Children are born believers in God, academic claims

It means, it is instinctive to believe in a higher power, however the actual tenets of religion can only be established through a parental or guardian unit...

many 16 and even 13 year olds with children, but you should stay in school and finish what you need to have a family by legal respectable means...

all the best
 
It means, it is instinctive to believe in a higher power, however the actual tenets of religion can only be established through a parental or guardian unit...

many 16 and even 13 year olds with children, but you should stay in school and finish what you need to have a family by legal respectable means...

all the best

Yes, I know. A girl in my grade has 3 kids, 2 and 1 on the way, and she is proud that she has that many, I can understand being proud to have a child, but getting pregnant 3 times before your out of highschool isn't exactly planned.

I do not plan on having kids till I am at least 20+
 
You don't have to tell me, I went to catholic school, and half the girls were out pregnant, although I generally was the last to hear about it.. strangely I thought they were catching a strange bug that had them bed ridden for weeks after it caused them undue corpulency :haha:

It was indeed both contagious and a rampant epidemic...
 
Mashallah! Nice find bro. I bet atheists will eat that Doctor alive after reading this! :p

Why? Am I the only one who isn't the least surprised by this?

Children are rational creatures, and of course they will seek explanations of what they experience in order to make sense of the world. It seems fairly obvious that they will hit on what is perhaps the simplest solution first, a puerile (in the literal sense of the word) version of the 'watchmaker' argument. That incorporates God, gods (there's nothing about the 'oneness' of God there), nature spirits, jolly green giants or whatever as possible creative and causative agents.

What is the alternative.. that kids sit down, have a little think about things and come up with Newton's laws and the theory of evolution by natural selection?!
 
You don't have to tell me, I went to catholic school, and half the girls were out pregnant, although I generally was the last to hear about it.. strangely I thought they were catching a strange bug that had them bed ridden for weeks after it caused them undue corpulency :haha:

It was indeed both contagious and a rampant epidemic...

I go to a public school. We are the bad kids of the American society haha
 
Why? Am I the only one who isn't the least surprised by this?

Children are rational creatures, and of course they will seek explanations of what they experience in order to make sense of the world. It seems fairly obvious that they will hit on what is perhaps the simplest solution first, a puerile (in the literal sense of the word) version of the 'watchmaker' argument. That incorporates God, gods (there's nothing about the 'oneness' of God there), nature spirits, jolly green giants or whatever as possible creative and causative agents.

What is the alternative.. that kids sit down, have a little think about things and come up with Newton's laws and the theory of evolution by natural selection?!


Greetings,,

Children may indeed stumble upon basic laws of physics, they might not loan them a name or a formula.. they might indeed figure the shortest distance between two places is a straight, or the two dimensional motion of rigid bodies when playing with a boom rang or that acceleration requires force when they use their water gun and realize it almost out of water...

All that which makes sense to us as human beings indeed goes with our nature even if we don't attach mathematics or scientific jargon with it...
It isn't puerile, it is instinctive, and just like the sense of God is refined and deepened after theological introduction, so are the laws of physics, math and biology.. things that don't make sense to folks are sometimes indeed so because there is very little logic attached to them and require that you instill a non-instinctive belief all the same...
 
"Dr Justin Barrett, a senior researcher at the University of Oxford's Centre for Anthropology and Mind, claims that young people have a predisposition to believe in a supreme being because they assume that everything in the world was created with a purpose."

Folk are religious because they make unfounded assumptions about nature... who would have guessed?

On a more serious note, what sort of answer are researchers expecting when they ask a 6 year old a question like "why did the first birds exist?"?

Perhaps: "Actually Dr Barrett I don't presume to know what the answer is or even if it a valid line of enquiry. These leading questions probably reveal more about your Christian beliefs than my own worldview. Can I haz sweetie now pleeeez?"
 
"Dr Justin Barrett, a senior researcher at the University of Oxford's Centre for Anthropology and Mind, claims that young people have a predisposition to believe in a supreme being because they assume that everything in the world was created with a purpose."

Folk are religious because they make unfounded assumptions about nature... who would have guessed?
Exactly what is unfounded in observing the natural world and asking questions?
On a more serious note, what sort of answer are researchers expecting when they ask a 6 year old a question like "why did the first birds exist?"?
They are expecting the atheist response, that children are atheists until their care takers indoctrinate them of course, at least that is what many of you allege!
Perhaps: "Actually Dr Barrett I don't presume to know what the answer is or even if it a valid line of enquiry. These leading questions probably reveal more about your Christian beliefs than my own worldview. Can I haz sweetie now pleeeez?"
I take it, you have inside details to what went on in the research?

all the best
 
this is not really what the article says, what it says is that children look for purpose in everything and can't grasp things like coincidence and may think a person is behind it.

what?! are you sure your reading the same article, let me quote him for you:

"The preponderance of scientific evidence for the past 10 years or so has shown that a lot more seems to be built into the natural development of children's minds than we once thought, including a predisposition to see the natural world as designed and purposeful and that some kind of intelligent being is behind that purpose," he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme."

he doesnt say they MAY THINK there is something behind it, and he doesnt say they CANT GRASP COINCIDENCES, rather he clearly says they do see an inteligent being behind the purpose, not that they think there is one or bla bla.

and did you forget this one:

"If we threw a handful on an island and they raised themselves I think they would believe in God."

lol that doesnt sound like ANYTHING of what you said, your taking this guys statement and twisting them beyond bad, face the facts of what he said and just deal with it, no need to blatantly distort it to say something completely different.
 
Believing in God is the nature of the human being. (with studies as proof!)

Asalam alaikum warahmatulah Wabarakatuh


Believing in God is the nature [fitrah] of the human being.



The Prophet (peace be upon him) also informs us: "Every child is born upon the natural way. It is then his parents who turn him into a Jew, a Christian, or a Zoroastrian." [Sahîh al-Bukhârî (1296)]



Everything has a logical purpose

Everything in this universe follows certain sets of rules, which we can comprehend and understand. If these laws run according to logical rules, then it is most likely that something has been co-ordinated this set way in order for these laws to have been established in the first place. If these set laws are not established in the beginning, then how can co-ordination form from chaos? This is extremely unlikely. Logically speaking, order is put into motion by one who controls and directs. This is how the human nature understands the universe we live in. Someone might argue that it is due to our perception - that we logically try to percieve things in order, so they are in order only due to our minds placing them within that sequencing - however, it is because they are within this order that we are able to percieve the control that we see.

If one was to argue against this - then they are saying that the logical came out of the illogical, something which the human mind cannot really comprehend, prove, or even agree to naturally. Anyone can say we evolved to only accept control as a perception, but the reality is still otherwise - in the universe we live - where the Planet Earth was in the exact location to allow life to survive and remain protected within it for millions of years. People cannot explain why the planet earth came in this location to allow life to remain within it, however due to the extremely low probability of the earth being in the exact place to achieve this purpose without control - the human nature is more likely to agree that there was some form of intervention, to allow it to to be in the exact location to support life, and to provide for the different species for a long time period. That is what the human nature agrees to, to understand that every living and non living thing has achieved something for a purpose. Survival in of itself is not a purpose, although it may be a means for achieving something.



The probabilities of 'Coincidences' is - in most cases - lower than Impossibility


A good example of this is given when certain chemical reactions take place, we know that they can take place to produce certain products. However, some form of control is required to react these substances together to produce the outcome. Someone may argue that it is possible for certain events to occur through natural means, and that is true - however - these are extremely limited. So the person may reply that over millions of years, natural occurences, and trial and error - useful products are produced. However, the weakness in these arguments is that the probability of such events - especially of trial and error - occuring are extremely low, and in many cases - statistically impossible (a probability smaller than 1 in 10 (to the power) 50 [50 zeros after it] is statistically considered to have a "zero" probability of occurring, and most of these cases require a higher probability than this number.) This then, logically speaking, makes certain events impossible, except through control and some form of intervention from someone with Knowledge, and Ability to do so.





2 Equally Competitive but Conflicting theories are Present - the Simplest is most likely true



According to the Ockham's Razor Principle, if there are two conflicting theories of equal value, then the simplest of the 2 theories is most likely to be true. In this case - the universe - being controlled to produce and sustain life is the simpler of the 2 theories, therefore more likely. For example, we see;
Pro creation by anthropic theory: When considering the complex way the rules of physics manifest themselves in both physiology and cosmology it seems obvious that the slightest change in any factor of physics or any change in the nature of the universe would have made life impossible:

“If the rate of expansion one second after the 'Big Bang' had been smaller by even one part in a hundred thousand million million (0,000000000000001%), the universe would have recollapsed. The odds against a universe like ours emerging out of something like the Big Bang are enormous”. (Stephen Hawking, 'A Brief History of Time: From the Big Bang to Black Holes', Page 128).

“If gravity (released by the Big Bang) had been stronger or weaker by even one part in ten thousand million million million million million million (0,00000000000000000000000000000000000001%) then life sustaining stars like the sun could not exist. This would most likely make life impossible.” (Brandon Carter, ‘New Physics’ Page 187).


So we see that the complex rules of the physics of the universe - even if they were altered slightly, would make life impossible to exist within this universe. It all started with a design of life; then the universe was custom made in order for such life to exist. Such a well balanced universe and complicated creatures cannot be the result of mere luck. This order suggests creation.




Moving on...


Claim that: Children - without being taught - have a Predisposition to believe in Supreme Being who created with a Purpose.


Dr Justin Barrett, a senior researcher at the University of Oxford's Centre for Anthropology and Mind, claims that young people have a predisposition to believe in a supreme being because they assume that everything in the world was created with a purpose.

He says that young children have faith even when they have not been taught about it by family or at school, and argues that even those raised alone on a desert island would come to believe in God.

"The preponderance of scientific evidence for the past 10 years or so has shown that a lot more seems to be built into the natural development of children's minds than we once thought, including a predisposition to see the natural world as designed and purposeful and that some kind of intelligent being is behind that purpose," he told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.

"If we threw a handful on an island and they raised themselves I think they would believe in God."

In a lecture to be given at the University of Cambridge's Faraday Institute on Tuesday, Dr Barrett will cite psychological experiments carried out on children that he says show they instinctively believe that almost everything has been designed with a specific purpose.

In one study, six and seven-year-olds who were asked why the first bird existed replied "to make nice music" and "because it makes the world look nice".

Another experiment on 12-month-old babies suggested that they were surprised by a film in which a rolling ball apparently created a neat stack of blocks from a disordered heap.


Dr Barrett said there is evidence that even by the age of four, children understand that although some objects are made by humans, the natural world is different.

He added that this means children are more likely to believe in creationism rather than evolution, despite what they may be told by parents or teachers.

Dr Barrett claimed anthropologists have found that in some cultures children believe in God even when religious teachings are withheld from them.

"Children's normally and naturally developing minds make them prone to believe in divine creation and intelligent design. In contrast, evolution is unnatural for human minds; relatively difficult to believe."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/religion/3512686/Children-are-born-believers-in-God-academic-claims.html



We see from the above study that the human nature accepts and believes that everything has a purpose, i.e. "to make nice music", "it makes the world look nice".



Conclusion


So we see that it is in agreement with human nature to accept that everything is done with a purpose, along with control and order of one with knowledge and power. This is what the mind accepts and is at ease with, this is the simplest and most plausible of the two competitors (chance vs control), this is the human nature.​
 
Exactly what is unfounded in observing the natural world and asking questions?
That's not what I or the report said.
"because they assume that everything in the world was created"
"make unfounded assumptions about nature"
They are expecting the atheist response, that children are atheists until their care takers indoctrinate them of course, at least that is what many of you allege!
I take it, you have inside details to what went on in the research?
What I meant was that it's hardly reasonable to expect a 6 year old to do anything but attempt to answer the question in a straightforward manner regardless of whether the question is simple, vague, leading or nonsensical; you could probably get whatever answer you wanted by asking the right questions.

"Another experiment on 12-month-old babies suggested that they were surprised by a film in which a rolling ball apparently created a neat stack of blocks from a disordered heap."
What does that really tell us beyond what we already know? People are usually surprised by things which are counterintuitive. The majority of adults I know are surprised by quantum tunnelling.
 
That's not what I or the report said.
"because they assume that everything in the world was created"
"make unfounded assumptions about nature"
What you said has no bearing on the research, it is your own opinion, what we can safely conclude from the report is that it is instinctive to believe in God, the point is no formal schooling at home or else where wouldn't breed little atheists if let be to their devices, rather breeds deists!

What I meant was that it's hardly reasonable to expect a 6 year old to do anything but attempt to answer the question in a straightforward manner regardless of whether the question is simple, vague, leading or nonsensical; you could probably get whatever answer you wanted by asking the right questions.

"Another experiment on 12-month-old babies suggested that they were surprised by a film in which a rolling ball apparently created a neat stack of blocks from a disordered heap."
What does that really tell us beyond what we already know? People are usually surprised by things which are counterintuitive. The majority of adults I know are surprised by quantum tunnelling.
Rather what you meant is that you didn't like the subject matter of the report, so you'd either bring in outside rubrics whether on children or adults that have positively no relevance to this one or dismiss it as a series of leading questions when in fact you weren't there to see how the research was conducted. People don't usually like research that is out to prove their basic beliefs incorrect, especially when science becomes the religion they look to for answers and then find that it directs them else where... this research proved the basic instincts in children like the moro, rooting, galant or palmar grasp.. to have them is instinctive and normal, to not have them is not, and unlike where most atheists contend that children would not be diests were it not for early indoctrination, in comes what proves otherwise and that appears from the response here extremely unsettling!

all the best
 
Greetings,

Does Dr. Justin Barrett's research suggest that creationism is essentially a childish belief?

Peace
 
Greetings,

Does Dr. Justin Barrett's research suggest that creationism is essentially a childish belief?

Peace


you have read the same article as the rest of us? even if you skimmed through it the title would have sufficed you as 'Children are born believers in God' not 'creationism is essentially a childish belief?' or 'atheists are psychoneurotic and delusional adults'

all the best
 
Greetings,

Does Dr. Justin Barrett's research suggest that creationism is essentially a childish belief?

Peace

As much as the fact that troubled people often lose faith makes atheism the position of the mentally disturbed.
 
What you said has no bearing on the research, it is your own opinion, what we can safely conclude from the report is that it is instinctive to believe in God, the point is no formal schooling at home or else where wouldn't breed little atheists if let be to their devices, rather breeds deists!
I wouldn't go so far as to say that attributing purpose to things is the same as instinctively believing in God.
Rather what you meant is that you didn't like the subject matter of the report, so you'd either bring in outside rubrics whether on children or adults that have positively no relevance to this one or dismiss it as a series of leading questions when in fact you weren't there to see how the research was conducted.
I'm going by what was posted. If those quotes aren't representative of the research as a whole then they just picked some really bad examples for the press release.

Of course it's no secret I don't like the subject matter of the report, I'm not hiding anything and it would be quite obvious if I were.
People don't usually like research that is out to prove their basic beliefs incorrect, especially when science becomes the religion they look to for answers and then find that it directs them else where...
It wouldn't make any difference to me either way, I'm quite flexible. That which can be shown to be true is fine by me.

My qualms are with the apparently loaded questions asked by an interviewer whose Christian leanings are fairly apparent.
this research proved the basic instincts in children like the moro, rooting, galant or palmar grasp.. to have them is instinctive and normal, to not have them is not, and unlike where most atheists contend that children would not be diests were it not for early indoctrination, in comes what proves otherwise and that appears from the response here extremely unsettling!
I'm not sure how the atheists of the world will react to you being instated as their chief spokesperson, but that's by the by.

The outcome described in this report seems perfectly reasonable to me, attributing purpose to events and objects without any solid grounding is something that almost everyone does.
What I don't understand is why the theists here are all rubbing their hands together with glee, unless it is the case that something which is intuitive is accordingly true.
 
I wouldn't go so far as to say that attributing purpose to things is the same as instinctively believing in God.
Then what in your opinion is the purpose?

I'm going by what was posted. If those quotes aren't representative of the research as a whole then they just picked some really bad examples for the press release.
In reports of this nature, I don't really know what sort of examples you want?
Of course it's no secret I don't like the subject matter of the report, I'm not hiding anything and it would be quite obvious if I were.
It wouldn't make any difference to me either way, I'm quite flexible. That which can be shown to be true is fine by me.
You can't fess up to disliking the subject matter and admitting flexibility at the same time, obviously your former point will issue some bias.
My qualms are with the apparently loaded questions asked by an interviewer whose Christian leanings are fairly apparent.
Again, I don't see how you can comment on that, not having been there to see if there were detrimental confounders.

I'm not sure how the atheists of the world will react to you being instated as their chief spokesperson, but that's by the by.
'by the bye'-- the topic has nothing to do with Christianity or Islam or Judaism, if your reservations are on a theist conducting research as it so happens atheists make up quite a small percentage of the world at large and the scientific community, will you always be dismissive because the researcher isn't conducting topics in a subject manner you like?
In other words and not so distant past some atheist fellow produced a report on how atheists are more altruistic than the general population, would that report be deemed more satisfactory and believable because it embraces your own personal bias, or because it is conducted by an atheist rather than for its scientific approach and integrity of the research?

The outcome described in this report seems perfectly reasonable to me, attributing purpose to events and objects without any solid grounding is something that almost everyone does.
Solid grounding will not yield you, your desired outcome, you might rationalize, intellectualize, ignore or any number of other defense mechanisms but there is no solid grounding in atheism just the same.
What we are born with is instinctive, going against it, isn't!

What I don't understand is why the theists here are all rubbing their hands together with glee, unless it is the case that something which is intuitive is accordingly true.
I feel the same way of atheists pouncing on this with some of the most sophomoric comments I have encountered, almost a stab at the very citadel of their worship.. the only reason this is of interest to anyone at all is for the numerous times we've heard and read from atheists that no one would believe in God unless indoctrinated through parenting or schooling or community at large..

apparently it isn't true.. take away religion and man will still seek his maker!

all the best
 
My kid may believe there's a monster in her closet, but that don't make it true.
 

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