6627055.stm



One in Ten US Occupation Troops Admit Mistreating Civilians

A survey of US combat troops deployed in Iraq has found that one in 10 said they mistreated civilians and more than a third condoned torture to save the life of a comrade, a report said Friday.

The study by an army mental health advisory team found continuing problems with morale and that acute mental health issues were more prevalent among troops with lengthening tours or on their second and third deployment to Iraq.

"They looked under every rock, and what they found was not always easy to look at," said Ward Casscells, the Pentagon's health affairs chief.

For the first time ever, a sampling of soldiers and marines in combat units were questioned on issues of character, and their answers suggested hardened attitudes toward civilians among front line troops:

-- About 10 percent of soldiers surveyed reported mistreating non-combatants or damaging their property when it was not necessary;

-- Less than half of the soldiers and marines would report a team member for unethical behavior;

-- More than a third of all soldiers and marines reported that torture should be allowed to save the life of a fellow soldier or marine.

Major General Gale Pollock, the army's acting surgeon general, sought to make a distinction between soldiers' thoughts about torture and their actions.

"These men and women have been seeing their friends injured and I think that having that thought is normal," she said at a Pentagon press conference.

"But what it speaks to is the leadership that the military is providing, because they're not acting on those thoughts. They're not torturing the people," she said.

The team surveyed 1,320 soldiers and 447 marines between August and October 2006 in Iraq. Although the report was completed in November, it was only released Friday in censored form after its findings began to leak to the press.

The study found that morale among soldiers was worse than among marines, which it said was explained in part by the marines' shorter six month tours.

The team recommended that the army's yearlong tours in Iraq either be shortened, or that soldiers be given 18 to 36 months between deployment to recover.

Instead, the army is moving in the opposite direction, extending tours to 15 months to keep pace with a surge in forces. The army is struggling to allow units a year at home between deployments.

Source: http://www.informationclearinghouse....ticle17647.htm

Insurgents in Iraq are right to try to force US troops out of the country, a former British army commander has said.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/6618075.stm

Gen Sir Michael Rose also told the BBC's Newsnight programme that the US and the UK must "admit defeat" and stop fighting "a hopeless war" in Iraq.
 
...people are not deliberatly killed at random by the west,...

Is that right?

Bomber McNeill, the Faceless Pol Pot of the Sky

Is This Man a Psychopath?


By RICHARD NEVILLE
July 11, 2007

You be the judge. Following his appointment as commander of NATO's forces in Afghanistan earlier this year, U.S. General Dan McNeill devised a daring strategy to defeat the Taliban. He would beat them at their own game.

That's why this week marks an important milestone for General McNeill--"Bomber" to his troops--because his goal has been achieved.

Although mocked by British officers for overuse of air power, McNeill proved its effectiveness within days of taking up his post.

His air strikes hit homes in the Kapisa province north of Kabul, killing nine people from four generations of a local family, including a 6-month-old child. The usual complaints erupted from human rights fanatics and the lily livered Dutch, but McNeil held his ground.

It was the fault of civilians for living in populated areas, explained Lt. Col. David Accetta at the time, areas that can provide a shelter for Taliban on the run.


So homes were "targeted and hit." This was the first clue to the McNeil plan.

Among the corpses found in the mud brick rubble at Kapissa in March, were four women, four children under 5 years old, and an 80-year-old man. The Bomber's tactic was on track.

The gloves were off. Over the next three months, NATO would set out to prove that its air force could kill more civilians than the number achieved by the Taliban.


But it wasn't easy. The British and Dutch were reluctant to accept the mission, fretting about civilian blood. (General McNeil is a veteran of Vietnam).

Some experts spread rumours that the flurry of attacks by US aircraft was "indiscriminate", but that was the point.
Others argued the strategy violated the Geneva provision that parties to conflict shall at all times distinguish between the civilian population and combatants and between civilian objects and military objectives and accordingly shall direct their operations only against military objectives (Article 48, 1977 addition to, Part IV).

However, as the US Attorney General Gonzales had dismissed the Geneva Conventions as quaint, who cared?

PHOTOS STOLEN AT GUNPOINT

McNeil welcomed input from other services.

After the aerial slaughter in Kapisa, a convoy of Marines fleeing an ambush east of Kabul, started shooting wildly at the highway traffic. Their score was 19 civilians dead and 50 wounded. Afterwards, US soldiers confiscated photos of the incident at gun point.

In the past few months civilian injuries and deaths have been reported every few days, although Western sources report the numbers are often exaggerated - Chicago Tribune.

A bizarre kill was achieved on June 12, when US troops destroyed a police checkpoint east of Kabul and called in attack aircraft. Seven Afghani police were killed and four wounded. Shredded and bloodstained police gear littered the crash scene.

"We are here to protect and serve the Afghan government, but the Americans have come to kill us," said Khan Mohammad, a policemen who felt he was under attack by the Taliban.


Six days later, McNeil's jets bombed a compound suspected of housing al-Qaida militants in eastern Afghanistan, netting seven children. President Hamid Karzai condemned foreign forces for careless 'use of extreme force' and for viewing Afghan lives as 'cheap', but this didn't deter the mission.

The following day NATO forces fired a rocket into a building in Pakistan and notched up another tally of civilians - a child, a woman and seven men. Pakistan military spokesman Major General Waheed Arshad said his country demanded an explanation, but no-one was listening. In the body bag stakes, NATO and the Taliban were now neck and neck. A puzzled Ban Ki-Moon, the United Nations Secretary-General, came to Kabul to slow Mc Neill's hand, but it was too late for that.


SWORD AND SHIELD THAT GUARDS AMERICA


NATO planes struck again at the end of June in Hyderabad, in the remote Girishk district, killing numerous villagers, including women children.

"Six houses have been bombed, three of them have been reduced to rubble," a local named Feda Mohammad said, claiming about 100 had been killed or wounded.

"People are still busy bringing out the dead from under the rubble, there are funerals at various places. A local member of parliament, Wali Khan, said "the Taliban were far away from there".

He warned that continued slaughter of civilians will spark revolt against the Afghan government.

Local Police said 25 civilians were killed in air strikes in the same area the week before, including nine women and three young children.

Hamid Karzai said "indiscriminate and unprecise" operations by foreign forces could no longer be tolerated, but his voice was drowned out by this year's Independence Day address delivered by the Secretary of the Air Force Michael W. Wynne and Air Force Chief of Staff Gen. T. Michael Moseley, which urged American Airman to be proud of their calling:"Wherever you are on our nation's 231st birthday, have a safe and enjoyable holiday, and take pride in knowing that you are a member of the finest Air Force the world has ever known! Your service provides the sword and shield that guard our nation, its interests, and ideals throughout the world. On this Independence Day be proud to be an American Airman -- a warrior who has answered our nation's call to fly, fight and win.

And win they did. This weekend it was confirmed that US troops and their NATO allies have out killed more civilians than the insurgents. UN and local rights groups tallied 314 civilians killed by McNeil's forces and 279 killed by the Taliban and associates. Congratulations, Bomber, enjoy your victory.

AUSTRALIAN AIR CREWS ASSISTED

Except of course, it isn't a victory. Every dead civilian recruits 5 more locals for the Taliban. This will provide an excuse for continued US presence in the region and plenty more Afghanis to use as targets.

Even if Bomber McNeill is arrested for war crimes, such insane attacks will continue. It is what the air force does.

That its enemy lacks warplanes only intensifies its savagery.

In bloodless bureaucratic prose, the official site of the US air force reports around 40 sorties each day in Afghanistan (90 in Iraq), which involve the extermination of [suspected] insurgents in tree lines and family compounds.

Example: "July 507: F-15Es hit an enemy mortar position with GBU-38s near Kajaki Dam. The JTAC reported the weapons hit their intended target. The pilots also conducted a show of force to try and flush out any insurgents still in the area aircrews also strafed enemies in a tree line", etc. C-130 crews from Australia assisted in such attacks, despite Canberra's assurance that its mission is one of "restoring infrastructure".

Western commanders say any comparison of casualties caused by Western forces and by the Taliban is unfair because there is a clear moral distinction between accidental deaths from combat operations and deliberate killings of innocents by militants. This is claptrap.

When invading an impoverished land peopled by extended families with interlocking tribal loyalties, the world's mightiest air power has an obligation to proceed with respect and restraint.


Alas, this it failed to do, as it has failed to do in previous wars.

The killings of civilians cannot be excused as regrettable "accidents".

They may not have been intentional, but they arise from a military culture that makes such casualties inevitable. In their hearts, the officers know this. It is why they don't do body counts. It is why in the daily reports of hundreds of bombing raids, you'll never see any mention of death.

Richard Neville has been around a while. He lives in Australia, the land that formed him. In the Sixties he raised hell in London and published Oz.

He can be reached through his very bracing website, http://www.richardneville.com.au/

Source:
http://counterpunch.org/neville07112007.html
 
Islamirama said:
Troops suffering from anxiety, depression or stress were more likely to engage in unethical behaviour, together with those who had had a colleague wounded or killed in their unit.

This seems like the most rational explanation for why they might condone torture. Not because they're all swivel-eyed racist loons.
 
This seems like the most rational explanation for why they might condone torture. Not because they're all swivel-eyed racist loons.
IF you can't stand the heat then stay out of the sun. No on asked them to be there except their dictator.

And i assure you, iraqis don't want their kind of democracy

About 10% of those surveyed said they had actually mistreated Iraqi civilians by hitting or kicking them, or had damaged their property when it was not necessary to do so.


-- About 10 percent of soldiers surveyed reported mistreating non-combatants or damaging their property when it was not necessary;

-- Less than half of the soldiers and marines would report a team member for unethical behavior;

-- More than a third of all soldiers and marines reported that torture should be allowed to save the life of a fellow soldier or marine.

Bottom line is
....US and the UK must "admit defeat" and stop fighting "a hopeless war" in Iraq

Insurgents in Iraq are right to try to force US troops out of the country, a former British army commander has said.
 
oh, terrific! as if pakistan didn't have enough problems. :(
well this should open the eyes of at least some al-qaeda fans in pakistan.

That's all bogus, bro.

1. Al Qaeda in Afghanistan.

2. Al Qaeda in Algeria.

3. Al Qaeda in Morocco.

4. Al Qaeda in Gaza.

5. Al Qaeda in Somalia.

6. Al Qaeda in Lebanon.

7. Al Qaeda in Iraq.

8.Al Qaeda in several European nations.

9. Al Qaeda building it's network in America.

10. Now, Al Qaeda declares war on Iran.

11. And, Al Qaeda declares war on Pakistan.

Al Qaeda sure has one hell of a logistical capability, eh?

They can compete with the PentaCons global reach.

This is all bogus.

Al Qaeda is not on every corner.

It's Just a tool to create mass hysteria to get the people to do the governments bidding.

And now, our head of Homeland Security has a "gut feeling" that there will be a summer attack on America.

Some coincidence, Just before King Cretin is about to bow out in disgrac. He wants one more invasion and destruction of a nation etched on his bed post, "Iran."

What a bunch of crap this is...
 
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Al Qaeda is not on every corner.
is this better?

Terror chief Al Zawhiri publishes a new video calls for attacks on Pakistan.

had you bothered to click on video, you would have heard the terrorist telling Pakistanis to do his murderous work by trying to give them the illusion that their salvation lies in their death an destruction rather than in prayer, good deeds, sabr and strengthening their country.

with friends like that who need kafar Hindus as enemy?
 
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Some coincidence, Just before King Cretin is about to bow out in disgrac. He wants one more invasion and destruction of a nation etched on his bed post, "Iran."

What a bunch of crap this is...
1st I don't wonder why lahnatullahs and other shia scum incite us to go forward into hell by committing suicide.

2nd I think it is because you are preparing for arrival of al-Dajjal (twelfth imaam trapped in a cave)

3rd it is not possible for anyone today present on this earth, to destroy the dajjalic state of Iran. If anything it is going to at least double if not treble in strength and size future by taking parts of Pakistan, most of Iraq parts of other countries to become the biggest evil empire you have ever seen.

It is going to be a bigger danger to Muslims than Both Israel and America are today, (put together).
 
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